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Topic: Root canals & breast cancer

Forum: Alternative Medicine —

This forum is a safe, judgement-free place to discuss Alternative medicine. Alternative medicine refers to treatments that are used INSTEAD of standard, evidence-based treatment. Breastcancer.org does NOT recommend or endorse alternative medicine.

Posted on: Apr 24, 2012 11:27PM - edited Nov 16, 2012 02:21AM by Moderators

norahamby wrote:

Let's take a poll: how many ladies have had root canal dental work and had breast cancer subsequently on the same side?

Dx 1/29/2012, DCIS, <1cm, Stage 0, Grade 1, 0/1 nodes, ER-/PR-, HER2-
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Oct 30, 2012 11:03PM jojo68 wrote:

Ooh, interesting about mouse mammary tumor...will be researching that, thanks!  The body scan is called spectravision body scan...no real website, just google it and lots comes upSmile

2012 Stage 3 Lobular Er+/Pr+/her-/Grade 2 7 nodes +/2014 marrow mets/2018 Mets to Bones/ovaries and peritoneum
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Oct 31, 2012 06:38PM malleycat wrote:

Dental- It seems you're confusing "natural" with "safe."  There are plenty of things that are natural that are toxic.  Arsenic for example.  And whatever it is a box jellyfish injects you with when it stings.  I could go on, but you get the idea.

Again, I'm not saying this link isn't possible, but it's not definite either.  My mom has lots of root canals and no cancer, and I have cancer and no root canals.  Just something to think about.

Surgery 1/17/2012 Lymph node removal: Left, Right; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Reconstruction (left): Tissue expander placement; Reconstruction (right): Tissue expander placement Surgery 5/8/2012 Reconstruction (left); Reconstruction (right) Dx 12/2012, DCIS, 6cm+, Stage 0, Grade 2, 0/14 nodes
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Oct 31, 2012 07:00PM Galsal wrote:

ironically, the root canal has been performed on the side opposite from BC and after BC as well.

Dx 12/14/2011, ILC, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 2, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 2/9/2012 Mastectomy: Left; Prophylactic mastectomy: Right Hormonal Therapy 10/5/2012 Arimidex (anastrozole) Hormonal Therapy 12/12/2012 Femara (letrozole) Hormonal Therapy 4/15/2013 Aromasin (exemestane)
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Nov 13, 2012 05:29AM 1Rawgirl wrote:

Hi NattyGroves,

Thanks for clarifying! I just had 3 root canals extracted last Friday. And my bio-dentist showed me the abcess...YUCK! I asked him before leaving his office if I there's anything I need to do to avoid swallowing the bacteria. He basically said my jawbone is already infected. Next step is to do some bridgework (bonding) and partial denture. NO IMPLANTS!! And chelation therapy. The pathology lab result will come in sometime this week to give us a better idea.

This is all new to me and am learning so much! So now am waiting to see if the tumor on my left breast will continue to shrink. Now it makes all sense why my digestion is still not working properly. The abcess in my mouth was most likely contributing to my yeast overgrowth due to my blood being so acidic! I've had to stop reading and researching as it was just stressing me out as I learn the truth! Needed a break...

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Nov 13, 2012 08:53AM MENA1954 wrote:

dogsandjogs, I just read your post and noticed the connection you made between Cancer and your use of antidepressants. Can you please elaborate on that?  I am very curious to hear your theory because I also used benzo's!

