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Topic: Paleo Pals - Health, Weight Loss & Support

Forum: Fitness and Getting Back in Shape — Conversations about exercise, diet, and getting back in shape after breast cancer diagnosis and treatment.

Posted on: May 29, 2018 02:14PM - edited Dec 14, 2018 01:22PM by Egads007

Egads007 wrote:


'Paleo' might be a term you've heard in the dieting world. The main thrust is eating/exercising the way our Paleolithic hunter/gatherer ancestors did. The most basic principal is: no wheat/grains/simple sugar/legumes/processed foods. Before you click off the thread thinking you have to carve yourself a spear and bag a mastodon for dinner, please know that it's completely do-able in a modern world. First of all, it's not a diet, we don't count calories. Yes, you read that right, no calorie counting (how many kinds of cool is that?) We do, however, cut certain foods out, and keep an eye on our carb intake, especially if weight loss is the goal. No, it's not all about the meat. Paleo folks don't eat sides of bbq'd beef for breakfast, but we do indeed enjoy eating meat, along with a boat loads of veg. Everything in moderation and balance. Bacon. If that doesn't temp you I don't know what will.

Interested in better health/weight loss? Sick of diets? Join us. Any and all welcome. Keto, Whole30, Mediterranean Diet, Atkins, heck even the vegetarians are welcome if they can deal with the animal based proteins that will be flung around the posts! Heck, we might all learn something from each other through healthy non-confrontational debate.

Here's the very basic Paleo options:

Hardcore Paleo: No wheat, grains, legumes, simple sugars, processed food, alcohol, dairy. Only organic veg, grass fed organic meats, eggs etc…Squeaky clean.

Primal: No wheat, grains, legumes, simple sugars, very VERY little processed food, some dairy. Basically a less restrictive way to go (this was my choice, but I bounce back to hardcore at times).

80/20: 80% of your diet is Paleo/Primal, 20% isn't (within reason, don't eat 9 bags of chips and expect to feel good). I think of the 80/20 as the Las Vegas Paleo….what happens on the weekend, stays on the weekend.

Variants include: Keto Diet, Whole30, Mediterranean Diet, Atkins, Low Carb Diet

Some choose 50/50%, some choose to eat wheat but no sugar…etc… The choice is your own depending on your situation and goals. Nothing is in stone.

Yes Virginia, there is homework! The more you understand, the better your decisions will be. Paleo is a massive subject online and the information available goes from here to infinity (kind of like this post!), so I have listed basic helpful links below that really should be read before starting. Understanding the 'how and why' is vital.

DISCLAIMER: All things do not work for all people. It is recommendend that you run any diet change past your PCP first. Also, getting baseline blood work done would be wise to gauge how any diet affects you over time. Common sense must prevail so if you notice any adverse effects stop and investigate.

Websites:

www.marksdailyapple.com(check out overviews & Definitive Guides…helpful with food & everything else you need to know).

www.robbwolf.com


Guide Links:

Easy to read, plenty more info on website link above:

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/how-to-succeed-with-the-primal-blueprint/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/the-a-to-z-guide-to-leading-a-primal-lifestyle/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-to-the-primal-eating-plan/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/why-grains-are-unhealthy/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-grains/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/fats/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/the-definitive-guide-to-sugar/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/how-much-meat-is-too-much/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/10-ways-to-optimize-your-meat-consumption/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/health-benefits-moderate-exercise/

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/17-reasons-youre-not-losing-weight/

FISH SAFETY - Check out what you're eating:

http://seafood.edf.org/salmon

https://fishchoice.com/

Recipe Sources:

https://www.paleohacks.com/

www.paleohacks.com/

http://paleomg.com/

https://nomnompaleo.com/

https://thepaleomama.com

https://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2011/10/two-minute-mayonnaise.html

*

CAVE CHICK RECIPES

JunieBee's Broccoli Chicken Casserole: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1OQ2hLIKQL7yEuJ...

SUPER SOUPS

Vampeye's Tomato-Basil with Shrimp Soup: https://drhyman.com/blog/2016/07/13/tomato-basil-s...

CAULIFLOWER HEAVEN

https://blog.paleohacks.com/cauliflower-recipes/

https://paleogrubs.com/cauliflower-recipes

https://www.brit.co/paleo-cauliflower-recipes/

SALAD DRESSING

http://eatdrinkpaleo.com.au/paleo-salad-dressings/

http://paleogrubs.com/salad-dressing-recipes

MAYO IN MINUTES

https://www.tasteslovely.com/easiest-3-minute-home...

https://dontwastethecrumbs.com/2015/04/failproof-diy-homemade-mayo-in-2-minutes/

COOKIES

https://wholenewmom.com/recipes/paleo-cookies-suga...

THICKENERS

https://www.marksdailyapple.com/low-carb-thickener/


Check out your charity:

https://www.charitynavigator.org/

(An excellent rating site that will help you make wise choices when considering a charity)

"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 10, 2018 12:20AM Jadedjo wrote:

@Egads007

Omg I'm never going to be able to eat tofu again without thinking "im having bean poop for supper".lol. Thanks for that laugh I needed it.

I've also never heard the term chicken ovulation either so that's a new one "huh,seriously?" Moment for me too.

