Survivors who have used only alternative treatments
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Totally agree
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OK, that's what I thought IPT was. I wish I had done that - it sounds like it makes so much sense. Also, Dr. Block does a test where he tests the cycles of your cancer cells and your healthy cells, because they are usually on different schedules. Chemo/IPT is then administered when your cancer cells are awake (and more suseptible to treatment) and your healthy cells are asleep (and less suseptible.) so if the best time of day for you is 5am, you get chemo at 5am via a timed release system that you can carry with you. THAT'S the future of cancer care, if you ask me!
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Ladies,
If I EVER get a recurrence....I will not do chemo or herceptin again. Ever. The damage from chemo is the 'gift that keeps on giving'. Years later, women turn up with some malady related to chemo. I realize women get blasted on BCO for diverging from the standard care of 'cut, burn & poison'. This is where the money is, over a billion a year made from breast cancer alone. Of COURSE this method will be pushed, but it does not mean it's the only way or the right way.
If natural supplements are all just so much quackery, then why is BCO worried and censoring comments about alternative therapy? Why are they deleting comments that are true statements by poster like zuvart?
For a true CURE to happen, all avenues have to be explored. People have to put aside their egos and positions in the world of Big Pharma and understand that cancer can and will hit them as well. There are alternative therapies that are very successful at beating cancer. Alternative therapies focus on PREVENTION (something the drug world knows nada) as well as supporting the immune system/body in general. So many women die from chemo because it ruins their immune system, the very thing that they need to fight cancer.
This bias and censorship makes me very angry. People who can't see beyond the end of their noses tick me off. I want a cure to happen, but with Big Pharma goons muddying the waters this is unlikely to happen.
Sad. How do some of you drug pushers sleep at night?
tucker
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Lol Tucker, they swallow tons of sleeping pills, antidepressants, antipsychotics, they've got connections....
Dune, I'm really sorry you suffered at the hands of abusers, just know that you are not the only one. You just happen to be a grown up woman who thinks for herself, knows what she wants and does not want and wishes to regain her health the healthy way, tiz all
Wornoutmom, I can only reiterate my warning about not letting down your guard
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Wanted to learn some more about all sides of bc treatment but I guess the polarization of opinions won't allow for that. Sigh, I was really hopeful. Caryn
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'So many women die from chemo'......where did this come from? Yes, there is a very rare possiblility that you could get secondary leukemia.....but really - many women ??? NO, this is simply not true.
Please tell me about the 'alternative therapies that are very successful at beating cancer' - I am genuinely interested.
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sam52: I would suggest if you are truly interested in alternate therapies, you rent and watch the movie "The Beautiful Truth" about the Gerson Therapy, which is considered an alternate treatment. I saw firsthand how my friend and co worker put her Mysthenia Gravis in remission by following the principles of this diet. It works, but it takes committment and a longterm diet and lifestyle change that most do not want to follow.
Unfortunately, I did witness another friend die from chemo overdose. She became so weak from being unable to eat that she literally starved to death. It was tragic. Another friend of mine got through chemo, but then went back to eating and drinking the same as before cancer. Isn't that the definition of insanity...doing the same things you always did and expecting different results.
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kay-b, you seem to believe that you understand Obamacare. I am wondering how that is possible because the members of Congress who voted for it don't fully understand what will and will not be included in it, and the administrative rules governing the specifics of how it will be implemented are still being written and are subject to change.
Obamacare is the epitome of a government boondoggle.
Which treatments will be covered? Will there be age restrictions? Will expensive treatment only available to people who fall within a specific age range? Will any alternative treatments be covered? How will treatments in clinical trials be paid for?
What about those people who fall through the cracks? Like those under 26 whose parents don't have insurance, or who don't have parents who are still alive? Not everyone under 26 has insurance coverage today, and as a result of people thinking that they do, many of the safety nets that were available a few years ago are no longer there.
If you truly understand this thing and aren't just parroting the Administration's talking points, then please enlighten us.
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Obamacare is the result of two parties being unable to come together to forge something that would be in the best interests of all. It isn't meant to be understood...like all of our other government programs!
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Please all watch your tone. It has gotten terribly disrespectful, and we have therefore pulled it from the active topics to protect our newbies.
