Anyone on just Taxotere and Cytoxan?
Comments
-
- My message disappeared.... I'll try to remember it -
- Catlover - I am on 3 of 4 tx's; my dose is similar to yours. I weigh 122 lbs and I think it is given by weight. I had 8 positive nodes, I think the most on this thread, and my onc said 4 TCs after I told him I wouldn't take Adriamycin. I would think 4 would be sufficient for you, and from what others on here have had that looks right.
- On the Neulasta/Neupogen, my onc's office called my ins. co to be sure they would pay, but my ANC/WBC was in the danger zone then; if your dr. can show it was medically necessary they should pay. If he /she automatically gives it without having your WBC drop the first cycle, that may be why they are refusing. I would contest it and have the dr. send them something on why. I have appealed two claims and won on both; mine didn't want to pay for a PET scan and path tests done out of network although ordered by the in-network pathologist. Saved me over $5000. Hope it all works out for you!! I'm on day 10 of 3d tx; feel good, a little bone pain from Neulasta but not much. My infusion veins have developed red lines over them. My last one will, thank God, be on 8/21.
0 -
Think I need to come see your onc! I weigh 135 lbs, so we should be very close in what they give us. The 4 vs. 6 seems almost to be a regional thing, which is very annoying because I'd really love to be done since I've just finished #4! Of course I want to do everything possible to avoid a recurrence, but if 4 is not much different from 6....? I've been unable to find anything comparing the two, except in a very broad sense with different drugs.
I'll be calling the ins. co. Monday, and if they dig their feet in, I'll call the onc's office and have them send them what you described. They do automatically give the Neulasta, so I don't what will happen. The last 2 txs I've had a 2-day fever from the injection, but no bone pain. The only way I'll get out of txs 5 & 6 without pissing off the dr. would be if I had insurance snafus....if I refuse the last 2 on my own and end up with a recurrence down the road, can you imagine how awful I'd feel? Plus I wonder if the drs. would have attitude about treating me if I didn't follow their exact recommendation? So barring insurance barriers, I'll just suck it up and be done in mid-September.
Glad you'll be done this month! Have a great weekend~
0 -
I'll wish you luck with the ins. co. But I have found there is "attitude" with the oncs... my first one just kicked me out the door when I refused the Adriamycin and wanted to see statistics on how much benefit high ER/PR positive get from chemo (I am 100%/98%). I got a stiff call from his office that "they would need to refer me" and then the certified letter. No discussion at all and I thought it very unprofessional. I figure I am better off since my current one went with 4 TCs - the first one wanted 6 chemo cycles period.
Incidentally, I have read where the effectiveness of TC is not diminished even if the dose has to be reduced to reduce SEs, so I would say it is pretty strong stuff.
0 -
Ms. Karin - How awesome to see Rod in such a small venue and to be backstage with him. Sorry about the beer bottle! I was thinking about getting a "rod" wig to wear tonight and one for my dh (bald too!!). Then maybe he'd have us come up on stage.
Maria - A walk on the beach sounds great. Not easy to do living in Ohio. (Lake Erie beaches leave something to be desired).
Terri - That's bulls**t about your insurance co. Hope that doesn't happen to me. This has already taken a toll on us financially. (Had to quit one of my part-time jobs because of this) and sending two of three of my kids to college. I'd fight it and good luck.
Have a good weekend all!
0 -
Hello again..
I had my first treatment of TC on August 1st. The side effects weren't bad at all...very little nausea and some bone pains..all not to bad...( compared to the Adriamycin 5 years ago).....decided not to get the Neulasta shot on MOnday and wait to see if my blood work would be ok..well it wasn't so I got two Neupogen shots on Thursday and Friday...The wierd thing is I fell more sick to my stomach now than I did the days after Chemo..I don't get it..I wonder if those shots can give you nausea, besides the bone pains??
Did anyone here receive the Neupogen shot? Boy do I know to listen to the doc now when he sais take the shot.....
