Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?
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I am an atheist, freethinker, realist....
(throw a lil buddhism thoughts in there too)Glad to know there are others. I lost my mom to bc (a devote catholic) and I've just got my genetic results back today that say I'm + for the mutation for bc.
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We need to be louder! I was looking at medical bracelets & the one on the tlc catalog site has an angel on it. Wonder if we can get them to add a choice of a Darwin fish?
csj0 -
I would love that
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Deleted by Mizsissy
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I have no problem with your beliefs and would never denigrate them or try to make you change your mind. I only wish that you had the same respects for the things we believe in too.
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Deleted by Mizsissy
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Yes of course different opions are tolerated. I just find it interesting that someone with different beliefs would read, let alone comment on a thread with this title.
I do not find it offensive that the Prayers for Cy thread exists - since it's not something I'm personally interested in, I don't read it, nor would I ever post anything on that thread.
I have many religious friends. When I was diagnosed one of them wrote to me and said "I know you don't believe, but I'm going to pray for you anyway." He is a good friend who is expressing his affection for me in a way that is meaningful to him. Not in a way that seems to hint that my feelings are wrong or misguided. If that's not what you meant, then I apologize.
I never intended to start a flame war and have no intention of contributing to one. By the definition of this forum, we have enough problems to start with.0 -
Well, I didn't think my idea of spirituality coming from within AND without was quite that far away from some of the other ideas expressed here, but it's obviously making some of you uncomfortable, so perhaps I should delete my remarks.
I think it is quite possible to have a belief in spirituality and a Divine Being and also be a scientist. I myself was a member of the scientific community and was a doctoral student for a number of years. Many respected scholars in my field and related fields indicated their belief in a Divine Being...including biologists & evolutionists. The most famous one I am thinking is Edward O. Wilson...who some of you may have heard of.
BTW, there is a spiritual thread here which begins with an explicit warning that the ideas expressed may be offensive to non-religious folks. Perhaps you should preface your thread with a similar warning if you really don't want anyone but atheists posting here (agnostics excluded).
I'll be happy to delete my remarks and leave you to yourselves if anyone else here finds them offensive.
Miz
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Hello everyone.
Dudess, great idea for thread! It's great to know I am not alone on being a non believer. While I am not an atheist, I am at least an agnostic . Anyway, what helps me the most is my love for music. Now, I have absolutely no musical talent in either singing or playing an instrument. However, I still sing my little heart out and dance around, sometimes in my underwear (probably a little tmi for ya ; )) or I combine it with my other love which is driving. I can often be found singing in the car, completely off key and everything. I can't help it. For me, I have found it to be very cathartic.
Also, I have seen plenty of responses with people who have cats. Me too, I adopted Samson who is just about to turn 7 in early March two years ago. Actually, I adopted him the day before my lumpectomy which was 3/3/06. Shortly before I was diagnosed I had a cat, Mic who passed away and I didn't want to be alone going thru all this as I had just broken up with my boyfriend. Samson is my baby, he's black and white, long-haired and very affectionate. He is exactly what I needed and I don't know where I would be without him. I would post a picture but I have absolutely no idea on how to.
Wishing sunshine in everyone's lives!0 -
Suzy- where does that great quote come from- it's very familiar but I can't place it? Redspark- posting pics is pretty easy- I'd tell you the directions now but I'm too tired - that might sound ridiculous but it's true- I had a big day yesterday and I am not that far out from finishing treatment so I burn out easily. Maybe someone else will step up- I'd love to see your cat. I could also give you the directions when I have a little more mental focusing power. My "chemo cat" is my current avatar- if you read all the posts I'm sure you saw here great big pic and read the tale of how she came to us.
This morning I listened to a very good (I thought) guided meditation from one of the blog talk ? shows associated with the flylady website-I really like this person's approach and am going to try to include this in my routine for the day. I have been a meditator on and off for years but lately have fallen out of practice. After my diagnosis I could not handle sitting mediation- it turned into a fear mediation and was not good for me. I found I did much better with walking which seemed to stabilize my mind more. Anyhow- I was curious if any of you out there are meditators or have other practices that help you feel connected and grounded.