Your Mods
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I avoid GMOs like the plague, at least I thought I did. Then someone pointed me to this site about corn:
http://www.cornallergens.com/list/corn-allergen-list.php
Apparently, avoiding corn is a really hard thing to do. However, having information helps us make the best decisions we can.
Moderators, it is good to be reminded to be more respectful, but this discussion doesn't even come close to the disrespect that I have received on this site by those who disapprove of my choice of alternative treatment. Apparently they fear newbies will see what I have chosen and may follow my lead. And now you are "protecting" newbies too. hmmmmm.
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We hope that we have pulled those threads from the active ones as well. If you feel that we should pull posts or threads, please let us know.
We don't want newly diagnosed folks coming into disrespectful, nasty discussions, as it is not representative of the overall supportive nature of this community.
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Moderators, what's the real reason why this thread was pulled from the active topics??? Let me answer my own question. BCO does not want newly dx folks finding alternatives to chemo. Please do not insult our intelligence. That is disrespectful.
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I'm glad it was pulled. Every time someone makes comments like "slash, burn, poison" or "dying from chemo" it is inflammatory. Because alternTives are not the norm, all who are in favor have an extremely defensive and passive aggressive attitude in their posts. It is possible to discuss and inform without being so defensive and aggressive. Unfortunately, that is not happening on this thread. As the mods have stated, the tone is nasty.
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I agree mardibra. The anger and disrespect on this thread is almost palpable.
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Disrepect is in the eye of the beholder.
You, moderators, are censoring anything that does not align with your beliefs of a chemo only approach. You are NOT doing those of us who are suffering from breast cancer any favors, and we WILL and have found alternatives despite your Gestapo tactics. Ban me, do whatever you want to. Your not allowing newbies to be able to read all options is what is scary. To limit these women is criminal. Hope you sleep good at night but then I guess you would with all your pharma connections.
You allow disrepect by allowing rudeness to prevail....you haven't banned Black Cat, orange or digger have you? How much do you pay them to monitor the boards?
YOUR tone is nasty, invasive, controlling and scary. Why don't we make BCO stand for Best Chemical Options????
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anyway.......................
this thread was started because someone was searching for others who were using alternatives only, though the one searching had already been through the conventional treatment wringer. Hope is the word, answers. She went out there and found her answers.
I have done the same for myself. I believe in my alternative choices so strongly that I am paying out of pocket for every penny thus far - except, I qualify, the initial surgery and all tests. The surgery left me in a mess with positive margins. I picked myself up and carried on. I believe that cancer is systemic no matter what way it comes at us. Removing the tumor burden is - edited to add...... not always necessaryy by any means..... end edit..... often the best but only in the hands of a skilled and knowledgeable surgeon, which I did not have even though he was widely respected.
So I continue to pay. I cannot receive social security disability. I lost almost two years work when I lost my memory and was too exhausted later on to work at all.
Today, alternatively speaking, Hubby and I are going over our finances, new budget and bills then the protocol and treatment in order to pull togetehr a longterm plan for my health's sake.
DUNES - it is possible you would not want to do oral Vita C w node involvement. The IV is different. See Mayo for info, though that is w a grain of salt as they were the ones that distorted the Pauling 'replicated' Vit C trials, first by giving to people who had had chemo and only for a few weeks (check for details, I am unsure of how long, but not as long as Pauling who did not give Vita C to anyone who had had chemo at least not in their trials - edited to add that part) then, when taken to test for not duplicating the Pauling trial, they repeated with people who had not had chemo but again not long enough then pulled the IVs and gave chemo so what result could they even hope to reccord? But the Mayo does have opinions on Vit C oral does when lymphs are involved, and I agree with them, you need to be careful, take it to your ND for more info, okay.
WOM - and on it goes. Though your segment is going on television, there is a possibility the clinic will still be protected at the last minute, perhaps by their attorney. The more hints and info you can give for others to follow to their own clinic of their own choice, the better. But I sure would not want to give up my doctor either. Too many who speak out or practice have spent too much time in prision, paid too many fines, lost their life's work, patients left to die.
I do believe there are bc searchers following this thread and other alt threads for info, though they never post. They gain from one tidbit of info and run with it, like I did. So continue to leave breadcrumbs for them.
