Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?
Comments
-
Morning all .. happy Saturday.
Caerus .. loved your note this a.m.
Bren
0 -
Thanks for the Epicurus words and the Celtic prayer. They made my day.
I find it interensting that the Christians think we're angry when we politely tell them to move the proseltyizing to a Christian thread, when they'll find more support there. We find our support here, so why would we go to "their" thread? Nonetheless, anyone with bc is going to get our support, if they are looking for bc support. We are not an angry bunch. You want angry? Go to one of the political threads!
Hard to be (or stay) angry when one has nature around them, or good friends, or good books, cups of tea, and ice cream (forget that yogurt stuff!) and M&Ms. (Hmmmm, maybe there IS a god, since we have M&Ms!)
Anne
0 -
Oh my gosh! I am so glad I was looking at the "most active" threads this morning and found this one. I was dx last month and begin my chemo on the 18th of this month and am so comfortable living with my situation without a belief in a deity. But I was beginning to think I was alone in a sea of religious people. A situation not helped by living in SC where it is automatically assumed by 99.9% of people you meet that you're a believer. I've been prayed over and told that God only does this to make us stronger so many times in the last month and just don't know what to say. When asked if I had a good relationship with Jesus I said it's just not something I believe, but that I appreciate prayers. And I do, and good thoughts, and energy, and simple words of support because, as someone here said, it just shows how much support we DO have out there. That can't hurt.
As a former baptised Southern Baptist, I understand where folks are coming from. It's just that I couldn't ignore my scepticism and natural inclination to questionand finally had to admit to myself that I don't think there's anything out there. I really loved the quotation from Epicurious and what y'all were saying about how to pray for the storm to move from your backyard meant it would have to go elsewhere and the absurdity of sports teams praying for a win . . .
In any event, I know I can get through this just as well as women of faith can. It hasn't made me turn to God, nor am I bitter. This is what it is -- it's as simple as that. I got bc because I did -- not because it's part of God's plan, or because Ineed to learn a lesson, or whatever other "reasons" are floating around out there. In fact, I don't _need_ a reason, and I don't need an answer, and I don't need someone/thing to blame. All I need is to continue fighting this crappy disease, getting up in the morning, spending time with my husband and cats, and loving life.
Thanks for letting me ramble.
0 -
Welocme Julie and I am glad you found us...
I feel the same way about BC, It is what it is, deal with it...
but when people ask why I think I got it I tell them it was
the worm in the bottom of the tequila bottle...that usually stops them
0 -
Hi JulieH and welcome to "our gang".
0 -
SoCalLisa: LOL! But, hey, it's as good an explanation as any!
0 -
Welcome Julie. So glad you found us.
Lisa, thanks for the laugh. I'm going to remember to blame the worm. I can't wait to see the look on the first person who asks. I may have to follow with a hug.
Arlene, thanks for sharing the Celtic blessing.
I lurk in the Buddists and Natural Girls threads, occasionally asking a question. And thanks to Lisa I found the reincarnation of our "healthcare" thread, I believe it's called "I say yes, you say no, OR People are Strange." Thanks Blue. Also, there's a "Deletees" thread. I think we've been banished to the outback or hinterland.
Thanks WildRocky, I had been gone about five weeks. Visited a cousin in the States and came back to winter madness in Paris. Four inches of snow and we call out the armoured cars. Wild!
0 -
Hi everyone,
I lurk here but hadn't posted until I just HAD to offer Maya that high five.
So glad to find you all since I've been enduring the same comments from religious folks in my life since gettting dx'd on Nov. 30.
From the first day, I had DH tell my MIL - a lifelong, unquestioning Catholic who uses all those crutches to "help" others ("God never gives you more than you can handle"; "have faith, this has happened for a reason that only He knows"; "just pray and He will be there to comfort you") - not to say ONE word like that to me or I would not be held accountable for my reaction.
Luckily she has kept this stuff to herself so far, but with apparent great effort. I think I've actually caught her biting her tongue!
Although I'm not sure I'm a full-fledged atheist, I do not believe in religion - I'm more inclined to go with pagan, nature-based and Eastern philosophies. Yoga helps me, appreciating the natural world around me helps, seeing the goodness in people helps. I see goodness and UNDERSTANDING in this thread and appreciate that more than I can write here.
And, the humor is just what I need (and right up my alley), so yay for that too!
0 -
Welcome Michelle!!
The one that bugs me the most "God won't give me more than I can handle." bleh.
Bren
0 -
Ugh! All of those have a familiar ring. Fortunately, it's not so bad in Europe than in the US. The US is kind of a teenager as far as countries go and hasn't evolved much from it's original Puritan beliefs.
Michelle, so glad you like yoga. I teach at our treatment centre for our patients--and graduated patients. I was also a journalist for many years as I traveled from one country to another.
So glad you stopped lurking and spoke out. And yes, this group can be quite funny!
0 -
WildRocky--thank you for such a warm welcome. I like the idea of here. It's comfortable. I have faith in people,knowledge and anything you can prove to me!
