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Topic: Alternative Treatment

Forum: Alternative Medicine —

This forum is a safe, judgement-free place to discuss Alternative medicine. Alternative medicine refers to treatments that are used INSTEAD of standard, evidence-based treatment. Breastcancer.org does NOT recommend or endorse alternative medicine.

Posted on: Aug 8, 2011 04:32PM

dougbrimor wrote:

Has anyone used alternative treatments such as Lorriane Day, Chris Beat Cancer, The Hallelujah Diet and skipped the cookie cutter 6 weeks of radiation and five years of Tamoifen?  I am so confused , even the 2011 cancer book that the radaition department gave me in my red folder states that radiation can cause a second cancer, that they are working on improving these satatics.  I read the whole book cover to cover and was just blown away by what they are admitting of these chemicals.  Anyway, would like to know if anyone else is swinging on this bridge?  Thanks

Dx 7/18/2011, <1cm, Stage I, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Oct 24, 2011 05:07PM ShelMel wrote:

I'm so glad I found this thread. I've been reconsidering taking Tamoxifen for a few weeks now. I started taking Tamoxifen in May 2011 and since then, my triglycerides and cholesterol has gone sky high and I just had an abnormal pap. I have an appointment with a gyno tomorrow to do another pap and they're talking about scraping my uterus since Tamoxifen can cause uterine cancer. I also found out that Tamoxifen can cause high cholesterol and triglyceride numbers.

My onc offered me the option to have a hysterectomy before I started taking the Tamoxifen, even though I caught my BC early, but I had just turned 40 years old, I had already had surgeries, chemo and rads and I just couldn't handle the thought of yet another surgery. 

I'll be checking out all these links. Many blessings to all of you! 

::::Life, Love, Hope, LIVE :::: mets to lungs, chest wall, sternum, liver, spleen, L5 spine Surgery 9/26/2010 Lumpectomy: Right Dx 9/27/2010, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/5 nodes, ER+/PR-, HER2- Chemotherapy 12/1/2010 Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Taxotere (docetaxel) Radiation Therapy 3/9/2011 Breast Hormonal Therapy 4/30/2011 Surgery 8/23/2012 Prophylactic ovary removal Dx 10/30/2012, IDC, Stage IV, mets, ER+/PR-, HER2- Hormonal Therapy 12/17/2012 Arimidex (anastrozole) Chemotherapy 1/3/2013 Adriamycin (doxorubicin), Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil) Chemotherapy 5/14/2013 Carboplatin (Paraplatin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Chemotherapy 7/15/2013 Halaven (eribulin)
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Oct 24, 2011 11:57PM Kaara wrote:

Beeb75:  That's an interesting study.  I'm wondering, and I am certain it wasn't done, but of the women who did not take tamixofen, how many were using alternative metods of treatment such as diet and supplementation?

If one is not going to go the route of conventional therapy, then it is imperative that diet and supplements that rid the body of cancer or prevent it from growing be researched and followed.  If you want to avoid the SE's from drugs, then you have to utilize other options to keep cancer at bay IMO. 

Kaara Dx 11/14/2011, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Dec 14, 2011 07:07PM Right2Live wrote:

This Post has been removed by the Community.
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Dec 14, 2011 08:21PM Right2Live wrote:

I wish it was easier to pass on important alternative therapy information to people......sigh

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Dec 15, 2011 02:19AM dougbrimor wrote:

Was notified that there were new post, logged on and found that they had been removed, what is that all about? 

Dx 7/18/2011, <1cm, Stage I, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Dec 15, 2011 03:21AM Rosieo wrote:

Hi everyone

Here is a little fact on Tamoxifen.  I was diagnosed with breast cancer 15 years ago.  Because I had many radiation treatments about 15 years before that (the radiation was for Hodgkins) my Dr said I could not take radiation for the bc, so the mastectomy.  It was stage 1 and I did not need chemo but the oncologist did give me Tamoxifen.  I took it for 5 years with no problems.  Now this past year I was diagnosed again on my other breast with a new breast cancer.  Stage 1 ER+Pr+ no lymph node involvement, clear margins.  Another mastectomy.  Back to oncologist.  First words out of his mouth CHEMO  I said oh no, I didn't have to take it last time and it is the same diagnosis as last time, why would I have to take it now!!  He said, they didn't give it back then for this diagnosis!!!!  Well then I asked for an oncotype dx test.  It came back 1(one)  So he said " no need for chemo" but take Arimidex.  Which I have only taken now for three months. 

