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Topic: Does anyone take DIM with Tamoxifen?

Forum: Complementary and Holistic Medicine and Treatment — Complementary medicine refers to treatments that are used WITH standard treatment. Holistic medicine is a term used to describe therapies that attempt to treat the patient as a whole person.

Posted on: Oct 16, 2013 01:01PM

gemini4 wrote:

Subject line pretty much says it all -- I take Tamoxifen along with DIM, D3, and Turmeric. I know a number of ladies here take DIM instead of Tamoxifen, but I'm wondering how many take both.

Age 48 at Dx, pre-menopause / OncoType score 16, no chemo Dx 12/7/2012, ILC, 1cm, Stage IB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 12/19/2012 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel Surgery 1/14/2013 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 2/10/2013 Breast, Lymph nodes Hormonal Therapy 4/3/2013 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Oct 16, 2013 05:37PM crazyride43 wrote:

Gemini, I do. I take DIM, fish oil, turmeric and a multi every morning, and take my tamoxifen at night.

I am so glad you started this thread. I hope others will come along - hopefully someone that knows about the clinical trial using both DIM and tamoxifen.

Dx 1/9/2012, IDC, 2cm, Stage IIA, Grade 2, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Oct 16, 2013 07:23PM gemini4 wrote:

My MO had not heard of DIM, so I sent her information about the clinical trial and Memorial Sloan-Kettering's website info about DIM. Her response was that it looked very interesting but that she couldn't comment on safety or efficacy (since that's what the research is trying to establish). She left it up to me -- but I figured she would advise me NOT to take it if she felt it would be unsafe. My feeling is that it's OK to do since there's a clinical trial going on that combines DIM with Tamoxifen. But I do admit wondering if it's a good idea most days when I take them together. I have no qualms, though, about the turmeric or D3 supplements that I take.

Age 48 at Dx, pre-menopause / OncoType score 16, no chemo Dx 12/7/2012, ILC, 1cm, Stage IB, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 12/19/2012 Lumpectomy: Left; Lymph node removal: Left, Sentinel Surgery 1/14/2013 Lumpectomy: Left Radiation Therapy 2/10/2013 Breast, Lymph nodes Hormonal Therapy 4/3/2013 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Oct 20, 2013 08:35PM new2bc wrote:

crazyride43,

I have been considering adding either Dim or Indole 3 carbinol to Tamoxifen. I asked my oncologist and he said he does not know what they are. But if they have something to do with hormones, he does not recommend it. It is very confusing figuring out what to do. What dose of Dim are you taking daily? Did it cause any side effects such as more stiffness? Also, what multivitamin are you taking? I am shopping for a good multivitamin these days. Thank you.

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Oct 31, 2013 09:39AM shelly56 wrote:

What is DIM ?  And can I buy tumeric at Wal-Mart or is it only at health food places ?

"Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear - not absence of fear." Dx 1/26/2009, IDC, Right, 6cm+, Stage IIIA, Grade 3, 4/15 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2-
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Oct 31, 2013 10:05AM abigail48 wrote:

DIM is the extract from cruciferous vegetable which have protective nature for cancer & help if you have it.I conjecture that the operating factor is sulfur

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Oct 31, 2013 12:38PM - edited Oct 31, 2013 12:39PM by new2bc

Hi Shelly56,

Based on my research it is best to buy Curcumin (not turmeric) that has bioperine (black pepper) in it. You have a better chance finding it online instead of walmart. The black pepper will make curcumin work better. Also make sure you check your vitamin D3 level and based on that take additional Vitamin D3. 

Anyone else uses DIM with Tamoxifen? Anyone taking I3C? Does it make you more stiff?

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Nov 15, 2013 01:11PM - edited Nov 15, 2013 01:15PM by buftup

I'm no doctor, but it's my understanding that DIM provides "good" estrogen. There are 3 kinds of estrogen: estrone, estradiol and estriol, and they all have the ability to lock on to estrogen receptors. Estradiol is the "bad" one that you don't want on your receptors. I can't remember which of the other 2 is the good one, but it's the one contained in DIM. If the estrogen receptors are occupied by good estrogen, there's no seat available for the bad estradiol. Phyto-estrogens such as soy and wild mushrooms are also good at adhering to estrogen receptors, thereby taking up the seats that might have been occupied by estradiol.

