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All TopicsForum: Breast Reconstruction → Topic: BREAST IMPLANT SIZING 101

Topic: BREAST IMPLANT SIZING 101

Forum: Breast Reconstruction — Is it right for you? Discuss timing and various procedures and techniques.

Posted on: Jan 7, 2010 11:01 PM, edited Feb 6, 2013 08:06 PM by whippetmom

whippetmom wrote:

BREAST IMPLANT-BASED RECONSTRUCTION AFTER MASTECTOMY:

Please scroll to the bottom and find your tissue expander information and dimensions and/or breast implant information so that you can be well-informed about your optionsllll

PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS REGARDING BREAST IMPLANTS.

It is very important and even crucial that you discuss all of your concerns, hopes, desires and plans for your breast reconstruction outcome with your doctor.  You have every right and every reason to want to get it right the first time and to know what your options are in this regard.  Please let your doctor know that you are very interested in being a partner in the decisions he or she will make regarding your breast reconstruction journey. 

This thread is essentially an informational link for those who are preparing to undergo mastectomy [unilateral or bilateral] with immediate reconstruction with two-stage tissue expander placement or have already undergone reconstruction and you are in the tissue expander fill phase of this process.  

1.  TISSUE EXPANDER - OVERFILLING AND REASONS FOR DOING SO:

Overfill is sometimes performed and it can be done so for a myriad of reasons.  It can be done because a PS always does it in his practice [which makes no sense to me]; it can be done for assurance of good implant coverage with the skin flap; expanding out the skin a bit more so that a larger implant can be used, or in order to achieve ptosis [droop], especially in unilateral recon.  It is not necessary in all cases to overfill and some docs never overfill, some rarely ever and some always do.  But for those who are small-breasted prior to MX, it often is necessary, so that there is good skin closure, if a larger volume of implant is needed or if symmetry with the contralateral breast is required for ptosis and symmetry. 


2.  SILICONE VS. SALINE?

Please note that the question of whether you should have silicone vs. saline implants at the time of exchange is one which you can research on your own, and you can find various threads discussing the differences on bc.org.  However, the overwhelming number of women on these forums now have silicone breast implants - most specifically - silicone smooth round breast implants. 

If you live in Canada and/or your PS has access to true cohesive gel implants, aka, "gummy bear implants" - the Mentor CPGs or Allergan 410s, there are numerous threads here on bc.org which discuss the merits of these implants versus the standard silicone rounds.  [We are happy to help with sizing in this regard as well, although please note that breast reconstruction experts state that the tissue expander should be chosen specifically for expanding and creating the breast pocket for the corresponding cohesive gel/gummy bear implant.  Therefore, it is probably more uniquely important that you discuss with your PS where he/she intends to go in terms of implant size/projection at the time of exchange.]  

3.  IMPLANT SIZING INFORMATION:

If you are interested in discussing implant sizes,  make sure you compile and provide us with the following information:
 
Height, weight, ribcage measurement [measuring the circumference of your ribcage under your tissue expander(s) or under your bra line].  Also, if you have TEs [tissue expanders] - we need to know about them.  The style - Mentor or Allergan most likely - and whether they are short height, moderate height, full height if Mentor and style number if Allergan.  We also need the recommended fill volume of the TEs - the number of cc's.  (NOTE:  If you have PMT Corporation tissue expanders or any other unlisted manufacturer, please see if your PS will provide you with the dimensions of such devices.]

4.  "WHAT CUP SIZE WILL I BE?" OR "WHAT SIZE IMPLANT DO I NEED FOR A "C" CUP?"

I CANNOT PREDICT CUP SIZE.  PLASTIC SURGEONS ADMIT THAT THEY CANNOT PREDICT CUP SIZE WITH ACCURACY! 

It is very difficult to determine cup size with breast reconstruction patients, as volume does not easily translate to a specific bra size. There are so many factors which determine how implants will look on any one individual, e.g., your ribcage circumference, whether your chest wall is bony or if you have a fair amount of adipose tissue surrounding the chest wall.... if you have any ribcage deformities or other structural issues which might impact implant placement.  We can sort of "project" where you might want to be...or estimate the implant volume which you could "aim" for - so that you can sort of look at the prize ahead of you.  Most of us have found though, that it is better to continue with tissue expansion until you have reached a desired volume and appearance, and then compare these dimensions with the breast implant dimensions found on the links at the top of the Exchange City thread in the Breast Reconstruction forum. 

