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Topic: Birad 5 ...?

Forum: Not Diagnosed but Worried — Meet others worried about developing breast cancer for the first time.

Posted on: Apr 11, 2011 06:08AM

ABE123 wrote:

Hi .... Glad to have found this site. 

I recently got my first mammo and ultrasound --- and the report rated my left breast as a BIRAD 5 ---apparently the area is small .. only 8mm .... it was described as asymmetric density and a hypoechoic lesion ....

My question is .... how often are BIRAD 5 negitive???  Is a 5 only given if they can see certain characteristics on both the mammo and ultra that strongly resemble cancer???

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Posts 1 - 26 (26 total)

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Apr 11, 2011 07:55AM GmaFoley wrote:

Sounds like the same situation I am in LilyNJ.  I keep being told not to worry until the biopsy results come back..  Mine is BIRAD 5 too and is about the size of a little peanut (without the shell).  I see my surgeon to meet him and discuss the biopsy this week.  I'll be praying for you - That your results come back B9.  BTW, did yours show up on the mammogram? Mine only showed up on the ultrasound.

Imagine God in His HUGE rocking chair, rocking you and saying, "It will be ok, you can do it. I will be right here for you". Oncotype score: 8, Rads 28, Bilateral arm, truncal LE and now Obstructive Sleep Apnea

Dx 4/19/2011, IDC, 1cm, Stage Ib, Grade 2, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2011 08:02AM, edited Apr 11, 2011 09:11AM by dlb823

Lily, here's a chart that might be helpful. http://breastcancer.about.com/od/diagnosis/a/birads.htm 

It looks like there's still a possibility your lesion could be B9, so let's just pray that both you and Esther will be in that 5% category.

I'm sorry that you're both dealing with this, but I'm glad you've found BCO, and hope we can help you through this scary time.    (((Hugs)))    Deanna

"The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears" Native American proverb

Dx 2/1/2008, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 3, 1/16 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Dx 1/3/2014, Stage IV
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Apr 11, 2011 09:00AM ABE123 wrote:

HI and thank you for your responses -- this is ALL new to me ... it all started last week with a routine yearly OBGYN visit.  The Dr had felt something in my left breast --- so I went and got a mammo and ultrasound.  Ironically, what the Dr felt -- turned out to be nothing --- yet, both the mammo and ultrasound detected a different area that is about 8mm (i suspect thats pretty small)

Yes. the area showed up on both the mammo and ultrasound.  Likewise, they did several different views on the mammo --and the area still showed up.  Also, once the tech finished the ultrasound -- the radiologist came in to the room -- and redid the test herself .....

I guess my question is ---- if a BIRAD 5 is assigned to a questionable area ---- they must somehow be able to see something that makes them think its cancer -- otherwise -- why not use a 4? 

I am seeing a breast surgeon tomorrow .....

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Apr 11, 2011 01:35PM GmaFoley wrote:

Yes LilyNJ, In my report, the radiologist said that because mine was "taller than it was wide and irregular shape" it was a BIRAD 5 - Also the radiologist came back and redid the ultrasound with me too.. That seemed more scary to me than anything, but he actually talked and explained why he did that and told me what my next step would be.. His reason was he wanted to be sure what he saw on the techs pictures - so he came in and watched the tech do them to make sure.

Imagine God in His HUGE rocking chair, rocking you and saying, "It will be ok, you can do it. I will be right here for you". Oncotype score: 8, Rads 28, Bilateral arm, truncal LE and now Obstructive Sleep Apnea

Dx 4/19/2011, IDC, 1cm, Stage Ib, Grade 2, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 11, 2011 03:32PM Sassa wrote:

Hey, ladies!  I had a Birads 5 on my left breast in May 07.  Threw me for a loop as I had just had a mastectomy of the right breast, finished chemo and was on herceptin.

Turned out to be just a benign tissue of an aging breast.  So, sometimes the 5% benign does happen.

Dx 11/6/2006, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 3, 0/9 nodes, ER-/PR-, HER2+
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Apr 11, 2011 05:26PM changes wrote:

Sorry you are going through this. With BIRADS 5, the odds are 95% that it is malignant, but SOMEBODY has to fall in the good 5%. Mine was BIRADS 5, and I was actually appreciative that the radiologist just told me that it almost certainly was cancer instead of letting me fret while waiting for biopsy results. I was able to start wrapping my mind around it and preparing for what I needed to do. I hope that you and Esther both fall in the "good" 5%, but even if not, you CAN get through it. The first few weeks after a diagnosis are really stressful, but it all becomes more bearable once you have a treatment plan in place. This site was a wonderful source of support and information for me and I'm so glad it's here. Wishing you both the best.