Mena

Mena Dx 6/25/2012, IDC, Right, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 8/1/2012 Lymph node removal: Right, Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): DIEP flap; Reconstruction (right): DIEP flap Hormonal Therapy 9/20/2012 Arimidex (anastrozole) Hormonal Therapy 11/3/2014 Aromasin (exemestane)
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Nov 16, 2012 01:48AM samian wrote:

New here, I'm a guy mid 20s. Just randomly found a lump in my chest, searched around the internet and eventually landed here... I had a root canal some years ago and remember the doc telling me he wasn't able to completely clean out the roots because there was an extra smaller one he couldn't reach. I don't think I have cancer(maybe) but my health has been declining more than usual for a guy my age. I've always been skinny and used to be pretty healthy. I have digestive issues and doc tells me it's just IBS. There are lumps in my lower lip now that weren't there before, when my immune system is down these white lumps protude out of my skin there. No idea what that is. Also have a fibroma on my cheeks same side as the root canal (build up of fiber from biting) shortly after my braces got taken off, if you google it you see pink lumps. Mine is white but when I went on a cleanse once it turned pink, to me suggests that it's white because theres bacteria constantly there.

I still don't know what to think of this lump I just found, I'm at least not as paniced as I was when I first felt it about 30 minutes ago... but still a bit worried even after finding out that breast cancer is rare among men...

Rawgirl, could I ask you about how much it costs to get something like this done with a holistic dentist? To remove the root canal tooth and what not.

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Nov 16, 2012 07:06AM motheroffoursons wrote:

Just a note. I don't think the side correlation with breast cancer and root canals will hold up. Mathematically you have four combinations, (1)Left breast, right root canal (2) Left breast, left root canal 3 Right breast, right root canal, 4 Right breast, left root canal. In other words, in 50% of the cases that a person has a root canal and breast cancer it would mathematically be on the same side (2 and 3 above). It would be hard to get data to have a much higher correlation. I am not saying inflammation from the need for a root canal cannot affect other systems, but I am saying the relationship between sides is probably not valid and just a mathematical construct.

God does not promise you tomorrow, he promises eternity. Sharon Dx 11/2/2006, DCIS, Left, 4cm, Stage 0, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Nov 16, 2012 12:18PM NattyOnFrostyLake wrote:

There are two separate correlations. The first relates to specific teeth on the stomach meridian which is related to the breast.

The second is more general in that a root canal maintains an ongoing infection in the body from keeping a dead body part (the tooth) in the body. This is a stress on the immune system whether asymptomatic or not.

In the second correlation, the location of the infected tooth is irrelevant. The immune system is overtaxed. Some people seem to sustain infections with medical impunity. Others, for reasons not understood, are more vulnerable to underlying infections. Thus, the admonition to be wary of root canals.

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Nov 16, 2012 01:15PM stride wrote:

This root canal theory mystifies me every time I hear it. I have never had any dental problems whatsoever. No cavities, no fillings, no infections, no dental work done except for ordinary cleanings. If getting your teeth cleaned causes breast cancer, we're all screwed.

2012: Stage II IDC ER-/PR+ Her2- became triple negative with areas of carcinosarcoma during neoadjuvant TAC. 12/2012: clean PET/CT. 8/2013: Mets to lungs, liver, brain, bones, muscles, kidney, thyroid, adrenal gland, etc. Surgery 11/7/2012 Mastectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/16/2013 Radiation Therapy 8/22/2013 Brain
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Nov 16, 2012 04:33PM - edited Nov 16, 2012 04:33PM by NattyOnFrostyLake

No one is saying everyone with a a deep dental infection gets breast cancer.

No one is saying if you don't have any infection you won't get breast cancer. We're talking about risk reduction.

Many clinics in Europe insist that you have your root canals and mercury fillings removed before coming to reduce the burden on your immune system.

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Nov 17, 2012 09:06PM 1Rawgirl wrote:

Jepherz,

Hello!  I'm a newbie here myself.  Am glad I found this discussion board and have a good discussion with like-minded folks!  I had 3 root canal extractions that totaled to a little over $1,000.00!  It took me almost the whole year to decide as I wanted to get 2nd, 3rd opinions and research it first.  And my bio-dentist had to do a pathology labwork as all 3 were abcessed.  But it sounds like you only have 1 root canal, right?  So, maybe around $250 - $300/tooth extraction and depending if there's a pathology labwork (maybe $300).  