BREAST IMPLANT SIZING IS SPECIFIC TO YOUR VITAL STATISTICS

Implants of a specific volume will look different on A 5'10" 176 pound woman with a 35 inch ribcage, than they will  someone who is 5'3" tall, weighs 110 pounds and has a 29 inch ribcage.  So height, weight, ribcage circumference, body habitus - all of these things come into play when determining what style and volume of implant will best fit someone's frame.

QUESTIONS FOR YOUR PLASTIC SURGEON:
 
In the interim, here are very important questions to pose to your plastic surgeon.  Ask your PS if he/she tends to place you in an implant with a volume larger than the TEs, or if he/she prefers to place you in an implant smaller than the TEs.  If your PS likes to overexpand - overfill - ask about this.  It is important to know what is in your PS' mind about where he intends to go with your reconstruction, because this will assist us in calculating to what extent you require expansion in order to exchange to the desired implant size and dimensions.
 
Based on everything I have read in my four years of researching breast reconstruction, the tissue expanders SHOULD be placed by the PS with the foreknowledge of the approximate size and style of implant he/she intends to use for you down the road.  It should not be "let's just throw this tissue expander on her and see where it takes us." The WIDTH of the tissue expander is a very important consideration.  Proper placement of the tissue expanders is a very important consideration.  Please discuss these issues with your PS.  

TE and Breast Implant Data:  We should be given a little plastic credit card with information regarding our TEs and our breast implants after surgery.  ASK FOR YOUR CARD!  These are registered medical devices and the manufacturer intends that patients have access to this information.  Make sure that you ask your physician's office for this information and retain it in your medical files.   

It should be stated that a great deal of other criteria goes into implant selection.  Also of importance: Your torso [short or long], any potential ribcage or chest wall deformities or issues [e.g. pectus excavatum, pectus carinatum], and how much tissue you have overlying the chest wall.  Also, if you are a unilateral, symmetry issues come into play and this determines the style and volume of implant selected. 
 
We all want the best possible cosmetic outcome from this reconstruction journey. There are other women throughout the bc.org family who also have important information to share and we hope they add their thoughts to this thread so that your breast reconstruction journey is made easier and also so that you feel empowered about this aspect of your breast cancer recovery!

TISSUE EXPANDER AND BREAST IMPLANT CATALOGUE LINKS:

ALLERGAN:

breastimplantadvice.com/wp-con... 

MENTOR - CLICK ON IMPLANTS OR TISSUE EXPANDERS

www.mentorwwllc.com/global-us/...

SIENTRA:

www.sientra.com/Content/pdfs/P...

SSP - Specialty Surgical Products/DERMASPAN TES:

www.ssp-inc.com/Products/Breas...

QUICK LINKS - IMPLANTS ONLY

MENTOR:

www.justbreastimplants.com/bre...

ALLERGAN:

www.justbreastimplants.com/bre...

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 03:33 PM whippetmom wrote:

Maybe another answer to your question would be....I rarely think about my breasts, except when I am at the gym and then they more than mildly annoy me...LOL!  I look at some of these women doing burpees and their breasts are jumping from their waist to their shoulder blades and I want to shout "You are going to be sorrryyy!" I wear a high impact sports bra and still refuse to do a full burpee.  I will do the plank part but no jumping out and then up for me.  Apart from the gym, my breasts feel comfortable and feel a part of me - feel "real". I never think of them as "foobs" or "fake".  My skin, my skin tags, my birthmark, everything there as it was from birth and it is just that they are minus the fat and glands and connective tissue which I do not miss one single bit!

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 03:38 PM, edited Apr 11, 2012 03:47 PM by Fighter_34

It's the inner part of my breast along the chest wall at the corners and it feels rather stuff/hard. My PS said it was extra skin. I had revision surgery done and the corners are still stiff/hard. I am thinking time will soften these spots up. I know I am going to need more fat grafting done, but I just want to enjoy life w/o so many Drs appts maybe early next yr.

Prevention is the real CURE!
Diagnosis: 8/30/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 3, 0/1 nodes, ER-/PR-, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 03:42 PM, edited Apr 11, 2012 05:02 PM by whippetmom

Fighter:  Just continue to massage with BioOil or the equivalent and get on with your spring and summer.  Then, yes, another fat graft session might be all that is required.  If at any time you want to send me photos privately, you can PM me and I will give you my email address.

