natural girls
Comments
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Better to have false hope than false hopelessness!
vtmom - I treated myself to a Vitamix and a really good juicer when I was diagnosed. I love them both. I got a single gear masticating juicer instead of a centrifugal blender that shreds the food and spins the juice out. I like the gear juicer a lot better, because it doesn't make nearly as much foam, and I never liked the foam. Although you can also strain the juice to get rid of it. My juicer actually came with a separate screen tray just for that. My juicer is an Omega.
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Thanks for the welcome, Deni!
Shay, I don't know how to advise you, but I will say I did not ask my onc about going off Tamoxifen. Of course, my DCIS was extremely small and a lot of women have been surprised I was put on it at all.
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Welcome to our little group, inspiewriter and ShayT!
vtmom - I treated myself to a Vitamix and a really good juicer when I was diagnosed. I love them both. I got a single gear masticating juicer instead of a centrifugal blender that shreds the food and spins the juice out. I like the gear juicer a lot better, because it doesn't make nearly as much foam, and I never liked the foam. Although you can also strain the juice to get rid of it. My juicer actually came with a separate screen tray just for that. My juicer is an Omega.I have a Vitamix and an Omega juicer too... I second the recommendation; they are both FANTASTIC.
I've already decided that if I'm ER+, I will NOT be taking Tamoxifen. (I know it is the right thing for many women and that's great; I have no problem with anyone taking it.) I KNOW why my hormones are screwed up. It's because I'm fat. (and because of other lifestyle factors that screw with your hormones)
I've made the diet/lifestyle changes I need to to get my hormones back on track. (I've already lost 8 pounds, too -- woohoo! Only 37 more to go for my "hormonally balanced" ideal weight!) I'm committed to this new lifestyle for the rest of my LIFE. I don't need or want a drug to do it.
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And I've said it before: I turned down Tamoxifen 4 years ago..........
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Welcome all you newbies. It is so great to see so many others taking charge of your own health.
It bothers me the way they scare us into using these drugs. I stuggled with that decision for quite awhile, so I know what you are all going through. My drug of choice(theirs not mine) was arimidex. I was so freaked out by the whole idea of taking a drug and not knowing what it might do. I never felt like it was going to help me. Just like you said Shay, I thought I was taking poison. I would sit with my doctors and nurses and cry and cry about the drug. They thought I was overreacting of course. So that is when I decided to start to not just take their word for it, I decided to research. I kept uncovering very frightening facts about how this drug was used by body builders on the black market, and how the study that pushed it on the market was never even completed, etc etc. Then I picked up Dr. Northrups book, The Wisdom of Menopause. It just opened up to the chapter on breast cancer and I read her statement that whenever we are stuggling with a decision, we need to trust our own bodies reactions. I thought this was a sign. It was such a relief to hear a doctor say that I was not crazy and there was a reason for my visceral reaction to taking this drug. I had never done any research before on the internet because my doctors kept telling me not to, that they would take care of me, and I trusted them completely. I did have wonderful caring doctors, but they just were not helping me with this decision. So I googled arimidex and came across a debate here, and the rest is history. Back then, as Yaz said, there was not safe forum for anyone touting alternatives. Anyone who did was attacked and accused of all kinds of things. But the brave people who posted, really got me to thinking. I liked what they said, how they seemed so optimistic and enpowered. I went to the library and starting reading like crazy and the rest is history.
Here I am, 2 years later, happier and healthier than I have ever been in my life. I dropped 40 pounds without trying, just because I was eating the right foods and exercizing daily. Yes Julia, you can do it too! I have been pudgy my whole life and now I am a size 6. I am still learning new things and tweaking everything. My point is that I hope you all will continue to research and make wise decisions based on what you learn, but also on your gut instincts. We all have that little voice that tells us what path we should follow. All we have to do is be quiet long enough to listen.
Althea. I never heard of that ashwanga stuff??? What is it supposed to do. Are you taking progesterone at all? The dizziness and low temp could be from that. It could also be a detox symptom. Are you taking iodine and doing the salt loading? If you are not salt loading regularly, you may need to do it.
