Will 30% of Early Stage (1-IIIA) go on to metastasize??
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These drugs are steroids most gain weight on steroids.
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Anastrozole is a non-steroidal aromatase inhibitor, Exemestane is not. Letrozole is also non-steroidal.
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so far I am losing weight on exemestane. Most things upset my stomach now. The muscle loss in my legs is upsetting.
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I've been saying that about implied lifestyle! A good way to blame the patient rather than the treatment.
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voracious - Mindful Eating was a book that helped me lose weight. It just makes sense that I needed to change something permanently in my eating to lose weight and keep it off. I lost 50# in the year following my disgnosis and my MO explaining that I had estrogen in the extra pounds I was carrying. I was motivated and that book helped me do it. I cut out sugar, started walking more, and cut back portions. I have maintained my lower weight for two years now. And I'm someone who wouldn't diet because I felt it would all come back so I gradually would gain a pound or two each year during our 48 years of marriage
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I lost weight during treatment and my weight has stayed the same since, while taking femara. I know weight gain is common in connection with bc treatment, but wonder what other factors, genetic perhaps, contribute. In my own case, my body seems to thrive on low estrogen. I had low estrogen in my early 20s as well, and I was at a low weight then too.
I have not read the mindful eating book, but I practice a form of mindful eating. We were brought up that way. I always think about what I want to eat before a meal. I have little rituals around meals. It can be simple stuff, like making sure you set a table etc., but I do think it matters
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gramma! Congrats! I am suspecting that your relationship with food has changed...for the better. Doesn't it feel good inside you that food is now your friend and not the enemy? I sometimes think that dieting is an exhausting exercise and that is why people become frustrated and resume their negative eating skills...
Mom....I agree that Mindful Eating starts when we are young. That said....it is never too late in life to begin. The only reservation that I have is that once a family member changes their food rituals..the question is whether or not they can succeed if those around them are choosing poor eating rituals. I think those of us that have positive eating rituals seem to be attracted to others who enjoy those same food rituals. For example...my sister and her loved ones enjoy chain restaurants like Outback Steakhouse..I abhor eating dinner in loud chain restaurants. My sister's family think I am a food snob. So...I think she is going to have a hard time changing her food rituals since the people around her have such poor eating skills.
Awhile ago... I read a terrific book....Cheap. A chapter was devoted to chain restaurants. It pretty much reinforced my aversion to chain restaurants. I prefer the experience of dining and not eating. The book spelled out why most people in America have never experienced how a steak or a shrimp should taste despite thousands of Outback Steakhouse and Red Lobsters.
https://www.amazon.com/Cheap-High-Cost-Discount-Cu...=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top
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Voracious, agreed. It was just that I read an article on this ages ago, and realized we already did a lot of what was mentioned. When my kid was little, other moms often thought I was hard-assed or weird with eating. It wasn't anything drastic, but meals, even snacks were eaten from a plate at the table. No eating with the TV on. No eating directly off the highchair tray. But that is how I grew up myself, so it seemed normal to me. In the end it doesn't really matter what the specific ritual is anyway. The kid is now grown and has very good eating habits as well as a normal weight
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Mom....don't get me started on the topic of other parents....😱
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Eh! I didn't mean it badly. It just made me realize that most people don't have these habits. Besides, I probably am a bit of a hard-ass
I wouldn't let he kid play in front ofthe TV either. She could play OR watch TV, not both at the same time. It was, again, a mindfulness issue to me.0 -
mom....those rituals are studied at the Cornell University food lab....I always found interesting the study of little children who learned food patience and how the descrepency among children affected future rituals....not just pertaining to food decision-making.
Those folks who study food behavior rock!
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I've just been reading about Lonliness as a major health problem and as a cause of death that is greater than obesity. I think we have a difficult time differentiating obesity from overweight and much of the discussion here is about women who may be overweight either temporarily due to cancer treatments or permanently, but are not obese. Let's quite beating ourselves up over weight gain and focus more on the rich and varied connections that are needed by all of us to maintain optimal health even in the presence of disease. I believe both concepts can coexist..
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I lost almost 30 pounds after my diagnosis due to stress and fearing to eat anything that it had caused the cancer. During chemo I tried to maintain my weight s I was afraid to lose anymore weight. Now 1 1/2 years I have put it all back on and have high cholesterol Having difficulty losing the weight. I blame it on Letrozole.