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Hi Everyone!
Thank you so much!
Sunflowers- you and me both, I think that the gift of music, especially if you can sing is the best gift you can have. B/c music is timeless, it really is the soundtrack of our lives. And, thank you for the website, I will definitely check that out. About a year or so ago, we had some flute players come in to the support group that I sometimes attend and they were great. I think most if not all of them were cancer survivors or survivors of a major illness and they said that it was very healing for them. So, I will have a listen to the harp. Oh, yes, I love that phrase and I try to live that way. Also, who is that song by "I hope you dance"? It sounds very peaceful where you live.
Madelyn- I'm sure I entertain lots of other drivers! But, I understand your plight as I generally make sure that the windows are rolled up at least most of the way if I'm belting something out. It's alot easier for me to sing my heart out in the winter but in the summer I always have my windows down. So, when I'm sitting at a light in the summer I'm usually dancing but singing b/c I don't people to start barking at me : )
Allysonw- that is such a sweet story and your cat is beautiful. There was definitely a reason that she came into your life when she did. Maybe you needed her as much as she needed you. Oh, and it's no worry at all, I understand the fatique. Thank you very much for offering, whenever is fine. Or, I'm sure if I try I can figure it out. I sometimes meditate or try to anyway. I've been realizing that I tend to follow more of a buddhist philosophy on life. I would like to do yoga. Everyone says how much it has helped them.0 -
The Dixie chicks are great sing alongs, and as a fan of old country music, I just love Martina McBride's CD of old songs - forget the title. But the melodies are so straightforward, even I can get them right.
For my first chemo tomorrow I downloaded a couple of new CDs and will just have to hope I can stop myself from singing along in the chemo room. I also hope that you can move around while you are doing this because I find it impossible to sit still to good music.
Guess music is my religion! I've told people that even though I'm culturally Jewish, I could never be religious because we don't have good gospel music.
susan0 -
Susan-
Good luck with your first treatment. Having a plan/entertainment really helped me- things to read and things on the ipod. I had a really great nurse for most of my treatments and often my husband and I spent a fair bit of time talking with her. You can move around (as much as you can when hooked up to an IV pole). I actually kind of got into a little routine of things that made me sort of like going. Hey, I had to go so why not make the best of it. Don't miss it however. Country music and bluegrass pair well with bc I think. Klezmer... not so much.
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Hey Dudess! I too am an athiest. Just diagnosed with IDC. No node involvment. Neg her2. 7 weeks of radiation and 5 years of Arimidex. When people tell me they are going to pray for me I thank them. When I reply via e-mail, I always than them for their thoughts and cares (not prayers). I'm getting by with an attitude that I fully intend to kick this cancer's ass! No other outcome is a possibility ... period.
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OK, I have to join this conversation...I've been mostly lurking around this site since my 1/15 dx, learning a fair amount, but not really inclined to post much on the treatment-oriented threads (perhaps because I don't yet know what my treatment is going to be, and won't until after my 2/26 lumpectomy/SLNB). But this discussion really caught my eye, both because I fit the bill (yep, another atheist with BC), and because of all the great comments and support it's sparked.
I can shrug off the prayer comments, and appreciate them for where they're coming from, but prayer and religious belief are not and never will be my thing. I'm taking a lot of pleasure these days in watching the ice form and break up on Lake St. Clair (each day it looks a little different), in going for runs (the topic of the one other conversation that drew me in), and in being with friends. I'm surprised how calm I am, generally, and am not sure what to attribute it to.
Oh, and I'm a cat owner too - of a calico and a tortoise-shell, both female, who like to curl up together on any clothes I've left lying around. They're the only creatures on earth who actually *like* the smell of my clothes after I've been out for a run!
Warm thoughts to all of you...