This too shall pass. It might pass like a kidney stone but it will pass. Dx 7/2018, IDC, Right, Stage IA, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 10/1/2018 Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant
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Aug 10, 2018 12:41AM - edited Aug 10, 2018 12:43AM by Egads007

Jadedjo - So glad you found our cave and posted! A big Paleo welcome to you! Glad you got a laugh, and hope I didn't spoil tofu for you lol. There's more fun to come and plenty more laughs with the great group of Cave Chicks in this little community. They're a little quiet at the moment.....my fault really........I posted workout vids and dietary math homework today...who can blame em'! So yeah......"huh seriously" indeed. Breakfast may be tough for me in the morning, so I hear ya loud n' clear! I see you're VERY recently diagnosed, how are things going for you? Treatment plan in place yet?


"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 10, 2018 01:46AM - edited Aug 10, 2018 01:49AM by Jadedjo

@egads007

Thanks. 

So far it's surgery and I can't get an exact date on that until I see plastic surgeon which will probably be end of this month.the wheels turn slowly here.

After that they will decide further treatment. For now I'm working out whenever I can and will be doubling up on my Ellen barrett barefoot cardio series (mix  of Pilates,ballet and cardio) after our local heatwave stops (I keep it light in +30c or more days)along with my nighttime yoga because I know if I got my blood sugars,blood pressure under control and build some decent muscle before surgery my chances of a good recovery are better (length of time depends on if I'm a candidate for direct to implant or just going flat) I know it's going to be awhile before I can get back to working out afterwards my only exercise will be the stairs where I live on the top floor of a walk up.  trying my best to stay in the high protein,veggie and fruit diet my dietitian recommended but money is very tight. I'm also starting meditation as I'm going to need it when I'm at the hospital.i have issues with hospitals.last time I saw my father he was dead in the icu and my mom had a massive heart attack in the ambulance outside the hospital bay doors right in front of me  and we shut the machines 2 days later so ya,issues galore.for me hospitals are the place I lost the two people I had left  in the world.bless the people that work there but hospitals themselves only have painful memories for me. It's gonna be rough.

So trying my best to do some self care treatment to make the actual treatments flow better.nothing is guaranteed but if I can even reduce my risk of complications by 25% it's still 25% less then if I did nothing.

Wish I could afford to eat paleo but at this point it's pretty much chicken or fish wraps with spinach leaves and pickles ,frozen broccoli,peas and green bean and what's on sale  fruit with occasional tofu thrown in. I do tend to make a wrap one meal and a couple cups of veggies the other so it works out in the end. I'm chugging along best I can I guess. Also I'm going through my stuff deciding what to donate and keep so that's working the muscles too.

Blessed be.

This too shall pass. It might pass like a kidney stone but it will pass. Dx 7/2018, IDC, Right, Stage IA, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 10/1/2018 Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant
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Aug 10, 2018 03:08AM JunieB wrote:

A couple recipes that look quite yummy.

https://www.skinnytaste.com/healthy-salmon-quinoa-burgers/

https://www.skinnytaste.com/cubano-chicken-pickle-ham-and-swiss-chicken-roll-ups/

Surgery 7/28/1991 Lymph node removal: Underarm/Axillary; Mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (right): Tissue expander placement Dx 7/30/1991, IDC, Right, 1cm, Stage IIA, 0/25 nodes, ER+/PR+ Dx 8/28/2014, 2cm, Stage IV, metastasized to bone, ER+/PR+, HER2- Radiation Therapy 9/21/2014 External: Bone Hormonal Therapy 10/11/2014 Arimidex (anastrozole), Faslodex (fulvestrant) Targeted Therapy Ibrance (palbociclib)
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Aug 10, 2018 06:07AM - edited Aug 10, 2018 07:40AM by vampeyes

Welcome Jade - we love newbies! Glad to see you here, you will definitely enjoy this group of gals - lots of fun. P.S. I can't afford Paleo either, I am just taking it from the kids college funds. lolol

Egads - hahaha thanks for the early smile - bean poop. As for the chicken eggs, try to remember where it's coming from (like a vegatarian - hahahahaha) seriously though some people don't think about what they post before they hit send. Keep telling yourself that eggs came first! Loopy

I don't feel guilty - is that weird, but I know I will be back to my healthy eating today and working on my 30/20/50 macros. I got this and I enjoy the food more. Honestly I kept thinking maybe the cheat would somehow help me out with the weight loss stall. hahahaha yeah right!

Morning all.

Edited to add - DO NOT CHEAT!! My guts are hurting, I am gassy, and hot flashes???? I will never ever stray from my Paleo lifestyle again!

Diagnosed at 41. Oncotype 21 Dx 9/20/2017, IDC, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- (FISH) Surgery 10/18/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Surgery 11/15/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/29/2018 Whole-breast: Breast Hormonal Therapy 3/1/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 10, 2018 10:31AM - edited Aug 10, 2018 11:26AM by Egads007

Good morning princess peeps!!

Well, thankfully I had my coffee ready when I lost my whole response post....TWICE. My last post was crabby so I'll refrain from bee-oitching about it any further...….

Jade - Wow girlfriend, you have not had an easy time have you? What an awful loss you've suffered, in the worst way possible. I lost my dad years ago but still have my mother. She was my brick throughout it all, so I can't imagine how rough it must be for you to be dealing without a parent. My heart goes out to you....and understand the hospital PSTD....I get it now at every appointment, even approaching a medical facility feels icky. Hugs! Please know that all us Cave Chicks are here for you and got your back, keep us posted as to your progress. As for your diet, sounds pretty close to Paleo to me....well except for wheat based wraps lol. There is a bit of a misconception that paleo must be done with all organics & grass fed meat. Even with 'regular' grocery items a person would still be ahead of the game with a paleo bend to their regime. No need to go broke over it. I completely understand budgetary restrictions…..lived it a loooooong time as a single parent. It looks as if you are eating pretty darned healthy AND you exercise….awesome!!! You'll fit in here nicely! So happy you joined the crew!

