Survivors who have used only alternative treatments
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I'm sure overexercising was not an issue for me. I dragged myself to the gym because it was good for me, not because I particularly enjoyed it! But, I still think exercise has tons of benefits (even beyond cancer) for everyone, so I will definitely go back to it.
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Is there anyone else here who finds this thread so incredibly sad, given the wrenching grief on another thread of a husband losing the love of his life and the mother of his sons to this beastly disease? It's just hard to watch as someone is so bound to do it her own way that being "right" becomes more important.
I'm sorry to those I offend with these straightforward words, it's just very emotional to see a vibrant beautiful woman felled by this disease and another who has decided to do it her own way. Were it that simple...0 -
Exercise is one of my favorite complementary cancer therapies, although whether it could strengthen you overall probably depends.
The body is a stock market, and cancer makes that more evident than any other disease I have had. When measuring the pros and cons to cancer vs the pros and cons to your body, it is almost always a give-and-take in which one aspect is strengthened or stressed at the expense of another. Not enough exercise is bad. Too much exercise can cause injury. Too much cancer will kill; too much treatment can also kill you. It is a never-ending system of checks and balances that are never really checked or balanced except for a second. Like the rest of nature.
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Digger,
I agree with you. I am haunted by Olga's beautiful face. I cannot get her out of my mind. I do hope the decision WOM makes is the right one for her.
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WOM,
I can appreciate the thought you are putting into your treatment options as I am currently dealing with a secondary cancer caused by the treatment for the first. I was treated for hodgkins lymphoma in 1988 with radiation and now am dealing with bc as a result. I believe that at the time oncologists felt that there would be a small risk of bc for long term survivors but now they have found that risk to be as high as 30-50% depending on age when received radiation. I think that it is safe to say that there will be similar ramifications of current treatments for future long term survivors. That being said, I did decide to go ahead with chemo and herceptin as I am also her2+. The decision was very hard, especially because I was dealing with a 9 mm grade 1 her 2+ so there is really very little data out there as most her2+ are high grade. I think that my tipping point was knowing that even though I am dealing with the fallout of a treatment given 22 years ago, I am still here and for the most part have great quality of life. I do respect that each person has to make this decision for themselves and should not just submit to their doctors recommendations if it does not feel right. Best of luck.
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There is no right or wrong when it comes to the fight against cancer! I am very much into alternative therapies and really believe in them. I had a left mx and thank god I did because my tumour was alot larger than what the MRI stated. I still debated about chemo but I was advised that I should do dose dense ACT. It has honestly been a breeze. Sure, I have had some side effects but it was so doable. One of my girlfriends had FEC-T and has been very sick but apparently, that regimen is alot more toxic. I have been told that radiation is an option but it would only give me a 5% decrease in reoccurence and it would really screw up my reconstruction and a few percentage points are not enough for me. After I finish my chemo (next week) I will go heavy duty into alternative. I think you should consider utilizing both traditional and alternative. The chemo is not as bad as you think but afterwards I would definately use alternative to keep the beast away!
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I would think the sadness we all feel for Olga would serve as caution regarding the limitations and frequent uselessness of conventional treatment - not as a call to arms for more of it.
(Nor as an endorsement of alternative treatment). Strange how different people can get completely opposing messages. The beautiful face is the victim of the war we have yet to win against cancer. 0 -
The beautiful face is the victim of the war we have yet to win against cancer. So true 1Athena1.0
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I know I am going to regret this, but here it goes!
This beautiful young woman has small children! I had locally advanced breat cancer, as you can see by my signiture! When I was dx I was 41, I had a 4yr old son and a 8 yr old daughter.
No breast cancer in my family, Clean mammo the year before, this cancer had to be early right?
Before I knew the agressivness of my cancer, my first thought was, throw the book at me!!
Now, that was before I knew I had a 4.5cm tumor and 10 pos nodes. When I found out I had locally advanced bc, I was my own advocate. Listen I have two small children who need there
mother, period!!!! Once I was done with my BMX, I had 4 rounds of A/c and 12 rounds of dose
dence taxol, I had my ovaries out due to my ER statis. I then had 38 rounds of rads. I am now on
an anti hormonal, and pray that I will be able to be on one for it least 10 years! In conjuction, after
my western med. tx had ended, I then got on the antioxodent wagon, I take 5500 vitd-3 a day plus, 1200 calcium, major fruits and veggies, and juice plus on top of that. No meat, no processed foods, all organic stuff, I exercise and have lost to date 35 pounds. I am taking exellent care of myself, I will alow red wine in moderation. I finally have my point, We have kids, we need to raise
are kids, they need there mothers. I found treatment hard, but very doable! I am fighting for my life! This is a real sneaky cancer. The medicine is good, you can go completely holistic after
you do everything you can to rid yourself of the free radical cells that could be in there! You have an advantage you can take an antii-hormonal and herceptin, Here's the thing, please don;t hate me. Only God truley knows our future, we are only in so much control. Sweeti, Fight for your life
and fight hard, because, you can do all I talked about and it can still come back. In my opinion
your chances of survival are much better with the treatments I spoke of. Not to offend anyone here, we are all sisters, but many of the women giving you advice are very early stage women.
