TE/Implant OVER pectoral Can exercise, comfortable &NO RIPPLES!
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Andraxo, you may want to look into Monolaurin too. It is a powerful antimicrobial, antiviral, antifungal as described in this article. Interestingly, it is derived from lauric acid which is also found in human breast milk. I use the pellet form which is supposedly more bioavailable. I used this brand while being treated for Lyme disease.
So I had my outpatient surgery yesterday to release the implant that was contracted due to pocket too tight laterally. Local anethesia only. It was not bad during the procedure. My face was draped and the ps and his 3 nurses and I chatted during the whole thing! The problem though is I am now in severe pain, much more than with my previous exchanges. At my pre-op, the nurse only wrote a script for 10 percocet 5 mg. That may have been sufficient, but while ps was working on me I reminded him that there was also an issue of burning pain and swelling on the medial upper pole that I have endured since waking up in the hospital Dec 4. He said he would have to remove the implant in order to see what was going on in there. He had to keep numbing me as my local would wear off. The initial plan was for a simple 45 min procedure. But the removal of the implant through my IMF incision allowed him to see that the ADM had bunched up under my collar bone. He had to dissect it from my tissue as it had already incorporated, then irrigate the pocket with abx, cram the implant back in and cauterize part of the capsule and stitch me back up. It took an hour and a half. There was alot of tugging and I really hurt bad once the local wore off. His office is an hour away so I won't be driving out there to get another script. I do have some Tramodol left over from a different surgery so I will use it for breakthrough and just pray the pain gets better. I go back to see him Monday.
Macb04, while he was working on me we talked about the upcoming fg and the fact that I was nervous about being awake for it. He said I could go under if I want, no problem but 80% of his patients choose not to. Mainly as there is no G/A to detox from. But also, he uses the Tumescent technique. According to this article it is much less painful than tradiotional lipo under G/A. It also produces less bleeding, bruising and pain for a much quicker recovery. I don't know if that is what you had. Since I will be having more than one round, I may try it that way first and see how I do. But I will insist on more than 10 pain pills!!
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macb- Do you think it’s too late to help? I’m scheduled for exchange at the end of March. I think next weeks fill is my last. I have no problem asking for it, just not sure if it’s too late to make a difference. This is the same ps who said no to pre-TE fat grafting. And didn’t want to split my next fill into 2 because of “risk of infection”...
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Shoregirl, most MD offices that I deal with submit Rx s electronically. Maybe yours can submit to a local pharmacy so you won't have to drive so far?
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cpeachymom, it might start being helpful, but it will take weeks to start the most notable changes. You would also have to stop use 10 days to 2 wks before your surgery. Hate to say it, perhaps delaying another month or two? I understand the really huge need to be DONE. Even after Implant exchange I have continued using the Pentoxifylline and Vitamin E orally and Topically. It is something that you ideally take for at least a year or longer. I have been on it consistently for the past 2.5 to 3 years without any problems.
The only benefit of delaying surgery would be to improve stretch and suppleness of your skin before doing the implant exchange. Just think about what you want/need. I wanted you to know all the options.
Shoregirl, I am not sure if I had the Tumescent technique or not, although it sound familiar. Try it , might just have been me being sensitive.
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Bcbc, my docs submit all scripts electronically except controlled substances which have to be hand written and carried in to the pharmacy. Doesn't make sense to me. You would think the electronic would be less of a chance of fraud then hand written!! I feel better today. Found an old script of Tramadol from a previous surgury. I take it so I can stretch out the percocets. The nurse called me yesterday to check on me and was very apologetic about the oversight in giving me more meds. Said if it is unbearable the ps would meet me at his office over the weekend. That was nice but I think I can manage til Monday when I have my post-op.
Macb04, I will def be researching the Tumescent online over the next few weeks. Have a great weekend ladies!
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I am sure controlled substance laws very from state to state. i live in California. I'm glad the nurse was apologetic. Hope your weekend goes well.
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Yes Shoregirl, here's hoping you are comfortable this weekend.
Also, here in Seattle, Urgent Care Clinics are open 8a to 8p, same cost as a regular clinic visit, and able to prescribe Narcotics for pain. Perhaps you have similar services nearby if the pain is bad?