Vamp - *Sound of Screeching Brakes* Wait a minute.....did you write "my Paleo Lifestyle"?!?!?!?!? DING DING! Ladies and germs, we have a convert!! Woot!! Keto to Paleo..........score 1 for our ancient ancestors :)))))))))) The paleo princess crown goes to you for the weekend babycakes! Oh and.....THANK YOU for posting your edit on the 'Dairy Queen Scandal'......it only confirms just how sugar (and other things) effect the body....especially the gut! I'm really glad you didn't feel guilty....ice cream ain't the worst cheat, and actually has decent nutritional profile. If you're not dairy sensitive it's paleo/primal. It's the white sugar in the processed stuff that gave you the Vegas Pizza Slap (lol....I love that new term). I'm going to post paleo ice cream recipes via a link today.....hot flash/gas/pain free too! Gonna have to make sure to post fry recipes with it LOL!! Hugs!

Junie - Hiya sweetie! Thanks for the recipe post.....looks great. There are a few ingredients that are def not Paleo, so if you don't mind I'm going to post a tweaked version for all to enjoy today....only if they care to stick to the no wheat/grain thing....otherwise I'm trying both recipes next week....they look awesome! Now, down to business.....I read that you're flying out to see the Mayo Clinic neurosurgeon on Monday. We'll all be there in spirit for you and will be looking for an update as soon as you ave news. Crossing my fingers, toes and eyes for good stuff! Big Hugs! How's your baby Kirby doing? Such a cutie!! He's gonna miss his momma while you're gone!

Ok, so off to get my foodie post together, hope y'all are too....btw.....where the heck are all of you?????

"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 10, 2018 11:18AM Egads007 wrote:

You can all come out of hiding…..no macros or exercise, promise! It's the day we've all been waiting for……

FOODIE FRIDAY!!!! Three cheers! Woot Woot Woot!!

Post your recipes, pics are nice but not necessary….post your fav method, kitchen tool or even kitchen reno….let's just set the weekend up right with our culinary ponderings!

Here's my entry…..Firecracker Grilled Shrimp, Grape Tomato & Red Onion, with Cilantro Lime Cauliflower rice:

Recipe at:: http://www.geniuskitchen.com/recipe/firecracker-shrimp-240223

Not into seafood? You can sub out for chicken, pork, beef, whatever!

Easy peasy, great way to use your BBQ. To be fair, I tweaked out the spice rub…..there isn't a recipe yet that I haven't fiddled with to suit our preference.The sweet paprika was switched to smoked paprika (loooove that stuff), and I added home ground chipotle pepper……just to be sure to make it hot enough to clean truck tires! Also, it calls for 1 tsp of garlic power….pull-eeessseee, are they kidding! I won't say how much I added, just know that the neighbors avoided me after dinner :))))

The cilantro lime cauli rice was simply stir fried up in a wee bit o' coconut oil, added the zest and juice of one lime and tossed in fresh cilantro when done…..salt & pepper too. Yummm, I love lime, it colours me happy!

Speaking of lime (which I use ALL the time along with lemon) I FINALLY bought a new juicer and it rocks my world! I've used the old fashioned 'screw' type, a spoon, hand squeezed, and even a chain saw :)))…..saw this little number at the local grocery store (they're on amazon and for you Canadians at Superstore)… Made of metal, has a slot for lime or lemons (clementines), strains and no pits, gets every last drop without pulling out a chain saw.…..it's a Martha Stewart kinda good thang'…..highly recommend!

So show us your stuff....food parade!

"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 10, 2018 09:40PM JunieB wrote:

Egads - Tweak away! Actually I forgot to check if those recipes were Paleo compliant. They just looked yummy and I wanted to share.

Kirby is doing good. I doubt he'll miss me that much. There are usually other dogs being boarded that he can play with. However, I will MISS him like CRAZY! The week I spent in the hospital last week felt like a month away from the little bug. Here he is sitting in the window watching everything. He even hauled his toys up and put them on the windowsill. He's too funny!

Surgery 7/28/1991 Lymph node removal: Underarm/Axillary; Mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (right): Tissue expander placement Dx 7/30/1991, IDC, Right, 1cm, Stage IIA, 0/25 nodes, ER+/PR+ Dx 8/28/2014, 2cm, Stage IV, metastasized to bone, ER+/PR+, HER2- Radiation Therapy 9/21/2014 External: Bone Hormonal Therapy 10/11/2014 Arimidex (anastrozole), Faslodex (fulvestrant) Targeted Therapy Ibrance (palbociclib)
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Aug 10, 2018 11:56PM - edited Aug 10, 2018 11:58PM by InnaB2018

Made Keto szechuan chicken for dinner. My family lovingly calls this dish 'chicken with green snot' because of spinach. It's delicious

Dx 3/26/2018, IDC, Right, 3cm, Stage IIA, Grade 3, 1/18 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 4/24/2018 Lymph node removal: Right, Sentinel, Underarm/Axillary; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): Tissue expander placement; Reconstruction (right): Tissue expander placement Chemotherapy 6/1/2018 AC + T (Taxol) Radiation Therapy 10/7/2018 3DCRT: Breast, Lymph nodes, Chest wall Hormonal Therapy Arimidex (anastrozole)
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Aug 11, 2018 12:33AM - edited Aug 11, 2018 12:33AM by ksusan

I've been at a convention but there's a diner with grass-fed beef and a Whole Foods nearby. Other than tasting a pork belly appetizer with a "maple glaze," I'm still entirely on plan. I am probably the only person at the convention eating chicharrones, though.