Deni-It sounds like your DH is doing well. It must actually be even more bonding that you are both going through this together and can really understand what the other is feeling. My husband just thinks I am a little obsessive and I cannot get him to totally follow my eating plan, but I know he is proud of me, though he is not very verbal. I do not do facebook much, but I would like to become friends with Dr. SS, but not sure how I do it. Is there a link you can give me. I tend to be more into reading books than all the computer stuff. Yeah, I am showing my age!
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vivre, if you have a copy of the Warrior Goddess book, it's listed in the last chapter. It's one of the 30 things she recommends for protecting health. Ashwagandha is an herbal 'adaptogen' which is beneficial in reducing stress. I think all the places I read about it say it's an antioxidant also. I've seen it mentioned many times in reference to helping thyroid conditions also. This description came from eiresource.org: "It works in a similar way to guggul in improving thyroid function by increasing blood levels of T4 and T3 as well as reducing lipid peroxidation in the liver and increasing antioxidants such as superoxide dismutase and catalase. "
I started taking iodoral in december last year. I probably got up to speed with the entire iodine protocol in July with the vit c, atp cofactors, selenium, magnesium and salt. I've been low energy all week and my temperature dropped even lower.
crunchy, you must've already done some homework on tamoxifen. It causes birth defects, so you definitely wouldn't want to take that while trying to conceive. When it was time for me to take hormone therapy, I was given a choice between tamoxifen and arimidex. I had pretty strong feelings about not wanting arimidex. Back then I didn't even want to take a multivitamin, let alone a pharmacuetical, but I took tamoxifen for 26 months.
I had a stomach flu one weekend and didn't take my tamoxifen. One day turned into months and I never took it again. Then it was time to tell my onc. I was apprehensive about getting a fire and brimstone lecture. I swear, he practically yawned. He did so little that I had to wonder if I should've taken it in the first place. But then... you probably wouldn't want to see any of the doctors I've been to except for my surgeons, and I travelled a long way to get to them.
It's truly one of my goals to live a healthy life without any pharmaceuticals. Now I know about iodine. I've been taking it almost a year and I place way more confidence in it to protect my health than I ever had in tamoxifen. There's a huge thread on iodine with reading recommendations for you to explore further.
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When it was time for me to take hormone therapy, I was given a choice between tamoxifen and arimidex. I had pretty strong feelings about not wanting arimidex. Back then I didn't even want to take a multivitamin, let alone a pharmacuetical, but I took tamoxifen for 26 months.
Brave woman... well, hopefully it did what it was supposed to. BTW, do doctors explain when they're prescibing tamoxifen how important it is for estrogen/progesterone balance to get into a healthy weight zone (if that's an issue), to avoid parabens in their cosmetic/skin care products etc.?
What is it with the fire and brimstone lectures?? Totally unrelated side note, but my infertility specialist, Dr. Jackass (as I affectionately refer to him), had put me on Metformin (which tests showed I did NOT need but I had asked him about it). At my 7-week appointment with my last pregnancy, he asked if I was still taking Metformin. I said no, that I was taking an herbal equivalent instead, and he turned on me and said, with a cold sneering tone, "Clearly you're not serious about wanting to keep this pregnancy."
I was crushed -- um, I had had three miscarriages already; OF COURSE I was "serious" about wanting my baby! I tried to remind him that I had been the one to ask him about it and that my bloodwork didn't indicate that I needed it, but he basically repeated what he had said, sharply told the nurse, "Release her to her OB/GYN," and stormed out of the room. I started crying as soon as I walked out the door... I did lose my baby two weeks later, but genetic testing showed that she had a fatal genetic flaw, meaning that losing her had NOTHING to do with not taking Metformin. I just couldn't believe a doctor could be so cruel to a woman who had lost all her babies, over a drug that he ONLY prescribed because I had asked about it. (He hadn't even mentioned it during or before my previous pregnancies.)
