Iodine, thyroid, and breast cancer??
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I : 10/11/2008, DCIS, Stage 0, Grade 3, 0/2 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+
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According to those who know on the Yahoo group, they say increasing thyroid meds will often overtax your adrenals. I think that's one of the reasons they want you to take so much C and salt--to nourish the adrenals. Go over there and ask them.
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I am adding this article to this thread because it's an important one... anondenet posted this when it first came out in 2008, but I don't think it's been mentioned since then:
Int J Med Sci. 2008 Jul 8;5(4):189-96
Iodine Alters Gene Expression in the MCF7 Breast Cancer Cell Line: Evidence for an Anti-Estrogen Effect of Iodine.
Stoddard Ii FR, Brooks AD, Eskin BA, Johannes GJ.The protective effects of iodine on breast cancer have been postulated from epidemiologic evidence and described in animal models. The molecular mechanisms responsible have not been identified but laboratory evidence suggests that iodine may inhibit cancer promotion through modulation of the estrogen pathway. To elucidate the role of iodine in breast cancer, the effect of Lugol's iodine solution (5% I(2), 10% KI) on gene expression was analyzed in the estrogen responsive MCF-7 breast cancer cell line. Microarray analysis identified 29 genes that were up-regulated and 14 genes that were down-regulated in response to iodine/iodide treatment.
The altered genes included several involved in hormone metabolism as well as genes involved in the regulation of cell cycle progression, growth and differentiation. Quantitative RT-PCR confirmed the array data demonstrating that iodine/iodide treatment increased the mRNA levels of several genes involved in estrogen metabolism (CYP1A1, CYP1B1, and AKR1C1) while decreasing the levels of the estrogen responsive genes TFF1 and WISP2. This report presents the results of the first gene array profiling of the response of a breast cancer cell line to iodine treatment.
In addition to elucidating our understanding of the effects of iodine/iodide on breast cancer, this work suggests that iodine/iodide may be useful as an adjuvant therapy in the pharmacologic manipulation of the estrogen pathway in women with breast cancer.
We suggest that the protective effects of iodine/iodide on breast disease may be in part through the inhibition or modulation of estrogen pathways. Data presented suggests that iodine/iodide may inhibit the estrogen response through 1) up-regulating proteins involved in estrogen metabolism (specifically through increasing the CYP1A1/1B1 ratio), and 2) decreasing BRCA1 inhibition thus permitting its inhibition of estrogen responsive transcription. These data open the way for further defining pathways impacted by the essential element, iodine, in the cellular physiology of extrathyroidal tissues, particularly the breast.
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Crunchy, I have never seen that one! What a great article. I was not aware Iodine may have an anti-estrogen effect... C OOOOOL !!!
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Springy, where have you been? We have missed you and your wonderful posts here.
Come baaaack....
Yup, it's nice to know iodine works on the genes as well as the estrogen receptors to "down regulate."
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Okay Anon! Will keep an eye out for new posts!
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Hi everyone
I finally found a really good thyroid doc and he put me on dessicated thyroid. I am only using half of what he told me to take, because I feel better with less. Have any of you tried making your own lugol's? I would like to try so I can buy it in bulk and share it with my SIL and my autistic nephew. They cannot afford it otherwise. It looks like chemistry 101, but I was terrible at chemistry!
Have you guys checked out my site lately? We have been making a lot of changes, and will be changing more in July when NING changes their format. I would love to know what you guys think.
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VIVRE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOW it's good to see you here!!!!!!!!!!!
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Dr. Kharrazian, in his newsletter and blog is persuaded that taking iodine for the thyroid will exasperate the thyroid. He is willing to debate Dr. Brownstein regarding the use of iodine for thyroid autoimmune disease. I will soon be retested for my autoimmune disease...and will see not taking idoral the last 2 months has brought down the number for the autoimmune thryoid problem.
I respect both Dr. Kharrazian and Dr. Brownstein. I'm not sure who is right?
This was in Dr. Kharrazian newsletter.
Lastly, the article on iodine on my blog continues to receive comments from people with Hashimoto's who have had negative experiences taking iodine. Again, if you use iodine and have Hashimoto's, I urge you to test your CD4/CD8 ratio and your cytokine levels (please see the book). Iodine supplementation can decrease thyroid antibodies, giving the appearance of it being beneficial, while driving up inflammation and autoimmune attack.