Mutant uprising quashed. Dx 1/2015, IDC, Right, Stage IIA, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 1/2015, DCIS, Left, Stage 0, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone) Surgery Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right Radiation Therapy Whole-breast Chemotherapy Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Taxotere (docetaxel)
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Aug 11, 2018 06:55AM vampeyes wrote:

Junnie - skinnytaste has many delicious recipes, I use to frequent her site when I was on Weight Watchers years ago. She caters to all diet styles. Thanks for the reminder to check out what's new on her site.

Diagnosed at 41. Oncotype 21 Dx 9/20/2017, IDC, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- (FISH) Surgery 10/18/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Surgery 11/15/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/29/2018 Whole-breast: Breast Hormonal Therapy 3/1/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 11, 2018 09:59AM JKL2017 wrote:

Yea, I'm officially out of food hell! Surgeon removed all my diet restrictions yesterday & said go forth & eat paleo. Started with a big salad topped with roasted chicken (I was in too much of a hurry to cook anything) & it was awesome. I'll probably continue eating small amounts of Greek yogurt (for the probiotics) while I heal but will primarily eat paleo. This experience sure convinced me that paleo is the way to go (at least for me)!

Just curious, but do any of you with dairy difficulties use Lactaid? Always worked like a charm for me.

Egads, hope your plumbing issues are behind you (oh, that was bad).

Dx 2/2/2017, ILC, Right, 2cm, Stage IIA, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 3/7/2017 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Sentinel Radiation Therapy 3/20/2017 Multi-catheter: Breast Hormonal Therapy 5/24/2017 Arimidex (anastrozole), Aromasin (exemestane)
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Aug 12, 2018 10:15AM - edited Aug 12, 2018 10:19AM by TwoHobbies

Hi, everyone. I didnt disappear but just very busy during the week with work, and I am stuck with Ipad because laptop is on the fritz. Its so slow to type on this that I dont like to post as much.

Junie best of luck at Mayo and I have been in the hospital for infection. Not fun! Glad you conquered that.

Jade welcome and so sorry about your parents and your ill feeling about the hospital. Definitely try some meditations and I would even tell the staff so maybe they can give you extra care. PTSD is real.

Vamp I tried this crazy diet called The Plan and she believes that some of the"healthy" foods we eat are causing us to retain and gain weight. It was a very complicated process but I did lose 13 pounds on the diet. In my case, I learned that white potato causes me to gain weight every time, and a few other weird things that led me to go Paleo. However I seem to be intolerant of bacon or sausage even if it is “clean". So it made me wonder if something you are eating, even if it is Paleo, might be unfavorable to your body chemistry. You might try writing down what you eat every day and weigh yourself every day. Then you know what works for you and not.

Round 1 -bmx, tug flap reconstruction, tamoxifen. Local Recurrence-excision, TCx4, radiation, Zoladex, Anastrazole. Dx 2/22/2011, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIA, Grade 2, 0/7 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 4/25/2013, <1cm, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Aug 12, 2018 02:08PM vampeyes wrote:

TwoHobbies - can you get SWIPE on your ipad? I have it on my phone, you just swipe to the letters to spell the word. Sometimes my phone likes to put in its own words though. 🤔 I have to ask, maybe I have already.... what are your two hobbies? Thank you for the suggestions, not sure I could weigh every day, may depress me. Lol.

JKL how are you feeling?

Ksusan that's fantastic you are able to stay on plan while away. What's your secret? I find restaurants just don't have a lot of healthy options.

Today is the twins birthday party, think I am ready. DH is away for work 🙄 Found out the basement is leaking when DS2 and I brought up the folding table. Spent the morning moving stuff and taking out fiberglass, got it laying down with fans blowing on it to dry. Maddening, the house is barely 6 years old! I hope this is covered somehow in the hours warranty. The real problem is that we just had the twins toy room finished a year and a half ago and I am pretty sure the water leaked on their side too. At least now I know what the smell is, DS1 kept telling me he farted. 😂🤣

Diagnosed at 41. Oncotype 21 Dx 9/20/2017, IDC, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- (FISH) Surgery 10/18/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Surgery 11/15/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/29/2018 Whole-breast: Breast Hormonal Therapy 3/1/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 12, 2018 07:51PM JKL2017 wrote:

Vamp, how was the birthday party? How old are your twins? (I laughed at DS1's comment; boys just love that kind of humor, don't they?) So sorry you're dealing with all those leaks, especially now!

I'm feeling great (thanks for asking, Vamp). I'm just frustrated that I'm not supposed to do so many of the things I feel like doing. Can you imagine six weeks without the gym? At least I can walk & resume my PT exercises. Now to get back on the paleo train!

JunieB, I hope the Mayo Clinic provides the answer you need. Keep us posted. Your Kirby is a cutie; it's no wonder you find it so hard to be away from him.

Welcome, JadedJo, the more the merrier here in the cave!

