Topic: In Favor of Feminism: Share Your Views

Forum: Bonded by Breast Cancer — For those who have met on Breastcancer.org and want to continue growing their cybersibling friendships beyond cancer.

Posted on: Jul 13, 2021 12:13PM - edited Jul 14, 2021 06:48AM by divinemrsm

Posted on: Jul 13, 2021 12:13PM - edited Jul 14, 2021 06:48AM by divinemrsm

divinemrsm wrote:

I'm starting this thread for those of us who support feminism and its beliefs, so we can exchange thoughts, ideas, inspiration, frustrations, personal stories, news stories, famous people stories, memes, book & video recommendations and other matters pertaining to women's equality.

Here's a general definition of feminism: the belief in full social, economic, and political equality and opportunities for all genders. It's about respecting diverse women's experiences, identities, knowledge and strengths, and striving to empower all women to realise their full rights.

[[****Edited to add: The above description is taken from several websites and aligns with my personal view of what feminism means to me. You may have other thoughts. What does feminism mean to you? Please feel free to discuss.]]

Only in the last ten years or so have my eyes been open to the patriarchal world we live in. Since then, I'm continually aware of the many women (including from this forum and also myself) who've been conditioned (by society, religion, family tradition, etc.) to prioritize others before themselves; to take on a "less than" persona, to minimize themselves and their contributions. As women, we need to recognize our value individually and collectively, advocate for ourselves and treat ourselves with the same care and loving-kindness with which we treat others.

Please honor the spirit of the thread. It's not for opposing views. The intention is for those of us with similar views on feminism to have a space to gather, share insights and find support. I feel I will have a lot to contribute. Will you join me?


found lump 12-22-10—ilc—er+/pr+/her2—stage iv bone mets—chemo~lumpectomy~radiation~arimidex—March 2019-ibrance/aromasin* —Sept 2019-verzenio* —March 2020-xeloda*
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Jul 23, 2021 07:35AM divinemrsm wrote:

found lump 12-22-10—ilc—er+/pr+/her2—stage iv bone mets—chemo~lumpectomy~radiation~arimidex—March 2019-ibrance/aromasin* —Sept 2019-verzenio* —March 2020-xeloda*
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Jul 23, 2021 11:40AM voraciousreader wrote:

would love to hear Camille Paglia chime in..

Doctor told me regarding my prognosis that I WASN'T on the Titanic! Hmmm...Really?....Okay! 02/2010 Pure Mucinous Breast Cancer, Oncotype DX 15, Stage 1, Grade 1, 1.8 cm, 0/2 nodes, ER+ 90% /PR+ 70% HER2- (+1)
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Jul 23, 2021 01:34PM divinemrsm wrote:

This week I watched the Netflix docuseries on 22-year old tennis superstar Naomi Osaka and recommend it if you’re interested. I don’t even keep up with tennis, but liked the 3 part series.

From Wikipedia: “Osaka is one of the world's most marketable athletes, having been ranked eighth among all athletes in endorsement income in 2020. She was also the highest-earning female athlete of all time by annual income that year. Osaka has gained significant recognition as an activist, having showcased support for the Black Lives Matter movement in conjunction with her matches. She was named one of the 2020 Sports Illustrated Sportspersons of the Year for her activism largely as part of her US Open championship run, and was also included on Time's annual list of the 100 most influential people in the worldin both 2019 and 2020.“


The documentary doesn’t even mention any of the above. I’m not sure how you’d classify it, but it’s a more intimate, softer look at her life the past two years.



found lump 12-22-10—ilc—er+/pr+/her2—stage iv bone mets—chemo~lumpectomy~radiation~arimidex—March 2019-ibrance/aromasin* —Sept 2019-verzenio* —March 2020-xeloda*
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Jul 23, 2021 01:57PM minustwo wrote:

Divine - thanks for posting the great explanation of giving vs. taking. Of course women are "programed" to give in all instances.

Short aside - When we moved to Texas in 1974, I applied for a check cashing card at the local grocery store. Of course women couldn't get credit cards at the time. The customer service desk asked me why I hadn't listed my husband, & they wanted to add his name to for check pre-approval.. I told her that he ever cashed a check in the store - or even came into the store - they should call the cops because it would mean I was dead.

2/15/11 BMX-DCIS 2SNB clear-TEs; 9/15/11-410gummies; 3/20/13 recurrance-5.5cm,mets to lymphs, Stage IIIB IDC ER/PRneg,HER2+; TCH/Perjeta/Neulasta x6; ALND 9/24/13 1/18 nodes 4.5cm; AC chemo 10/30/13 x3; herceptin again; Rads Feb2014
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Jul 23, 2021 02:33PM - edited Jul 23, 2021 02:34PM by olma61

Hey voracious, fellow Paglia fan here, too : )

Minus Two, great comeback! I laughed out loud for real.

Speaking of women's sports, I heard about the women's beach handball team who was fined because they refused to wear the skimpy bikini bottoms that were selected as their uniform and opted to wear shorts instead.

I get that it's “beach" handball and that the league want to sell tickets but really? Playing a serious game in tiny bottoms, in the hot sun?

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/20/sports/norway-beach-handball-team.html

They're pictured from the front wearing the bikinis in the times article. There are images elsewhere of the rear view and they aren't thong bottoms, but almost thongs....I feel the image might be a little too risqué for BCO - hard to believe this is a requirement in the current era.

Not a prude myself, either, but playing a sport and being hired to look beautiful lounging on a beachare two different things.