Then I went to my holistic dentist for the bridgework.  I chose a bio-compatible material and as non-invasive as possible so I went with a pontic bridge bonded to adjacent teeth.  This cost me a little over $100.  So, it's actually cheaper than a root canal.  The downside is there's a chance it can break sooner than later since it is not implanted into the gums.  But considering all the chronic inflammation and my overtask immune system, it was a smarter move.  Logically, it didn't make sense for me to do another root canal retreatment or an implant when my immune system was overtasked and... you get the picture.  Besides, I've learned to eat a variety of foods and glad there's an abundance now.

Have you ever heard of The Body Ecology Diet by Donna Gates?  Her book is what made me realize my body was going through something more than just myofascial pain and explained why my nervous system was malfunctioning.  

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Nov 18, 2012 01:13AM 1Rawgirl wrote:

Jepherz,

I just thought I'd add that when you look for a holistic dentist, do your research and make sure they really follow the holistic approach. I found out not all holistic dentists practice what they call themselves...I asked my oral surgeon why not and he said could be that they never really were.

As I get to know my holistic dentist, I am learning he is open. But seems to be reserved about the correlation between root canal and immune system health issues. I showed him my pathology report and at that point, he couldn't say anything! Except be in agreement with my bio-dentist. My bio-dentist knows who he is and reminded me that I am actually teaching him! Too bad as that is their job but it is what it is. Glad there are those who are open and truly care for the health of their patients!

Do you have dental insurance? Cause that really helped defray the cost when it was time to pay. Just know it may take time depending on your insurance. As it needs to be pre-authorized, etc. Hope this helps! From the sound of what you may be going through, this direction will definitely lead you to the road of healing. There is hope!

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Nov 19, 2012 10:53AM dogsandjogs wrote:

Mena: Well, it is just something I heard a long time ago  Can't remember where.. Anti-depressants depress your immune system  which is bad in many ways. I was on them for a number of years before I got cancer. I will never take them again.

Dx 11/1982, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/17 nodes Surgery 11/17/1982 Lymph node removal: Right; Mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (right): Nipple reconstruction Dx 11/15/2010, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+ Surgery 2/11/2011 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel
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Nov 20, 2012 01:40PM rosyFL wrote:

How is a root canal removed?  I didn't know it could be done.  Then what happens to the tooth, is it pulled?  Is there any scientific proof that root canals cause BC? 

Then what about other procedures like implants, or dental bone grafts that sometimes need to be done for an implant?  I think as we get older, some of our teeth need repair that goes beyond a filling in order to save the tooth. 

This is pretty scary stuff to me.  I've had tons of dental work done and if there is truly a connection, then what are we supposed to do to try and save our teeth.

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Nov 20, 2012 02:06PM - edited Nov 20, 2012 02:06PM by ali68

My filling is leaking and the dentist says he will replace it. He then says as it's a double tooth and near the nerve I will have to have root canal work. I told him I didn't want it being a cancer patient but says he won't remove A good tooth.

I don't want it done!!

Dx 12/7/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 3, 9/32 nodes, ER+/PR-, HER2- Chemotherapy 1/12/2012 Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil), Taxotere (docetaxel) Surgery 6/18/2012 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Underarm/Axillary Hormonal Therapy 7/24/2012 Radiation Therapy 8/1/2012 Breast, Lymph nodes
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Nov 21, 2012 08:30AM rosyFL wrote:

Can you get a second opinion from another dentist? 

I'm getting a lot of dental work done now, but didn't know about any relation between BC and root canals and possibly other procedures.

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Nov 21, 2012 08:39AM ali68 wrote:

Hi, i have tried to do that but no one will see me. So worried i will get infection and end up in hospital. My doctor is giving me some strong sedatives and i will take them.

