Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?
Comments
-
Wonderful news, enjoyful. I believe you will qualify for medicare after two years on disability.
Of course, it is sad that you qualify for disability rather than having good health.
__________________________________Dx 8/07,IDC, 2.4cm, Stage IIa, Grade 2, 0/8 nodes, ER+PR+Her2 borderline -- "If you see what is small as it sees itself, and accept what is weak for what strength it has, and use what is dim for the light it gives, then all will go well."- Lao-Tsu
0 -
Hello, dear ladies, have been enjoying this thread since I was diagnosed several months ago. I've been an atheist in a its-no-big-deal kind of way every since I can remember. Same with my brothers and sister. I guess we were raised that way, since our atheism isn't something we ever discuss with each, just take it for granted. Oh, and I also don't believe I have a soul.
I popped in here to whine a bit, and I hope you'll put up with me, in the middle of these beautiful pictures, interesting stories, and bits of news.
I am in the middle of round #2 of four of chemo, and I am finding that my brain isn't functioning at the perfect peak efficiency I've always imagined it's been humming at before (grin). In fact I have all the classic symptoms of "chemo brain": word finding difficulty, short term memory problems, difficulty concentrating, a hard time reading and comprehending, no ability whatsoever to multi-task. I also have been feeling unreal, like I'm "high and I can't come down" for 7 days. Just driving locally is a challenge; I can not now safely get on a highway. Blah blah blah. No drugs, lots of sleep, plenty of exercise, good food, etc. I'm blaming the chemo.
So why am I posting? Seriously, I just forgot. Jiminy! Something about brain, and my mind being a product of my brain, and "me" being my mind; and my friends not understanding my despair, because they all believe that "me" is their soul, which is eternal. I guess I'll need to come back and edit this when I can make sense.
Some research seems to be showing that the "chemo brain" effects, while usually temporary, can be permanent. I have almost two weeks to decide, but am moving in the direction of refusing more chemo, and instead going direct to the five years of hormone blocking. This is a big change for me, since before now I wanted to do absolutely everything and anything to prolong my life expectancy. I thought I valued all life experiences, good and bad, joyous and despairing, because life is an interesting trip, much better reading than any novel; and death is, well, death is nothingness. But if I must risk my brain, my mind, my "me," well, it sounds like a stupid song, but I just wanna be ME.
I think my friends want me to just have faith, and press on, knowing that God has a plan for me, no matter how brain damaged I get. I'm guessing only other atheists can understand how terrifying it feels to me to risk my brain, on a gamble that the cancer won't recur.
...about fertilizer, recycling after death, aren't we all constantly recycling right now? Every atom of every breath, recycled billions of times through other organisms, all life processes incorporated in the earth's ancient carbon cycle. Every molecule, through eating/excreting/shedding/respirating, constantly exchanged with the rest of the environment. The microscopic mites that live on our skin and eyelashes, the bacteria essential to the workings of our gut, that delicious asparagus an hour ago? In general, I take great existential comfort from the notion that I'm temporarily "earth made animate."
Except, these few days, I'm taking little comfort from anything at all...
Thanks so much for reading my blatherings. Expressions of sympathy are always welcome.
0 -
Hmmmmm well....that's a tough call, mammal. I've been through chemo twice and my "chemo brain" side effects were short-term. A return to normalcy took two years after ACT, but just a few months after TC (which I believe you're taking?). I have short-term memory problems sometimes but I blame Arimidex for that. *sneering at Arimidex*
I had not heard that some of the brain effects might be permanent. Youch! What if I just think I'm me but I'm too stupid now to realize it?? Hahahaha...seriously, nobody seems to think I'm less sharp than I was before, and I still kick everybody's butt at Scrabble (except for my BF, but he's always beaten me!).
Please talk with your onc about your concerns. Hopefully someone will be along soon to relate their experiences, too.
Best wishes!
E
0 -
Notself - Thank you! I still get retiree health benefits from work so I'm not in dire need of medicare yet. I suspect my employer may be changing retiree benefits soon, though, since they're so expensive.