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I have developed a large red area over the medial side of implant and beneath the incision. Sent a pic to the ps. He put me on a 2nd abx. Said when I see him Monday if no better will have to put me on iv abx. He was surprised at the picture though as the implant he worked on is still higher than the other side. He said when he sat me up in the OR they were symmetrical. Will probably have to RE-DO it!! I asked how long should we wait before deciding it needs to be redone. He said we would know within a week. The only good news I got was that he would do the lowering at the same time as the 1st fg round. I am starting to lose confidence in this guy. The whole reason for this revision was to get the implants symmetrical. So far I have had 3 ps that have each caused me to have to have more surgery. Oh, and all this trouble is on the prophy side. I have also developed an allergy to adehesive in the tape, so now have ugly blisters in my cleavage. Tonight my incision started burning really bad. I took the sports bra and dressing off to have a look and part of the incison is slightly open and oozing blood. I pray we don't get hit with icy roads Monday so I can get to his office!!
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Oh, no! I'm so sorry. What a mess for you!
They used surgical glue for my incisions and that worked really well. Maybe they could do that next time if the adhesives are bothering you?
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That is such a pile of crap Shoregirl! I am sorry. I had one mess after the other too. The last PS I had seemed clueless that he put in an implant at least a 100cc too small to match my other breast, I redid the surgery 3 months later and because he cut away the extra skin, it's still too small by about 40plus cc's. That's why I took Dr Bryam McIntosh off the list. He didn't even give me a fee discount, and it was his big mistake. We do due diligence and try our best, but we are at the mercy of these people, and sometimes they never deserved our trust in the first place.
Shoregirl, please start on Oregano Oil/ Olive leaf extract, also the Monolaurin mentioned above, and whopping doses of Liposomal Vitamin C ASAP. It works SYNERGISTICALLY with the antibiotics. Most likely with your story of many antibiotics over the past couple of years, you are developing some resistant bacteria. That is why one course of antibiotics was not effective. Can you go somewhere to get High Dose IV Vitamin C? I once had an infection in my Left , affected arm. Had creeping redness. I went and got 60 GRAMS of IV Vitamin C, and literally, the doctors and I could see the redness fading away. The IV was in my Right arm.
We have to think outside of the increasingly narrow box to save ourselves, as obviously the mainstream way doesn't work very well.
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Time to bail on this guy, in my opinion. I don't see how he could have maintained excellent sterile technique while going willy nilly all over your breast, stopping to do more anesthesia, pulling the implant almost as an afterthought and everything else he did WHILE YOU WERE AWAKE! How the heck can anyone work well while chatting and being cautious about whether or not the patient is numb?
The lack of appropriate pain control is also a big red flag. We go through enough as BC survivors! If anyone deserves to be a freaking addict, it would be us (being sarcastic there).
Nope. I would not let him touch one fat cell on my body or try again with his awake surgery BS. Please at least consider two more opinions, tell them your story, get their reactions, and then proceed.
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macb04 - I'm getting ready to start radiation for a local recurrence. I already have my implants and am hoping to protect my skin and reconstruction as much as possible.
Did you take the pentoxifylline (Trental) and vitamin E during radiation or only afterwards? I know most ROs are still cautioning against taking antioxidants such as Vitamin E during, but not sure about a cream.
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mellee, all the info I have read describes the use of Pentoxifylline and Vitamin E use after rads, not while undergoing rads. I did find one study that did use it during ( might be more, but just found the one), but they didn't say it was helpful in that way for preventing rads fibrosis. I don't know if a topical Pentoxifylline and Vitamin E Cream would be a helpful thing or not, while being actively irradiated.
Sorry, I would tend to encourage just the usual recommended skin care until the rads is over, and then immediately move on to oral Pentoxifylline and Vitamin E. As soon as your skin is healed, then you could add topical Pentoxifylline 5%/Vitamin E 1%.
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Brave, they used glue but the adhesive was the tape on the bandages that caused a problem. When I was in OR in Dec under G/A my eyelids were taped shut. When I got home there were huge blisters in my mouth (from the breathing tube being taped) and on the skin under my eyes.
