Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?
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magiclight-well said.
Ananda- I look forward to reading some of your recommended books.
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magiclight, It seems to me that you are doing fine all by yourself living a life of kindness, empathy, sympathetic joy, and equanimity.
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One of the most translated books in the world is the Tao Te Ching. It is also one of the shortest, 81 stanzas, and most beautiful. Here is a link to my favorite translation. read:https://terebess.hu/english/tao/gia.html
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The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the beginning of heaven and Earth.
The named is the mother of the ten thousand things.
Ever desireless, one can see the mystery.
Ever desiring, one sees the manifestations.
These two spring from the same source but differ in name; this appears as darkness.
Darkness within darkness.
The gate to all mystery.0 -
Ananda..Thanks for the encouragement. Your inclusion of noteworthy authors and other sources reminds me of the term Bibliotherapy whereby a person looks to books as a source of healing. There are so many giant thinkers out there and within these threads that provide me with a very cost effective form of therapy. Thanks to one and all.
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I've read the Tao. Sometimes I think it's profound, other times, I think it's contradictory horseshit dressed in fancy language that actually says nothing.
I follow a minister on FB, name of John Pavlovitz, who has a cool concept of "The Church of Not Being Horrible." He's so open-minded that I forget he's a religious person. For me, life boils down to one basic thing, and I don't need any spiritual quest beyond it: "When in doubt, err on the side of compassion." Doesn't mean I have to be nice to assholes, though! 😁 I just get to try to "persuade" them to be more compassionate.
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ananda- Tao Te Ching is one of the most beautiful books ever written. I haven't looked at it in a while. In other words I will have to go through several stacks of books in my room to find it. Going through stacks of books is my idea of Nirvana. My stomach is still queasy from food poisoning so I will have to wait until tomorrow. Thanks for the mind jog. Kindle is great for convenience but for the sheer love of reading there isn't anything better than having the book in your hand.
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jo6359, thank you for your post. Many would say I am religious and more would say not. My own thought is that I am not. I totally agree with you on mutual respect and tolerance of our differences. The fact that we are mostly female-may be a few men out there-and are breast cancer warriors gives us a unique perspective on life and the living of it. I came to this site seeking common ground and have found sisters fighting this fight the best way they can.
I have not come to this public forum to preach, to evangelize, to call people out, or to tell someone they're wrong. Nor have I encouraged anyone to seek some higher power in their struggle or seeking enlightenment.
Many come to this site, feeling their way through this darkness, looking for some kind of solace and I think that the compassion and empathy can be found here.
I'm sorry that some feel their safe place has been invaded and violated by someone who may not march to their drum, but none of us have the same drum, but we do have cancer.
My highlighted comment was not directed to unbelief but to the manner in which certain groups were addressed. I'm not offended nor do I feel like the thread is not suited for me since my interest was in coping with terminal illness and the absolute truth of death that I face.
Sorry for the long post.
Enjoyed the sharing of philosophy and writings of the ancients.
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I think we are becoming way too intellectually driven. I simply am non theist.
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No invisible puppeteers.
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No tiny teapots.
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Has anyone ever said to someone who offers to pray for you: please don't? I wish I had the courage to say that. Well maybe instead, thank you for your prayers but donating to a cancer organization would be time better spent.
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My cousin is 'born again' and I have given up on not getting prayed for! He loves me, he is a kind, good man, and if he wants to pray for me, and that makes him feel better, I can let it go. So I say "thank you."
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Cats: I like that idea
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I asked my sister not to tell me she was praying for me because of a study done by the Templeton Foundation that indicated heart patients did less well when they knew they were prayed for. Although the study did happen, I told her that because I didn't want her bringing prayer up in every conversation for the rest of our natural lives. 😄
Here's the link. https://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html
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I did when I was younger. Now, I say "Thank You" or " If it makes you feel better, do so". In my past experience the majority starts lecturing and it becomes ugly quickly. A few would say "you dont believe in prayer but I do, therefore my choice." There have been a few interesting discussions which was respectful and courteous. PS: My brother is a Baptist minister in a small town. Story for another time. Lol
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If people other than my sister, who I am very close to, want to tell me they are praying then I pretty much just smile. It never happened much even though I live in a very religious part of the country.