You are not! Please Know that you gave it 150%, if not for you, PLEASE do it for your children !
I hope you form a plan soon, don't wait around and research to much. Don't give any cells a chance to attach to an organ, rid of the beast for good.
Thousands of woman die every year of bc, every year!!! Don't be a statistc! You can do this,
it's treatable, Stay Strong, and please forgive me for over stepping my bounds, I know I did.
I just feel so strongly about this.
God Bless you on your journey, you are soooooo in my prayers!
Stephanie
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Had my first blood tests and everything is looking great!
My ND pointed out things she was concerned with that my regular Dr never mentioned or did not know what was causing my symptoms. My ND had me ask for more specific tests and the truth is coming out! I had no idea the main test will show me as normal but the more specific tests are showing me not in range. Things that cause fatuigue and mood changes and lowers the bodies defense. It will be interesting to see why my onc says. Pays to be your own advocate and not let them dismiss it as getting older or stress and not address it. Wish I had done this sooner
On a brighter note I ran 52 flights of stairs today if SF in honor of a woman who had the same misdiagnosis of clogged ducts instead of BC. I ran for the lung association as it had spread to her lungs. I thought of all the other stage 4 BC whom also have had it spread. Wore my believe shirt
My thoughts are prayers are with you ladies!!0 -
Good for you!! Hugs, gal, in this journey to figure it out.
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Wornoutmom Glad your tests are looking great. Thanks for checking in.0
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I had mentioned that I see some ideas over lap. Hyperthermia was seen as an alternative medicine and some called quackery as well. It requires a fraction of the chemo and rads which means less suffering for patients and less harm to your body. Watched two videos on you tube dating in 2007 so why are we not seeing this added.
An alternative site mentions how you use less chemo and rads and this means less damage but the mainstream just mentions you need it in conjunction. If both sides see it's potential there probably is something to it. More women need to research and speak up as the longer we don't the longer there will not be change. I used to laugh at those hippie protesting but you know what we were making progress back then. Seems like now the majority just sit back and compain and do nothing to require a change.
I have to type each website as I can't paste still!! Hope it works:
www.youtube.com/watch?V=8mDWk0KV6jI
www.youtube.com/watch?V=jF-nm8fi3oo&feature=player_embedded
For the mainsteam type seach CNBC story on using hyperthermia devices to treat cancer as I don't think the link works. Should be a lady going into tupe with pink flowered gown.
For alternative search James Bicher MD (breast cancer treatment) (alternative) hypertermia @ valley cancer institute
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wornoutmom here are the links. Thanks for sharing:
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52 flights of stairs.. WOW
I used to live 4 flights up from the ground, I was a superavid biker at the time and would cart my bike up the stairs after riding 20 - 30 miles, a couple times a day.... all the time working 50 hours or so a week.. I'd eat a ton of food, do FIVE flights of stairs (I drove my neighbors bats) and I thought I was cool... 52 flights of stairs.. now that is HARD work. i would die to have that energy again. Now, I just let a lot of my housework go and play the piano for exercise.. ha ha.
WOW again. I'm glad you are getting some good news.
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WOM: If you don't mind, I'm just going to plagiarize a section of your post
because I agree with it so much, even as a self-confessed hippie critic (profound me, I detest the hairstyles and the druggie-bum habits): More women need to research and speak up as the longer we don't the longer there will not be change. I used to laugh at those hippie protesting but you know what we were making progress back then.
I have always wondered about hyperthermia and it would be one of my first choices if I were stage IV (after surgery, when possible) and selected, targeted radiation on some parts of the body (not others).
I hope you find a formula that works for you and that you and your family can live with. Keep us up to date.
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This is a procedure in a phase 1 tes at this time for early sage BC. My Onc. was hoping to use it for me but the trials only allow IDC patents. This procedure could have a great future. My BC also said it acts sort of like taking a vacine it builds up antibodies to fight our particular type of cancer.