Macb04, I don't have lipsomal C but I have powdered pure non GMO Ascorbic acid 2000mg. I have Oregano essential oil but I don't feel good about taking it internally as the company I got it from has since left Amazon and I can't find contact info for them. Is there a brand you recommend? I think I may be able to get IV Vit C at my stepfathers office.
I honestly don't know what to do. I feel so defeated like I just don't have fight in me anymore with these ps. PS 1 did a beautifully symmetrical job, but used the wrong size implants for my pockets so they kept flipping over and he doesn't do fg in front of the whole implant nor does he do nipple recon. If it weren't for that I would go back to him. I only have state sponsered insurance (Medicaid) so not everybody accepts it. When I got upset that PS2 stopped participating with medicaid halfway through my staged revision her coordinator had the nerve to tell me that after the doctor's overhead and 4 hours in the OR she only ends up with $800.00 in her pocket.
I was elated to find PS3 who does the fg and nipples and takes medicaid. But as I said, I am losing confidence and I don't know what to say to him tomorrow!!
VegGal I am taking what you said under serious consideration. Thank you for your input
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Shoregirl,
Oreganol brand Oregano is pretty potent, safe. Also have used HerbPharm Brand is good, although the Oreganol brand is more concentrated. Both can be found on Amazon. Also consider Golden Seal.
With Liposomal Vitamin C it is possible to get much higher levels in the body orally than with regular Vitamin C/ascorbic acid. Because the ascorbic acid is bonded( so to speak) with Fat molecules,, it's possible to achieve much higher absorption before bowel tolerance causes diarrhea.
I understand you are badly disheartened by the whole stupid reconstruction mess. I have had 15 surgeries, an extra 5 because of screw ups, and I am still not symmetrical. I could tear out my hair, I really could. It is so unfair the unnecessary hurdles thrown in front of us by lazy stupid people and endless bureaucracy. I have zero respect for most doctors, and none at all for the bc industry.
Just do research, ask real people what has worked for them and then don't despair, don't give up, just keep trying things. Something is bound to work out to something you can at least live with.
Hugs to you Shoregirl
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Shoregirl,
I am sadden to hear you are having difficulties. You have every right to be discouraged and tired. Please take time to give yourself some LOVE. Have you tried restorative yoga? Sending healing an happy vibes your way.
Andraxo,
You mentioned stopping Tamoxifen because you are an athlete. Would you explain? What did your MO say
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Cpeachymom, Could have been the PT, fills or time but I am almost 6 weeks post surgery and just dealing with slight TE discomfort. I also did not have to do any other treatment so I may not be a good comparison.
But, I now have another problem. Last drain on left was removed 2 1/2 weeks ago, but I continue to have fluid build up around TE. I had 70 CC's removed today, 62 last Thurs, 40 last Mon and 80 the Mon before. My breast is pink, I'm not using my arm (Dr's orders), I'm on levaquin and augmentin but I'm really concerned about infection. I've continued fills (5 of 8 done) in hopes that filling the cavity will help. Anyone have any experience with this???
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PRides, have they cultured the drainage? How many courses of antibiotics have you been on in the last year or so? Have you done those particular antibiotics recently? You could have resistant bacteria. Like I said above, go for as much Liposomal Vitamin C as you can, or even better, high dose IV Vitamin C at a Naturopath.
High dose Vitamin C produces Hydrogen Peroxide in your tissues, and is very bactericidal, while being perfectly safe. Bacteria are Never able to develop resistance to the Hydrogen peroxide effect of High Dose IV Vitamin C. That is why IV Vitamin C is now finally, quite sucessfully, being used for Sepsis all over the world, following Dr Marik's study.
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Could vitamin C save lives in sepsis? These hospitals aren't waiting for proof.
https://pulmccm.org/critical-care-review/vitamin-c-save-lives-sepsis/
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Oooh PRides I 2nd Macb04's suggestions!! Be careful of Levaquin. I took it last year and developed horrible tendonitis. Cipro can cause it as well.