Dx 12/7/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 3, 9/32 nodes, ER+/PR-, HER2- Chemotherapy 1/12/2012 Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil), Taxotere (docetaxel) Surgery 6/18/2012 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Underarm/Axillary Hormonal Therapy 7/24/2012 Radiation Therapy 8/1/2012 Breast, Lymph nodes
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Nov 21, 2012 03:20PM 1Rawgirl wrote:

Hi NattyGroves,

I am healing from my 3 RC extractions.  Got my pontic bonded teeth placed last week.  And am waiting for my ND to get back to me about chelation therapy.  As I research it and find out the difference between EDTA and natural chelation, I'm more inclined to do the natural chelation at home.  Just wondering, did your friend do his chelation at home, too?  Combined with EDTA?  You might have mentioned it already, so I apologize.  Still getting used to maneuvering around the discussion board.

I caught a cold over the weekend and it is hitting me hard!  Haven't been hit this hard but I'm sure it has to do with my immune system being so weak right now soon after the extractions.  I've spent so much $ already that I am doing my best to do things at home to save $.  But I don't want to do it by myself if I'm supposed to have a professional monitor the chelation therapy.  Any thoughts?

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Nov 21, 2012 03:26PM ali68 wrote:

Omg, what did you say I didn't understand haha

Dx 12/7/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 3, 9/32 nodes, ER+/PR-, HER2- Chemotherapy 1/12/2012 Fluorouracil (5-fluorouracil, 5-FU, Adrucil), Taxotere (docetaxel) Surgery 6/18/2012 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Underarm/Axillary Hormonal Therapy 7/24/2012 Radiation Therapy 8/1/2012 Breast, Lymph nodes
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Nov 21, 2012 03:27PM 1Rawgirl wrote:

Hi rosyFL,

Here is one website you can read.  There's another website I've read but it escapes me right now.  I'll post it later if I remember.

www.cancertutor.com/Other02/AdvDental.html

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Nov 24, 2012 03:46PM rosyFL wrote:

Does anyone know about implants? Dental bone grafts?  Is there a danger there also?  OMG, this list of bad things just keeps getting longer & longer.

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Nov 24, 2012 04:47PM Beesie wrote:

Living is dangerous.  None of us gets out of it alive.

Virtually everything in life comes with risks and in one way or another can be bad for us.  If you only look at the risks, you will become paralyzed and afraid to live.

You have to remember that virtually everything comes with benefits too.  From the standpoint of your overall dental health, retaining your own teeth, even with a root canal, is better for you than extracting a tooth.  

Don't allow yourself to be scared by all the things that are seemingly connected to breast cancer.  Remember that in medical science, what was deemed to be bad for you one day might the next day be found to be good for you. And in making your decisions, consider your overall health and well-being, and your quality of life.  If breast cancer risk is your only consideration, you could end up making some really bad decisions, as it relates to other aspects of your life and your health. 

Just my two cents worth. 

“No power so effectually robs the mind of all its powers of acting and reasoning as fear.” Edmund Burke
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Nov 24, 2012 06:20PM NattyOnFrostyLake wrote:

So you're recommending keeping a dead and rotting body part in the body of someone with a compromised immune system?

Have you read up on this?

Blessings to you!



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Nov 24, 2012 10:07PM Beesie wrote:

No, I'm not recommending that.  A dead and rotting tooth should either be extracted or the rot should be cleaned out with a root canal, which leaves just the shell of the tooth. 

The most common complication of tooth extraction is infection. This can be either an infection in the area of the tooth, or, when the tooth is pulled some of the infected rot can enter the bloodstream and cause an infection to develop somewhere else in the body.  

So it seems to me that there are risks with both procedures.  

I would certainly recommend that anyone who has either procedure go to a specialist who knows what they are doing, in order to reduce the risk of infection from an extraction or any future problems with a tooth that's had a root canal.  I'll all for everyone knowing the risks and taking the proper precautions, but when I see people come to this board with the single objective of generating fear and anxiety, and when I see them succeeding in that goal, I get my back up a bit. 