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This is a fascinating thread and I wish I came here earlier. I did the alternative and walked away from BMX and recon and any other treatment the onc and surgeon suggested back in 1994. I had extensive DCIS and a tubular cancer R breast. I had a lumpectomy and that is it, very dirty margins. We moved to Chicago and BS there suggested watching it and that' what I did for 17 years. DCIS showed up on Mamm, but the invasive IDC showed up on an MRI (not on Mamm) in Jan. 2011. Mammograms are a waste of time, unfortunately MRI is more expensive and medical community shys away from them because of that, for follow up etc.
I feel very comfortable getting a RMX now and am scheduled for this Tues. 3/29. I have only skimmed this thread, but no one has mentioned OncoDx that I see. I'm counting on that to hopefully avoid chemo or rads. My new IDC is a microinvasion and the DCIS is grade 3. Does anyone feel treatment boosts the cancer cells? Kind of like when you poison rodents, they become immune to the poison and come back bigger and stronger? I know we don't know which cancers mets. but sometimes I think everyone has cancer, but some stay dormant or encased and just don't travel. There are studies that say removing a cancer can open the can of worms, so to say. Happened to my aunt with a colon tumor. The surgeon broke through the encasing tissue and it spread all over into her system. The surgeon admitted to this.
I can say I survived 17 yrs. with no recurrence, but decided not to gamble anymore. The breast is going now that I'm 53, no recon. I had a bone scan, CT scan, 2 NB, MRI because they wanted to see if anything mets. all these years. I will post my DX when I get it after the surgery. Very good discussion here, we agree to disagree and there is nothing wrong with that. BTW, I am an advocate for fresh food in every way, very little meat, lots of beans, tons of water, and lots of exercize. I guess I'm afraid of lymphedema at this point.
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Re hyperthermia: My friend traveled to Duke University to take part in a study using this method. So they are pursuing it. She did experience a slight improvement, but it was very short lived. Unfortunately, the beast came back with a vengeance and she died 10 months later.
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My non evidence-based hunch about cancer is that it is a virus or infection created not by the outside but by the body itself but with unique properties, and I have also wondered whether some drugs cause it to get worse as it develops resistance. Also, pure hunch.
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Nerida tthis video may help you make sense of your thought. You will also see how chemo can (doesn't mean always) actually back fire and make the cancer cell chemo resistant thus unable to be killed by chemo. It also explains how it can come back with a vengence.
www.envita.com/cancer_treatments.html
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My 60 year old mother (nanay) was diagnosed with IDC Stage IIB ER+ (90%) Her2+++ with mutated BRCA 2 genes last January 2010. Had undergone right breast mastectomy with 4 of her lymph nodes removed. She (or rather we) declined chemo and radiation (which would have cost us about $50,000 USD in the first year of the treatment plan (includes Herception-- but does not include any other medication for known side effects).
In March 2010, she went through a 42 Day detox protocol patterned after Breuss and Gerson Theraphy (involves drinking vegetable juice & fresh tumeric juice and taking coffee enema) for 42 days. She lost about 10 kg, her althritis was healed, her vertigo never bothered her again.
In April 2010, I took her to an Endocrinologist specialising in diagnosing women related illnesses such as Breast Cancer through non-invasive tests such as Hormonal Profile, Thyroid testing, Organic Acid Imbalance tests.. based on the results of these diagnostic tests, she was prescribed a Cruciferous Vege supplement (I3C) from Life Extension, 5HTP and a few other supplements for her to remove too much Arsenic from her body (Zinc and Selenium respectively).
Tried to help her improve her sleeping patterns, by taking Melatonin, being in bed before 10pm and being awake by 6am so we can walk up the nearby hill, while the sun is not out yet. We also prayed and meditated together, something that we would have not done, if the face of death is not too close to us...
Everyday, she juices her own organic juices (vege/fruits)-- and has been completely vegetarian since her operation.
All my friends has been telling her that she never looked better. she looks younger, her skin looks more fresh (her liver spots are gone)-- My problem now is that the Singapore Immigration (we are Filipinons), would not allow me to extend her long term visit pass for another 5 years as she looks "healthy"... I need to send them proof that she was diagnosed with Breast Cancer and would me to sustain her natural theraphies..
It has been 1 year and 3 months since she was diagnosed. At 60 years old (I am 35 yrs old), she is often mistaken as my sister (its either she looks young or I look old)
..... is she a survivor? probably not according to the 5year mark, but for me-- she is a survivor and we are both fighters.. we are fighting for our time together...It was a choice we made and though some times other people thinks I am out of my mind or I am putting my mother at risk--- we know for sure that we have made the right decision not only for her but also for me and my daughter.. just like wornout mom, if I am going to make a choice between natural HONEY and a cough medicine to cure my daughter's cough, I would go for one that poses less risk, less side effects.
I am not saying which is better HONEY or cough medicine-- its just a matter of preference, we prefer that whcih poses less side effects.