Dx 2/2/2017, ILC, Right, 2cm, Stage IIA, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 3/7/2017 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Sentinel Radiation Therapy 3/20/2017 Multi-catheter: Breast Hormonal Therapy 5/24/2017 Arimidex (anastrozole), Aromasin (exemestane)
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Aug 12, 2018 08:32PM Jadedjo wrote:

Thank you all

This too shall pass. It might pass like a kidney stone but it will pass. Dx 7/2018, IDC, Right, Stage IA, Grade 2, 0/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 10/1/2018 Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant
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Aug 12, 2018 11:55PM ksusan wrote:

I'd say a combination of choosing some restaurants beforehand by looking at menus and reviews, choosing some spontaneously based on the menu, and having on-diet snacks packed. For example, we went to Whole Foods and I picked up prosciutto and fresh mozzarella, which I put in a bag and ate for lunch the next day. Also, being really clear about what's on diet and then ordering it. For example, on keto,

  • Breakfast: Eggs, bacon, coffee with half and half and MCT oil from a packet, water with lemon.
  • Snack: Chicharrones (<1 g. sugar), water.
  • Lunch: Guacamole with radish slices, salad of lettuce, jicama, scant mango, cucumber with fork dipped in no-sugar dressing, no-sugar grilled shrimp, unsweetened iced tea.
  • Dinner: Cheeseburger (no ketchup, no bun) with mustard, Cholula, lettuce, slice tomato, dill pickles, steamed broccoli with butter, side salad (no croutons) with olive oil, water.
  • Evening snack: Mozzarella, olives.
It also helps a lot to have a spouse who supports your diet and will wander off for nachos or ice cream while you're doing something else rather than insist that you eat at, say, a pizza place.

*

Today's new food:

I'm not a giant fan of cauliflower, but I have to say that mashed cauliflower is really good. I looked at a bunch of recipes, then did this: Cut the florets from a small head of cauliflower. Don't use stems. Break florets into small pieces. Steam in a covered stove top steamer until a fork easily goes right through them. While you wait for this, melt about 5T unsalted butter. You could shred up some kale, but I didn't. Shred some cheese and a little shredded prosciutto. Remove cauliflower from heat and uncover. Rest it for a few minutes. Drain any water that collected in the steamer insert. Drain the water from the bottom pot. Move the steamed cauliflower to the bottom pot. Mash with a potato masher until it looks pretty mashed. Add the melted butter, granulated garlic, salt, and pepper. Other herbs would work, too. Use a handheld blender to blend until it looks like mashed potatoes. Some recipes suggest letting it rest a few minutes then blending it again. Spoon some into a bowl. Add cheese and prosciutto (and kale). Add more cauliflower. Top with cheese and meat if you want more.

Mutant uprising quashed. Dx 1/2015, IDC, Right, Stage IIA, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 1/2015, DCIS, Left, Stage 0, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone) Surgery Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right Radiation Therapy Whole-breast Chemotherapy Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Taxotere (docetaxel)
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Aug 13, 2018 05:21AM vampeyes wrote:

JKL - I was concerned at first with the party, I can't relax at these things. I hate hosting for that reason. Then Chad's aunt suggested that maybe the garden I put in was the problem, so I obviously got upset, because of all the time, money and hard work I put into it. We did look eventually and thankfully it's not the garden height at least. I thought for sure I would be taking a sledgehammer to the wall. My mood did turn back around eventually and the night went well, tried to get the boys to let me have the birthday cards and them the presents, but they were not falling for that! lol

I totally understand how you feel about the working out, I am trying to do little bit everyday of some kind of activity. Like Egads told me I am basically starting over again and have to rebuild - can't go by what was. I am contemplating a gym membership next month once the kids are back to school, but we will shall see. I am cheap (haha) and feel uncomfortable at the gym, I have my stepper, weights, trampoline, exercise ball, and my bike...... just need to start using them more! Can you do some yoga?

Ksusan - thank you for posting those examples, this will help me when it's time to pack up for our family vacation to Niagara Falls. Looking forward to the vacation, but not the eating out part! Mashed cauliflower work great on Shepherd's pie too.



Diagnosed at 41. Oncotype 21 Dx 9/20/2017, IDC, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- (FISH) Surgery 10/18/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Surgery 11/15/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/29/2018 Whole-breast: Breast Hormonal Therapy 3/1/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 09:37AM Egads007 wrote:

Happy Vegas Monday Cave Chicks!!

I have to report an 'indiscretion' in the form of a 1" square piece of cheese over the weekend. Not really a cheat as I'm paleo/primal BUT, I should know better. I had the same punishment that Vamp suffered with her dairy queen scandal. My tummy resembled the goodyear blimp, and felt & ended like the Hindenberg :))))))

Junie – I'm sure Kirby will be missing you in between all the fun he'll be having! Great pic, he's such a cutie, and looks SO soft! Don't worry about checking recipes for Paleo compliance, I think it's a great way to show all how almost any recipe can be tweaked. When I started out I would ignore recipes I could have tweaked, so it's all good, keep on posting! You're in our thoughts today on your flight out to the Mayo (great name for a hospital lol….mayo is good for everything). Keep us posted on your progress as you can. We're with you in spirit! Hugs!!

Inna (godda davida) – LOL, lovely name for your dish….chicken n' snot (*gulp*). When I was a kid my mum would buy potato scones, we called them giraffe skin….must have been my early leaning towards paleo :)))) I ADORE anything and everything Szechuan, so please post your recipe if you can…..you've got me craving it, even with the *gulp* name your family labelled it LOL!!