My good report from post op yesterday is the redness is NOT infection. Whew!!! When I asked ps what went wrong, why my implant is too high he said he "overthought it". That he was concerned since he had added adm that the IMF needed extra support so he put tight stitches at the last minute. He offered to get me in this Thursday to fix it or said if I can hang in there he can do it at fg session while the fat is processing. I elected to wait. The other thing he said was they had sat me up at 45 degrees to check symmetry and all looked good. So he asked me to lie down yesterday, as I got to the 45 position, the implants looked level. But once I got all the way upright, the left one is obviously an inch higher. I asked if it is possible for me to get symmetry and he assured me yes. I will insist they sit me ALL the way up though. No more DO-OVERS!!! I told him I am growing weary of all this so he understands that even though I am a mild mannered woman I am pretty irritated at this extra surgery. It wouldn't bother me so much but I am also dealing with other health issues...hypothyroid, hip arthritis, deg disc disease, Lyme disease so its tough. Macb04, my heart really goes out to you enduring all you have!!! Thank you so much for your support and guidance
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Bird-of-light: I was having increasingly worse muscle problems on Tamoxifen, and worsening joint pain, and a bunch of other random symptoms. Took it for 2.5 years and the last .5 year was by far the worst. I finally just asked for a break to tease out of my symptoms were from Tamoxifen, menopause, or just getting older (I'm 49 and very athletic). Brain fog, irritability, on/off dizziness, leg edema, muscles feeling dead all the time (for lack of a better word) - none of my sports felt good anymore though I kept doing them anyway. Then there was the GYN issues and being on my 4th uterine biopsy in 2.5 years. MO suggested 4 weeks 'holiday' and that it would take 2 weeks just to get it out of my system. At 2-1/2 weeks I was feeling significantly better! Muscle problem 90% gone, but joint pain still lingered. The biggest change by far though was my head - I didn't realize how much I was not feeling like myself until I started feeling like myself again (if that makes any sense!) I followed up with oncology at 5-1/2 weeks after stopping Tamoxifen. I told her how much better I was feeling in that I did not see how I could go back on it. She was totally understanding and did not give me any grief about it. I did ask about a lower dose, but the study from Italy, which isn't published yet, about a lower dose was for people with DCIS, not invasive cancer like I had. She's asking an oncologist friend who is a breast cancer specialist. I am now 7.5 weeks off of it and the joint pain is getting better. EVERYTHING is better off it. Still waiting to hear from her about possibly trying 5 mg. She says now I may try a myself, room just taking it at all. My choice. Sure my risk is now higher, but I started in a very low risk category for recurrence. I choose a happier and active me, now. There is thread about runners and other athletes on Tamoxifen if you want to read about other people's experiences.
Macb04: I have been taking Oregano oil and added a lot of liposomal C on top of my regular C for the past 5 days. I finished antibiotics today. No change, still reddish and minimal edema. I am not sure what the next step is. Likely try different antibiotic (general surgeon friend at hospital I work at thinks I need a different one because the local 'bugs' tend to be different...strep vs staph), but I will keep up with the supplements. I was thankful to find an oregano oil in a vegetarian capsule, as I hate the taste of oregano. One day I had oregano burps though! so bad!!
I will be following up with plastic surgery on March 14. That was the soonest I could get in. Unfortunately the plastic surgeon who did all of my surgeries is no longer in Santa Fe. He is now up in Taos New Mexico and not under my insurance yet. He is starting a breast clinic there in conjunction with the cancer center, but it isn't up and running yet. Macb04, please change Dr. William Dougherty to Taos instead of Santa Fe, NM. When I see the new surgeon in Santa Fe I will find out if he does pre-pectorals and let you know.
- xo
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PRides, I wonder if the Augmentin is one that is now associated with Resistance since you were very recently on it. Unfortunately, resistance can develop extremely fast. I would ask them to change you off the Augmentin, even go to a Cephalosporin like Keflex, which is a next door neighbor class of antibiotics, but just different enough that it might be more effective. Be careful to do zero exercise while on the Levaquin owing to the possibility of tendon rupture.
Wow Andraxo, I hoped you were improving when I hadn't heard from you. Dang. I guess switching antibiotics classes might be the best bet. I will change your PSs location info.
Shoregirl, good for you. Make sure that he knows this last time is it, and that he has to get it completely 100% right. Keep us in the loop. Best of luck.