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I don't take issue with building decisions from this site, I certainly did! Did you all know that without this site, I wouldn't have pushed for a preventative sleeve for my lymphedema? Or asked for a thyroid guard,or taken L-glutamine with chemo (and I had no neuropathy, which of course could be coincidence)? I listened to the naturopathic, allopathic, and combination sides on this site, and made my decision along with reading, listening, and asking. The bottom line is, even if we were research scientists, I think Athena's stock market analogy is quite apt.
What I wanted to do was reach out to you as a young survivor. One of my biggest issues on this site is that young and older often post alongside one another, and actually, it is all the difference. Many believe BC in women under 40 is in fact a different disease. You can parse the research, what you will find is our group is poorly represented.
Talk to some women with Young Survivors Coalition. Give them a call, get a "coach". They will steer you, I promise.
Also, get three opinions. I did. My case was tricky: I literally got three different ideas about what to do. I am a smart gal, I know nothing is certain, and that "fighting fire with fire" re: chemo in some ways makes us feel like we are fighting when actually the studies don't always show cause and effect.
I will take the risk to say this: if I were in your shoes, I would go the traditional treatment route. Being young means you can bounce back. I bounced back from chemo beautifully. With the guidance of people like Member of the Club (thank you, Member!), I have taken what seemed like a really negative experience, and improved my life. I feel better today than before treatment, now that I do Vitamin D, and a whole host of other lifestyle modifications.
Talk to a naturopath. You can also do this treatment in tandem.
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I also just want to throw out that organic is great, but in my opinion, as a long time vegetarian who ate organic and never touched parabens, it is part of the equation, but I don't think is a valid "treatment".
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DCIS stage 2b?
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Nanny,
I'll be blunt. Your mother is 60 years old and has a lower stage BC than WOM's. While it's wonderful that detoxing has worked for her thus far, it's like comparing apples and oranges. WOM is 36 years old with more advanced BC. The two simply don't compare.
Regarding hyperthermia and the Cancer Valley Institute, the doctor there seems to claim extraordinary success with all different types of cancer with this one mode of treatment, and again claims that the big bad pharmaceutical companies just don't want to accept his novel alternative treatments.
I'm being blunt, but if it sounds to good, it probably is, you know?0 -
Dear WOM,
Please be careful in choosing your treatment. Conventional, integrated, alternative. None are a guarantee. However, I am concerned that your understanding of the situation refers to you tube videos, individual interpretations of events(anecdotesl) and commercial web sites.
Your information is only as good as the sources.
Please choose wisely in considering your sources and your options. You can ask questions here and ladies will answer. However, the answers will have some controversy. But these differing opinions will allow you to see all sides.
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Pip57 I too was wondering DCIS, no nodes stage 2b? That doesn't sound correct. stage 2b means nodes invaded or an invasive tumor 5cm+. She might have misunderstood that even if the DCIS is over 5cm it still has to be invasive to be over a stage 0. My tumor was 5.5cm invasive part only… they did not include the DCIS part (less than 20% of the tumor. MRI indicated 6.5cm so I'm assuming the DCIS was around 1.5cm)
Digger/LtotheK I too agree that age plays a huge part in this. Under 50 is different than someone in their 60s. Under 40 or under 30 is even more critical when considering treatment. I'm sure WOM knows this as she seems to have done extensive research.
There are pages and pages of women telling her to do aggressive treatment. I think she gets it at this point. The alternative may work. She might in that percentage that doesn't even need chemo or chemo might not have worked for her anyway... she might not even need alternative. None of us (including the oncs) really know. At this point she has chosen her journey and now it's time to support her.
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LtotheK, pip57,digger and motheroffour,
I have done my own research- in fact have stopped working for 3 months just to research and shop for doctors. My mother and I worked as a team and decided as a team on her treatment plan. I just answered WOM's question - "if there is anyone on this forum who went for AL and survived"-- I responded and said " my mother or my mother and I (our team) did", however I cannot claim yet that she is a survivor (based on the 5 year mark)-- however, as you all are, I claim that we are fighters.. we fight for our time together, as you fight for your time with your children...
I am not arguing with you or anyone on this thread... :
I just answered WOM's question. Based on previous posts at 36 it seems she have a good head above her shoulders and can make a decision for herself.Motheroffoursons,
I do agree with you..that God does not promise us tomorrow, He promises eternity. The truth we all are seeking is only as good as the source. If the source is flawed, the whole system is flawed.
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Nanay:
DCIS by itself can't be stage IIB - unless there is also an invasive component. Did you mean IDCstage IIB? Lots of us with invasive cancer have a non-invasive component so your grandmother may also have some DCIS, but that does not count at staging.
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