But I guess I would like to ask you ladies because I know you are well read.  Why do you think the dr. is giving me arimidex.  I have no more breasts and I am 75 years old.  How much estrogen can I have  If any one has any kind of answer I would appreciate

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Dec 17, 2011 11:56PM impositive wrote:

Rosieo, You might try posting that question in the "Early Stage Natural Girls" in the "alternative Forum".  I think you'll get a response there.

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Jan 2, 2012 06:16AM Luna5 wrote:

Rosieo  seems stupid to me  for a doc to give you an AI to lower your estrone and estradiol if you don't know what your levels are.  Why not have your estrone and estradiol checked?  While you are at it, also check you progesterone and testosterone.  You need a little testosterone for you brain and other things and you definitely need at least 1.7 progesterone for your body to be able to kill off bad cells.  And of course only use bio identical if you supplement from a reputable compounding pharmacist.

Bi-Lat Mast, Hysty/Ooph, OncoType DX 0, No Tamox, No AIs,No Chemo, No Rads, We can all make informed choices without making the same choices. Dx 4/2009, IDC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/5 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Feb 2, 2012 04:29AM sunspark wrote:

I read an article about science finding an ancient mummy that suffered from cancer. Upon mentioning this to a friend of mine, he replied that, "Yes, that it is true, some people did have cancer long ago, but only those people who chose not to go to an alchemist". When I expressed disbelief about his statement, he replied that long ago, alchemists were able to cure people of all forms of diseases by using alchemy. Then, he rapidly listed names and dates. He seemed quite knowledgeable and genuine.Thought this to be quite interesting.

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Feb 2, 2012 06:17AM sweetbean wrote:

Alchemy?  The process of turning lead to gold?

People weren't being cured of cancer back then, they died.  Probably fewer people got cancer, due to a variety of factors (including the increased risk of dying from something else), but people weren't surviving it.

Dx 11/18/2010, ILC, 5cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 2, 2/15 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (FISH)
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Feb 2, 2012 08:54AM - edited Feb 2, 2012 08:56AM by AlaskaAngel

I have more of a question or theory than a conclusion about tamoxifen use for breast cancer, for those here to consider (not only HER2 positives, but HR negatives).

I was dx'd stage 1 grade 3 HER2+++, and after doing CAFx5 and rads, was put on tamoxifen. I was on it for a year and then started finding reliable info on the net in 2003 that indicated that about 1/3 of the HER2 positive bc patients developed resistance to tamoxifen. Since they didn't know they were developing resistance to it, they didn't know they were taking it for nothing. So at the end of the first year of it I cut my dose down somewhat, and brought the info to my PCP, who took it to my onc.

Both my PCP and my onc, instead of being polite enough to treat the question (and me) respectfully by intelligent discussion, merely responded that "because I was probably menopausal [by this time], we will just put you on an aromatase inhibitor". I was appalled (and justifiably irritated) to have been put on a drug that had a 1/3 chance of risk of not being effective at all for me without any discussion in the first place, and then being treated like an idiot for bringing in the documentation for discussion--especially given that tamoxifen has many side effects and some additional risks.

It is possible that initially the tamoxifen was helpful to me, since my breast density was still dense at completion of rads after CAFx6 but disappeared by 3 months out from starting the tamoxifen. (Ditto for my sex life -- permanently.)

The research indicates that those HER2 positives who have a high AIB1 level are the ones who are likely to develop resistance to tamoxifen. I don't know why but there does not seem to be testing commonly available to determine whether one has a high AIB1 level.

What is concerning to me is that recently I saw some research that indicated that another group that has a high AIB1 level is the HR- group, which also tends to have a higher recurrence rate. The conclusion of the recent study is that maybe finding a way to knock down the AIB1 level may be worth targeting.

I don't know how "usable" this info is for those here, but it is just interesting to consider on an individual basis.

AlaskaAngel

Dx 12/3/2001, DCIS/IDC, Left, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 3, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (IHC) Surgery 1/3/2002 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel Chemotherapy 3/12/2002 Adriamycin (doxorubicin), Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil) Radiation Therapy 9/10/2002 Breast Hormonal Therapy 11/15/2002 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Feb 2, 2012 01:56PM sweetbean wrote:

Now, that's interesting, AA.  About the A1B1.  There is also a link between recurrence and high levels of CRP, which can be controlled with diet and exercise.  Anything like that for A1B1?