It would be my pleasure to engage in a public debate on this matter with Dr. Brownstein, Dr. Abraham, or other doctors who support the use of iodine for autoimmune thyroid disease.http://co109w.col109.mail.live.com/default.aspx?wa=wsignin1.0
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Just wanted to pose a question while I go back and read. Is this thread only dealing with underactive thyroid and b/c connection? I have Graves Disease dx in 2000 and had radioacitive iodine to eventually kill my thyroid which lead to hypothyroidism. I have been an Armour thyroid user for 6 years and always felt best being a bit hyperthyroid with dosing so my endo left me there. Could having too much thyroid hormone in your bloodstream cause cancer as well as having too little?
Edited to fix this paragraph: I have had a strong suspicion that the radioactive iodine is connected to my b/c with a dx of triple negative b/c. Medicine seems to deny the connection between radioactive iodine and b/c outside of a few studies that say there is an increased risk 5-10 years out from taking it.
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packergirl-
Dr. David Brownstein strongly believes that no one should take any thyroid meds without being on iodine as thyroid alone will increase your risk for breast cancer. I really recommend both his IOdine and Thyroid books.
Beth
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I think it's on Dr. Flechas audio about the longer you take thyroid meds, the higher chances of your getting breast cancer are. They think taking so much thyroid hormone pills burns up all your iodine and takes the iodine away from the breasts. Does anybody know what audio that was?
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http://www.denvernaturopathic.com/AITDandvitb12.htm
The American Journal of Medical Science published a paper last year written by several researchers from Kfar Saba. Their paper reported a high prevalence of vitamin B-12 deficiency in people suffering from autoimmune thyroid disease. Of the 115 people in the study, all of who had autoimmune thyroid disease (AITD), 32 of them had low vitamin B-12 levels. That's 28%, slightly more than 1 in 4. Of those patients who were B-12 deficient, 31% had pernicious anemia. [i] So there is a clear relationship between vitamin B-12 absorption and autoimmune thyroid disease, that is what most people who are hypothyroid have.
I picked up a used book, Hypothyroidism, the Unspected Disease by Broda O. Barnes, M.D. and Lawrence Galton....Fancinating book! With much study, and cases they conclude that many diseases stem from a thyroid problem. Dr. Barnes (not all, most) patients after taking thyroid meds were relieved of their problems or diseases from skin problems, infertility, heart, and more!
I am coming to the conclusion that most of our problems stem from the gut, absortion problems, and nutrition. I feel like I am pealing a onion in coming to understand why disease in the first place.
ebarry
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ebarry, I am a firm believer that it all comes from the gut - fermented foods are soooo important - restoring beneficial bacteria, nutrient absorption and eliminating toxins.
The microflora in fermented foods makes B group vitamins; down inside you... right at the gut wall and they are assimilated immediately. It's all about a healthy inner eco system. The micro flora produce all the B vitamins and vitamin k. they help us extract minerals from our food and actually get the minerals out of our food then retain the minerals so that we can build mineral rich blood, which is essential. Unfortunately microflora are killed by excessive amounts of refined sugars. But sugar found in nature actually helps the microflora grow. Large amounts of healthy microflora create a garden like world in your intestines. When they are there they keep their world clean and healthy and when their world is clean and healthy that means your intestines are clean. It also means your liver is clean, you're not going to age as quickly, you'll find that your skin is more beautiful, you won't have joint problems, your vision will be more superior and we won't have the problems that so many people take for granted. When microflora keep your intestines healthy, your blood is healthy, your organs are healthy...your cells are healthy...preventing disease. Microflora actually have the ability to take other minerals, like silica for example and turn it into calcium for us. We really need to have the right gut flora and healthy intestines. I don't believe in just SPRING CLEANING THE LIVER...it should be done on a daily basis. Eating/drinking fermented foods, cutting out refined sugars, and only eating sugars found in nature such as stevia ...and the plethora of other goodies we've been researching to get that level of optimum health. I will say I do cheat a wee bit on Sundays and have the occasional guilty pleasures. But 95% of the time I'm a good girl. I want to live .............looooooooooong!
I'm also a huge fan of Dr Otto Warburg...and huge fan of oxygen therapy. He's my hero!!! Someone on this site recently posted a new thread on Dr Warburg's research, on oxygen and cancer, and it was dismissed as spam. For heaven sake, l'd never thought l'd see the day when the genius Nobel Prize Winner would be considered spam, and his research considered out of date. Yet the Polack ninnies that came up with radiotherapy 100 odd years ago also died from exposure to it, and are still kicking goals in their graves...in 2010. Geez...there really needs to be advances made in cancer research! I'm sick of all the carcinogens they offer us!