Giraffe Skin :)))))

Ksusan – Hope your convention went (or is going) well! Chicharrones (pork rinds or pork belly) is to DIE for! Hopefully the maple glaze was just maple syrup (paleo), but if not I still bet it was delish! Excellent advice regarding restaurant choices! Doing your homework ahead of time (most restaurants post their menus online) and using good ol' common sense is helpful. I usually assume that veg oil is being used so steer clear of most fried items. Most grocery stores also carry premade salad meals and as long as their dressings are avoided it can make for a handy lunch. My local also carries small portions of roast chicken that I can add into the mix. Your cauliflower post is also excellent. It's one of the most versatile go-to food for paleo peeps. I've even made brownies out of the stuff!

JKL – YAY!!! Back in the land of food living….great news! So happy that you've been given that get out of jail free card! As for lactaid and dairy, nada, zilch, zip. Does nuttin' for me. I found out that it's not the lactose that bothers me, but the casein (another nasty lil' inflammatory in dairy). It has the same effect but unlike lactose it takes 6-12 hours to kick in. This is why full fat dairy is always the best choice (hard cheeses are best for me),as they have less casein. Great, now I want Brie :)))))

TwoH Whew! Glad to see you're still with us! Strangely enough my laptop is acting up lately too. Making posts on an iphone can drive me around the bend so I guess I better get shopping! I sympathize with your computer woes….they can make me tear my hair out! (like I need baldness ever again in my life LOL) As for Vamp, we may have worked out the problem. Her macros (at least IMHO) were a bit out of whack. I'm hoping to see improvement and good news soon. Our wonderful Vamp is one determined lady. As for your bacon & sausage sensitivity….just wondering out loud here….could the problem be a pork sensitivity or allergy? Btw, how is your son doing with the pasta deal? Did you ever get the amazon pasta? I'm curious whether it's worth buying for a treat.

VampA big belated Happy B day to the twins! They grow too fast don't they? My little cave monster is ready to head out and forge for himself soon….he was like 6 yesterday!!! I am SO sorry about your leak issue!! I feel ya there! If we have to replace our pipe completely it's going to tear up our front lawn…right through hundreds of dollars worth of boxwoods, shrubs AND stone wall along with front stone steps *SCREAM*. So I'm really happy to read your garden isn't the prob. Have you had it looked at yet? I know that water tends to travel and is a bastard to find where it's coming from…..my caveman has searched for more leaks than you can shake a stick at in his career. My fingers & toes crossed it's a simple fast fix for you…keep us posted. It looks like a few of our caves are turning into headaches J))))As for the gym….best money you'll ever spend (and I'm cheap too! :)))) Paying monthly makes sure you go and go more often LOL!

To add to Ksusan's cauliflower post: Ok, so yesterday my cavedude n' I got busy. No....not that! :))) There was a sale on cauliflower so I bought 6 big heads of it. We dragged out the food processors and pulverized it all down to cauli-rice. Now, cauliflower up here in Canada can get really expensive (once saw it for 7.99 a head!!!!) so when I saw it at 1.29 I jumped all over it.....had to fight off two old ladies, thank god for the gym :))))) The wonderful thing about cauliflower is that it can be riced and frozen flat pack for future use. Six heads gave me 5 extra large and two large ziplock bags o' the stuff. Flat packed takes up less room in the freezer. Simply defrost, steam, mash, fry, add to baking or casseroles, whatever...just darned convenient (the lime cilantro cauli rice in my last pic was from frozen). Only problem....well, it makes a helluva mess when processing. We find it in our hair right on out to the front lawn :))))))

Here's my haul:

On to another paleo/primal clean livin' week for me...……….who's wit' me?????


"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 11:29AM Pi-Xi wrote:

Hi Egads! Thanks for all the work you put into this thread. Although I'm only a cave visitor and not a resident, I appreciate it!

Vampeyes, I never dreamed I'd be extolling the virtues of Beachbody, but I've been on it for three years now and for 99USD/ year I have access to so many different workout programs at all different levels of difficulty including yoga. I stream workouts daily. I was able to start doing the programs daily again five weeks after BMX with direct to implant reconstruction because there is such a great range of intensity levels. (I do belong to a Facebook accountability group whose members are former dancers from the same group, so it feels completely normal to us. I don't really need the accountability- cancer is way more than enough incentive for me, but it is a way to keep in touch. The Let's Post Our Daily Exercise page here serves the same purpose.) I love that it is home fitness and I never have to go to the gym. I have had to buy new weights periodically as I get stronger! I have also developed a rather severe active wear purchasing addiction. 🤣
Oncotype 12 Dx 4/7/2016, DCIS, Left, 2cm, Stage 0, Grade 1, ER+/PR+ Surgery 7/11/2016 Mastectomy: Left; Prophylactic mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant Dx 8/3/2016, DCIS/IDC/IDC: Papillary, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, ER+/PR+, HER2- Hormonal Therapy 9/1/2016 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 01:18PM Egads007 wrote:

Helllloooo PIXI!

Thanks so much for your kind words! Very glad someone is actually reading all my blabbering :))) it's truly a labour of love...and truth be known if it wasn't for every single one of the cave chick's contributions this thread wouldn't be the awesome & informative community that it is....takes a village! Oh and btw....you may be from a neighboring tribe, but we'll always roll out the grass mat rug and save a place around the fire pit for you!

Check back Wednesday, your words to Vamp has inspired a Workout Wednesday post idea!