Karen

IDC Stage 1, Grade 1

Dx 5/14/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Hormonal Therapy TamoxifenRadiation Therapy ExternalSurgery 05/27/2010 Lumpectomy (Left)
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Apr 11, 2011 06:07PM ABE123 wrote:

Thank you for your response, comments and support.

I am 39 years old ... and have no breast cancer in my family -- thus, this has been quite an emotional whirlwind.   I am seeing the breast surgeon tomorrow afternoon -- and have no idea what to expect.   I just dont understand why the radiologist gave me a 5 ------ crazy huh?

I realize the next step is a core biopsy -- based on what the radologist said to me -- and also suggested in my radiology report ........ but I just wish there was a QUICK way to confirm or rule out ......the big "C" ...  In the report ---it says the area of concern is only 8mm ..  -- do the treatments vary based on the size of it?

This has been quite an emotional experience --- 

Thank you for your support and prayers 

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Apr 11, 2011 07:11PM changes wrote:

Lily,

Treatments do vary based on size, lymph node involvement, etc. 8 mm is VERY small. Treatment for breast cancer always involves surgery, but if the cancer is small, then a lumpectomy is usually a possibility (mine was 1.1 cm and I was able to have a lumpectomy). The biopsy will not only let you know whether it IS cancer or not, but will give you characteristics of the cancer (whether it is hormone receptor positive, her2 neu status, etc). Those things will all play a role in treatment. A small tumor that is her2 neu negative may not necessarily require chemo, for instance. Typically what happens if the biopsy comes back positive, they will schedule an MRI (to make sure it's not lurking anywhere else), then do surgery. After surgery it is officially staged, and then you would meet with an oncologist to discuss whether chemo is needed. If you elected to do a lumpectomy, then radiation is necessary (lumpectomy + radiation has the same survival rates as mastectomy).

The biopsy itself is not a big deal. They will numb the area with lidocaine, do the biopsy and send you on your way. I would imagine the surgeon will be doing the biopsy when you meet with him/her tomorrow?

This is all a very emotional process and the first few weeks are particularly difficult. This site has various threads for different issues. For example, there are surgery threads, chemo threads, etc, and you can get support for whatever you may need here. There used to be a rule that you could only post 5 times a day for your first month or so. I'm not sure whether that rule is still in effect or not. If you find yourself unable to post, though, you can always send private messages.

Karen

IDC Stage 1, Grade 1

Dx 5/14/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Hormonal Therapy TamoxifenRadiation Therapy ExternalSurgery 05/27/2010 Lumpectomy (Left)
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Apr 11, 2011 08:22PM ABE123 wrote:

Karen - thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge .....my goodness - each and everyone of you that are survivors are heros - at least in my mind -

Since this all came about last thursday -- everything is still very NEW to me .... and while nothing is yet confirmed (except for a BIRAD 5) ... I feel like I am in pergatory .... yet, I am really grasping tightly to that glimmer of hope that this will all resolve itself -- and perhaps I will be among the fortunate 5% ..... yet, the logical side of me is preparing ..and trying to muster strength...

When a lesion is categorized as a 5 --- is it because the radiologist sees what resembles cancer???  there must be something about both the mammo and ultrasound that give a radiologist the confidence to classify as a 5 ...... 

 Thank you from the bottom of my heart for al the insight and knowledge sharing .....

I suppose I will have more answers tomorrow when I have the consult with the surgeon.

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Apr 11, 2011 10:13PM dlb823 wrote:

Lily, here's another link I found for you that might be helpful to try to envision why the radiologist felt your lesion looked most like a Bi-Rads 5 classification.       Deanna

http://www.radiologyassistant.nl/en/4349108442109

"The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears" Native American proverb

Dx 2/1/2008, 1cm, Stage IIa, Grade 3, 1/16 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Dx 1/3/2014, Stage IV
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Apr 12, 2011 03:37AM Ruth_in_singapore wrote:

print this and show to your surgeon before he orders a biopsy

I am not a health professional so take everything I say as opinion and not fact. Consult your health professional for medical advice.

