"Cording" from below expander into ribs?
Hi,
I've read about cording that can extend from the underarm where nodes are taken and down into the hand. I've seen pics of this too. The thing is, I've got that going on from the fold at the bottom of my "breast" (where the expander is) and down into my ribs and beyond. I can literally see a cord, a tight violin string of tissue - stretched out from the bottom of the expander (and where the alloderm was stitched in) all the way beyond the bottom of my ribs. It hurts like a *$(#*$)@!! when I stretch. Anyone have this in their experience?
Geena
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I did (do), Geena. When at the worse, the cord ran both up through the axilla towards the right shoulder and into the right arm with toothpick like cords extending to the forearm AND down two or so inches and into the space below my right lower ribcage. I had to have the cord eventually incised twice to get some relief on all the tugging both inferiorly and up to the shoulder. This is very rare, and I went up to MSK in NYC for second opinion before it was done.
The cord inserting below the rib was a bad pain: recall it well. Most of the time these cords resolve on their own, so have hope. I'm sure others will give you sound advice on how to cope but I wished to let you know you're not imaging this or the pain.
My best to you,
Tender
Oops: I said (do) because a small remnent going to the rib still is present but on less tension due to the past incision. It's still tender to touch so I stay away from touching it. It's about an inch or more.
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Geena,
I had the cording in my arm and down my ribs. It is painful. I would rub it as I stretched. The cord in my arm actually popped. The therapist and I both heard it. The day after I had a bruise on the inside of my elbow and 2 lumps where the ends settled after they seperated. It took a long time to resolve and just when I thought it was going to get better and I let up on the stretching, it would start to get tight again.
Push through the pain and keep stretching.
Good luck to you.
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Geena you might wish to post your question in the Lymphedema Forum - many women there are experts at how to deal with cording through LE massage therapy. You shouldn't have to suffer while waiting for it to resolve on its own - sometimes that can take months. My LE therapist did massage therapy on my arm where I had cording - but also on my reconstructed breast and it really helped. Hope you feel better soon!
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I was told sometime PT can help but that is also painful. I had the cording from my armpit to my wrist. After exercise and massaging it myself it finally went away. It really does look strange just like a guitar string. YUK!
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Shoot... I know what you speak of sister.. I JUST CANNOT remember the name, I have been looking through all my old post too...grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Call your PS tomorrow.. I still stand behind that it is not cording. Not the kind running down our arms.
It is from bottom of breast to ribs. Looks like a cord and it hurts like it is attached... I am sorry I cannot find the name of it for you.
I really feel it will go away for you..Laura
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If you're thinking Esteep of the inferior insertion of the latissimus dorsi tendon, I don't know.
There is a vein that runs along the axilla from rib up too: but, now I don't recall it's name. I think maybe long thoracic vein? One of my docs thought my "cord" was actually this vein which had thrombosed or clotted. In the end, no one could tell and they carefully (because arteries, veins and nerves run in bundles together) incised the cord to release the pulling pressure.
A "cord", it seems, might be lymphatic, thrombotic, and is almost always fibrotic (fibrous scar).
Good thread,
Tender
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It sounds like something I had after my lumpectomy and after my mastectomy. It was called Mondor's cords. Your plastic surgeon can tell you if this is what it is. It was very painful but it did go away although it took a couple of months.
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YES YES YES,,, Mondor's Cord.. THANK you coffee..
This is what I think it is... call your doctor in the morning just to check it out.. LE is not anything to mess with... but I bet that is all it is.. Mondors Cord..
THANK YOU COFFEE.. it has been driving me nuts..:)
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I am glad I could help. I think it was just treated with heat and ASA or advil for comfort. It is really common with breast reductions as well. I have not gone back to look it up but I think it has to do with inflammation of the blood vessels or lymph vessels post surgery???