Ugh, sorry for the rant... I just hate doctors who think they're God.
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Newbie here,
I finished chemo and radiation in March 2009. I'm double negative and am thinking of cleaning up my life style and eating habits. I lurk here and take in all the various posts with gratitude. Thanks for book recommendations, vitamin descriptions and how they are helping bring health back to your lives.
I'm going to the naturopath, in December, recommended by my doctor, and then to an acupuncturist. I'm on SSDI so these visits must be planned but I am determined to not get more treatment from big Pharma. I took four medications which were taken off the market; they caused patients to die,
Propulsid, and Baycol were removed be the company from the market.Celebrex which I took for my RA caused me to have 2+ protein spillage in my urine. Even a RN has to stop and smell the coffee sometimes.
I have many co-morbid conditions...hereditary unfortunately...and I would like to live my years from now --I'm 64--until the end of my life in a better place physically emotionally and mentally.
Again thanks for this thread. It has inspired me to try alternative methods in my quest regain my strength, which really crashed after radiation, and live a more healthful life.
Mina
excuse all typos grammar...
Came back to tell you that I am going to buy the book recommended,,,TY again...The doctor's life story is fascinating.
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Welcome to the natural girls thread, Mina! Oh goodness... this really makes me mad:
I took four medications which were taken off the market; they caused patients to die
But hey, under the "what doesn't kill me, makes me stronger" principle, you are a VERY strong woman!!
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Good morning everyone!
Althea I am surprised at your onc's reaction--I am not even going to tell mine. He had told me 2 years ago I didn't need to come see him anymore, but then suddenly to renew my Tamox he wanted me to come in. What for? I saw my gyn and had my m'gram, there was no reason to see him. That's when it dawned on me--I don't have to keep taking the Tamox! I can just stop!! It's only been a few weeks and I already feel better, my skin looks better, I have more moisture where I need it and I think I have lost a pound or two!!
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Crunchy, so sorry to hear all that! And shocked at how cold the docs can be.
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Well ladies, I took my first Tamoxifen pill last night. But please dont send me away; I need you now more than ever. My newest mission is to figure out the pros/cons/ differences between regular CoQ10, fermented CoQ10 and CoRN(with riboflavin and niacin, I believe) which I've decided is tops on my list to take. know I've read about them here and will reread and do further research to help me figure out which to take
And I get what you all mean about bossy docs. I didn't like the medoncs I met with, so tried a third one and lo and behold, this one is just my speed. For a med onc prescribing Tamoxifen, he is amazingly open minded. He even told me about drinking tonic water before bed to avoid/relieve leg cramps. Time shall tell.
Thanks to all of you.
PS. Yazmin - Thanks for the kind word. I actuallt was called names on the Tamoxifen thread but since I believe it should be an open formum fought for it to be that way and things have resolved itself nicely.
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MTG please keep us posted on how you do with the Tamoxifen. I was on it 3 months and came to this thread without even thinking I would be shunned LOL.
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Dear MTG:
Of course we would NEVER send you away from here. I, for one, value your contributions, because your posts are well thought-out and positive, and I am sure that our girlfriends here would agree.
Please keep us all posted on your progress with Tamoxifen, which, by the way, I consider a good medicine: Tamoxifen is currently saving the life of one lady in my support group, who has uterine cancer. As soon as she started taking Tamoxifen, all of her tumors sort of "deflated."
What I am opposed to is the automatic prescription of Tamoxifen to everybody, one-size-fits-all-style, when in fact it will only benefit just about 1% of us. But then again, Tamoxifen has hit me close to home: my aunt (not blood related) is currently battling uterine cancer, after years of Tamoxifen. However, I realize that she just happens to be the 1% for whom that happens.
I am sensible enough, though, to acknowledge that the person I mentioned above IS, indeed, that 1% success story. She is raising her family, pursuing a career and, in one word, she is living, even with her extremely serious condition. THANK YOU, Tamoxifen.