Dx 1/9/2010, IDC, 3cm, Stage IIb, Grade 3, 3/25 nodes, ER+/PR-, HER2+
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Apr 13, 2011 04:02PM changes wrote:

Lily and Esther,

After I posted it occurred to me that a helpful warning is in order. Because ANYONE can post here, you sometimes get advice that is foolish or downright dangerous. Once you've been here awhile, you'll learn who are reliable sources and who to ignore. Be sure to check out any information you are given here with your physician! I wish you both the best.

Karen

IDC Stage 1, Grade 1

Dx 5/14/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Hormonal Therapy TamoxifenRadiation Therapy ExternalSurgery 05/27/2010 Lumpectomy (Left)
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Apr 13, 2011 04:31PM, edited Apr 13, 2011 04:35PM by Artemis

LilyNJ ~ I had two BIRADS 5 lumps biopsied.  One was malignant, the other was benign so yes, there is a chance that a "highly suspicious" lump is nothing.  Good luck to you!

*hugs*
Artemis

DD ACx4, Tx4. BMX 6/1/2009. Tamoxifen: 55 bottles. Rads 28/28. Herceptin 18/18

Dx 1/6/2009, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIb, Grade 3, 1/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+Targeted Therapy HerceptinSurgery Mastectomy (Right); Prophylactic Mastectomy (Left)Chemotherapy Adriamycin, Cytoxan, TaxolRadiation Therapy ExternalHormonal Therapy 06/16/2009 TamoxifenSurgery 12/11/2013 Reconstruction: Tissue expander placement (Both)
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Apr 13, 2011 10:14PM GmaFoley wrote:

Thanks Karen, and I know what you are talking about.. No worries.

Imagine God in His HUGE rocking chair, rocking you and saying, "It will be ok, you can do it. I will be right here for you". Oncotype score: 8, Rads 28, Bilateral arm, truncal LE and now Obstructive Sleep Apnea

Dx 4/19/2011, IDC, 1cm, Stage Ib, Grade 2, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 14, 2011 10:46AM ABE123 wrote:

HI all ..and again, thank you for your comments and support.

I saw the breast surgeon on tuesday --- and had the core biopsy done today ..... I asked the radiologist (a different one) if she would still clasify the lesion as a 5 -- and she said . yes -- but, one never knows.  The one thing she told me today -- that I didnt already know --is that the lesion had a blood supply to it.  (perhaps all do?) -

When i saw the surgeon on tuesday she actually made me feel a lot better -- probably because she said "its small ... 8mm and its not going to kill you nor will it change your life very much" .... thus, this was a sense of relief --- yet, my worries will not end until my biopsy results are back.

Anyone have any experiences with a BIRAD 5 that had a blood supply to it?

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Apr 14, 2011 04:51PM changes wrote:

Lilly,

Unfortunately, yes, I do have experience with a lesion with blood supply - mine did. I believe it is one of those things they look for that cause them to classify something as BIRADS 5. Angiogenesis is the process by which a tumor starts to form its own blood supply so it can grow. I do not know if there are other circumstances in which a lesion would have a blood supply, though.

An 8 mm lesion is very, very small. If it is cancer you have caught it very early. I know that may not seem comforting to you right now, but smaller is usually better. When do you get your results?

Karen

IDC Stage 1, Grade 1

Dx 5/14/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Hormonal Therapy TamoxifenRadiation Therapy ExternalSurgery 05/27/2010 Lumpectomy (Left)
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Apr 14, 2011 05:25PM ABE123 wrote:

Hi Karen ---

Thank you for your reply and info.  I must say -- the ONLY good things about getting a CLASS 5 radiology score -- is that it seems to put things on a FAST TRACK!!   --  from Mammo/ultrasound --->surgeon (normally it takes weeks to get in to see the Dr I saw) --->core biopsy ... 10 days!

YES -- 8mm small ... thus, that makes me feel as though this isnt all that bad.  I get my results probably next tues or wed.  Interestingly, last week when I had my 1st mammo and ultrasound - there was no mention of a "blood supply"  - neither was it on the radiology report. 

I saw the breast surgeon on tuesday and she didnt say anything about a blood supply either --- but did mention despite the small size if its cancer - they would still do a lumpectomy of the area. 

SInce its so small -- most likely contained (since very early) -- if it is cancer --- i wonder if I would need any other treatment ....

The core biopsy wasnt as bad as I had anticpated .... since the lesion was pretty deep --  the radiologist said it was close to chest wall -she spent a lot of time numbing me up ---- however, tonight it hurts a lot --- but, i am sure it will start to feel better tomorrow.