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When anyone says they'll pray for me, it is SO hard not to say "Whatever floats your boat" with a Whatever face or, sometimes, "Why are you telling me that?" with an anguished look. Just to return the annoyance! 😈 As long as no one wants me to pray WITH them - then it could really get nasty.
For years, I thought I should do some kind of spiritual quest as an instead-of-Christianity, then I realized I didn't believe any of them. Some have interesting cultural traditions, as does Christianity, but they are all just elevated fairy tales. Then I thought that maybe I should get into philosophy to fill whatever void was supposed to exist in the non-religious. Nearly bored myself to death with that! I finally realized I was born without a spiritual gene and I've never been happier since I stopped searching.
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I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. I take their comments about praying for me to mean they are hoping the best for my health because I am dealing with mbc. I smile and say thank you. That’s all that’s needed. It’s sort of like when someone gives you a gift and you already have it. Like this Christmas, my sister gave me a copy of a book we read in our childhood. Well, I already own it, but I wasn’t going to ruin her joy in giving it to me. I thanked her and opened it and looked at the stories and pictures.
You can often sense when a person says they are praying for you but it is because they believe you are going straight to hell and they get their joy out of feeling high and mighty because they think they have a direct line to God that you don’t.
And people, like family members who do not a thing for you, but say they are praying, like that makes up for their inaction. Yeah, okay.
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I just smile and say thanks when people say they've been or will pray for me. I live in the bible belt so it happens often, and I usually assume they mean well. When I was in treatment I was very annoyed by the people who didn't offer any sort of help, but just had to tell me they'd been praying for me. I guess if they are true believers, they really do think it helps.
I do want to ask one of them exactly what they are praying for. Not out of nastiness, but out of genuine curiosity. Were they praying for all of the cancer cells to disappear, or for me to have peace with whatever my fate may be, etc. I don't know anyone I could ask without either offending them or getting into a discussion I don't want to have, though. One of my closest friends is deeply religious, and I know she worries about me because I am not. She wouldn't be offended by the question, but I think she would use it as an opening to try to convert me, and I'm just not up for that conversation.
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I just smile and say thanks because i dont like to offend but what i would like to say is " so if all goes well (prayers answered) God gets the koodos, if things do not go well who gets the blame?" I really dont understand prayer, think people just say it to make themselves feel better because they dont know what else to say.
I love my kindle because i can take 100 books with me everywhere i go. I added the Dissident Daughter on Monday and i am half done it already, i am loving it.
Great convos here, I too have done tons of searching and realized i am happiest and like myself the best without religion. When i mentioned this to my mom she said she likes me better too, yikes i guess I was an obnoxious christian. Me and my husband, both happier and healthier now. Family on his side are praying for us to come back to the fold lol. I know how they think all too well and a glad to be free, so free.
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Just bought Bertrand Russell. "Why I Am Not A Christian" on my kindle, love the ease, it was 98 cents, Canadian that is. Thanks for the recommendations.
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Glad that some of you are interested in reading Dance of the Dissident Daughter.
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I believe most people mean well. To be honest with you. My brother the minister is a nice person. His wife is one of those sanctimonious individuals who pats you on the shoulder and tells you she will pray for you. Soon as they're out of earshot, shake her head, give that little all knowing smile and say you know I don't like to judge but-- . I used to call her out when she would pull those little sanctimonious stunts but now I don't even bother. Fortunately I only see her two or three times a year.
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NanfromOntario,
Thanks for the suggestion. Why I am not a Christian is $0.99 on Kindle in the USA.
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A friend from Louisiana told me that you can say anything about someone as long as you follow it with God love her.
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Wren- that is too funny. I had forgotten that expression.
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"Bless his/her/your heart" works, too. 😈
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I just usually say " Whatever works "
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Great suggestions, love it. I think most people mean well but i am 100% certain that many folks just want to sound spiritual. I remind myself of how they have been taught to think and that i was there one, I squeeze my eyes so that i don't roll them
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Kyrsten Sinema, new senator from Arizona, was sworn in with hand on law book, not bible. She is religiously unaffiliated, now that is a first.
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