I have also come to terms with being called names because of my medical beliefs. I now understand that TREATING disease is only one side of the equation. Creating hope is the other side of that same equation and here, it does not matter whether it works or not. Modern medicine functions on that assumption. This is where our Dear Daddy-Doctors are on the same "wave length" with African or Amazonian Medicine Men (I know, I know: they would have a fit if they heard that
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Hi Lovely Mina!
Althea, I wonder if your Onc's "yawn reaction" to you going off Tamoxifen was due to the fact that so many women end up bagging it? I can't remember where I saw this or what the numbers were, but one of the largest issues with the "hormone" drugs (either Tamox or an AI) is that women won't stay on them.
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MTG-we would never tell you to leave just because you are taking tamox. All we are doing is telling everyone there are choices, and we each should feel good about our choices. Tamox definitely has a place for many and it may give a lot of us comfort, especially if we need the time to figure it all out. The problems with any drugs is long term use. That is why we hope to learn as much from each other. Changing our lifestlye can get us through the long haul when the drugs do not. If we go off a drug after 5 years or so, (because we know tamox loses effectiveness then, and may even promote new cancer), we become high risk because we have not changed our enviroment. Obviously, we had some kind of a deficiency or we would not have gotten cancer. So if we do not figure out what it was, we are at risk for it coming back. No magic pill is going to keep us safe. So those of you who are not entirely "natural" are more than welcome to come on board. You do not need to be as driven as some of us to change almost everything, but even changing some things will be healhty. And that is why we are here, to encourage more people to get healthy.
Mina-It just breaks my heart when I hear how people's health is compromised by big pharma. These drugs are pushed onto the market so quickly because the money is there to advocate for them, yet their deadly side effects are unknown. Welcome to our group. Hope we can help you.
Crunchy-I just have a deep faith that you are going to get everything in balance and end up with those beautiful twins or triplets! What a baby shower we are going to have! Those babies will have lots of aunts, godmothers, and grandmothers(like me!). Heck my boys are committed bachelors so I will take grandchildren any way I can get them. LOL
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Hello Ladies and a special welcome to all the newbies!
I'm on day 4 of a new regime I've added which includes DIM, calcium D- glucarate, turmeric, high dose omega oil, COQ10, milk thistle, magnesium, probiotics and bulk lax (to get things moving). I have to say that I can feel a difference already. Not only do I have more energy but the pain in my left lower leg seems to have diminished considerably. ...could it be the oil that's helping? I'm so grateful for this thread and the friendship you ladies have shown. I know in my heart that this is the way to go even though I am still on Tamox until I get a couple more months of a healthy regime under my belt. It's comforting to know that I'm welcome here even though I'm not totally "natural" and that I can learn from those who are.
Hope everyone is having a great weekend
Terri
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For those who are new to this thread. Here is a list of my regimine. It changes as a learn but this is it right now.
DIM
Iodine
Bcomplex drops
Multi vitamin
C
Zinc
Resveratol
Selenim
Q10 Fish oil
turmeric
alpha lipoic acid
Super enzymes
Htp-5
Meletonin
D3
Milk thistle
Broccolive
all taken with green juice, w/ blueberry concentrate added
Organic food only, no meat
Each one of these is worth looking up and researching for yourself then deciding if you want to add them.
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Welcome all of the newbies that are here to share and learn. The only prerequisite for being here is that you have an open mind - and if you are here, you do.
Mina - so horrible that you were taken off of 4 different drugs that were taken off the market. Does not give you much faith in the medical system as it operates today. We do need changes, don't we?
Viv - to become Dr. Servan-Shreiber's friend on Facebook, you simply have to go to Facebook.com and open an account. Once you do this, you can search his name and then request to be added as a friend on his page. It will probably take a couple of days before he (or someone) responds and adds you. Definitely worth the effort, he's got some great info that he updates regularly.
Enjoy your weekend lovely ladies! Tomorrow is my daughter's birthday and we are celebrating today. She was just a baby, now she is 15! When and how did this happen???