Deborah

Edited to state:  But, before you have any further procedures, a second opinion with another PS might be a good idea. 

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 05:13 PM every8thwoman wrote:

Hello Whippetmom,

Went to PS and he is talking about adding approx 100ml to new  silicone implant.  Was very direct and clear about what I wanted.  I think he heard me this time.  Will be getting high profile to increase projection.  DH thinks I was too forceful but HEY ITs MY BODY and I think I should get what I want!!  Anyway, went to the hospital today to do pre-op screening.  Surgery is on 26th.  Wish me luck and thanks for all your help.


Diagnosis: 10/18/2007, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/4 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 05:14 PM, edited Apr 11, 2012 05:14 PM by every8thwoman

This Post was deleted by every8thwoman.
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Apr 11, 2012 06:04 PM, edited Apr 11, 2012 06:06 PM by whippetmom

every8th:Okay, but this makes no sense at all.  I really wish you would get a second opinion though.  I just want to make sure you do not wake up from surgery and there is an "oops, could not fit the 300 ccs" note pinned to your hospital gown.  It is NOT a matter of just throwing in another 100 ccs - the implant itself has to be the right implant.  He cannot just promise you a HP with 300 ccs - that implant will be too narrow for the pocket.  So I think he is pacifying you with a promise he should not keep. 

Your TEs: Mentor low height 350 ccs: [Per your PM to me last week]

12.7 cm width and 6.5 cm projection. 

Mentor HP Implant - 300 ccs - 11.1 cm width and 4.5 cm projection [far too narrow!]

Completely inappropriate. You would need the following Mentor HP to match the width created by your TEs...

HP 425 ccs - 12.5 cm width and 5.0 cm projection

The other option would be a Mentor moderate plus profile implant:

Mentor MPP: 350 ccs - 12.5 cm width and 3.5 cm projection.

Back to the drawing table. You honestly do not want to go through another general surgery until you have all of your ducks in a row. 

Deborah

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 09:47 PM robo47 wrote:

Hi WM... Still living with my TE,s here... Been to every doc in country trying to decide what to do... Met with a doc in MI in on the trials for the gummy bear 410 .... liked him a lot, but have to pay out of pocket for him(10G) then I read this morning that the "gummy bear " by Sientra was FDA approved this week. So, I,m in Chicago being treated at Northwestern..... Any idea what this means for choices for ins coverage?? Just wondering I suppose if I wait till next winter will more docs be savey to this implant and I could get it covered by ins??? how fast do you think this could happen? Any ideas?? If I could get the gummy covered by ins....I,d be all over that! But doc in Grand Rapids doesn,t take any ins....still considering it but wondering now if in a few months all docs will be using this. The doc in GR uses the Allergan which is still not FDA approved....

RoBo47
Diagnosis: 5/26/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIa, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 09:59 PM christine47 wrote:

RoBo47,  I missed something, are you not a good candidate for tradional silicone or sailine? 


Diagnosis: 11/11/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 2, 1/17 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 10:35 PM robo47 wrote:

No you didn,t miss anything... I,m just making this complicated :-) I am pretty thin up top and had read many great things about the gummy bear being good for this use...also I was an A cup pre BC and wanted to stay an A cup...and didn,t REALLY want implants... So I,ve been researching all my options... And so far, I like the gummy bear....

RoBo47
Diagnosis: 5/26/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIa, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 11:42 PM whippetmom wrote:

robo: The Sientra implant recently FDA approved is not a form stable cohesive gel implant like the Allergan 410 or Mentor CPG.  It is a cohesive gel, but on par with the silicone implants manufactured by Allergan and Mentor.  The Sientra implants are not  "gummy bear" implants - which is the endearing term coined by Grant Stevens, MD about the Allergan 410.  Sientra does have a gummy bear implant in clinical trials, but it is a round "gummy", not an anatomical shape and it is not yet FDA approved.  However, Sientra DOES have a quasi-anatomical shaped vs. tear-drop shaped silicone implant, in addition to the round gel, which is now available vis a vis the FDA approval granted a couple of weeks ago.  The "shaped" Sientra implant might be a good option for you.

This Illinois doc has the Allergan 410s - and mentions Sientra implants in his blog.  He might just be posting news updates, and most plastic surgeons will not have ready access to Sientra products.  I spoke with Sientra recently and they were absolutely unprepared for the FDA approval when it was granted.  So they are just fielding calls and requests and it may take months before doctors can actually take delivery of the product. 

peterjohnsonblog.blogspot.com/...