I am so sad about losing my good health. Not a day goes by that I don't think of how I felt "before" vs now, and how it affects my daughter and my family, my BF and my best friends.... well crap. I'm going to go and watch a comedy now. :-)
E
0 -
Hi there mam...
I spent alot of time in Santa Cruz.. Two of my sons graduated from UCSC years ago.
I just wanted to reassure you about your mind at the moment..I too went through that on chemo and still have lingering very small effects of it, but then I am older now too, so some of that could be due to age...but I digress..
In the scheme of things the time in chemo is relatively short and there is life at the end of the chemo tunnel..even though at times it seems elusive.. I would say, hang on for that and deal with the rest later. you know," one step at a time and you have to do what you have to do..." but it is true.
Stave off making big decisions until after you have finished up with the chemo. This is a good place to vent and you have lots of us who are going thru this or have gone thru this and are good listeners.
Sending hugs up north to you
SoCal
0 -
Enjoyful...glad you were able to successfully deal with the red tape agency from you know where..
0 -
The red tape agency from....NEW JERSEY?! Hahahaha....no offense to my NJ friends. :-) Actually, SS was quite understanding and relatively easy to deal with.
I was diagnosed in 2004, then had a recurrence in August 2009. Were you talking to someone else, Lisa, and I just butted in??
*stupid Arimidex*
E
0 -
Sorry, E., I just looked at something and it was not what I thought it was, forgive me..
chemo brain??? lol
0 -
Hahaha...no problem, Lisa. I was starting to think I was actually diagnosed in 2000!
0 -
Hi guys -- just checking in after watching a re-run of Boston Legal (never watched it the first time around, silly me!). What an absurdly funny series that was.
Mam- let me add my welcome to you along with everyone else in our little corner. As for chemo brain -- well, it took me by surprise! I'm sure there is a physiological reason for it, but I tend to think that one's pre-occupation with a cancer dx, and the treatments, and the tests and appts., and dealing with the se's, and with family and friends who are worried etc., may just have a great deal more to do with memory and cognitive function than is given credit
Even now, two years after tx, I find I can be easily distracted and frequently forget the reason I just walked into the kitchen! But I don't attribute that to chemo -- just to life and the fact that I'm not quite as young as I think I am
!Hugs to you! Linda
0 -
Add me to the list of those who've been operating in super-slow motion this last week. This was my Canadian vacation - Toronto, Montreal and Stratford - and it went from hot to steamy to unbearable. Yesterday (in Stratford) was a glorious respite, but today, back home, it's sultry again.
I feel as though I owe myself a compensatory Montreal vacation sometime soon, as this one sort of shriveled in the heat. Plus, I missed connections with Mary (covertanjou). But we did catch some great music at the jazz festival, explored the shadier parts of the botanical gardens (which are amazing, especially the Chinese garden) and ate extremely well.
Linda
0 -
Posted the above before jumping to this page and reading the rest of the posts . . . Mammal, I'm really sorry that chemo has been so hard on you. I hope you can find support here, and that we can help pull you through. As someone else also remarked, you write really vividly, so even if you feel as though you're losing yourself, I'm going to be presumptious and say that you're still there. It's terrifying to think of side effects lingering, or even being permanent, but in the vast majority of cases, they do go away. I also agree that it's hard to sort out what's responsible for what - what's chemo, what's stress, what's menopause, what's tamox/AIs, and what's just getting older.
Linda
0 -
Many thanks for the replies and sympathy. Just this morning, was able to reach down the rabbit hole, pull out my brain--a little tattered and dog-drooly, but definitely MINE--dust it off, and pop it back in my skull. Glided joyfully around the house, carefully avoiding any housework and exercise, cuz, hey that's how I know I'm truly myself. Secretly kissed the kitchen table, because it was so REAL.