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Magic, that is a good point and I agree. In no way do I think anyone should beat herself up over weight. Part of the mindful eating thing is also to make meals social connection points when possible. In general food should not be an enemy, but a source of nourishment, health and joy
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Voracious, the famous marshmallow study looked at the ability of kids to delay gratification. When they studied the matter further, they concluded that the ability to delay gratification was a stronger predictor of school success than intelligence, which kind of makes sense. It is possible to train kids, gently and steadily, to delay gratification and it definitely makes sense, IMHO, to avoid practices that condition them in the opposite direction. I also think focus can to some extent be learned, or at least you can avoid habits that encourage divided attention and a need for constant entertainment. Habits around food are one component of all that
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For the record...beloved sister and her family are morbidly obese ( BMI >40). Sister has many health issues...but cancer isn't among them.... Recently she was candid about her weight. Her doctor told her to lose weight but didn't offer a plan. That is when I began telling her about Mindful Eating.
I think that in my sister's life food and socializing have been warped together. She looks for opportunities to get together with loved ones so she can eat. I think once she separates the two...she might one day develop a healthy relationship with food. I can see where loneliness is unhealthy..but so is this need to be with others so one could justify overeating. My sister and her husband also take cruises 6 or more times a year. My sister complains that she sometimes has to force herself to take cruises because friends insist that she and her husband accompany them. Perhaps TMI.... but I love my sister and it is so painful for me to watch her....it also affects me because I see how hard so many of you work at rebuilding your lives after a cancer diagnosis. The thing I miss most about my sister is not being able to take walks together.Walking and reading are two of my favorite activities and I can no longer share those activities with her...reading for her has always been difficult and now walking is even harder...
My point to all my BC sisters is we shouldn't be afraid of what we don't know might happen. Why use energy on worrying when can better spend our time and energy on doing activities that are enjoyable? Make each meal enjoyable and make it a point to celebrate even more growing our relationships with the people who are important in our lives. The last thing I want to worry about after I'm finished worrying about my sister and my loved ones is when or perhaps if I'm going to recur! I'm going to drink wine...but I will also use my seatbelt and only permit myself to worry just enough and no more that it will interfere with plans for living. And if I do recur...well...I will deal with it... Since I won' t have any other choice about it....
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Mom...many of these studies build on one another.... I find child psychology so fascinating...kids are so amazing before they have filters on them.... my favorite child psychologist.... who didn't have a psychology degree and taught me the most about children was .....Art Linkletter. Adult psychologist? Groucho Marx.
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I was thinking about my childhood from this discussion. We never had snacks and rarely dessert. You ate breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and as Momine says, at the table. We didn't watch much TV. We played outside a lot, the whole neighborhood - riding bikes and playing games, shooting baskets, tetherball. I had no weight problems, no disordered eating. The first time I gained weight was in 7th grade and I had fallen down the stairs and was not able to move around much for a few weeks. Gained 5 lbs. The second time I gained weight was when my father died. Everyone brought food. I was sad. I ate. Gained 10 lbs. When I read the study about women gaining weight after treatment, especially chemo, maybe its not such a mystery. Its not the happiest time in our life and between surgeries and chemo, its hard to exercise.
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I don't believe any one who gets breast cancer and is overweight should blame themselves. That's like blaming myself for not having kids…which also is a factor in increased risk.
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I definitely didn't blame my extra weight for my cancer but I did use the discovery that there are hormones in extra fat as an impetus to make a change in my life and lose the extra pounds. 60 Minutes (I think) had a segment on the author of Mindful Eating and it helped me make choices about what I want to put in my body. His story about people in jails that gain weight partly due to wearing baggy clothing pushed me to buy clothes that fit and regulate my weight that way instead of watching a scale. If I crave something, I plan out when I will eat it, and have the best experience when it happens instead of trying something convenient and cheaper to try to meet that craving. It's all about making choices.0
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grammakathy....I agree that we shouldn't blame ourselves. However we must be aware of the fact that fat produces extra estrogen. This is exactly the reason I feel aromatase inhibitors are somewhat contradictory in our recovery. How can weight loss and exercise be so important if they prescribe a drug that makes it difficult to maintain a healthy weight and limits mobility? That together with the side effects makes me hope and pray that better treatment options are in our future.