Deborah 

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2012 11:58 PM whippetmom wrote:

robo: Tell me again about your TEs - style, volume, etc. Also, isn't there a PS at Northwestern who has the Allergan 410?  I think Dr. Kim?  I personally think you can get your small, natural results with a silicone round and on a patient with a bony ribcage/thin body habitus, the gummy bear can be pretty firm and rigid.  I'm just sayin'....

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 12, 2012 12:45 PM SMG1954 wrote:

Hi Whippetmom!

I had my implant surgery yesterday. I was hoping for Style 20 Allergan and that's what you had recommended too. 325 to 350 cc. My PS put 421 cc style 15 though. Apparently a better match for me. What do you think? Remember that I had TE filled to 240 only and my previous PS wanted to overfill by 50%.

Simona

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Apr 12, 2012 01:14 PM lago wrote:

simona you can read the specs here:

www.justbreastimplants.com/bre... 
www.justbreastimplants.com/bre...

It appears your projection is reduced by less than 1cc (.3c-.6cc) which seems pretty minor but your width is wider/fuller. I have style 15 and I'm quite happy.

DONE!! alturl.com/enjth • Tattoos 2.7.2012 • Nipples 10.6.2011 • Exchange 6.24.2011 • Chemo 1.18. 2011 • BMX done 8.31.2010
Diagnosis: 7/13/2010, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIb, Grade 3, 0/14 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+
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Apr 12, 2012 03:09 PM TinaT wrote:

Simona - I have Natrelle Style 15 implants as well and I'm very pleased.  Sounds like your PS may have taken both Style 20 and 15 into surgery.  Has he/she explained why the 15s seemed better for you?

Surgery: NSBMX Feb 2011 for ILC and DCIS - More lobular neoplasia and multiple foci ADH in same breast found at surgery - Oncotype DX = 18 (No Chemo!) - Anastrazole April 2011 - Exchanged TEs to silicone implants Aug 2011
Diagnosis: 12/8/2010, ILC, <1cm, Stage Ib, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 12, 2012 03:42 PM christine47 wrote:

Robo, good for you, doing your research and getting what you want!  Good luck,  I am not thin on top, but following my BMX, felt very thin on top.  I had 2nd round of fat grafting on top of implants last week and now have very natural and fuller boob on top.  I have round, silicone, high profile implants.


Diagnosis: 11/11/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 2, 1/17 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 12, 2012 04:39 PM robo47 wrote:

Thanks Christina.... I have done lots of research and have met with lots of docs.... I had some time to kill during chemo anyway.. And this seemed to be the only part of whole treatment that I could control somewhat...so took advantage! But still am undecided LOL... I did rule out the fat grafting with Dr K in Miami... So between round silicone and gummy at this point...
WM... I will resent you my info when I,m back on computer...

RoBo47
Diagnosis: 5/26/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIa, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 12, 2012 05:06 PM SMG1954 wrote:

Lago and TinaT

Thank you for sharing that you also have style 15. It seems that my PS's preferred implant is style 15. He told me he would do what's best for me. Originally, when he measured me, he said he saw a width of 12 cm for me but I see that this particular model is more than 13 cm width. I suspect he needed to fit the pockets created by the TE. I did not talk with him much after the surgery because I was too groggy. I will see him post op on Apr 19. He mentioned to me when he first saw me that after 6 months, if I wanted something bigger, he could do that, do even a few sizes up. I don't know if it's worth it though. Right now i cannot really tell because i am in a sports bra and have some dressings underneath.

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Apr 12, 2012 07:57 PM whippetmom wrote:

Simona:  That is a fine size for your frame.  Often the PS just does not know what will work best until he has removed the TEs and is using the saline sizers to see what works best.  He planned for a 12.0 cm or less implant and found he needed 13.0 cm.  So I am happy this part of the journey is over for you.  Now on to healing!  Please let us know how they look in a week or ten days.  Remember that they can look pretty strange for the first ten days after the exchange. 

Deborah 

I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5.
Diagnosis: 10/15/2008, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 12, 2012 08:52 PM lago wrote:

BTW simona I don't know your frame size but I'm sporting 1 size smaller than yours.
DONE!! alturl.com/enjth • Tattoos 2.7.2012 • Nipples 10.6.2011 • Exchange 6.24.2011 • Chemo 1.18. 2011 • BMX done 8.31.2010
Diagnosis: 7/13/2010, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIb, Grade 3, 0/14 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+
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Apr 13, 2012 08:54 PM SMG1954 wrote:

I thought i posted but maybe not. I am 5' 3" and 110 lbs. Does anyone hear a sloshing sound inside their chest after the implant surgery?