So I endured 7 days of twilight zone unreality. I went shrieking for help all over BC.org, and the general consensus seemed to be that there are two issues here. One is the scary disconnected high feeling, which other women have experienced, and one woman attributes to the steroid. The other is the classic "chemo brain" which usually improves after treatment, and might be blameable, physiologically, on menopause. Though I really must point us to the small 2009 study at Stanford (Kesler and Spiegel) that fMRIed 14 women post chemo and 14 women controls;and found something odd and longterm fishy about the post chemo brains. I think,in my muddle, I confused the two issues and thought the high feeling was the brain damage that might be permanent. (My hippie-era husband professes amazement that I would not like to be permanently high.) Plus, my heart would break if I had permanent chemo brain that kept me from returning to work.
I still think "chemo brain" is too cutesy a term by far, and should immediately be replaced with the medical term "Devasting Neurocognitive Dysunction That Is Way Not Taken Seriously Enough By The Medical Establishment." I will be consulting tomorrow with my PCP about my DNDTIWNTSEBTME. I'm gonna see if I can convince him to send me to one of those Stanford research hot shots; or at the very least get him to prescribe me some of that Super Secret Brain Protector Spray that all you well-recovered ladies must have already been issued, in case I do decide to keep dipping my favorite organ into the TC chemo soup.
George Eliot wrote my favorite quote: "What do we live for, if it is not to make life less difficult to each other." It's a twofer--not only a great quote, but my main moral precept.
Thank you all for your kindness in responding, saying nice things, giving advice, relating your own experiences. You made my life less difficult to me. I tell you, you godless atheists are total kick butt moral super stars!
I'm off to kiss my refrigerator door handle now.
0 -
Hi all:
Yes, Madalyn, I have bunnies. Or rather one is a bunny, the other is part mountain goat. I found her on the stove one evening. Never had a climber like that before. It gives new meaning to bunny proofing the house.
Alas, the happy ending for Stormy may be premature. Turns out she has an owner - who says she "occasionally" gets loose. I'm sure he means well but it's only a matter of time until one of the many speeders hits her. I'm so sad. She would have had a wonderful - and safe - home with my friends.
Mega congrats, E, on your pending retirement. I know you don't feel good about retiring while you feel well but life is so unpredictable. And, frankly, you have a lot on your plate now. So take advantage of it. I know you will but stop feeling so guilty about it! It gives you the freedom to focus on your health and the ones you love.
0 -
Good Morning Ladies and Leprechaun!
And welcome to Ms. Mammal!
Madalyn .. the problem of typing the wrong word is huge for me. Especially since I'm a transcriptionist. And it's getting worse. What is my excuse/reason ... I didn't have chemo. I'm 54 so not quite senile yet. It's very frustrating and at times makes me so anxious. My PCP can't figure it out either. But since it happens to lots of ladies with and w/o chemo .. I wonder if it's the lack of estrogen ... or that my mind goes so fast, my fingers shortcut to any word they'd like.
This is so frustrating, especially for "word" people.
I'm so sorry Stormy doesn't get to stay in her new home. My biggest pet peave (pun intended) is people who don't keep track of their pets. I hate it when I see loose dogs around here. I have to round them up and find their families. How do you not know your dog or cat is missing!?!
Sending good thoughts for a fresh new week.
Love,
Bren
Edited: Typed wrong word in the right place! arghhhh!
0 -
0 -
Bren., love it
0 -
Wow! That's almost 3-dimensional!
Those of us who are camera-challenged really appreciate the sharing of gorgeous pix! Thanks!
0 -
What an amazing picture! I wish I could take pictures like that.
Two inches of rain overnight. Another two inches today. While at work, all I could think of was my garden floating down the street. Which actually was a nicer image than the image of a flooded basement which also haunted me.
Thankfully, neither proved to have happened.
Rain, rain, go away. Please come back another day.
0 -
Thanks friends ... can't take credit for the pic .. my sis took that picture!
Rico ... glad to hear you weren't flooded out and your basement and garden are still intact!
TGIF .. have a grand day everyone,
Love,
Bren
0 -
those contemplating memory issues: remember that stress will also erase your memory and impair your ability to pull up the right, the right, the. . . what was I saying? Seriously, the general stress of life, let alone, cancer can cause you memory issues even if you aren't on chemo.
