Fasting benefits
I've been doing different types of fasting. I found it beneficial during chemo. My goal now is to minimize risk of recurrence and to lose weight. I've been trying to find information on how long and how frequently I should fast. I found fasting might also help with improving cognitive function and lessening chronic pain. Thought a thread on fasting in general would be a good place to post links.
Fasting can be done no matter which diet people follow, but those on low carb diets will find it easier.
Role of therapeutic fasting in women's health: An overview
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4960941/
Being hungry shuts off perception of chronic pain
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/03/180322125024.htm
The Sweet Spot for Intermittent Fasting
https://medium.com/the-mission/the-sweet-spot-for-intermittent-fasting-9aae12a2158c
Are There Any Proven Benefits to Fasting?
6 Surprising Brain Power Benefits of Intermittent Fasting
Fasting During Cancer Treatment
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I'm fasting now as we speak for chemo Monday. I have found it virtually eliminates my SE of chemo. Great idea for a thread!
Jess
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I'm so glad fasting is helping you. Hope today was uneventful. I liked to break my chemo fast with homemade jello.
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I just broke my fast with some stewed veggies for breakfast. I feel really quite productive today. It’s certainly the steroids but I am off for a hike. I had Taxol yesterday. I figured out how to do a quick and dirty fast for weekly Taxol. Works like a charm for me.
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A hike? That's fantastic! It's cold and wet here, so I'm happy to keep upright on the sidewalk.
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Just wanted to say I happened to come across your daughters concert with the African song. It moved me to tears. In fact im still crying as I write this. She is extremely beautiful and the whole thing touched my heart. I hope all continues to be well for you and your beautiful family
Sharon
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I was a faster too. MoonGirlJess and I both did chemo at the same time and it worked for both of us. If you look up the "Fasting Mimicking Diet" and Dr Valter Longo at USC, you can read up on it, or search this forum my posts about the diet.
You can do a 3 day water only fast (w/ chemo day being day 2) or a 5 day ultra low cal fast (1100 cal day one, 800 cal days 2-5) with chemo day on day 3.) Should be 10% of cals from protein, and 45% from fat, 45% from carbs, roughly.
I had Taxotere and Carboplatin x 6. I never threw up, and I did not even take any anti-nausea drugs the last 3 chemos since they seemed superfluous and made my milconstipation worse. I did not experience any worsening of SEs over treatment-- only a worsening of overall "bounce back" (due to anemia).
Fasting fortifies healthy cells and helps boost immunological factors. Apparently it functions like a re-set of the immune system. Something that likely was an evolutionary outcome of 'feast and famine' living for 200,000 years. Which makes sense: cave people did not eat nearly as much or as often as we do.
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MoonGirlJess, will you share your quick and dirty Taxol fast? I start weekly Taxol next week and am keen to give fasting a try. I did it for one round of AC and it wasn't the magic bullet I'd hoped but maybe second time's the charm. That said, I'm worried about losing too much weight (never imagined saying that before BC!). Have those of you fasting lost much weight during chemo or does it come back on once you start eating normally again?
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Britspeech - That was a beautiful video, but it wasn't my daughter.
I believe it was posted by reflect.sanatbarbarian - Glad that more people are having success with fasting during chemo. It was easier for me to go without food than try the FMD.
beeline - When I had Taxol, I would have no food the day before treatment and eat about 6 hours after the treatment ended. Altogether it was about 48 hours with no food. I did lose weight with each fast. When I got close to the weight where I would have stopped fasting, I started drinking milkshakes to gain the weight back. I regained the weight once I finished treatment. Good luck with Taxol!
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Cancer and Fasting / Calorie Restriction
What is Our Recommendation?
Comparing the research between CR and fasting, fasting seems to provide more dramatic results and protection of healthy cells, without the risk of weight loss or immune suppression. Both CR and fasting are the subject of ongoing research, and definitive conclusions await the results of those studies. As mentioned above, it may not be appropriate for everyone, particularly those who are underweight or very ill, and should never be attempted without the supervision of qualified practitioners.
For general cancer prevention, it may be beneficial to add intermittent or short-term fasts in combination with a plant-based cancer prevention diet, as described in detail in the Dietary Approaches section of this website.
Here are some take-home tips from our literature review:
- In general, follow an anti-inflammatory diet with lots of colorful fruits, vegetables, beans, lentils, herbs and spices.
- Low to moderate carbohydrate intake with low glycemic starches
- Healthy fats at every meal, including good sources of Omega-3s
- Moderate protein intake of 3-4 ounces per meal from a combination of animal and plant proteins
- Lengthen the time between dinner and breakfast to allow for a longer overnight fast, with the goal of 13 or more hours, for example dinner by 6:00 pm and breakfast after 7:00 am.
- Short-term water fasts of 1-3 days to possibly help re-generate the immune system and increase cellular protection against oxidative stress. Working with a healthcare provider, you can determine how often it may be appropriate for you to engage in a fast.