Workout clothing addiction...heh heh...oh I feel ya' on that.....



"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 02:55PM vampeyes wrote:

Egads - you have inspired me to get my tomato canning started! Lots to do - Salsa, Pizza Sauce and plain old Sauce. I guess I should throw in some cauliflower for the winter months, thanks for that suggestion! :) As for the basement, it stinks, but looks like it is starting to dry up, the basement people are coming Wednesday night to have a look. No idea where it's coming from. I will keep my fingers crossed you do not have to replace the pipe all the way to the house, that would be awful! I would cry for you, maybe even fly out to help you re-landscape. Loopy May have to get a Gofundme page going for both of us. hahahaha

Pi - you're right staying at home is much better - save money, I don't have to drive anywhere, no body staring at me (not that they are, just that low self esteem kicking) lol and I have YouTube full of all kinds of wonderful videos!

I DID IT! I finally completed the darn 40 minute video! Usually I quit after 20 minutes, but today I was able to finished it. YAY!!!

Taking my pup to the vet today, her anxiety is seriously getting out of control.

Diagnosed at 41. Oncotype 21 Dx 9/20/2017, IDC, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- (FISH) Surgery 10/18/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Surgery 11/15/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/29/2018 Whole-breast: Breast Hormonal Therapy 3/1/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 03:18PM Pi-Xi wrote:

Way to go, vampeyes! I am happy you finished the video. Congratulations!

This cave is lovely to visit, Egads and all residents!

Oncotype 12 Dx 4/7/2016, DCIS, Left, 2cm, Stage 0, Grade 1, ER+/PR+ Surgery 7/11/2016 Mastectomy: Left; Prophylactic mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant Dx 8/3/2016, DCIS/IDC/IDC: Papillary, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, ER+/PR+, HER2- Hormonal Therapy 9/1/2016 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 06:21PM Egads007 wrote:

Vamp - LOL looks like we both have stinky houses...it smells like dirty feet in our basement, add the freshly ground cauliflower to the mix and it’s got us calling our plumbing Dexter! I hope you’re going through insurance and that you’re not out of pocket at all! Hugs for the landscaping offer and I’ll take you up on it in a New York minute...just wait until the the Dexter Scent recedes LOL! Bring some tomato sauce...sounds so good! High 5s on the vid...40 mins!!! So awesome, you’ll be ‘rebuilt’ in no time!! Makin’ us all proud!! More hugs foryour anxious pup!!


"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 13, 2018 09:32PM ksusan wrote:

Ooh, I hadn't thought of shepherd's pie! Or ricing and freezing cauliflower (which was previously 3rd from the bottom of my preferred vegetables list).

This week I'm comparing MCT oil packets vs. MCT oil capsules. I can't find enough information to figure out if they've got comparable levels of medium chain triglycerides, so I'm just using each for a day or so and seeing how they sit. Since I am not losing any weight (beyond ~4# initially) and my fasting blood sugar is hanging at 110-115, it's more a question of how they taste, whether they reduce my appetite, relative convenience for travel, and cost per serving.

I have more business travel coming up, so I'm thinking through the areas around the conference hotels. Guessing a Philly cheesesteak is out, though I might eat it without the roll. Also thinking about Thanksgiving, though keto (if I'm still doing it by then) is much easier than vegan at a holiday. Suggestions for a gravy thickener that isn't flour and isn't gross?

Mutant uprising quashed. Dx 1/2015, IDC, Right, Stage IIA, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 1/2015, DCIS, Left, Stage 0, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone) Surgery Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right Radiation Therapy Whole-breast Chemotherapy Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Taxotere (docetaxel)
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Aug 13, 2018 10:21PM - edited Aug 13, 2018 11:25PM by Egads007

Susan - thickening can be done by simple reduction or by mixing a spoonful of arrowroot powder or tapioca starch with cold water to create a slurry....add a wee bit at a time, whisk well and leave a minute between additions until you get desired thickness. Same as you would with cornstarch. You might want to practice a few times on other gravies, soups or stews before the big day. The very first time I used arrowroot I had a gloopy mess in my hands. I learned to use a light hand while adding the slurry a few drops at a time. Lastly, you can also use mashed cauliflower or a bit of mashed white potato to thicken.

I've also heard of using almond or coconut flour but haven't tried this method yet as knowing how these flours 'work', I can't imagine they'd give the silky results most of us want from our gravy.

Edited to add: link to a thickener article (little more purist) by my Paleo guru Mark Sisson: https://www.marksdailyapple.com/low-carb-thickener/

I’ll add to original post for anyone’s future reference. ;)

"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 14, 2018 12:45AM ksusan wrote:

Thanks! I think I'll play with cauliflower (my wife is a bit reactive to tapioca).

Mutant uprising quashed. Dx 1/2015, IDC, Right, Stage IIA, 1/1 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 1/2015, DCIS, Left, Stage 0, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone) Surgery Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right Radiation Therapy Whole-breast Chemotherapy Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Taxotere (docetaxel)
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Aug 14, 2018 08:11AM - edited Aug 14, 2018 08:31AM by Egads007

TWO CENT TUESDAY (brought to you by the other side of paleo, life!)