I will not argue again and say lets wait till I need it. I could have avoided some of this I guess if I would have went with the Neulasta shot on Monday....Lesson learned..0 -
I had to have 7 Neupogen shots after first tx. They only made me have the piercing short pains in my back occasionally, nothing else that I could pin on them. It could be an allergic reaction and you might tell your onc about it.
0 -
Hi, everybody!
I saw a question about how the chemo dose is calculated. The dose you get is based on your body surface area. The calculation of body surface area considers your height and weight. Here's a really neat website with a calculator for body surface area, body mass index, and some other stuff. The units for body surface area are meters-squared:
http://www.halls.md/body-surface-area/bsa.htmSo, someone who is 64 inches tall and weighs 125 pounds would have a body surface area of 1.6 meters-squared.
The typical dose of Taxotere, if given with Cytoxan every 3 weeks for 4 treatments, is 75 mg per meter-squared (per treatment). The typical dose of Cytoxan in that situation is 600 mg per meter-squared. Someone whose body surface area is 1.6 meters-squared would get 120 mg of Taxotere and 960 mg of Cytoxan per treatment. At least, I think I did that correctly...
otter
0 -
Hi, Tx66. I had the same problem -- no nausea until day 5 and 6. It was because the steroids and anti-nausea meds had worn off and my GI tract wasn't healed up yet. I had to call the onc office to get better nausea meds. My main prob was diarrhea, and I still have some nausea whenever I'm cramping from diarrhea. The nausea goes away when the cramps subside.
Catlover, good luck on your decision and insurance. Not all oncs will get pissed off when you question them, only the insecure ones. That was one reason I chose my onc -- she welcomes and respects questions and disagreements. The guy who knew it all and mocked my questions lost my business.
0 -
I just have a question for all of the ladies that had a lumpectomy. Did any of you get stats as to what the radiation does percentage wise? I am sitting here wondering why I still need radiation after clean margins & chemo. Although I was once sitting here wondering why chemo? I still am not quite sure I can answer that 1.
Doesn't the chemo get to the area where they are going to do radiation anyhow? Yes, once again I am trying to get out of something.....
Any thoughts?
0 -
I was told that radiation is a must with a lumpectomy, as the benefits of lumpectomy vs. mastectomy were calculated using radiation. I think I was quoted as 20% chance of recurrence with lumptectomy and radiation, which gets lowered by 30%with chemo added, and lowered again 30%with tamoxofin or herceptin. From what people report on the boards, radiation is not nearly as bad as chemo. I'll be having it once chemo is over. It is inconvenient (every day), but I reckon worth it for the security of knowing I did EVERYTHING possible to prevent recurrence.
Gina
0 -
Bumping for hood 1980
0 -
Nausea has been a much worse problem for me after round 2 than the first was. Still taking the occasional Zofran and I'm at day 11.
Sherry--I've had the same questions about radiation as you...I was told that the radiation keeps the cancer from coming back in the same breast, but doesn't do anything for the other one or anywhere else in the body; and chemo keeps the cancer from showing up in the other breast and rest of body but not the affected breast. Now I understand the concept of the radiation only helping the breast being radiated, but why doesn't chemo help the affected breast? Plan on asking the onc about that before starting radiation, but I know, like Gina, I will do the radiation. Just like with chemo--in the end, despite all questions, concerns and dreads, I'm more afraid not to than to......
0 -
I will begin Cytoxan and Taxotere in September. I am wondering what those of you who have been through this already have found. Will my onc recommend avoiding the mall at Christmas shopping time, small children, etc? I realize with compromised immunity limiting these activities is a good idea, but can any of you give me a good gauge of what is necessary and what is over reaction?
Have any oncs restricted fresh veggies from diets? Mine said no salad bars.
With all the new anti nausea meds, do I still expect to lose weight during chemo?
Thanks for any insight. Just trying to get a good idea of what lies ahead of me.