Lago, what size bra do you wear now? I know you said you are happy with the result.

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Apr 13, 2012 09:06 PM TinaT wrote:

SMG1954 - Sloshing?  I had some weird sensations in my chest after my BMX, but no sloshing sounds since my exchange.  Peculiar!
Surgery: NSBMX Feb 2011 for ILC and DCIS - More lobular neoplasia and multiple foci ADH in same breast found at surgery - Oncotype DX = 18 (No Chemo!) - Anastrazole April 2011 - Exchanged TEs to silicone implants Aug 2011
Diagnosis: 12/8/2010, ILC, <1cm, Stage Ib, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 13, 2012 09:50 PM mkw1 wrote:

robo47: I may be wrong but a friend of mine has the gummy bear implants and she was covered either by insurance or by whoever is doing the trials. She just had to sign a paper enrolling in the study for the gummy bears and agreed to have an MRI at a certain time. They also told her they would pay her $150.00 for participating in the trial.

Isaiah 54:17 No weapon formed against you shall prosper
Diagnosis: 1/12/2011, IDC, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 2, 1/7 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 13, 2012 10:17 PM lago wrote:

SMG I currently wear a 34D (measure 30"+ ribcage). I'm 5'6" and 129lbs-136lbs depending on the time of year.
DONE!! alturl.com/enjth • Tattoos 2.7.2012 • Nipples 10.6.2011 • Exchange 6.24.2011 • Chemo 1.18. 2011 • BMX done 8.31.2010
Diagnosis: 7/13/2010, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIb, Grade 3, 0/14 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+
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Apr 13, 2012 10:21 PM MinusTwo wrote:

Robo:  I'm a bit older than some of you, but yes my gummies were covered by insurance - in my case Medicare & AARP.  There are ongoing payments to you for participating in the trial.  Can't remember all the details offhand, but you get the first $100.00 after post op appointment.  There are sporadic payments like that starting every 6 mos & increasing to a year or more through out the 10 year research period.

And yes, I like the shape & feel of my gummies.  They're bigger than I wanted, but otherwise I'm pleased with the product.

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Apr 13, 2012 11:24 PM marial wrote:

Exchange surgery today! Got 800cc hp ..hope they end up looking bigger than my 600cc tissue expanders!

Diagnosis 12/15/2010 IDC 3cm 0/6 nodes stage IIa,grade 3' Triple Negative
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Apr 14, 2012 09:21 AM MondaysChild wrote:

I had the sloshing sounds right after exchange.  That goes away.  I think it is mostly air caught in the pocket that will dissapate and the implant is moving around in that, but also some fluid that will be absorbed.


Diagnosis: 10/15/2010, IDC, Stage II, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 14, 2012 12:14 PM christine47 wrote:

marial, congrats on your exchange! I hope you're feeling well today, how do they look?


Diagnosis: 11/11/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 2, 1/17 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 14, 2012 12:21 PM marial wrote:

I am wrapped in an ace bandage until monday so not sure how they look yet..and one drain due yo some extra work needed on the left side..but I am glad he was able yo get in the 800cc..as I was afraid I would wake up with less..and these 600 tissue expanders are too flat

Diagnosis 12/15/2010 IDC 3cm 0/6 nodes stage IIa,grade 3' Triple Negative
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Apr 14, 2012 12:26 PM christine47 wrote:

I bet you will look great. I also was concerned when I had my exchange surgery that my PS would go to small.  He told my husband that the last thing I said before going to sleep was "error big", so he went with the largest implants possible for me, 600 cc high profile. I am now a c/d cup and love them. Just had some fat grafting and now has even more fullness at the top of the implants. Definitely better than my original parts as far as how they look.


Diagnosis: 11/11/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 2, 1/17 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 14, 2012 12:35 PM, edited Apr 14, 2012 06:45 PM by marial

Ya, when he marked me he said, he will try to get the 800cc in..and i guess they fit I said if you are between two sizes, err on the large..I hope to be a full c/d

Diagnosis 12/15/2010 IDC 3cm 0/6 nodes stage IIa,grade 3' Triple Negative

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