For me, my next choice will be PolyMVA w or w/o low low dose 'alternative' chemo. As in something that is not the norm chemo, perhaps from Europe. I don't know what, I have not done much ressearch but I do know that chemo can be quite naturally based. That is what I want. ETA.... Edited To Add..... The IPT can be used with the PolyMVA too. But that is only if I am a candidate for those treatments.
My Chinese herbs have stopped and completely reduced the masses I had growing in both breasts, but are those masses gone? Don't know. I would need an ultrasound or PET scan, and am not feeling the need for tests at this time. See my bio for details on what I am doing right now, those it is always changing. But the Cinese herbs are when this turned around for me. Have also lost a weighty amount of 'dampness' meaning phlegm or coaggulated fluids throughout the stomach and abdomen, even the legs. I am pleased and much more comfortable, so to have these new masses disappear is to me more than a coincidence.
I know I had cancer removed, the path report clearly called it cancer, I felt it was cancer, I was too ill for it to be simply coaggulation. Butt I also know what I am doing now is working.
Is my Chinese herbal choice all that I need? Don't know. I am also taking other supplements, herbs, strong alternative supports. Perhaps it is a combination of these and one other or more.
That is why this is so individual.
You know, cannot go without saying, I read the entire thread, today was reading the last four days. I heard no anger or disrespect.... until the end. Don't even know why it happened except that alternative people do not even feel they can speak freely in their own forum about what they believe.
My hope is I will be crosscountry skiing at 98 and perhaps sail off the side of the mounttain, have a nice flight down and painlessly die of a heart attack ETA BEFORE HITTING BOTTOM .... after seeing my life pass before my eyes in a pleasant way. I hope to be wearing a purple ski suit and a red hat. I hope that the alternative choices get me to that place where everyone who knew me from age 55 to then says, man does she have a tremendous quality of life for someone with cancer. Did she ever lose her hair? No, it just got thicker and longer, nails too.
It will come and go, and every time I let me guard down I know I will have to kick it into submission again, but I plan to do s gentlty, so as not to harm the patient - me - along the way.
Do you know I had enough energy to pack and unpack and help move an entire house, w the help of furniture movers and some others..... and now I am planting a garden and getting ready for a barn sale. And beginning my business anew.
A miracle, considering where I was two years ago when I was so poisoned by cancer and thyroid issues that I had no memory or energy.
I am blessed. We all are because of all the info we are allowed to glean to help ourselves, just go for it., thanks :
ETA fixed typos too....
and please visit the threadsntroduced here on bco and thanks for sharing or bumping them : ) Hope that you find them places where tthere is no division, we are all the same, just experience, strength and hope.
The Spiritual Journey into Breast Cancer: Inspirational Sharing
http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/38/topic/785748?page=1#idx_7
Symptoms of Breast Cancer: a comprehensive list frrom bc people
http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/83/topic/784673?page=3#idx_71
Does Breast Cancer Hurt: the trurt from those wwith breast cancer
http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/83/topic/784732?page=6#idx_163
Thanks again,
Diane (Essa)
Will be offline for another few days until computer connection is at new place.
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It is all SO obvious, the unfairness, the alliances, the gang mentality, the prison camp 'atmosphere'.
Tucker, I'll trade you a few cinnamon sticks and a yogurt in exchange for a few DIM supps, just ran out - Zuvart is right, you're smart as a whip
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Sorry that it is interpreted as such, Tuckertwo. We are in fact extremely open and respectful of alternative and complementary approaches. We hope that that is clear in our content. We are very opposed to disrespectful tones. No member of our community is paid staff.
Please feel free to report members or posts to us if you feel that we should take a closer look.
Thanks for your help,
Your Mods.
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Or better yet ... why don't we all acknowledge that this is a site paid for and provided by a trained medical doctor ... who has no obligation to help anybody promote every nonsensical and unproven 'alternative' that can be found on the internet being sold as a 'cure' for cancer. IMO it is dangerous for them to allow as much leeway as they do. But it is not my decision to make ... nor yours. It's their board. The least we can do is mind our manners.
Mods ... sorry you have to be subjected to this. The views and disrespect being shown here are not those held by 99.9% of the members of this board. But you already know that right
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Sweeping statements like "all who are in favor have an extremely defensive and passive aggressive attitude in their posts" seem to me to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution.