0 -
Well, I may have to switch threads. Ended up in the hospital on Thursday with a fever and very low blood count. My doctor reassured me the diarrhea was from the taxotere and is putting me on something different for my next tx. Oh, boy, now I get to frantically obsess about new potential SE's. Anyhoooo.....after 3 days of antibiotics, fluids, and shots ( not neulasta but similiar ) my count is back up and I'm infection free. However, I feel totally wiped out. I'll keep my eyes on this thread. Thanks for all the advice and information. You certainly feel far less alone in this adventure when you get to hear from so many people experiencing the same symptoms and emotions.
Kathy
0 -
Kwoodson, sorry to hear about the side effects. I am having the exact opposite. I have been eating all kinds of vegetables to try to counteract the constipation and am still barely regular. Amazing how this affects us all so differently. How many treatments have you had so far? So, far my worst se is rapid heart rate on days 4-7 and sorrrreeeee knees!
Missnelson, it effects us all so differently it is hard to say how it will be for you. But, I have been having a fairly easy time of it. No nausea, no vomitting. It is kind of odd how it works. I feel good the day of chemo & the following day - then I start aching everywhere and my heart goes crazy. If my heart doesn't stop aching soon here I am going to head in to the emergency room. It isn't horrible, but it is never good to feel pain in your chest.....I am able to go shopping and all, my daughters continue to have their normal sleep overs and I have remained healthy. I am just worried about how I will do after school starts. I can always count on getting sick when that happens - even when I am healthy : )
Thanks for the thoughts on radiation. I am sooo tempted to not do it. If I knew for sure all I was worrying about was recurrence in the same breast I would just forgo it. Really, I had wanted to do the mastectomy in the beginning anyhow. I just can't figure out why it would be needed when the chemo is running all through my body. Would there be any reason to think that it couldn't have gotten there? I am already nervous about what the chemo is going to cause me in the future....I worry even more so about what the radiation will cause.
0 -
Hi Sherry, I wanted to check in and see how you are doing? Did you have to go to the ER? Is your blood pressure OK or is it elevated along with the heart rate?
0 -
T-C SChedule for the Week!!!!!
Good Morning, Ladies. Below is my best stab at our schedule for the week. I am taking over this task for Otter, who is an official T-C Graduate. Please let me know if Ihave made any mistakes or if there are any changes for future weeks. Hope you all have a great week.
Congrats to Stickerlady, TC_Chickadee, BBLady and Elaine62, who are finishing up this week (and to VBG who got to pass on her 8/14/08 final infusion)
Good luck to everyone getting treatments: may your SEs be few:
Monday, 8/11/08--TC-Chickadee (#4), lanihardage (#2), Stickerlady (#4), terridwo (#3)
Tuesday, 8/12/08--no one
Wednesday, 8/13/08--phillydee (#2)
Thursday, 8/14/08--BBLady (#4), judianna (#5 of 6), Elaine 62 (#4)
Friday, 8/15/08--Darlene53 (#2 of 4?)
0 -
MoinTexas - I think you mentioned that you read somewhere that the effectiveness of TC is not diminished if the dose has to be reduced due to side effects. Do you remember where you read that? I need some reasurrance as my dose was reduced for tx2 and for the next 2 txs, but I can't help being worried that effectiveness may be reduced.
Thanks, Gina
0 -
missnelson - I'm having my 4th and last TC treatment on Thursday. My onco asked me to stay away from fresh fruits and vegetables until around day ten of my cycle (anything you can peel is o.k.). The worst days for low blood counts seems to be before day 10, so those days I tried to stay away from as many people as possible and pretty much just stayed home. Twice I've had to go on prophylactic antibiotics because my wbc went down to 1.5 even with the Neulasta shot. As far as weight loss goes, my weight fluctuates all over the place but I'm staying within 5 to 10 lbs of where I started out at. I have no taste for food for a week or so after chemo, but then eat like a horse when the taste buds come back. Guess I'm stocking up for the next treatment. The main thing is to drink as much as possible. Lots of water before the treatment, and then whatever you can tolerate after. Water usually tastes horrible to most people after treatment, but drink juice or eat popsicles to keep hydrated.
Good luck with your treatments. It's not fun, but it's doable!
Kathy
0 -
Hello to All !!