Our cat was also an abandoned kitty. I still don't get how someone can do that but whatever. We noticed that when we moved and took him with us, his personality began to change. It was like he was waiting for us to ditch him like his first owners and when we didn't, he started to relax. Then when we moved again, he completely settled in. He has gone from a hissy growly thing that couldn't even be picked up to a cat that feels imposed upon if he has to walk anywhere--isn't that why we got him a small boy? so cat would have a porter/sherpa?
0 -
DH took this pic this a.m.
0 -
Hi ladies
Although I was brought up in a strong Anglican family, I am probably an athiest but I keep my options open, lol. I have read the whole thread and I enjoyed your discussions. What really gets up my nose is the intolerance of my 'disbelief' by those who do 'believe'. Why must I be 'saved'? I am happy as I am, just leave me alone - I leave you alone!
For example my best girl friend has a strong faith but she doesn't press her religion on me and I thought we were tolerant of eachothers' beliefs however, a couple of months after my dx, she said 'I prayed that He would show you the path to follow him but I didn't think it would be this soon'. She meant of course that my BC had been a message from Him to come into the fold. First of all I was horrified that she might have caused my BC ( stupid I know but in my defense your brain is not working normally when you have just had this dx is it?) and then I was hurt that she would think that this dx could be something good for me but I was then actually more hurt by the fact that she obviously does not accept me as I am. I couldn't see her for a long time after that but forgave her when I realized that she only wants the best for me and that if God had chosen this way to 'enlighten' me she trusted that it must be the right way. Well, it didn't work and hopefully my experience has enlightened her about real strength in the face of adversity.
Oh, would love to have some warm days here - winter for me here in New Zealand. I am cold with temps 45-55 most days. Where I live we have a pretty mild winter compared to most other parts of NZ so not too bad. Summer is not extreme either with temps 75-85 mostly although we do get pretty high humidity so that makes it seem hotter.
It is 10.30pm Saturday night - I am looking forward to my warm electric blanket bed.
Rae
0 -
Welcome, Rae.
How very strange that someone would pray for something bad to happen to you so you would find God. If someone admitted doing that for me, I'm not sure I would still want to know her.
But then I've always struggled with the notion of a vindictive God who punishes people who do not worship him. We don't respect people who behave that way. Why would we think that an omniscient, omnipotent God would behave that way?
Very strange.
0 -
Hi Rico
I don't think she prayed for something bad to happen to me - just some life altering event that would nudge me into a faith. I would much rather have had an 'enlightening' moment on the top of the Grand Canyon or something though - that may have worked! Although thinking about it I have stood at the top of the Grand Canyon in awe but being a geomorphologist I was looking for landforms not God, lol.
Rae
0 -
raeinnz,
You are right. The issue is really about her lack of respect for your non-belief.
I had to end a friendship with a high school classmate because she would not respect the fact that I had a right to be an atheist. All I asked her to do was to stop sending me emails with religious messages. She refused so I told her that I was marking all her emails as spam. She stopped talking to me at all. To me this indicates that she was never interested in friendship but only in putting a notch in her conversion belt.
Every once in a while we get a religious person proselytizing on this thread. I report her post and send a PM explaining why we as atheists want one place where we can be free from proselytizing. It is almost like a compulsive behavior and it is always based in fear. "Believe as I believe or you will not be saved." It is a sad religion that is based in fear.