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Andraxo,
I have issues with Tamoxifen too! I get horrible muscle cramps, my libido is non-existent, and my vajajay is fried. I can barely stomachtaking it. The pills smell so toxic when I open the bottle. I am 47 and very active as well. Since you are in menopause, were you offered an AI? My BS mentioned asking my MO about switching. I have to admit, I don't take the tamo daily. I shoot for every other day and have taken a week off here and there. I'll look for the thread you mentioned.
Shoregirl, thanks for the update. I am happy to hear that your PS is going to take care of you. I'm sorry that you have to go through more crap! Keep your chin up.
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Hey Andraxo and Bird-of-light: Wow-sounds like we have age (47 and active) and Tamoxifen troubles in common. Wheee! I’m still searching for my best path (had to stop 3 1/2 weeks in due to debilitating SE’s).
Hey Pebbles-loving the memories of KitKat. Also, you seem like the nicest person ever!
I hope all you gals out there are having a lovely Wednesday! Take care out there
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Bird-of-light: I wasn't menopausal at the start of cancer tx, and likely I'm really perimenopausal....but I was never offered an AI. I even asked at my last oncology f/u (where I told her I wasn't going back on Tamoxifen) if the plan was 10 years on Tamoxifen then an AI. She said no and that some will do 5yrs Tam followed by 5 yrs AI, or all AI, but she wasn't going to recommend that for me. After looking into everything before I even started Tamoxifen, I would not take one even if offered it now. The side effects are supposedly far worse for AI - especially for bone/joint pain. If I ever have a recurrence, or develop mets/stage IV though, that's a different ball game and I would have to reconsider what is recommended. There are so many threads related to Tamoxifen on BC.O!
Sugarmaple - I hope you find a path that works for you...minimal side effects and lets you enjoy all the things you love to do!
I am wondering what will happen at new plastic surg consult mid March. I do know that if it is ever recommended to remove an implant or even exchange them out, I will opt for being flat and no nipples...which I wish I followed my gut and did that from the start. These little (250cc) pre-pecs are fantastic for exercise, but no breasts was also fantastic. I was flat with nipples for approx 1.5 years before reconstruction after chemo, rads and recovery. Sometimes I wish this thread title didn't say "no ripples" though because I think many of us with pre-pecs have plenty of ripples, so it is misleading. Some people will be very disappointed aesthetically if they think pre-pecs look like sub pecs.
Happy Wednesday! - xo
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Andraxo, I've been thinking exactly the same thing. For me going prepec has been a trade off. I am glad my muscles are back where they should be but since my revsion from sub pec I have ugly ripples unless I am standiing absolutely straight and pulling up through my centre like a ballet teacher!
I had some fat grafting last week but even now before the inevitable die off of whatever percentage I will lose there are still ripples and another unresolved issue with a too tight pocket on the right.
Prepec is a good way to go but it isn't easy or perfect. I'm confident that reconstruction will improve by leaps and bounds since the epidemic of breast cancer isn't slowing down.
Yaniza
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andraxo and yanzia, do either of you have the Natrelle Inspira Gummy implants?
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Well I am not sure what percentage of women don't have ripples with Prepectoral Implant Reconstruction , but I am in that group.I think several variables impact whether you experience ripples or not. Implant size/ tightness of implant pocket/Fat Grafting/ADM. Also the thickness of the skin.
Before I got Prepectoral Reconstruction I briefly corresponded with a woman from England who had Prepectoral Implant Reconstruction years ago, before the advent of ADM's like Seri. She told me she had no ripples. She also had 1 implant Prepectoral, and then a later implant on the other side with a different surgeon that was Subpectoral. She said she preferred the Prepectoral method.
Results seem to be random and variable, that's all I can say. I hope they continue to refine the methods to make sure that ripples don't occur. We all deserve to feel comfortable and confident in our own skin.
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Bird of Light, I have mentor smooth round, the same size and kind that I had sub pec.
Macb04, there are a lot of variables not the least of which is... what is the plastic surgeon left with after the surgical oncologist is finished. More fat grafting would help, if the results thus far from last week's procedure are an indication.
I'm still glad to have my muscles back functioning as they should be.
Yaniza
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Yanzia, I am happy to hear that you are pleased with the level of comfort.
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