- If you are a cancer patient, water fasting 2-3 days prior to treatment and up to one day following treatment to optimize the efficacy of treatment and reduce treatment-related side effects may be considered, but only under the supervision of a qualified practitioner.
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I completed a 36-hour fast today. Planning on doing it once a week.
Intermittent Fasting for Weight Loss and Other Benefits
https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/happiness-in-world/201704/intermittent-fasting-weight-loss-and-other-benefits
My recommendations for using IF for weight loss:- You should always make sure that whatever strategy you use to lose weight is a strategy you use to maintain weight loss, that you can maintain indefinitely. Otherwise, you'll almost certainly regain any lost weight once you change your eating lifestyle after achieving your weight-loss goals. That is, if you're going to use IF, make sure you can continue some form of IF (albeit perhaps fewer days per week or fasting on individual days for a shorter duration) indefinitely.
- Don't fast longer than 3 days in a row (to preserve muscle mass and prevent a reduction in basal metabolic rate).
- I suggest fasting for 36 hours at a time (e.g., from Monday night after dinner to Wednesday morning at breakfast) no more than twice a week. Alternatively, you could eat your first meal of the day around noon and your last meal no later than 8 pm every day. You will, of course, get hungry on days you fast, but you won't feel hungry all day long. Your hunger will come and go, typically around the times you would normally eat. If you distract yourself by becoming engaged in the tasks of your day when you feel that hunger, it will tend to fade within 10-30 minutes. Make sure to drink adequate amounts of water during fasting so you don't become dehydrated.
- Make sure to exercise and take in adequate levels of protein on non-fasting days to maintain your muscle mass.
- Combine IF with a low-carb diet on days you eat. I'd also include a cheat day as I described in a previous article.
- If you have diabetes, make sure to embark on IF only under the close supervision of your doctor.
- If you have or have had an eating disorder, IF is not for you.
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beeline—Sorry. I didn’t check this thread!!! I have chemo on Monday. So Saturday I knock off eating early. Like 4 pm. I don’t particularly eat too healthy that day just stop eating early. Sunday fun day. Maybe I have a cup—not a bowl—really a cup of vegetable soup. Only veg and broth. I drink an enormous amt of water. Monday nothing but water and herbal tea and chemo. I eat Tuesday morning.
I’m skinny. Oh, so skinny. I look like a cancer patient. My side effects of body pain and aches are nonexistent when I fast. If I don’t fast I feel like I’ve been hit with 2x4s, especially in my hips and lumbar spine. Ouch.
Sorry for late response!
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Copied from Ibrance thread:
Posted by Cure-ious
A new report recently came out in Nature from Longo at USC- they find that intermittent fasting increases the effectiveness of faslodex for ER+ MBC, moreover, when fulvestrant and Ibrance were combined with periodic cycles of fasting or a fasting-mimicking diet, they got long-lasting tumour regression and could reverse acquired resistance to drug treatment! The fasting inhibited mTOR and increased levels of the PTEN tumor suppressor.
So, this is something one can try if there are signs that the Ibrance-Femara/ Faslodex therapy is starting to fail
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2502-7
https://news.usc.edu/173485/fasting-mimicking-diet...
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Serenity - sounds like it's a good idea to activate this thread from 2018
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Normally I eat one meal a day in the mid afternoon. It's not cancer related now, just the way I usually live now that I'm retired. It's hard for people to understand how I can walk 4 miles in the morning or exercise for an hour w/o eating anything, but it works best for my metabolism. I sleep better too.
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I like the idea of this thread, too, MinusTwo. Before the pandemic I was doing a good job of restricting my eating to an 8 hour window and fasting 1 or 2 days a week. Boy did that go out the window when things went crazy in March.
We've been basically homebound since March 12th. Unfortunately, my husband and I are really good cooks. Plus I've gotten really good at making sourdough bread. Add to that a broken ankle 4 weeks ago. To no one's surprise, I've gained ten pounds. I need to get back on track. Asap.😏
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Minus - I used to be unable to fast, but once you start it gets easier. Many people still think it's weird.
Trishyla - I've gotten into sourdough as well. I usually bake bread a few times a year, but with a starter I've been baking more often. Since I can't eat bread too often, I've been making sourdough crackers. It's a good way for me to keep the starter active. I love sourdough focaccia, but we eat all of it in a day. Can't do that too often. Hope your ankle heals well.
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Yeah, Serenity, I hear you on the focaccia. Unfortunately I love sourdough just as much. Hence the ten pound weight gain. ☹
I have to back on a low carb, with limited fat. That seems to help me with being able to fast. Lower processed carbs means fewer carb crashes while I fast.
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Oh my - bread, any bread, anytime - covered with butter. LOTS of butter. Darn - coleslaw for lunch.