Sloritz - Thank you for taking over the schedule from Otter - it is much appreciated !! My Tx is not today though (wish it was to get it over), but last Tx # 4 is Wed., Aug. 13.
Sherri38 - Per my Onc., the statistical survival rate is the same whether one has a mastectomy or lumpectomy with radiation instead of mastectomy . . . so it looks like even if we have chemo the radiation appears to be needed as well . . .
Kwoodson - So sorry to hear you had to go to the hospital and hope you are feeling better now - Best Wishes to you and whatever new regimen you go on . . .
MissNelson - Not every Onc. gives the same directions etc., but my Onc./NP specifically told me that my blood counts would be lowest from days 8-14 after chemo and to stay away from restaurants during this timeframe - Also to always avoid anyone who is sick and it's not a good idea to be in large crowds / gatherings . . . As you can tell from the posts, this Tx is not always easy, but it is Do-able . . . Best Wishes to you !!
Hang in there Everyone !!
TC-Chickadee
0 -
MissNelson- My Onc. also told me to stay away from fresh fruits and vegetables. It's too easy to pick up an infection through them. This is really hard because the one food I've been craving is fresh fruit. And I was also told specifically that I would not lose weight. I think that's the cruelest joke of all since I could use a 20-25 lb. reduction in my girth. I didn't even lose any after a week of diarrhea and 3 days in the hospital! I also found the only thing I could drink was cherry kool-aid so I was obviously getting my carbs and calories. As far as avoiding people, it probably can't hurt, and I would definitely do it if your levels are low. I'm supposed to start back at my school job soon but I'm beginning to rethink that plan. It's nearly impossible to not get sick when you work in a school. Best of luck with your treatments.
Kathy
0 -
Gina - I could not find where I kept a citation or a URL for where I read that about taxotere, but I have read it at least 2 or 3 times. They were probably medical article abstracts that were not otherwise helpful to me or I would have saved them. Sorry. You might ask your onc and see what he/she says about it.
Marilyn
0 -
MissNelson - . . . realized I forgot to add a sentence to yesterday's post to you - In addition to saying no restaurants between days 8-14 after Tx, Onc./NP did say no fresh fruits or vegetables during that time also . . . However, just to be on the safe side, I have not been eating any fresh fruits or fresh vegetables at all . . . I've been using some really good frozen vegetables out there that taste like fresh when thawed, microwaved etc. and I've found that the individual fruit cups they sell (usually come in a package of four) are pretty good as well . . . Again, Best Wishes to you !
VBG - I hope you're feeling better now and the burns will heal faster now that you don't have to do Tx #4 - (we were on the same schedule). Hang in there !!
Hang in there Everyone !!
TC-Chickadee
0 -
MissNelson, my onc. didn't specifically tell me not to eat out, but the two times I have, I've wound up with a fever. And that was with Neulasta. So, no more restaurant food until I'm done! I only go anywhere on the days that aren't supposedly as risky (I was told 7-14 were worst), and even then I'm OC about hand-washing, not touching my face, etc. I find myself holding my breath if I wind up with people around me (I'll be like Monk before this is over!) My onc. made a horrified face once when I told her I had been to Kroger, if that tells you anything! I'm also missing fresh fruits & veggies (we're supposed to eat healthy but can't have those...crazy), but it won't be long now. This time goes by more quickly than you think it will--and that's coming from a very impatient person! Good luck~
0 -
A question about the avoiding raw fruits/veggies, restaurants, crowds, etc. advice... Those who are being told that, are you getting Neulasta shots with every tx? Or only if your WBC count goes below a certain level? I had the impression that routine Neulasta should prevent neutropenia, which should prevent you from needing to follow all these precautions! I'll ask my onc on Thurs of course, but I'm curious...
Thanks!
Drea (probably starting TC on Aug 21)
0 -
I just wash my fresh fruits and veggies. Aren't they just worried about stuff that is on the surface?
0 -
Drea, you asked about Neulasta: "I had the impression that routine Neulasta should prevent neutropenia, which should prevent you from needing to follow all these precautions!"