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I haven't tried to become a friend of Dr. Servan Schreiber, but I went to Facebook and became a fan of his.
Here is the link:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/pages/David-Servan-Schreiber/52993224054?ref=ts
There are links posted there.
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Yazmin ~ Thanks for the link! I just used it (and sent it directly to some of you via Facebook) and am excited to see what he has to share. I wonder if he has a website and mailing list, too? . Deanna
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Ah! Thanks Yazmin. I don't know very much about Facebook at all. I just started an account today and the only friend I have so far is my husband! At least now I can see what my daughters are up to!
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Thank you, all. This is a truly nice, safe, and productive place to spend time.
Yazmin - you may be interested in knowing that the MDs are finally doing something about the "one size fits all" concept. And let's face it, T is the ONLY drug I've ever heard of that has the same dosage for a 400lb person who's a low metabolizer as for an 85lb one who's a high metabolizer. The first study that is currently being conducted is increasing the dosage for low metabolizers from 20 to 30 and 40 mg. This is apparenly being done at 2 hopitals, one in NY and not certain about the other. After that wil be a test of 10mg for high metabolizers.
And now, my question for you ladies - what's a good internet or brick and mortar location to buy vitamin supplements. My friend had suggested Life Extension (apparently there's a discount associated with membership ?); anything else have great prices and quality ?
Thanks. Hope everyone's weekend was either a blast or peaceful, as you prefer.
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joanne, I've never heard of herb robert. As for taking things that might interfere with chemo, you might want to be aware that only 6% of students graduating from medical school have ANY training in nutrition or nutritional medicine. Doctors are training in detecting disease and prescribing pharmaceuticals. One author on nutritional medicine I've liked is Dr Ray Strand, if you want to search out more information.
yazmin, what a rush it must have been to meet dr servin-schriber! What kind of false hope could the man possibly be offering when he's living, breathing, and thriving after such a serious disease? Some people.
inspiewriter and vtmom and shayT, bar62, welcome to the thread. It's so great to see new people joining this thread! vtmom, be sure to get a masticating juicer, as opposed to a centrifugal juicer. Lots of good choices are out there. I use a champion that I bought 20+ years ago. It sat idle most of that time, but for more than a year now I've been juicing every day at least once, usually twice, and sometimes three times a day.
crunchy, I don't get these doctors either who get all high and mighty when questioned. I often suspect they have no solid foundation for their recommendations and it hits a nerve when we want to know more. And besides, it's like the ugly remarks from some people you got when you first arrived -- it reflects the nature of the person making the remark, not you. Even so, I can never seem to remember things like that at the time. Doctors like that rattle me to the core every time.
mtg, I would never scold anyone for taking tamoxifen! Part of why I stopped taking it after 26 months was my suspicion that it was the culprit in my fatigue that plagued me since rads. Well, I still have fatigue, but I do think my eyesight improved. And the hot flashes went away. Boy were they the pits.
Spring, I really was surprised at the nonchalance from my onc when I told him I'd stopped the tamoxifen. He didn't try to talk me into taking it again, didn't offer anything else, didn't offer any revised statistics of risk of recurrence. All he said was 'some women do fine with tamoxifen, and others find the side effects unbearable.' In fact, I was never given a percentage rate regarding my er/pr status, never told my risk or recurrence, or by how much they estimated tamoxifen improved my odds.
I know some oncs will monitor hormone levels. I asked for it one time, and the nurse said 'oh, we only do tests on things that are cancer related.' I thought, yeah right, I have an er/pr positive dx and take hormone therapy, but testing hormone levels isn't cancer related??? That same visit I asked the onc directly, and he didn't do that testing because he 'doesn't find the information helpful.' Later on I learn there's a cyp26 test that evaluates how well a person metabolizes tamoxifen. I'd stopped taking it by then, but somehow I suspect that 'information wouldn't be helpful' either in that office.