0 -
notself
I think it is getting harder than it was to be an athiest even in NZ. We have traditionally been a country of religious tolerance but that is changing now. Tolerance cannot exist where there is fanatacism and the mega churches, with their propensity to whip their members into religious fervour, breed fanatacism in my opinion. There is huge growth in the mega churches and a comparable drop in the numbers of traditional congregations, young members being particularly drawn to and strongly influenced by mega churches. We have brought our daughters up with no religion (we decided they could make up their own minds as adults as to their beliefs without early 'brainwashing') but have answered questions and had discussions on religion when it has arisen. We have taught them tolerance of and respect for others' opinions and beliefs in general but particularly religious and political beliefs as these are very emotive topics. However it is getting so hard for the young non-believers to deal with these fanatics who do not seem to exhibit the same respect or tolerance. At high school they have been accosted daily by believers trying to 'save' them. One DD in particular was so close to resorting to violence to get the message across to a girl who continually harassed her, that I had to approach the school and ask them to tell the girl to lay off. These teenagers just will not take 'no' for an answer and it is not right. Sometimes I feel I live a more 'Christian' life than Christians do - weird?!
Rae
0 -
Rae, I had the non-religious up-bringing of my children come back and bite me. I used to explain the theory/history behind a lot of christian belief systems without going into details re chapter and verse of the Book.
When my youngest son was 15 he became friends with a girl whose mother was into Wikka, 'the good version' he said.
She was really getting into his head and I was worried he was going to join a coven. When I tried to discuss it with him, I had to stress the fact that, until he had learned more about all religions, he could not really chose a particular one as he had no knowledge to compare it with.
Thankfully, it was a passing phase.
Sheila.
0 -
There's one heck of a lot of intolerance going on -- everywhere. Rae, I'm sorry to hear what's going on in New Zealand. We have a few mega-churches here in Canada, and every day more of the traditional congregations are having to close the doors of their smaller churches. But by and large the percentage of those who claim non-affiliation (or non-adherence) is inching upwards. Thankfully our politicians don't seem to feel the need to proclaim their religious beliefs at every opportunity!
0 -
aussiesheila
I hear what you are saying and we did consider that when we made our decision and we decided we had to be very careful about keeping in touch with our teenagers - they are so vulnerable and easily influenced in those years. It's not only young people that become entangled either and you are right on the nail when you say that very often religion it is a passing phase - my husband's eldest daughter, at 29, came on hard times and was drawn into the catholic church, was baptised and attended for about 2 years until things came right in her life and she dumped it all. Now she goes very red whenever the question of her faith comes up.
lindasa
Fortunately most politicians here do not voice their religious beliefs either although we do have 2 church based political parties (one a mega church type and one a Maori church party) - neither of them make it into parliament though thank goodness.
Our percentage claiming adherence to any religion is climbing but I also feel (no stats to back that up) the percentage of people attending church is rising. Our society has become more cosmopoliton over the last 40 years and many immigrants are ardent churchgoers whatever their faith. And some of the reason is that we have only 4.5 million total population and with the advent (oops sorry a word with religious connotations but I won't hold that against it, lol) of the mega churches there is competition for congregation and as a result the profile of religious belief has been raised markedly. The mega churches have a very high profile (and lots of money it seems) and advertise etc so they attract a lot more people. Our traditional churches are having to alter their profile to be more in line with the mega churches to keep or attract congregation - they are adding things like creches and cafes to make attending church more attractive - and are altering services to include more modern music or running some services in a modern format whilst retaining traditional services for those who prefer them. So whereas before people would go to church if they chose to, now we are being invited to 'have a go' or 'come and see what it is all about' or 'come and join our faith for beginners seminars'. Recently there was a billboard outside a local church - we live very near a place called 'Bethlehem' (true) and there are about a dozen churches gathered in a very small area (not surprizing with a name like that I guess) - and it said 'athiests have nothing to worry about - yeah right!' The 'yeah right' is a NZ saying that means 'I don't believe that'. The ultimate in intolerance and insensitivity toward anyone else's opinions we thought and decided a complaint wasn't even worth the effort if they could publically display something like that as a way of trying to attract people into their fold.
However having said all that, maybe we have been different from other countries in the past and are just catching up to the way it is elsewhere or maybe I am just touchy 1) that my beliefs are not as well tolerated as they were, 2) that people seem to think that I should alter my beliefs and regularly try to do so and 3) that I will be better off if I do.
Nice to be able to discuss these things with people who understand.
Rae
0