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Lewing - except for right before the surgery, I've also been calm, but I've been describing it as feeling detached. It's like this is all happening, but it doest feel quite real. We have bc - it sucks - now we just have to see it through.
My shrink said feeling detached was good as it kept me from getting depressed. Since depression has been a life long thing for me - it's worse than bc - you cannot be cured - you just take pills for the rest of your life.
Allysnow - I was safe from the klezmer - hadn't realized I hadn't ripped any of those cds yet. The nurse came up to me to ask if I was having this restless leg thing from the benedryl, and I had to explain it was the music...
susan0 -
Suzy- I can't believe it! You have made me nostalgic for the Dana Farber chemo lunch menu! I never ate the sandwiches...or maybe once I did. I mainly remember the chicken kebabs and the fruit salad. Even though I never had major nausea I accidently gave myself a short-lived aversion to broccoli by having it during my chemo. For one or two weeks afterwards I kept having intrusive thoughts of broccoli accompanied by feeling briefly queasy. I'd learned about this in psychology class in college but it was another thing to experience it- "the Garcia effect."
Susan- glad you escaped the depression. It hit me hard during my chemo and there was a point where I was probably more at risk for dying of that than from the BC. Thank goodness for SSRIs! The positive side is that having gone through such a rough time soon after my diagnosis I seem to have processed it and come out on the other side- embracing my life and at relative peace (most of the time) with the uncertainties that go with the diagnosis. Some women seem to have a really hard time after tx is over. This hasn't happened to me yet and I don't think it will. I am so grateful to be feeling better physically and mentally- I'm doing work that I love having ditched my previous job which I'd stayed in way to long and was draining me. Anyhow....enough rambling.
Lewing- wishing you the best on your upcoming SNB, etc. I have found both exercise (now back to running a bit now that the tx is over) and being out in nature to be a huge source of comfort.
Warm wishes to all of you. It's been a a crazy day here. Our younger dog Wendy (three year old dashund) hurt her back and had to go to the vet this morning. The nerves in her back legs and her bladder control are affected so caring for her has been a bit labor intensive. She's on a bunch of meds that we hope will work but basically I am seeing a trip to the veterinary neurosurgeon in our future. She is such a sweet dog, doesn't complain, has never done a bad or mean thing in her life. I keep tearing up when I see her looking miserable. Luckily we are not too far from Tufts. Uggh!
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Just googled Molly Ivans. I loved the "Joyful Outrage" Washington Post piece. LOL. I will definitely delve into more of her writing when I have time- for the moment it's mopping up dog pee and figuring out what's for dinner.
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Ally - I can understand why people get depressed when tx is over. I felt a bit lost when the nurse practitioner from the surgeon said goodbye & sent me upstairs to the onc's office. I only saw her twice, but it was like "where did my support go?" All the medical staff has been so nice, it must be hard when you are back on your own.
Well Chaco & Joli are sending their best thoughts to Wendy. It's harder when pets are sick - you can't explain things to them. They just look at you with those sad eyes & your heart melts & you do what you can do.
Today I have to figure out how to get myself to eat. I'm pretty shaky & can't figure out if it's going off the steroids or lack of protein or both. That tea tree oil left an awful taste in my mouth that's making it harder. Yuck. No, I didn't drink it, but the smell ...
Susan0 -
Hey, just checking in. guitarGrl, you mentioned "detached" - I can definitely relate to that. A few years ago, I helped a friend through his treatments with lymphoma, and during that time (which was actually much harder than anything I've faced so far since my own cancer dx), my coping mechanism of choice was to cultivate a kind of clinical detachment. I think I've carried a lot of that through to my own cancer. By staying detached through the initial shock, I seem to have worked my way through to a more genuine calm. I know there will be ups and downs and times when I'm going to want to break things, but for the time being - calm it is.
sunflowers, I loved your description of other peoples' reactions. I was (nicely) weirded out last Friday, when someone I hadn't seen since my dx came running up to me at our yoga class and enveloped me in a huge, tearful bear hug. By this time - just over 3 weeks since dx - it kinda feels like I've "always" had cancer. I have to remind myself that for some folks, it's still news.