0 -
Greetings - I tend to lurk here & there, never seem to find a thread that continues to be of relevance, just stumbled upon this a few days ago, ignoring it as it's under the forum Just Diagnosed, and that, for me, was over 2 years ago.
What interests me, and I can never seem to find - though it must exist on these threads and likely on this one, are stories of healing - physical and emotional/mental and changes in perception of life, and dreams of healing. I'm an a theist, in that I don't believe in the big man in the sky - ie a creator god, but I do have spiritual yearnings. I have been influenced by buddhism and Taoism. And the mystical aspect of "religions". Things that bring us close to our whole selves, and connect us.
I haven't read back much here - I am on dial-up and it's SOOO slow. So forgive me if I'm adding an element which no one wants to hear about - especially if your take on atheism is no divine aspect to the universe, at all, - but I would love to hear any stories about your changes, dreams, perceptions of how you are now in the world.
Arlene
0 -
I gave up my organized religion decades ago. I belive that heaven or hell is what you recreate on earth through your own actions and decisions and my God is nature (in my garden) (and that BC certainly was not of our or God's making unless you're a smoker or ate way too much, etc.), and that our best aids for ourselves is to eat an "anti-cancer" diet, gett least 1/2 hour exercise each day, and try to keep a positive spirit thru your relationships with others... So don't feel alone!
0 -
Hi, Souad,
Healing. One of my favorite words. For us as individuals, and the world as a whole. Whole. Healed. What I love about the women on this thread is the support, for who an individual is, where she is on this journey, and the support to HEAL and share what has meaning for her. I read a lot of books about psychology, and spirituality, religion - and remember often how Carl Jung described a "mature adult" as a person who has the ability to live with paradox, and mystery. I'm paraphrasing, but that's the gist. I don't think there is "An" answer - to anything, and it makes me queasy, when anyone tries to tell me that "If you just....whatever" - all will be well.
Well, Nature is my greatest healer. I am comforted when others share how Nature helps them heal. Sorry you're on a dial up, but I look forward to learning more about your own healing journey.
0 -
Hi Souad,
I have always, deep, deep, down in my catholic trained heart, been more buddhist / eastern philosophy sort of person.
After dx I did the "healing journey"(s) at Wellspring as well as mindfullness meditation at PMH. This has been such a joy for me. It feels like pieces of a puzzle fitting together. I am pretty ecclectic in my approach - I hear about somebody interesting - read their book / website and see how it feels. I get the feeling that if we took away all the rules from religions - they would all be the same. And that is a shame, not that they are the same, but because of all the unnecessary fighting, wars, etc - over nothing.
I must admit, I am not formally trained in any religion - this is just my sense of things.
Various readings / teachings i have learned / heard - that we are all one. If I hurt you, I hurt myself and everybody. This totally amazes me. It makes me feel very responsible and kind in my actions.
The Aboriginal's include the earth, water, air, trees, rocks, animals, everything as being equal to us. Again, it makes me very aware of my impact on this earth and responsible and kind towards everything.
I don't know where I will go with this - it's a journey, but I don't feel the need for a god to answer to - I have myself to answer to.
One reason why I like this board. When someone comes on and feels bad - there is always someone or several someones who will chip in with hugs, support and understanding. Our connection is over the internet - and it is real.
0 -
Welcome Arlene. Glad you're no longer lurking, but hey, I did too. But it's a friendly group and I found a good fit here.
Didn't realise we were in the Just Diagnosed section. More proof we just don't know our place? I too spend time on the Buddhist thread. I capture and release outside all insects in my flat, so I've been called a Buddhist by my friends for years. I don't mind at all. Also like the Natural Girls thread. I just can't help but believe that cures are available in nature.
I've found a comfortable place here to discuss options and ask questions, something the church I grew up in would never allow me.
0 -
In the past, we've discussed moving this thread out of "Newly Diagnosed," but I think the majority thought this was the best place for newbies to find us. I haven't been a newbie since 2005 and didn't find this thread until about two years ago. It's a wonderful group of women here and I'm so glad more women have found us.
Since I've been through BC/chemo twice, my advice re healing (and I mean mental, physical and spiritual healing) is to try to be patient with yourself. Once you're done with treatment, it's common to think you'll just bounce right back to your old self. I'd say it takes at least six months post-treatment to start feeling fairly normal.
I don't want to scare the newbies, but cancer is an experience that I think changes you forever. Your life is divided into pre-cancer and post-cancer. I suppose any major life experience (marriage, childbirth, death of a spouse, divorce) does that. You're never really the same as what you were before. You're different, but that's not always a bad thing.
I also feel drawn to the Buddhist way of thought. To me, being more "mindful" means I take the time to appreciate all the small things that make up my life. That probably sounds trite, but a heart full of appreciation is much better than a heart full of bitterness or anger.
I appreciate all of you so much. You've made my journey so much easier!
--CindyMN
0 -
Hi Madalyn, and Evergreen9, and Caerus, and Molly 52, chumfrey and maya2 - and thanks for all your very interesting posts, and for welcoming me. Molly 52 - 'I get the feeling that if we took away all the rules from all religions - they would all be the same". Yes indeed.