The current conventional treatments for breast cancer are extremely brutal, so referring to them as slash, burn and poison are accurate, even if the terms make someone promoting them uncomfortable.
Everyone who has surgery has scars. Some more disfiguring than others, but common to all.
Virtually everyone who has radiation has burns as a result of treatment. The severity varies, but the burns are not some rare side effect, they are expected.
The drugs currently used in chemotherapy are poisonous in the doses given to cancer patients. Those administering the drugs take significant precautions to avoid contact with the drugs because they are so very damaging.
People do die from chemo, athough usually from the side effects of the treatment and only very rarely during the infusion. That would include women who develop infections or cardiac damage from chemo that they die from as well as those who develp a secondary cancer as a direct result of their treatment.
It would be great if conventional treatment was safe and effective with benefits that far outweigh the risks for every patient, but they are not. Trying to pretend that they are wonderful won't make them so.
If an alternative treatment were ever proposed that significantly damaged every patient given it, killed a few, and may actually help fewer than 5% of the patients given it, those proposing it and inflicting it on patients would be prosecuted, and yet, we have chemo.
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Essa, I love you so much little sister !!
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Moderators: "Please feel free to report members or posts to us if you feel that we should take a closer look"
I HAVE NO REPORT BUTTON, the other "community" made sure of that - as I said on the other thread which was run underground:
"At the same time the BCO system kicked me out (banned by the "community" or in their own language "by petition") a few weeks ago, my computer was attacked repeatedly, no less than 6 intrusion attempts were made codified Severity = high in my security history - no coincidence IMO"
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So sorry Tucker, I'm presently seeing a trail of deleted posts of yours by the Moderators no more than one minute after they were posted, that's pretty impressive !
Hang in there, we need you !
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The terms "slash, poison and burn" were coined by none other than Dr. Susan Love, MD one of the most respected authorities on BC. Far from inflammatory, they are well known and not new. The intent of these terms is to make the point that breast cancer treatment continues to be a war of attrition against the cancer; that our understanding of the disease itself remains slim and that all we have are therapies that destroy and not necessarily ones that heal. It is a commentary on the state of the science; NEVER one on the women that endure such treatments.
I would highly recommend the documentary "Pink Ribbon Inc." The idea is not to criticize conventional treatment, but to point to the limited options we as BC patients have. That intent is never to criticize womens' choices. That should be sacrosanct. The sad fact though is that if you get BC, your choices are not very good.
I took the treatments that were available.
I think WOM has been maligned. However, Mods, I think taking this thread off Active Topics contributes to "Pinking" - the Komenization of BC in which only the rah, rah, rah positives are shown. I know that's not your intent. But patients dx'd with a life threatening disease deserve to be treated as men would - with intellectual respect. They should be afforded EQUAL access to the good, the bad and the ugly.
I never realized how sexist American women were until I got BC. Every other illness I had, the literature treated me with respect. I get BC, and I see pink crap, "you'll be ok" crap and other lies....
People need to know about these "fights." I don't have a dog in this fight. I took what conventional I could believe in and tolerate and what complementary made sense to me, and went with it. My superb medical team had the wisdom to understand the scientifically ambiguous territory in which we all stood and respected my choices. Their advice to me was ethical and well intended.
But the fights we have here stem from the fact that we are dealing with a disease with no known cause, cure, no unified etiology and that confounds us all. People deserve to know this.
But WE must also bear in mind that we are more united by our desire to rid ourselves of cancer than we are divided by our choices. Again: what unites us is stronger than what divides us. Let's remember that.
Let's not jump on other people's choices as though we, smugly, had the answer. We don't. We only fool ourselves if we believe otherwise. Remember: there is no KNOWN cure for BC, no KNOWN cause either. We are each doing our best. This is the bottom line.
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The best thing that can happen to this thread is to close it, let WOM start a new thread discussing her efforts for those who are interested. This thread went off the rails from the original question long ago. Start anew and fresh.
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We deleted Tucker's messages that were outside of the context of this conversation. She found it important to post the same post all over the boards. The discussion is happening here, and out of context we found the post to be harassment and hostile.
Chickadee, we think that you have proposed a very good suggestion. WOM, we hope that you repost this and we have a fresh, supportive start.
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