The other side of that is a friend of mine in another state, who writes me these hysterically funny emails, apologizing all the while - "I hope you're not offended! please don't think I'm being flip! just tell me and I'll shut up!" - that invariably make my day. Like the time he sprinkled his message with hyperlinks to some truly bizarre pink ribbon merchandising efforts, including (and this is something participants in this conversation will surely appreciate) a pink ribbon coffee mug that, when you turned it sideways, the pink ribbon turned into a Jesus fish. (But why would someone turn a coffee mug sideways? I mean, wouldn't you spill your coffee?)
More warm thoughts to all of you on this C-O-L-D weekend.
Linda
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I, too, have enjoyed this thread. What a breath of fresh air. Here's my 2 cents worth...
On Monday, January 28th I had TRAM flap reconstruction. Right after surgery I was told there was a problem and I might lose the flap. Phone calls and emails went out across the country and prayer chains were started. On Tuesday, I had emergency surgery to see if there was a blood clot causing the problem. I woke up to hear a voice tell me, "I'm sorry we couldn't save it." The flap was removed and the muscle was amputated. I am the "fluke" 1% that this happens to. So...what happened? All those prayers went unanswered? God has another plan for me? It can be explained a million different ways.
I am who I am, and I live as I do. I walk this path I have been given and I will fight to get where I want to go. I put my trust in doctors to give me treatments that will destroy the Cancer and prolong my life. I read everything I can get my eyes on and choose to be positive and to continue to move forward. As I told my PS, I always have a "Plan B."
Thank you to all the brave women out there who join me in this battle. It doesn't matter who or where we get our strength from, as long as we continue to fight...
Linda
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Madalyn - great link - that fist paragraph alone put me in a better mood today. Though I'm feeling no-so-great so maybe I'll go downstairs & play a few gospel songs on my guitar...
Just kidding guys - Spring training is about to start - "take me out to the ball game" is much more my style. I'll take my religion with steroids please.
Good to know the taste buds come back - at this point I can't even stand the taste of water Though since I've never worried about good nutrition, I don't see why I should start now. Ice cream rules - don't know if you get Julie's ice cream where you are - here both Whole Foods & Ralph's carry it. My idea of a good dinner. and lunch. and breakfast ...
susan0 -
Linda,
I'm so sorry that you tram flap reconstruction didn't work. I feel that something else will work for you, and I send you my best wishes for a speedy recovery. In the end, for me anyway, it was the support of friends and family, and mainly my husband, that got me through this and is still getting me through.
My very best wishes and hopes go with you.
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Susan in California,
I ate lasagna every single day, for lunch and dinner. Everything else tasted lousy. And I definitely put on weight. It didn't help much with the constipation either, but lasagna worked for me. Don't ask why, I haven't a clue, but you might try a bite or two and see if it works for you.
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I've been lurking on the edges of this conversation, too. Very interesting and inspiring to hear feedback from The Dudess's original post. I felt somewhat awkward with all the prayers my Christian family kept telling me over and over again about. But then my mother-in-law told me she was reciting Buddhist prayers and lighting incense for me at their family alter, and my native american friend did a drum wash for me, and my witch friends said spells for me, and after a while, it just felt like lots and lots of people holding me up, and it felt good.
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Madalyn- That Molly Ivers on bc link made my day. It's like that old SNL sketch "It's a floor wax and a dessert topping!" "It's a potentially fatal disease and an opportunity to express one's wit and great sense of humor in writing!" LOL
Susan- Hope the eating is going better. I can't add much here because for some weird reason I was spared just about all side effects other than (extreme) fatigue (oh and the depression- how quickly we forget!). There was just the one week of hating broccoli. I didn't lose my sense of taste or go food crazy from the steroids. I did have a very hard time going on and off them though- it worsened the depression and I had shakiness coming off them too.