All I want for Christmas is my two front teeth...……..and your opinions

Children's Christmas lists are delightfully funny, and seem to have a common theme running through them no matter where in the world they are written……the latest toy 'du jour' is probably the #1 request. This is shortly followed by the 'impossible gifts'. A pony (imagine that in your livingroom, like you don't have enough sh*t to pick up already!) or a brother/sister (a difficult feat to master by Christmas day in most cases). Well, on Christmas 2017 I fulfilled my caveman's childhood x-mas present fantasy. No, I didn't give birth or start a stable in the livingroom. I bought him Ancestry's DNA testing kit.

Long story short, within 15.3 seconds of receiving the test results an email arrived…..along with his shiny new big brother. After much backing and forthing we have confirmed this to be true. Science doesn't lie, and apparently science is quite the gossip to boot! It revealed that my caveman's father had set life in motion shortly after returning from WWII. He was just 30 when the great event took place, 8 years before he met his wife. By all accounts he was never aware of the child's existence (confirmed by family). My caveman's father passed away in 1999 and his mother has been alone since that time. Age 86, frail, and often telling us about her wonderful nightly dreams of him. She insists he's waiting on the other side, arms open, romantic reunion. Sweet eh?

Here is the conundrum, do we tell her?

My gut instinct says no. Perhaps it would wrench all her blissful romantic notions and throw them on the rubbish heap. She worked hard, raised 6 kids, broke a hip at 78 and as a pièce de résistance, went through colon cancer surgery at age 80. She's been left her weakened and older than her years. Does she really need to hear this breaking news so late in the game? Does she not deserve the peace of blissful romantic ignorance?

My logical mind thinks she's a grown woman, quite liberal, and has a right to know. Perhaps she would want to meet her stepson before her days end, which in reality could be any day now. Her husband put family at numero uno….always (as does my caveman does, following in his father's footsteps). If it were me I'd want to know….and treat the stepson the way my caveman would….with loving family acceptance.

Thing is, I'm NOT her and come from a very different time. A great deal of the problem is generational. This lady was born and raised in an era where shame was heaped on kiddies born out of wedlock & virginity was key before marriage. Victorian values were still glaringly prevalent. Ultimately the decision will be made between my caveman and his siblings, but he's asked for my input. I'm still opting to keep the news on the down low, leaving the lady to die in peace, making her way back to the man she loves, uninhibited by what might be hurtful news.

So what say y'all? Which way would you turn?

P.S. I'm SO happy to be getting a shiny new brother-in-law, we call the one I have now the same thing that's at the end of the human digestive tract :))))

"I base all my fashion choices on what doesn't itch" (Gilda Radner) Chemotherapy 3/20/2013 Doxil (doxorubicin), Taxol (paclitaxel) Surgery 8/23/2013 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Right Radiation Therapy 11/1/2013 Whole-breast: Breast, Lymph nodes Dx IDC, 4cm, Stage IIB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR- Hormonal Therapy Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 14, 2018 09:09AM vampeyes wrote:

I don't know Egads, I think that if she is that close to the end of time what's the point in stirring the pot? What if she doesn't take it quite as well as you hope? Honestly though you guys know her best and should be able to judge her reaction......good luck with that decision! xxx

Diagnosed at 41. Oncotype 21 Dx 9/20/2017, IDC, Left, 1cm, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- (FISH) Surgery 10/18/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Surgery 11/15/2017 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 1/29/2018 Whole-breast: Breast Hormonal Therapy 3/1/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Aug 14, 2018 11:17AM JKL2017 wrote:

Wow, Egads, that's like something from a novel! Do you & DH foresee a relationship with his new brother?

As to your question, I have to agree with Vamp - don't tell her. I say this for several reasons:

1. The generational issue you mention is very important. Women of her age are generally very concerned with how they are viewed by others. It's possible she would feel judged or pitied by outsiders if this fact were to come to light. Even if this is absolutely untrue, it might permanently affect how she thinks others will see her;

2. It could cast doubt on how she viewed her relationship with your FIL. She might wonder if he had deep feelings for the mother of this child. She could never know what went on between them or what things they might have said to one another. What if she came to believe that this other woman had been the great, unrequited love of his life? Such feelings could cause her pain;

3. It could lead her to question whether your FIL had been honest about other things in their marriage. It appears that he was unaware of this child, but your MIL will never truly know whether that is factual. And even if he didn't know, did he ever tell her that he had sexual relationships other than theirs? If he kept either of those things from her she might wonder what else he didn't tell her. You don't want her going down that path.

The problem is that your FIL is no longer here to answer any questions she (or your DH & his siblings) might have. It sounds as though she is happily contemplating their reunion & I would be hesitant to do anything that could undermine that. Of course, the ultimate decision rests with DH & his siblings. But I would tread very carefully. Once she is told, you can't take it back. Keeping this from your MIL is certainly going to be difficult for all of you but, as adults, we make difficult decisions every day. And what better reason to make such a choice than to protect someone we love (especially someone vulnerable).

I do think that "the times, they are a'changing" & that this dilemma is much less likely to affect my generation & yours. And that is a good thing! I wish your DH the best of luck making this decision. I'm certain his family will do what they feel is best. Please let us know what happens!

Just curious, is your DH glad he did the DNA test & would he do it again, given the results? (You don't have to answer that; I just find this whole issue really fascinating.)

Dx 2/2/2017, ILC, Right, 2cm, Stage IIA, Grade 2, 0/3 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 3/7/2017 Lumpectomy: Right; Lymph node removal: Sentinel Radiation Therapy 3/20/2017 Multi-catheter: Breast Hormonal Therapy 5/24/2017 Arimidex (anastrozole), Aromasin (exemestane)

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