So, should we take both tamox and DIM? I haven't discussed it with my oncologist, but the tamox literature states that it binds to estrogen receptors. Looks to me (again, not a doctor) like tamox and DIM are basically doing the same thing, but perhaps tamox is more reliable? more potent? Not sure, but I'm going to take both. Took my first tamox today because my oncologist says new tests are showing it to be even more effective at preventing recurrence. Have been doing DIM for 2 years, and will continue.

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Nov 15, 2013 07:38PM 4sewwhat wrote:

I took DIM with Tamoxifen for 8-9 weeks before my initial surgery. I could feel my tumor getting softer. When they did my surgical pathology my numbers had changed and my Ki-67 had even dropped from 9 to 7. My surgeon said it was making a difference. I was taking a whole slew of things but was more selective during chemo and rads about what I took. I did not do Tumeric because the Sloan Kettering Integrative website said that it could actually make Cytoxan less effective. I figured if I was going to do it I should not do anything to counteract it!

I just finished rads weds and started back on tammy yesterday. I will start the DIM and the Breast D as well. The lady that owns the health food store I go to says that they do basically the same thing and I don't need to take both, but it doesn't hurt either. So I do both! Maybe I am doubling my protection! Winking

Best of luck ladies!!!

47 when diagnosed 15 months after I originally went to doc about lump I found :( oncotype 13. Cold capping pics on my blog LaughingThruBreastCancer.blogs... Dx 3/25/2013, ILC, 5cm, Stage IIB, Grade 1, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 5/20/2013, ILC, 6cm+, Stage IIIC, Grade 1, 22/32 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Chemotherapy 6/14/2013 Cytoxan (cyclophosphamide), Taxotere (docetaxel) Radiation Therapy 9/30/2013 Breast, Lymph nodes
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Apr 22, 2014 03:33PM new_direction wrote:

I'm considering adding DIM/I3C to tamox and giving tam SE get too terrible I'll just drop it.

Does anyone have any news about it? its getting late here but I just found this article:

http://www.wellnessresources.com/health/articles/i3c_and_dim_for_breast_prostate_cancer_prevention/

This lead to another study by the same researchers to see if the I3C was as effective as Tamoxifen, which carries numerous undesirable side effects. They injected the first group of human breast cancer cells with I3C, a second with Tamoxifen, and a third with I3C and Tamoxifen. The cells injected with Tamoxifen alone experienced a 60 percent inhibition in DNA synthesis, the cells injected with I3C had a 90 percent inhibition, and the combination had a 95 percent reduction. These studies support the use of I3C for the prevention of a recurrence of breast cancer.

Can anyone suggest a brand? are you also taking I3C or just DIM?

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Nov 9, 2018 06:46AM Palesa2018 wrote:

Hi, I'm hoping this discussion can be revived. I've been taking i3c/dim while waiting to start tamoxifen after radiation. And I was comfortable with it. I have now started Tamoxifen and I'm wondering if I can take both at the same time? I get they might have the same effect but I would not want to risk making Tamoxifen less effective. For those who have been taking both for a while what has been your experience?

Dx 6/7/2018, DCIS/IDC, Right, <1cm, Stage IA, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 6/12/2018 Lymph node removal: Sentinel Surgery 7/9/2018 Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant Surgery 8/9/2018 Hormonal Therapy 9/12/2018 Zoladex (goserelin) Radiation Therapy 9/16/2018 Whole-breast: Breast, Chest wall Hormonal Therapy 11/4/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Nov 9, 2018 07:14AM dtad wrote:

Hi everyone...I take DIM in leu of an aromatase inhibitor not Tamoxifen. IMO you should take one or the other. Taking it with Tamoxifen is not only redundant but I would be afraid it could interfere with it. I also think you would be hard pressed to find any studies on it. Good luck to all.