I have heard that gingerale can help cut any weird taste in one's mouth. Pretty much any time I don't feel well just in general I go running for the gingerale and graham crackers- those and a wet washcloth. In my mind these things are somehow a cure all/make me feel safe.
Calypso- I feel the same way re: the prayer offers - it's support and caring. I don't think there was anyone I know who pushed anything on me or was intrusive about it. I was just sorting through papers today and re-read all of the cards people sent during my treatment- it was really touching to re-read them now that I am feeling well. Some of the cards were religious and/or mentioned prayer- especially from African American friends. Even though I am not a prayer myself, I realized that I LIKED people praying for me and expressing their caring for me. I certainly have my own ways of doing the same for others but tend to keep the specifics (chanting, metta practice, or lighting incense) to myself unless it's another Buddhist.
Susan- back to you- I'm laughing about your "take me out to the ballgame" metaphor.
We spent most of the day at Tuft's veterinary school and are now awaiting word on how Wendy got through her back surgery- turns out she had a very badly bulging disk that was impinging on her spinal cord. All prayers, Buddhist chants, witch spells, pagan rituals, etc. are welcome. Best to all of you.
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Ally - forget the rest of us. The important question is how is Wendy doing? We can express ourselves - she can't. Do they play the Westminster dog show on TV as entertainment? Though I could see that that might drive Wendy crazy - "that dog isn't as cute as me - why all the fuss!"
I had a lot of fun this morning going to the grocery story and buying any kind of junk food at all that I thought might have some taste. Ice cream, plastic cheese, candy. I may gain weight, but if I can stay awake, that'll be the best thing.
And like the rest of you - I will accept prayers or any thing else whether I believe or not. And I really do like gospel songs - have never understood that - guess good music is good music no matter what the underlying message is.
susan0 -
Thanks!!At last check in this morning Wendy was doing great. The neurosurgeon took out a big piece of blown out disk that was pressing on her spinal cord. That must be a relief, along with the hydrocodone. Here she is with our niece the year before last. Wendy is crazy about kids and babies of any kind- she was in charge of washing Isabella back when she was days/weeks old and looked like she might be a skunk.
She's improved quite a bit with age.
I almost forgot about Westminster- I am going to check the TV listings- I like to watch parts of it. I think Wendy is too doped up to appreciate it. She's supposed to come home on Thursday.
Susan- hope you're feeling well. Everyone- hope you're someplace warm. We've got the woodstove cranking and I am not setting foot outside unless I absolutely have to. I love being outdoors but the cold we are having today is beyond my tolerance. Better to sip tea, read, cook, watch dog shows, or listen to gospel music (I feel the same way about it you do- it "speaks" to me in some way).
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Talk about a face only a mother could love (I mean the kitten - not Wendy or your niece who are both beautiful), Yeah she's improved. Just about anything would be an improvement! So cute though. When I first got the little brown guy, he looked like a monkey. Grew into his features.
Saw a new fish I hadn't seen before today - it was a fish with fins that made it look like a space ship & inside it said "science." On a Prius of course.
susan0 -
She was pretty hideous. My mom would not stop harping on this. Everytime she saw her it was like the first time she'd ever seen something so ugly. Hopefully I didn't drive everyone from this thread with her ugly little face. Anyone new to the thread- please refer to my earlier post of the big beautiful cat, you won't believe it's the same animal!
Susan, how are you feeling? I went through all kinds of weirdness during each 2 week chemo cycle. Early in the treatment I seemed to bounce back around day 6. How's it going with finding foods that appeal? BTW Your avatar cat is beautiful- is he the "brown guy"?
Suzy- hope the gallbladder consult went well. Also hope you haven't been caught up in a flood. We have a lot of water on the roads here and my daughter gave me the report from up your way- sounded even worse than here. I went into work to see one client and was rewarded for my efforts with going out to find my car wouldn't start. Grrr
. Must have gotten water someplace critical in the electrical system going through one of the many giant puddles/rivers I hit on the way in.0