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Yes, sounds exactly like Mondor's. I had it and, though painful, it went away on its own in a couple of months. Apparently, this is the typical course. It can recur again, but while painful, it's not health-threatening. It can happen after any breast surgery, even implants in a healthy breast. Any cording is considered a risk sign for lymphedema but isn't in itself lymphedema. I had cording in my arm and Mondor's several years ago and do not have lymphedema (and am hoping to keep it that way!).
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Here you go Geena:
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How lucky am I to have FOUND YOU PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously! Thank you for all the feedback!
Tender (is that your real name? Love it!), Erica, Laura, Deborah, Coffee, Deborye, BBMom, Swim Angel - you all rock!
Deborah - the photos look pretty much like what I have only I can see them extend into my stomach. YUCK! I'm going to post pics and put them on Timtam's forum at some point soon so if others get this they'll be able to see. I phoned my doc about it and used the words "mondors cords" and she didn't second that. Don't know if that's because she calls it something else or what. She reiterated with me that when she stitched the alloderm in it sometimes catches the fascia that runs along rectus abdomins. She said it should resolve in 3-6 months. I used to be a massage therapist, so based on some of the posts I've started doing some slow self-myofascial massage to lengthen the fascia. It hurts, but I think it is helping me get more ROM.
Again the thing that I find wild - doctors don't mention this stuff - then strange things occur, like this. If I didn't have this forum, and with the limited access to doctors (due to the crazy system, their crazy schedules, yadda, yadda) - I'd be one freakin chick!
Thank you all!
Geena
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GEENA, I agree! I could write a book about things the doctors forgot to mention. When I showed my mondors cord to the ps, he acted like he had never seen one before. I always feel like I am his first patient to ever mention something. ie: first to find the TE's uncomfortable, first person to have pain with fills, first person to have trouble getting ROM back, first to have a mondors cord, etc. Thank god for this forum and google!
My 18 year old daughter just had her tonsils out last week. The doctors told me their version of what to expect. Then, when something different happened, I would google it and find out it was perfectly normal. It's like they only want to tell you the bare minimum.
Hope all of your cords resolve quickly.
Denise
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4greatkids,
Your post made me laugh out loud! Ha! The sad thing is I really believe my doctor's intentions are good, that she is good at what she does, etc. -- but the system just stinks! Rush, rush, rush - they go from one heavy duty case to the next, trying to keep up with the demands of the insurance companies and their profession. Honestly, I don't know how they do it. Still, you can bet when my dear PS come in the room, I try to mark the time and let go of any anxiety I have about taking my full 15 minutes. It is hard to assert sometimes, but it feels good to be proactive. And she gets it. I'm sure she wishes things were different too!
Just an FYI - I'm using a new avatar and screen name for confidentiality. I hope people here still know it's me!
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UPDATE - I just wanted to let any women reading this thread for info about this "cording" experience" or "Mondor's" - that it is now 9 weeks since my first surgery (bilat mx and expander placement) and the cords/violin strings are gone. They DID go away. I did do a lot of stretching WITH the pain (but not beyond the pain) and also heat and self massage. This helped. Hurrah!
Geena
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WOW I had this cording too along with cording all down my left arm!..Never knew it was called Mondor's Cording....The cording going down my arm was called Axillary Web Syndrom...I had about a dozen cords going form my armpit to my fingers and it took some intense physical therapy......It felt so good when my PT "popped" those cords!.... I could move more freely after every little "pop"......My sister on the other hand never got cording of any kind...Go figure!.......I am so glad I found this thread!......I now feel I am not so alone with this mess......
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Bump for someone on the Exchange City thread who is wondering about Mondor's......
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bumping. i think this is what i have got going on.
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Bumpity bump bump
I'm rekindling this thread because I've recently developed these painful cords and would like to hear from anyone else who is suffering with or has recovered from them.
I found the previous posts here very consoling.
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Bumpity bump bump
I'm rekindling this thread because I've recently developed these painful cords and would like to hear from anyone else who is suffering with or has recovered from them.
I found the previous posts here very consoling.