When you think of it, isn't a root canal really just the dental equivalent of a skin sparing, nipple sparing mastectomy?

“No power so effectually robs the mind of all its powers of acting and reasoning as fear.” Edmund Burke
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Nov 25, 2012 07:33AM NattyOnFrostyLake wrote:

You may want to read up on leaving a dead body part in the body before making generalizations about how healthy it is.

The jaw is particularly susceptible to ongoing, underlying infection that cannot be detected without surgically opening up the cavity. As I said, reading up is often a good alternative to winging it with generalizations. It's a way to help more people with trustworthy information rather than opinion.

Happy holiday weekend.

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Nov 25, 2012 08:36AM abigail48 wrote:

according to gary null a root canal can never get all the rot out of the canal, the canal gets smaller & smaller & nothing can reach the smallest places.  the dprocedure is not a good idea

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Nov 25, 2012 08:39AM dogsandjogs wrote:

speaking as somebody with very bad teeth; i've had 4 root canals and a few extractions usually you end up losing the tooth anyway. i feel that if you dont need the tooth for chewing and it isn't where it is visible, just get it pulled,. i have no molars left on the bottom and do just fine with only 19 teeth.

Dx 11/1982, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/17 nodes Surgery 11/17/1982 Lymph node removal: Right; Mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (right): Nipple reconstruction Dx 11/15/2010, IDC, <1cm, Stage I, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+ Surgery 2/11/2011 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel
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Nov 25, 2012 09:35AM Beesie wrote:

NattyGroves, I couldn't agree more.  Reading and researching - and learning how to distinguish between good data sources and biased data sources - is to me the only way to learn and get your information.

The people who know me around here know that I'm a bit (okay, more than a bit) of a research geek.  It's part of my professional background so you could say that I come by it honestly. I don't think anyone around here who knows me would ever accuse me of winging it. 

So I guess our advice to everyone on this thread is the same.  Do your own research. Find reliable, unbiased sources.  Don't believe everything you read. Don't assume that all theories are correct and don't base your decisions on unsupported theories; base your decisions on legitimate research that supports (or negates) the theory. If there isn't any research or data to support a theory, ask yourself why that might be. There could be legitimate reasons (the research is in process) or it could be because the theory is not supportable with real data.  And here's a hint: A website or article or blog or discussion thread that only talks about the negatives of a treatment or procedure or drug - or one that only talks about the positives - isn't likely to be reliable. You want to find sites that present and discuss both the benefits and risks, the advantages and disadvantages, the pros and cons.

A couple of perspectives that assess both sides of the debate:  http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/QAA400591/Are-Root-Canals-Risky.html

http://www.northsidedentalcare.net/blog/2012/02/are-root-canals-toxic-by-dr-mcrory/

I'll leave it at that.  Hope everyone in the U.S. is enjoying their long weekend!

“No power so effectually robs the mind of all its powers of acting and reasoning as fear.” Edmund Burke
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Nov 25, 2012 10:03AM - edited Nov 25, 2012 10:58AM by NattyOnFrostyLake

Winging it means relying on generalities without doing research. Winging it also means extrapolating from one organ to the other without evidence.

Please let us know when you find some actual research that compares live nipple tissue (as in nipple-sparing surgery) to a dead tooth.

So glad you are having a cheerful weekend!

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Nov 25, 2012 10:43AM Mardibra wrote:

I've done some research on this issue and I have not found any legitimate data stating a connection between root canals and breast cancer. There are some interesting opinions out there but that's it. If someone wants to share the data showing the connection, I would love to read it.

IDC and DCIS. Lumpectomy/AND 10/21/11. Chemo 12/1 - 3/15. UMX 4/13/2012. Rads completed 7/3/12. DIEP reconstruction to begin Jan 2013. Dx 8/31/2011, IDC, 3cm, Stage IIIA, Grade 2, 7/10 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-

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