Dx 11/18/2010, ILC, 5cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 2, 2/15 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (FISH)
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Feb 2, 2012 03:14PM dougbrimor wrote:

Could you explain the link between reoccurence and CRP, I hadn't heard about this before.  Thank you

Dx 7/18/2011, <1cm, Stage I, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Feb 2, 2012 08:14PM - edited Feb 2, 2012 08:15PM by AlaskaAngel

sweetbean may have more to add here about the CRP. But it is used as a test for cardiac purposes primarily, for inflammation of the circulation system. Mine was done because my PCP assumed that because I was menopausal and had gained weight after treatment and am older now that, like most, I was not eating a proper diet and because I had a cholesterol that was moderately high, I should take a statin for it. I challenged his conclusion and we agreed to do the CRP. It showed clearly that my diet was not a problem, and read "low risk".  (All my other lab results had been very clearly indicating such to be the case for me, but my PCP was fixated on the cholesterol reading.) I think diet is so key to keeping cancer from recurring that I think this test, when used with someone who has bc, can indicate whether they are eating the best possible diet.

Dx 12/3/2001, DCIS/IDC, Left, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 3, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (IHC) Surgery 1/3/2002 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel Chemotherapy 3/12/2002 Adriamycin (doxorubicin), Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil) Radiation Therapy 9/10/2002 Breast Hormonal Therapy 11/15/2002 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Feb 2, 2012 08:22PM AlaskaAngel wrote:

sweetbean,

I don't know of anything that those with a high AIB1 can do to lower it, but your question is very interesting. The deal for bc patients about AIB1 is that about 1/3 of HER positive patients have a high level, but MOST of the HR negatives have a high level.

With these 2 groups having such a bad rap (prior to trastuzumab at least), IF science can find a natural way (or less desirably, a synthetic way) to lower AIB1, then that would allow more successful use of tamoxifen until postmenopause is reached.

I dunno. I still wish they would just get over this tweaking with this and that, and get off their buns and get more serious about analyzing the natural endocrine basis and effects. I'd RATHER have a sex life than have to use a synthetic to just survive.

A.A.

Dx 12/3/2001, DCIS/IDC, Left, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 3, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (IHC) Surgery 1/3/2002 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel Chemotherapy 3/12/2002 Adriamycin (doxorubicin), Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil) Radiation Therapy 9/10/2002 Breast Hormonal Therapy 11/15/2002 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Feb 3, 2012 01:28AM Kaara wrote:

I am HR/PR+ and post menopausal.  I am starting on tamoxifen because it seems to have less SE's than the Al's.  I am going to start on a lower dose (1/2 the prescribed) until I can see if my body will tolerate it.  I read somewhere that better results are achieved if you do tamox for several years and then switch to an Al if you are postmenopausal.

Kaara Dx 11/14/2011, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Feb 3, 2012 08:55AM sunspark wrote:

Sweetbean in reply to your question:

Thank you for your question about alchemy and your statement that no one survived cancer long ago. I asked my friend about this. He said long ago alchemists cured people of cancer and all diseases, in the same way that they changed lead into gold, as documented in 1814.

He said alchemists use the sound energies contained in secret words and sing the sounds of ancient secret songs that cause the protons, electrons and neutrons of atoms to move into different configurations. He said this process transformed diseased cells in human bodies into healthy cells.

He also said he is part of an organization which will very soon go public with a big announcement.Here is a listing of alchemy related historical dates and names that were provided.

• 300 AD Roman Emperor Diocletian orders all books on alchemy destroyed.
• 1317 Pope John XXII issues "Spondent Pariter" condemning alchemist to exile and heavy fines for merchants dealing in alchemical gold.
• 1404 Henry IV in England issues edit declaring use of alchemy to be illegal.
• 1814 Bullet of lead alchemically transformed into gold in front of an army officer and a doctor. (Bullet and affidavits are located in London's British Museum).
 

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Feb 3, 2012 07:50PM AnnNYC wrote:

Sunspark = Shivamsarah?

Dx 3/9/2007, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/5 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Feb 3, 2012 09:06PM sweetbean wrote:

sunspark,

does your friend also wear a lovely tinfoil hat?  i'm sorry - that just sounds ridiculous to me.  cancer used to be a death sentence, and a fairly quick one at that, because by the time it was diagnosed, it was extremely advanced.

Dx 11/18/2010, ILC, 5cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 2, 2/15 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (FISH)
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Feb 3, 2012 09:20PM rosemary-b wrote:

I respect that we all have different beliefs as to what may cure our cancer but don't you think the alchemists would have paid somebody off with the gold they made so that they would be able to carry on their work? This is just too much to believe.

I will say though that I am curious about the big announcement.

Dx 2/25/2007, IDC, Stage I, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+
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Feb 3, 2012 09:24PM sweetbean wrote:

seriously.  i apologize for the snarkiness, but I am all hopped up on pain meds from my exchange yesterday.  i agree with rosemary - if alchemy worked, those dudes would be rich.