No, Neulasta doesn't completely prevent neutropenia (as many of us can attest). What it does is keep the ANC (absolute neutrophil concentration) from dropping quite as low as it would otherwise (but it still goes down), and stimulating it to go back up fairly quickly if it does drop. So, although the neutrophil count can, and often does, go down even with Neulasta, it doesn't stay down very long--probably only a day or two. Here's a graph I "borrowed" from an article comparing the effects of Neulasta and Neupogen on the Neutrophil count. There is no "negative control" group, but you can see that even with Neulasta and Neupogen, the ANC goes down.
Neulasta doesn't really even take effect until the ANC does go down. Exactly when that drop occurs will depend on what type of chemo we're getting. Most of us have been told the "nadir" (low point) will occur between days 7 and 14. I was told between days 10 and 14, but from what I read about the different chemo drugs, it's earlier with Taxotere and day 12 or so with Cytoxan.
As for fresh fruits & veggies, the instructions I got were pretty specific--no fresh (uncooked) fruits or veggies during chemo. Yes, most of the risk is due to crud on the surface, but it is awfully hard to wash bacteria off the surface of a strawberry. Lots of studies have been done showing that it is almost impossible to wash bacteria off the surface of the skin unless you use a scrub brush and antimicrobial soap. That would ruin the strawberry, I think. For most things, we can buy them fresh and then cook 'em, and they'll be fine. It's just the raw stuff we need to worry about.
That, too, will pass, and you'll be back to eating fresh salads again, before you know it.
otter
0 -
Hood1980, I have naturally low blood pressure about 98/58. My blood pressure was up at 120/65. I ended up taking some Tylenol and avoided the ER. The next day my heart slowed down - today it is back to normal.
I am dreading this with the next treatment. Thanks for asking : )
None of my Dr's said a thing about eating fruits & veggies. So, I've been eating them. But, I never asked about diet either - I just figured I would be smart to eat healthier...Maybe I was wrong.
On a different note - did any of you get an extremely itchy head after the hair came out. Actually not all of my hair came out - I still have "fuzz" all over my head which seems to be growing 1 week after the 2nd treatment.
It itches so bad and nothing seems to make it better. Now I have a bunch of red bumps all over my head....Help!
0 -
I am one week out from my First TX. No major SE to complain about. I did feel tired on Sunday but was still able to do some work but also spent more time just sitting and relaxing. I did not have the Neulasta shot (blood test taken before chemo determined that). I had blood work done today and counts still in normal range. Will not have another blood test until my next chemo date in two weeks. I was not told to stay away from fresh fruits and vegetables, in fact I use them in my daily cooking and my onc said not to change anything in my diet. As for crowds, I was told today to be aware this weekend of any temps and more tired feeling BUT I was also told that I should not become a hermit. Just be aware of my surroundings and who is around me.
0 -
My onc has not said anything about fruits or veges either, so I've been eating them like crazy!
I read something interesting in "The Breast Cancer Notebook". In the chapter on juicing, she said to soak all fruits/veges for 15 minutes in a sink full of cold water and 1 Cup Hydrogen Peroxide. (rinse before eating). I figured if it was good for juicing, it would be good for just plain eating, and had started doing that with all my fruits/veges after tx #1. I'm glad this subject came up, cause chemobrain seems to have struck and I forgot all about it after tx #2. Not sure what I thought those 2 huge bottles of peroxide under the kitchen sink were for.......
Love your chart, Otter. I was told day 10-14 would be the worst days for low blood counts, but your chart coincides perfectly with my own experience--days 7 & 8 are my worst days for fatigue, shortness of breath, rapid HR, and then of course bone pain (thank you Neulasta, for kicking in). I'm assuming if the ANC is down, so will the RBC's, which is why I have the above?
When I expressed concern to my onc about working when my counts are down (I'm a home health nurse) cause MRSA (antibiotic resistant staph) seems to be epidemic in the community, he gave me one of those looks over his reading glasses and said "MRSA's not airborne", meaning "wash your hands, stupid nurse", and then followed up by saying I just needed to use common sense and avoid anyone I knew to have a cold/flu, etc.
0