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Iwanna, I didn't reconstruct but had a lumpectomy followed by radiation during the summer of 2013. This past March, I developed my 1st cord. It extended from my affected breast down to my groin, and it really hurt, so badly that every movement was painful. My BS said it was a superficial thrombosed vein caused by the damage from surgery and rads. She said it should resolve on it's own. It did. It happened again twice more, in different areas down my abdomen. Each time it was less painful, and thankfully, it hasn't happened again. I wish you all the best, Jill
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Thanks for sharing that 4paws. It's a relief to know that these will go away.
I don't understand why none of the literature we are given at the hospital or doctors mention this possibility.
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I got them from armpit to elbow and one down my ribs. I was really surprised cos it was my prophyside and no nodes were taken. It is getting less painful. I am doing lots of exercise and stretches. I've also just learned to hula hoop to try to get rid of the rib one quicker. wow I had bruises all over my sides and hips! Oh, and on my shins - where I kept dropping the darn thing. But I think it's working.
x x
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I didn't reconstruct, but I had Mondors Disease too. My surgeon told me in all his years, I was only the 2nd case he'd seen, but it would resolve itself and it did. I noted it on my Dx and have been contacted by several women who have had it too.
I had one of the cords snap, when I turned over in bed one night. They extended from where my nipple had been, right down my ribs and branching off like a tree on my abdomen. I had mine massaged by a therapist who was doing myofascial release massage on my chest. I was told it could return and I did have a small one turn up again under my ribs many months after the first lot had disappeared, but it resolved fairly quickly.
I did a lot of searching to find out more about Mondors, apparently it isn't too unusual in augmentation surgery and is attributed to any kind of trauma to the breast. I also read that when biopsied or excised some are lymph and others are venous. It's sometimes referred to as phlebitis.
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Songbird--that's interesting that your cords are on your prophy side--that's where mine are too! I just looked again in the mirror, I can't even count how many I have! Although some of them are difficult to distinguish visually, from the road-map of stretchmarks I'm developing.
Arion--what did it feel like when your cord snapped? Sounds awful.
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I wannacookie, it was really strange. I turned over and felt quite a forceful snap, like a rubber band breaking. I don't know if I imagined it, or if it made a snap sound too. It was like a great release, going from a tight cord inside to nothing. I could stand up really straight and lean backwards straight away.
The other ones just seemed to disappear on their own.
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Oh Ariom--that sounds like an incredible relief!
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I think I have a mondor’s cord under my left breast. It has been
painful to lie flat or stretch and I have had to sleep in a reclining chair
since my double mastectomy on December 8th. It doesn’t bother me in the day when I am
upright unless I stretch my arm. I had mentioned the pain to my surgeon and she
thought it might be a neuroma. I had an injection of bupivacaine and
dexamethasone which did not help. When I stretch I can actually see a small
cord extending from my inframammary fold downward. Just wondering what has been
recommended to others as far as treatment. No one has mentioned this condition
to me and I was told not to use ice or heat near my breasts. Medications don’t
really help much. I am so afraid that I won't be able to sleep in a bed again!0 -
Hi Teidam, don't stress too much about this, they do resolve themselves. I had what looked like a big tree branch that went offf in a couple of directions, not pretty at all! LOL Are you doing PT stretches for your range of motion? I found mine got better with stretching, and firm massage.
As I mentioned in an earlier post, these cords aren't all that common after Mx surgery, but hey seem quite common after breast augmentation surgery. My surgeon said after all his years of doing breast cancer surgery, I was only the second case, he had seen.
Mine took a good few months to disappear and I had a recurrence for a month or so in the first year, but nothing since.
All the best with it!
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Thanks Ariom! I will be starting PT soon. I haven't actually been diagnosed yet, I am just guessing. Hopefully Mondor's is what I have and it will go away because it can be very painful and wakes me up at night . Is there something that can be done by the surgeon when I have my exchange surgery?
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