Anyway...I guess we've all got a way of dealing with this and a different protocol that suits us.
Have a good weekend ladies...x
Victoria0 -
My ONC just called me after reading my test results from bloods taken yesterday. He was shocked to see that my TSH was up at 12.3. In April it was .1, May 1.36 and now in June 12.3. I guess it makes sense since in APril I was on 12.5mg iodine, May 25mg, and June 50mg Iodoral. I haven't told him that I'm on iodine because he poo-pooed my taking supplements of any kind in the first place. He's now got me going back next Thursday to get re-tested. I also didn't tell him that I've switched to natural dessicated thyroid meds. My naturopath had me on 60mg dessicated thyroid and with 37.5mg of iodine it was the right balance because my TSH, FreeT4 and FreeT3 were all within normal range. I guess now that I've upped my doe of Iodoral to 50mgs from 37.5mg that made the difference and hence the increase in my TSH? I would have thought that my TSH would go down with a higher dose of Iodoral? He was freaking on the phone telling me that now I am "severely" hypothyroid and need to be re-tested. Should I maybe go back to 37.5mgs of iodine???????
Terri
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Crossposting to Natural Girls Thread from Dr. Flechas' article:
http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-10/IOD_10.htm
Dr. Flechas writes: "I have seen TSH sometimes go up rather than down while T4 and free T3 did not change or may have gone up some. This does not mean that the patient was developing hypothyroidism but that the brain was stimulating the body to make more sodium iodide symporters (NIS). The NIS are channels in the cell membrane that transport atoms into a cell as compared to a calcium channel or a sodium channel or a chloride channel where the channel only admits one atom to go through. The NIS transports sodium iodide into cells and has been found in all cell lines tested so far. Thyroid stimulating hormone, prolactin and oxytocin have been found to stimulate the making of NIS . While taking iodide, one may see an elevated TSH but we have to recognize that this is not a bad thing. TSH has many actions outside the thyroid that have been discovered . While taking iodine, the vast majority of patients lose fat and gain muscle weight"
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My560Sel - My numbers also changed with Iodine, and I needed to up my thyroid med. I was crashing in the evenings. I changed from Synthroid to Nature-Throid (desecrated instead of sythetic thyroid hormone).
In one of my consults with Dr. Flechas, I asked him if at some point I would need less thyroid medicine (given the article Anon posted above). and he said maybe, but it may be the case that I will always need some, or more, and not to worry about it. He said routine tests will show if I can lower the dosage. Apparently, it is really important to stay on the Iodine for us BC people, even if you need to take more medicine. That is my take away from talking to Dr. F. (who is very nice by the way!).0 -
Vivre published a great synopsis on her web site about Dr. Sherri Tenpenny's speech at the expo.
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oH good grief!!! I take aspirin. it is maddening.
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Maybe it would be easier to list what doesn't block iodine. Seems like everything does. Yes, it is maddening.
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I stopped taking the Aspirin!.
Also, apparently Floride in the water can block it, and a Brita filter does not get out the friggin Floride!!! I just learned this!!! So now we are thinking about one of those huge honkers you install under your sink or house - reverse osmosis or whatever it is. It never ends...
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Spring, one of the first things we did after my diagnosis was to get a water filter with a fluoride-removing filter... I didn't even know at the time it blocks iodine, but fluoride is HORRIBLE for many reasons. It's a waste byproduct of the fertilizer industry (if I remember correctly) and causes all kinds of problems (read your Crest label if you don't believe me! It can cause death if you swallow too much toothpaste). I found an official government website where they ADMIT it causes cancer (and other health problems). What they didn't admit was that it doesn't even improve teeth quality to ingest it.
It irks me that my state mandates fluoride in the water. That was a major coup for whoever pulled off that wheeling-and-dealing... get cities to PAY for a toxic poison that they couldn't dispose of safely otherwise!! Fluoride is also in other foods and drugs too (my husband was livid when he found out fluoride is a major "inactive" ingredient in a medication he has to take). Sorry for the rant, but it just solidifies my disgust that fluoride is foisted on us when it's so harmful.
BTW, a reverse osmosis filter is great... you'll need to remineralize it or add some unrefined sea salt to add back trace minerals that are lost during the osmosis process.