And I too do the same, read here & there and did the Mindfulness - but where I finally began to get my bearings was by taking physics (for lay people, no math needed) and religion (first all world traditions, then eastern) courses at university. They blew me away! first the scientists - and it is utterly fascinating - how they try to understand reality by measuring. And then you have religion - or we can say instead - spirituality - where we use our intuition. and if there's anyone here who loves to blab on about science & religion please - I'm your "man"!
Something profound "happened" to me when I got bc. Instead of my usual - becoming depressed - I seemed to go on some kind of high. There was no end to the wonderfulness (after the initial terrible anxiety)- my surgeon, the nurses, the home nurses, it was like I was flooded with love instead of fear, and, especially, love and compassion for my poor dear innocent breast. How the he** did that happen?? I remember, during chemo, it was fall, and I was looking at the intense blue sky, the red trees, it was all so alive - I could not tear myself away - like I had never seen the true beauty of fall before. some people asked my partner if i was on "drugs". Like -acid flashbacks!!! LOL. It's not like I knew what I was doing, but something came from inside.
I had a very important dream, too, the night before I was to see the surgeon for my pathology report. My mother (died in 1987, but had had a radical mastectomy when I was 4, in 1951) and I had big brooms and were vigorously batting away huge yellow blobs that were coming down the sticky, wet, kind of running pink pavement. I woke up and walked back into the woods, and knew I was going to be all right. And I was - or at least, I think I am, considering I'd had a 4 inch tumor.
I like to think about the new science of psychoneuroimmunology, and that we now know the immune system has neurotransmitters - and I wonder often about that dream - can the immune system communicate in dreams?
All this in the summer of 08 - and here I am, filled with appreciation for life, and that makes me happy. 5 years ago I woould go on the websites for positive psycholgy and find i had no sense of the meaning of my life at all.
So I guess the bc was a catalyst - perhaps, who knows, it allowed me to open my heart to myself. Not that the journey is finished.
sorry for going on - and this is a much-abbreviated version! thanks for reading, and now I will return and read your postings over, and take them in. So glad I found you.
Arlene
0 -
When I was first diagnosed and before my surgery, I pictured the cancer cells in my body and wished them loving kindness, metta. Here is a picture of a breast cancer cell. http://www.alternative-cancer.net/Cell_photos.htm As I wished metta toward my cancer, I imagined that those little spiky things became calm and smooth.
I don't know if it affected my cancer cells but the focus on loving kindness certainly helped me.
For those who may not know, Buddhism has no creation story or creator god. It is a philosophy but when practiced as a religion, it is a religion without a god or savior. One saves oneself. Most Buddhists are agnostics or atheists when it comes to belief in a creator being.
0 -
Notself .. I remember when another member posted something similar to what you said. I understood what she and you are talking about. Cancer is part of our body, it started from within, not without. I understand that we don't want to live with hate, but want to love our bodies into wellness.
But sometimes I find this very hard to do .. and I have hateful, negative thoughts about my body.
Welcome to all the new gals .. have enjoyed reading your posts!
hugs,
Bren
0 -
Binva, Notself has been helping me with her loving kindness meditation. It really works. You can use it for yourself or others.
One thing that I did to get over negative thoughts about my body was to pose pictures of myself all over the house (I used ones I liked) and really looked at them. This is my opinion only, but we rarely see ourselves. All day we look at others - so our own looks are almost a stranger to ourselves. So, I got to know myself - and have a little more acceptance of what I look like.
I read somewhere, a long time ago, Julia Roberts when to a NY dept store without makeup. At the makeup counter, not recognizing Julia, the sales person told her she could look really nice is she wore some makeup!!!!
0 -
This probably isn't very spiritual .. but I find if I put on make-up and dress up to go to the store, I feel so much better.
Molly .. I think I will look through some recent pics of myself that I like .. what a great suggestion!
Hugs to everyone today,
Bren
0 -
notself,
I loved your loving kindness visualization. Years ago, in Washington DC, His Holiness the Dalai Lama was at a public event, and when questioned about "what is your religion" - he answered:" My religion is kindness."
Loved it.
0 -
Caerus .. thanks for posting that. I love his reply and try to live by those words as well.
Bren
0 -
Bren this is for you
0 -
SoCalLisa: Love the pictures. I lived 5 years in Tucson as an adult (and was born in Phoenix), and I love the southwest. It always feels like coming home when I look at scenes like that. Thanks for posting!
0 -
Thanks Lisa .. love the collage. It looks like Old Town.
hugs,
Bren
0 -
I am loving these colors now..I just knit this laprobe for the VA hospital
and the veterans in wheel chairs..
0 -
Lisa, that's spectacular. And how lovely of you to make it.
Linda
0 -
It IS lovely Lisa and brings back lots of memories for me. When I started Girl Guides at the age of 10 we used to knit Peggy squares and our leader knitted them together into blankets and then sent them off to charity organisations. I knitted my fingers off for 8 years and I hope I made many people's live a little better in doing so. There seems to be little call for such things now days with the advent of polar fleece and such like.
0