I also learned along the way that they don't even take their blood pressure readings according to protocol. So, how am I supposed to have confidence in the care I receive? It's no wonder people kick their prescription bottles to the curb. ok, I'm done ranting now.
terri, I take ubiquinol coQ10. We discussed coQ10 previously if you want to search. I'm not recalling at the moment why I opted for the ubiquinol form.
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mtg, I've been shopping at vitamin shoppe. They have good coupons every month, and they have a free membership program for accumulating points. I'm not sure how the points will benefit me yet, but I have almost 500 so far this year. What I like best is being able to shop online at the website to figure out exactly what I want. So far, everything I write on my list is in stock at the store. If I do my shopping at the store, I lose my concentration when faced with the sea of choices. And besides, the print is so small on most labels, I'd have to bring my magnifying glass to the store with me. lol
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MTG - another good place for supplements is vitacost.com. They seem to have good prices. I have also ordered from naturamart.com for things that vitacost doesn't carry. Naturamart even carries some Life Extension supplements at prices lower than Life Extension WITH the discount. So, definitely worth checking out.
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Hi LJ13, I just wanted to say great post from march 5 11:03 am
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Dear Mina:
Welcome to the "altie" forum. I am sorry to hear that you have been through all this with medication.
Believe it or not, they had also given me Propulsid (before breast cancer). I think the reason why I turned to alternatives is that I spent about 10 (ten) years fighting digestion problems. They gave me AALL kinds of medicine, from Axid to (the little purple pill), etc...
How did I cure that health problem? One day, I had organic Yogurt (which I had been neglecting) and a bulb went on: I had discovered the probiotics. Since then, I have made a conscious effort to include probiotics into my diet. Fermented vegetables (but only from time to time, due to the salt in them, and to the fact that Dr. Weil believes that they might contain cancer-causing bacteria); Coconut Kefir....I make my four-vegetable salads with apple cider vinegar......and I have COMPLETELY cured my Irritable Bowel Syndrom. Completely.
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Althea: Yes, it was quite a rush to meet Dr. Servan Schreiber. But I was absolutely determined. I am normally a shy and non-aggressive person. At the end of Dr. Servan Schreiber's speech, though, I began to run towards the stage despite wearing high heels (couldn't let him escape), while the whole room was on its feet with a standing ovation. I then wasted no time speaking to him in our common native language: French. Hurled my most pressing question at him....And... VOILA..... In about 5 minutes, I had my picture taken with him by my friend. In addition to being an outstanding, off-the-beaten-path scientist, he appears to be a very caring, compassionate human being.
Deanna: I am also wondering if Dr. Servan-Schreiber has a website. Will find out. I did ask him if he is still involved with the Integrative department he co-founded in Pittsburg, and he said no, he now lives in Paris (If he had still been in Pittsburg, I would have tried to find myself an oncologist there among his colleagues, because his outlook is exactly what I have been desperately looking for in cancer care).
MTG, you wrote:
Yazmin - you may be interested in knowing that the MDs are finally doing something about the "one size fits all" concept. And let's face it, T is the ONLY drug I've ever heard of that has the same dosage for a 400lb person who's a low metabolizer as for an 85lb one who's a high metabolizer. The first study that is currently being conducted is increasing the dosage for low metabolizers from 20 to 30 and 40 mg.
See: that's one of the problems I have with the current conception of cancer care: their solution for this medicine not being adapted to each patient is to....increase dosage. What I feel they need to do is to work on a test to determine who benefits from Tamoxifen and who simply doesn't. And what they need to do is to change their mentality to start producing drugs that are: (i) less toxic; and (ii) better targeted. For all I know, we might soon hear that they had to back out of increasing the dosage for a better fit. After all, some women have been kept on Tamoxifen for up to 10 (ten) years before it was discovered that the risks of such a long-term treatment largely outweigh the benefits (I think that if they were willing to listen, some of us could have told them that from the get-go, and they would not have spent millions and millions of dollars in "studies" to find out).
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Merilee, Thank you so much for your list. It is so hard to find a place to even start and the research takes forever. I am going to take your list to a naturopath and go from there.
Shay
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