Dx 3/20/2015, IDC, Left, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 2, ER+/PR+, HER2- Dx 4/10/2015, ILC, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 2, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 5/21/2015 Lymph node removal: Sentinel; Mastectomy: Left, Right; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant
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Nov 9, 2018 03:45PM Palesa2018 wrote:

Thank you. I decided to stop DIM and go conventional. Will see how it goes. Keeping positive. One week in with Tamoxifen. So far so good...

Dx 6/7/2018, DCIS/IDC, Right, <1cm, Stage IA, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2- Surgery 6/12/2018 Lymph node removal: Sentinel Surgery 7/9/2018 Mastectomy: Left, Right; Prophylactic mastectomy: Left; Reconstruction (left): Silicone implant; Reconstruction (right): Silicone implant Surgery 8/9/2018 Hormonal Therapy 9/12/2018 Zoladex (goserelin) Radiation Therapy 9/16/2018 Whole-breast: Breast, Chest wall Hormonal Therapy 11/4/2018 Tamoxifen pills (Nolvadex, Apo-Tamox, Tamofen, Tamone)
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Nov 17, 2018 09:22PM LoriRuth wrote:

I do take DIM before breast cancer surgery on Dec 5th. I know longer than that because I have swim meet on Dec 1-2. This week my boss was out of town so no one take my place. My boss will take my place on Dec 5 and 6. I can't do vacuum and mopping at work. I will leave there until 2 weeks at Post surgery appt. I do take DIM. Little effect side so not much. Little fog. Dark urine. Not bad. Good sleep. I do take supreme green tea, vitamin C, Muiltvitamins with Ogema 3, Vitamin D and more, Calcuim and Vitamin D3. Wait to see what happen when I will take blood test on Nov 30. Positive go negative. Wait to see. I hate go through Radiation. I read Breast Cancer women wrote about Radiation. Some them abuse Breast Cancer women. That scare me. I tried to rid of cancer stage 1 invasive ductal carcinoma.

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Oct 7, 2019 07:14PM Begone wrote:

how is the tamoxifen going for you

Dx 10/15/2015, IDC: Tubular, Right, Grade 3, ER+/PR-, HER2+
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Oct 15, 2019 01:04PM Starryeyes wrote:

I'm 6 mos past surgery & onc suggested Anastrozole. Tried it a few weeks but felt an emotional wreck so stopped. Onc offered me Tamoxifen, but I declined. Told her about DIM & she seemed receptive but hadn't heard of it. Next visit she told me not to bring up DIM again, which I hadn't intended to do. She acted so unfriendly at this 2nd visit & was reluctant to do a breast exam saying it was my surgeon's responsibility. She did it though after I got up to leave. It was the most painful breast exam ever, hurt for days after. I will never go back. But I do see my surgeon soon for my last check up. I stopped DIM for various reasons but started up only to stop again. Starting it again. Think I should do something & the literature seems promising.

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Oct 18, 2019 11:23AM VioletKali wrote:

What made you stop taking DIM?

I am a 5 year Survivor that cannot take tamox because I take an SSRI that has worked well for me for 19 years, and I am not ruining my good mental health by trying something different. As a Nirse with a psych background, among many experiences, sometimes you don't fox what is not broken.

I AM in menopause. AIs were no good, I tried for 4 months and developed trigger finger and pain-NOPE.

I began taking DIM a few days ago, because the research is exceptionally promising.

My tumor was 1.7cm, 10% of it was noted to be DCIS. No family history of cancer at all. Discontinued Chemo d/t uncontrollable side effects which caused hospitalizations, blood transfusions, and poor quality of life. I am doing well! Dx 6/19/2014, IDC, 1cm, Stage IA, Grade 3, 0/10 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+ Dx 6/19/2014, DCIS, Stage 0 Surgery 8/17/2014 Mastectomy: Left; Prophylactic mastectomy: Right; Reconstruction (left): Tissue expander placement; Reconstruction (right): Tissue expander placement Targeted Therapy 9/14/2014 Herceptin (trastuzumab) Chemotherapy 9/14/2014 Carboplatin (Paraplatin), Taxotere (docetaxel)

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