Again, thank you --- :-)

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Apr 15, 2011 05:23PM cookiegal wrote:

For what it's worth, nobody said anything about Birads to me...they just said this looks like cancer.

So I guess anything other than that is good?

Good luck!!!!!!!!

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Apr 15, 2011 06:11PM changes wrote:

Lily,

I just wanted to let you know I was thinking about you. Waiting for test results is anxiety-producing. Please let us know when you get your results.

Karen

IDC Stage 1, Grade 1

Dx 5/14/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Hormonal Therapy TamoxifenRadiation Therapy ExternalSurgery 05/27/2010 Lumpectomy (Left)
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Apr 16, 2011 09:20AM ABE123 wrote:

Changes:

Thank you!  Yes, indeed - waiting for the results is not fun --- yet, I think I am either emotionally "NUMB" ... or perhaps I have resigned myself to the situation. 

However, while I feel OKAY .... and feel as though "I have it all together" --- I suspect hearing the words "Its cancer" --- is a separate chapter -- and a  separate emotional journey --in of itself. 

I am thinking .... I probably won't get my results until Tuesday or Wednesday (since my biopsy was Thursday) .....

CHANGES, thank you .... thank you for your thoughts and for reaching out.  I have been reading some of the recent posts on this forum -- i haven't participated in responding just yet --- but I certainly have a much better appreciation and level of compassion for every one -- then before my whole "thing" began - less then  2 weeks ago  at my yrly obgyn visit.    

Thank you!

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Apr 16, 2011 10:26PM snookiejc wrote:

LilyNJ,

Just wanted to say hang in there, and good luck.  I hope everything comes back benign, but please keep us updated.  ((Hugs)) to you!

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Apr 17, 2011 06:03PM Letlet wrote:

Lily, sending calming thoughts to you. :)

Dx 8/27/2010, IDC, 3cm, Stage IIIa, Grade 3, 6/23 nodes, ER-/PR+, HER2+
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Apr 17, 2011 06:18PM GmaFoley wrote:

LilyNJ, This has been a fast process for both of us.. I sure hope you are healing from your biopsy.. When I was in recovery, my surgeon said he would most likely call me on Monday with the results... Part of me is scared but then I started wondering...WHAT am I really scared of.. I found my fear was the word "cancer" the more I read and the more I talk with all these "survivors"... I will be ok and realized that whatever he says will just mean another bump in my road of life.. and I can get through this.. Hope what I said helped..If I am upsetting anyone please msg me and let me know.

Imagine God in His HUGE rocking chair, rocking you and saying, "It will be ok, you can do it. I will be right here for you". Oncotype score: 8, Rads 28, Bilateral arm, truncal LE and now Obstructive Sleep Apnea

Dx 4/19/2011, IDC, 1cm, Stage Ib, Grade 2, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Apr 20, 2011 08:12AM ABE123 wrote:

I KNOW my results .... Positive --- but, don't know any other details ---- speaking with Dr Later.

 The waiting has ended --- Let the next chapter begin -.  I really though things would turn out otherwise --despite the odds. 

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Apr 20, 2011 09:09AM changes wrote:

Lily,

I'm sorry the news was not good but you CAN deal with this. The first few weeks while you're waiting for a treatment plan are the worst, but then things get better. Please jump over to the forum for people who are newly diagnosed. There will be lots of support and information there. Sending hugs your way,

Karen

IDC Stage 1, Grade 1

Dx 5/14/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-Hormonal Therapy TamoxifenRadiation Therapy ExternalSurgery 05/27/2010 Lumpectomy (Left)
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Apr 20, 2011 10:48AM Artemis wrote:

(((LilyNJ)))  I'm so sorry that your results are positive, but I totally agree with changes. 

The first few weeks are terrible as bits and pieces of information trickle in, and nobody seems to be DOING anything.  Once your treatment plan is in place and you get started, things will be much better.  Not easy or good, but better.  

You CAN do this, honey, I promise! 

Love, Artemis

DD ACx4, Tx4. BMX 6/1/2009. Tamoxifen: 55 bottles. Rads 28/28. Herceptin 18/18

Dx 1/6/2009, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIb, Grade 3, 1/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+Targeted Therapy HerceptinSurgery Mastectomy (Right); Prophylactic Mastectomy (Left)Chemotherapy Adriamycin, Cytoxan, TaxolRadiation Therapy ExternalHormonal Therapy 06/16/2009 TamoxifenSurgery 12/11/2013 Reconstruction: Tissue expander placement (Both)