10/30/2017 Xgeva for bone mets 5/31/2018 Taxol finished! "If one just keeps on walking, everything will be all right” - Kierkegaard Dx 8/3/2017, IDC, Right, 2cm, Stage IV, metastasized to bone, Grade 2, ER+/PR+, HER2+, IHC Targeted Therapy 10/28/2017 Perjeta (pertuzumab) Targeted Therapy 10/28/2017 Herceptin (trastuzumab) Chemotherapy 10/29/2017 Taxol (paclitaxel) Hormonal Therapy 5/14/2018 Arimidex (anastrozole) Radiation Therapy 5/29/2019 External Local Metastases 5/29/2019 Radiation therapy: Bone
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Jul 23, 2021 04:24PM divinemrsm wrote:


Olma, I saw this today on FB. I often read a handful of comments to get an idea of what others are saying, and someone did point out that the complaint should have been made prior to the games and I agree. I hope that the players pursue the matter after the Olympics, and these rules get changed. It is so messed up. I read a month or so ago about female gymnasts also trying to go about changing some of the clothing rules for their sport.




found lump 12-22-10—ilc—er+/pr+/her2—stage iv bone mets—chemo~lumpectomy~radiation~arimidex—March 2019-ibrance/aromasin* —Sept 2019-verzenio* —March 2020-xeloda*
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Jul 23, 2021 04:31PM serenitystat wrote:

Divine - I alluded to this in my first post in this thread. The women did complain before. They were willing to pay the fine. Then they were threatened with disqualification on top of the fine.

🤦🏻‍♀️🤷🏻‍♀️ . . . . . "Do not overlook the little joys!" (Hesse, 1905) 🐶☕️🛀🖼🥐🌲🎭 Dx-11/2015-IDC.L.IIIC.10/11-nodes.++- 12/2015-L.Mast 2/2016-4AC+12Taxol fasted 9/2016-Rads.Nodes.Chest-wall.15+4boosts 10/2016-Tamox(2.5y) 4/2019-Exemestane 12/2019-Ibrance/Xgeva
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Jul 23, 2021 07:46PM - edited Jul 24, 2021 06:07AM by divinemrsm

Serenity, I can't even believe this discrepancy between men and women's uniforms still exists! It's upsetting.

Here is a good article from MSNBC (editted for length). The word they use to describe the uniforms is hypersexualization.


*This Norwegian beach handball bikini debacle is absurdly archaic

July 20, 2021, 6:43 PM EDT

Even being a world-class athlete won't shield you from having to deal with misogynist crap.

International Handball Federation regulations stipulate that female athletes must wear bikini bottoms "with a close fit and cut on an upward angle toward the top of the leg," and "the side width must be of a maximum of 10 centimeters," or about 4 inches. However, their male counterparts are allowed to wear shorts, as long as they clear 10 centimeters above the kneecap.

The Norwegian players chose to move forward with the uniform change as a form of public protest against archaic rules that prioritize hypersexualization over the comfort of the athletes. The Norwegian Handball Federation supported the players and agreed to pay the fines on their behalf.

"I hope we get a breakthrough for this and that next summer we play in what we want,"said team captain Katinka Haltvik.

Obviously, there is nothing inherently harmful about a bikini, in sports or otherwise. However, when required athletic uniforms are dictated by gender norms rather than the needs of the athletic activity, therein lies the problem — and the deeply embedded sexism.

To pretend that the way athletes are costumed has no bearing on the way they are perceived would be naïve. There is a reason that Olympic beach volleyball players are often photographed in parts rather than as whole humans: close-ups of butts and torsos and chests rather than as living, breathing, moving marvels.

To force female athletes to wear outfits they feel fundamentally limited by or uncomfortable in only serves to perpetuate the idea that they exist, first and foremost, to be consumed. The men can play. The women are putting on a show.

At the end of the day, the focus should be on the physical abilities of beach handball players, not the number of centimeters the seams of their uniforms are from their vulvas. If the athletes who play beach handball are demanding change, ignoring them sends the message that the ability of the public to leer at female bodies is more important than the sport itself.


found lump 12-22-10—ilc—er+/pr+/her2—stage iv bone mets—chemo~lumpectomy~radiation~arimidex—March 2019-ibrance/aromasin* —Sept 2019-verzenio* —March 2020-xeloda*
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Jul 23, 2021 07:48PM - edited Jul 23, 2021 07:51PM by divinemrsm

I looked to see if there was any follow-up to the story and found this: In response to expressions of criticism at the rules, and the treatment of the Norwegian women's team, European Handball Federation [EHF] President Michael Wiederer insisted that "the EHF will do all it can to ensure that a change of athlete uniform regulations can be implemented," but said such a rules change "could not happen overnight."

And here's a photo of what the handball players got fined for wearing.


found lump 12-22-10—ilc—er+/pr+/her2—stage iv bone mets—chemo~lumpectomy~radiation~arimidex—March 2019-ibrance/aromasin* —Sept 2019-verzenio* —March 2020-xeloda*
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Jul 23, 2021 09:04PM voraciousreader wrote:

want to talk about transgender and female sports? My crystal ball tells me that argument is heading to the Supreme Court sooner or later…

Doctor told me regarding my prognosis that I WASN'T on the Titanic! Hmmm...Really?....Okay! 02/2010 Pure Mucinous Breast Cancer, Oncotype DX 15, Stage 1, Grade 1, 1.8 cm, 0/2 nodes, ER+ 90% /PR+ 70% HER2- (+1)

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