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I fast so I can feast!
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That's my plan, too, Serenity. Just got to get back in the habit. It was so much easier when I wasn't at home 24/7.
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When we stray too far into carby foods we do a brief Whole 7. Whole 30 is just too long.
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I started IF (or time-restricted eating) in mid-June. I am done eating every evening by 8pm and wait at least 13 hours until eating the next day. Almost every day I simply skip breakfast, so usually it is 15+ hours before eating. I never ate junk food for breakfast, no donuts or pastries or freezer egg/biscuit sandwich thingies. My breakfasts were almost always whole grain cereal with raisins and cinnamon (nothing bad there!) or peanut butter on toast (not as good, but not awful!) It's not hard to do. I get a bit hungry but not more than I ever did, and if I just get busy doing something, it's easy to distract myself and forget about it.
My goals are to lose a small amount of weight, manage my glucose/insulin better, and reduce my risk of recurrence or new primary. My weight has always been in healthy range and very very stable, but I'd gained a couple of pounds. Now it's heading back down. I'd love to lose about 5 more pounds but if I didn't, I'd still be fine.
For glucose management, time will tell. I have a November appt with the "survivorship clinic" nurse practitioner. My intention is to keep going with this until then, at least. I'll want blood tests for glucose, A1C, maybe CRP and lipids, to see if my triglycerides have come down. I'm curious now, of course, but I doubt if 5-6 weeks is long enough to tell anything important.
And for the recurrence risk, I won't know if it works for that until it doesn't, or until I die from something else.
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I started IF in the spring to see if it would allow me to keep my weigh steady w\o logging food . I eat between 10am -6 pm. I’ve been at It since March and my weight is steady btwn 143-145. I’m glad it is working for me. I had to do a low carb diet for a day before a PET scan and that was the worst ! I’m not made for a life without carbs :-)
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I no longer eat cereal or cheap bread. I prefer artisanal carbs at lower frequency.
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I'm still doing time-restricted eating and managing it pretty well. I think I've gone through 7 weeks, not long enough to measure a change in A1C. I have lost 3-4 pounds which isn't quite as much as I'd have hoped by now, but I didn't have a lot to lose, anyway. I could drop 5 more before I'd start to look pretty thin.
One thing I've noticed is generally my energy level is as good as ever. Some days I still slump, of course, but most are fine. I am a lifelong napper, and in fact I've had trouble napping for the last 2 or 3 weeks. Either I don't fall asleep or only manage to doze off and then wake up. It's okay, since just taking the break and lying down is good. But I wondered if my morning habit of 2 cups of half-caffeine coffee, now with no food, is the problem. So I'm going to try having just one cup of half-caf to see if that helps. I REALLY do like a nap in the afternoon!
How are other people doing with intermittent fasting or time-restricted eating? Is anyone intending to do it just as their way of life, rather than as a chemo-SE management technique?
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I started with fasting mimicking during chemo and now do intermittent fasting. Will likely stay on this plan forever, as it is easy for me and I feel great and have restabilized my weight at what I weighed in my 20s.
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I'm fasting most days now (14 hours to 40-ish). I'm in my off week of Ibrance, so I'm in the middle of a 36-hour fast today. I would prefer to be 10 lbs less, but it's hard to decline desserts made by my kids. I taught them too well.
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I am anxiously waiting to eat lunch tomorrow after my 72 hour chemo fast and hoping my side effects this time will be reduced. Going to "feast" this weekend on days 3 and 4. Tomorrow I will be cautious with food...lunch will be eggs, maybe toast and homemade chicken wild rice soup for supper.😋 I need to go bed, steriods from the treatment are making me hungry!!!
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I fasted throughout my AC and Taxol infusions. During AC, I fasted 36 hours before infusion and 24+ hours after infusion. It significantly reduced side effects. I never vomited during chemo and I was not nauseous. The only anti-nausea medication that I took was the zofran that was given before each AC infusion. During taxol, I had olives with the dexamethasone that I had to take before the infusion. Since taxol was given weekly, I fasted 24 hours before and after infusions. I had very few side effects (no nausea, vomiting or neuropathy).
Now, I do intermittent fasting with my Xeloda. Side effects (nausea) are more intense and I think it is because I have to take the medication with food. That being said, it’s still very manageable.
For me, fasting really helped with the side effects.
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Iamloved - Enjoy your feast! During chemo I loved breaking my fast with soup. Hope you have fewer side effects.
NorCalS - Fasting helped me so much during chemo. I haven't had nausea or vomiting at all. I do have to take Ibrance with food, but I don't think nausea is a side effect. Perhaps the fast mimicking diet would help? Santabarbarian knows much more about it.
I completed a 40-hour fast earlier this week. After 36 hours I didn't feel like eating so I waited. Tonight I actually declined a fresh cookie from my daughter. My overnight fast had started already. I'll have some tomorrow.
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