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dtad, I hear you but weight and mobility problemsare not universal with AI use. I do have a fair amount of joint pain in my feet. It means that I cut out wearing heels and the pain can be annoying, but it doesn't limit my mobility
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I want to add to momine's comment. Many who experience joint pain from AI's feel better the more they move. Being sedentary often exacerbates the pain and stiffness. This is true for me, but, of course, won't be true for everyone. However, it doesn't hurt to move more to see if it helps
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I'm 4.5 years on AIs and I've found they have had no impact on my weight. I've been able to keep very close to my pre treatment weight (above and below it) which is within a healthy BMI. I gain a little when stressed by work - eat too much chocolate and don't sleep well. Obviously extra calories and poor sleep impacts weight. As soon as things mellow and I decrease chocolate and sleep through the night, the extra pounds drop easily. These two things were the exact ones that affected my weight before treatment.
For me, exercise helps control weight too, but not as much as watching what I eat and getting good sleep. I've had aches and pains on AI, but never to the degree I couldn't get up and move. And this has always helped. I try to get the recommended 150 minutes of exercise each week, but seldom exceed that. I think that is why it doesn't impact my weight much.
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Hmm mm. Not sure if it's a good thing or not, but to me food is just fuel. I will consider if I want 110 calories of fruit or carbs when I want a snack, listening to what my body is saying. Yes, I can enjoy a long dinner with family but it's not my highlight. After dinner we used to stay at the table and play board and card games with the kids. So food has never been the focus - just getting the calories for living.
So for intelligence and school!! I have a genius IQ and school was BORING!!!!!!! I would be the one putting my hand up so we could MOVE ON. Couldn't believe how most people just sat there. I loved learning new things and still do. But it's frustrating to see people chatting during a class or presentation and then asking questions that were already answered if they had just been paying attention! I just finished a 3 week training course with 22 adults and nothing has changed...sigh...people are just rude when someone is trying to train. I refuse to chat with someone when I am in a class.
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Bronx, yes, I find that the pain lessens if I move. I always walked a lot (I don't drive, never got a license) both before, during and after treatment. So even if my feet are stiff and achy, the dog still needs to go out and by the time we get back the feet are better.
Barbe, as the mother of a high-IQ child, I have lived through, painfully, the challenges that can bring in a school setting. The thing is that there is more to education than grasping info quickly. I ended up doing a lot of the real education myself and a rigorous college program did the rest. One of the things I found helpful was to set practical challenges for the kid, like learning to sew, for example. No matter how smart you are, it takes practice and stamina to learn a practical skill
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Good point Momine and probably why I still challenge myself to learn something new all the time. My kids have seen me going to school or training courses their entire lives. Some things I just do to see if I can - Mutual Funds License, Insurance licenses (life and auto), motorcycle and tractor trailer licences, scuba diving license, etc, etc.
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I could never view food as just fuel--I think it’s sad to be unable to enjoy, even relish, aspects of one’s life. My FIL, who lived with us for two years, was ascetic--spent 35 years as a yogi before reverting to Catholicism (a far more extreme form of it than before he originally left the Church). He thought it was a sin to “live in the material world” and take pleasure in food--yet he had a wicked sweet tooth and one of the things that sabotaged my own weight was his insistence that I bake for him. He ate meat or fish only grudgingly--only salmon or chicken breast. (His PCP, who is also mine, once told him “You’re 88. You beat the Reaper. Live a little--have a burger & fries once in a while”). He hated to drink water and instead insisted on two glasses of skim milk mixed with prune juice and Miralax per day (go retch, I’ll wait....). And he’d guzzle Ensure--which is sold as nourishment but is really liquid junk food. He would wander off on long walks and get exhausted and dehydrated--and then would get megacolon (literally, “full of s**t,” as our PCP put it) with diarrhea and was hospitalized several times for it--and they threatened to tube-feed him because he refused to eat any hospital meals that contained meat or fat. He eventually got a stroke when his warfarin couldn’t manage his INR, and died two months later, at almost 91. Oddly, I miss him despite his constant criticism of my lifestyle. But in his quest to lengthen his telomeres, he enjoyed almost NOTHING--didn’t watch TV, listen to music, or read anything but his Missal. I can’t help but think that he was 90 but felt like 100.
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I can and do enjoy food when I want. It's just not a priority except for energy. A good steak on the BBQ? Oh yah!!
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ChiSandy... "go retch, I'll wait" ... laughing my--ah--socks off here. Skim milk, prune juice, and miralax? Where did he come up with that recipe?
A you said, it might not help one live longer, but it will certainly feel longer.
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