Dx 11/18/2010, ILC, 5cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 2, 2/15 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ (FISH)
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Feb 3, 2012 09:27PM thenewme wrote:

Meh, Rosemary - you'd probably have to sign up for a  "must see" youtube video or something, forever subjecting yourself to spammy emails inviting you to join their inner circle of fabulously rich alchemists or something.

Dx 11/2008, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIB, Grade 3, 0/9 nodes, ER-/PR-, HER2-
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Feb 3, 2012 10:11PM rosemary-b wrote:

thenewme

You are such a cynic...but you have a point.

Dx 2/25/2007, IDC, Stage I, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+
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Feb 3, 2012 11:01PM thenewme wrote:

LOL! Reading the stuff some people post around here, it's hard not to be cynical.  

Who knows, though?  Maybe Sunspark's friend will come here and show us all the magic alchemic cure free of charge just because he's that kind of guy.  

Dx 11/2008, IDC, 5cm, Stage IIB, Grade 3, 0/9 nodes, ER-/PR-, HER2-
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Feb 4, 2012 01:01AM Wabbit wrote:

Hello ladies ... it just so happens that I know Alchemy and can turn lead into gold quite quickly.  For a small sum ... well relatively small in return for a cure ... I will share my secret with you.  Just let me know if you want more info.

OK ... before thenewme outs me ...  my Alchemy is really a computer puzzle game :)  But still ... you never know.  I'm going to start playing again tonight.

Dx 3/2006, IDC, 3cm, Stage II, Grade 2, 0/4 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Feb 4, 2012 02:05AM 1Athena1 wrote:

I am doing a Hard Sudoku Puzzle tonight. Maybe it will show me the way wabbit - lol!

Anyone diagnosed with cancer should learn to have a healthy disrespect for statistics. Statistics are maths. It's the science which still eludes us. Dx 3/2009, IDC, 3cm, Stage IIB, Grade 3, 3/8 nodes, mets, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Feb 5, 2012 01:45PM abigail48 wrote:

I posted when I first joined this site, & havn't been able to find it, or a post where someone gave a site for alternate treatments, I wonder if the deleted posts are such, cancer is a billion dollar industry for the allopaths & perhaps that;s the reason for the deletions:  it makes one think so anyway, & whatever the reason it shows disrespect for the posters & the search for information for all of us

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Feb 5, 2012 03:14PM - edited Feb 5, 2012 03:16PM by apple

the search function is excellent here Abigail.. you might try a different word combination and search within the forum you are in now.. 'The Forum:  Alternative Treatment:.   I'd help but I don't know exactly what you are looking for.   put your own threads in 'favorites' and if you click on your own name, your posting history will pop up.  Good luck.

I'm sure someone will help.

peace and love, apple - ..... Mary Magdalen Dx 4/10/2008, IDC, 5cm, Stage IV, Grade 3, 4/9 nodes, mets, ER+, HER2+
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Feb 5, 2012 03:23PM sunspark wrote:

On a historical note, I have heard that alchemists did try to pay off the Roman emperor, but who then got greedy, captured the alchemists, forced many to make gold for him (so he could pay off mercenary armies protecting the Roman empire's borders), killed off alchemists who wouldn't make gold for him. Special colloidal waters were part of ancient Egyptian practice during that time-period. The remaining alchemists went underground and saved techniques over generations - passing it father to son, mother to daughter, and so on.
On a more current note, I just saw a very recent article in the UK Daily News on the healing properties of silver in a study done at the University of Leeds. It is entitled: "Silver bullet for cancer: Metal can kill some tumours better than chemotherapy with fewer side effects". Now this I would call alchemy and perhaps there are modern day alchemists.
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Feb 5, 2012 03:38PM - edited Feb 5, 2012 05:26PM by exbrnxgrl

I truly respect everyone's beliefs and opinions and don't visit this thread often because I use conventional therapy combined with exercise, nutritional support and some supplements but...alchemy ? Really? Given the current price of gold, those alchemists should be very rich by now. No intent to insult or put down but this just seems too much like snake oil.
Caryn

Bilateral mx 9/7/11 with one step ns reconstruction. As of 11/21/11, 2cm met to upper left femur Dx 7/8/2011, IDC, Left, 4cm, Grade 1, 1/15 nodes, mets, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 9/7/2011 Lymph node removal: Left; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Reconstruction (left); Reconstruction (right) Dx 11/2011, IDC, Left, 4cm, Stage IV, Grade 1, 1/15 nodes, mets, ER+/PR+, HER2- Hormonal Therapy 11/21/2011 Arimidex (anastrozole) Radiation Therapy 11/21/2011 Bone Hormonal Therapy 6/19/2014 Femara (letrozole) Hormonal Therapy Aromasin (exemestane)

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