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Springtime-there were a couple of comments at the Expo about not using aspirin, that it did more harm than good, but it was so much information, and so hard for me to keep it all straight. The reason iodine is so important is that it chelates out the bad halides like chlorine and flouride. This is why those of us with iodine deficiency and thyroid problems get cancer. We have no protection. I know that the exposure that I had to trying to clean the mold off my bathroom with a chlorine based cleaner was major cause of my bc. I immediately went to my doctor, told her what had happened and I wasted three years with her running tests because she could not find anything wrong. It makes me so mad. If only I had gone to a holistic doctor, who would have immediately helped me to detox, perhaps I would have never had the bc develop.
Dr. Epstein was emphatic that the causes of cancer are our environment and that mammography is a scam. Check out his research at the cancer prevention coalition.
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Ladies- Do you have a good recommendation for a total newbie to begin to unravel the basics of a holistic approach? I take natural thyroid supplementation but beyond that it seems really difficult to know where to begin unraveling all this information.
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Packergirl: Here is a good site for the beginner.
"IodineTreats Breast Cancer: The Overwhelming Evidence"
You will want to read Dr. Brownstein's book that Dr. Dach refers to. Then do scroll back on this thread --These women really have done their research and shared their experiences.
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Thanks all. I stopped the aspirin and am looking to get the Floride out of the water. I wonder if it is even in bottled waters? ugh.
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Springtime, I drink bottled spring water because you can't filter fluoride out of city water.
But I think the biggest iodine blocking exposure is bromide from flour. We must have eaten flour three times a day when I was growing up: Wheaties, sandwiches, rolls, baked goods, etc.
I can deal with the dietary things but I worry about the bromide fire retardants. I think Hewlett Packard and some other computer companies banned them several years ago. I replaced the old bromide-treated mattress. All the major companies-Sealy, etc.,are now producing non-bromide mattresses.
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Hi,
It has been quite awhile since I last posted. I had chemo then a bilateral March 2009. I was tired but getting better. Things that I was diagnosed with after chemo.
gastritis - had endoscopic peek at it and no problems where found. Nothing given to help problem.
bone density a little low after chemo - nothing given to help stop it
blood pressure irradic after chemo, meds increased
thyroid problems even though on synthyroid - no one would listen that it wasn't working
sleep problems continued Lexapro given to help me sleep (big guns)
Then a friend from church told me about her new doctor. He is a sports medicine DO but also homopatic. What a difference, he tested my thyroid 3t's, magnesium,vita D, B12, iron and folic acid. Everything was below what it should be so he started me iodine, magnesium, Vita D, B12, iron and changed the kind of calcium I was taking. He started me on enzymes for the gastritis, wow what a difference. Last but not least Fosteum for bone density, the more natural of all the medications for this.
I can now sleep (Lexapro didn't work for long and I stopped it), my blood pressure leveled out and I was able to go back to the dose I was taking before chemo, my iron level is normal and we are still working on thyroid and allergies. I was not aware of all the things the chemo depleted from my body. My other doctors never even thought to test me for these.
I now feel I am on the road to recovery. I do wish it was noraml procedure to check all of this after chemo to get us back on track. Or better yet start us on these during chemo. It was a year before I found a doctor who could help me.
Sorry this is so long, but I hope it helps someone.
Joyce
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Joyce, my very favorite doctor in the world was a sports medicine DO. Twice I had injuries, and he actually HELPED me. What a concept! :where's the rolling eyes icon: After my bc treatments, my doctors would maybe run some kind of test every third visit and then shrug their shoulders, as if they were just waiting for me to resign myself to fatigue and stop complaining. When I get a bit of money saved up, I'd be willing to travel to see a doctor who's worth travelling for. I haven't found anyone locally worth leaving the house. Could you send me a pm and tell me the name of the doctor you like?
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Short of running back to the doctor ...
As a history, I've had my thyroid tested numerous times throughout my life for suspected hyperthyroidism. All the symptoms, but the levels never conclusively showed the condition.
May/June? I started taking 12.5 mg of iodine every day. All the weight I lost due to nerves from earlier in the year has plowed right back on (I've always been underweight). I'm also boiling hot most of the time since starting the iodine. I had a 2nd menstrual cycle about 16 days or so after the previous one. That ended maybe 2 weeks ago? Woke up last night with cramps to beat the band and spotting.
Considering the fact I'm 47 ... could iodine be regulating my body in such a way to bring on menopause? This is all happening since I started the supplement (I'm also taking D3 and a B supplement) and I'm wondering if it's connected or not?
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