natural girls
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With my low OncoType DX score of 0... I will not be doing Chemo (even though my onco wants me to) and do no know if I can tolerate AIs. I am post menopausal and just had a hysterectomy, ooph, et.al. this week. Now, I want to learn as much as I can about supplements that I should take and what my diet should be. I just read some study that said grape seed extract with Vit C "caused" breast cancer wheras grapeseed extract alone inhibited it. Can that be true? I only saw one study about that and am worried because I am currently OD..ing on grape seed extract, Vit C and flavenoids and CoQ 10, curcumin, acai, pomgranate, etc. Any help would be greatly appreciated as I was just diagnosed in April, had DBL Mast in April and now the total hysterectomy. So, I am new to this and don't know if I should be concentrating more on protein or fruits and veggies. Thank you for all everyone has done to help me through to this point. This is an amazing place and I have already learned so much. You all were so helpful when I was freeking out at the beginning!!!!!
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Hi Luna,
This is all very scary indeed. You have been through quite a lot over the past several months. It is time to get yourself healthy again. I would recommend that you seek out a good naturopath who can assist you with supplements and diet. Not sure where you live, but if you want a recommendation in the NY/NJ area, I can give you one. And, let's see how Smallworld does with her appointment as that sounds like it could potentially be a great resource for all of us! From what I have read, fruits and veggies are the way to go NOT protein. Fruits and veggies, can supply all of the protein our bodies need. But again, talk to a good doctor so that you can get onto the road to recovery!
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Luna5, I will for sure let you know how my appointment goes. I live in California. I hope that I can help all my sisters on this site, with information, and we all need all the advice and help that we can get. I will be back after the 3rd to update you all.
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Luna,
It would be hard to believe that vitamin C causes cancer. Think of all the C we get in juices, fruits, etc. Everyone would have cancer... there would be a line out the door of all our cancer centers. Some things just make no sense. I'd love to read such research because I'd send it on to the Pauling Institute, they're use to debunking such nonsensical research.
Sounds like you have a nice list of foods, don't forget an apple. It does keep the BC Doctor away, per the current research.
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Holy cow!! That's like out of the ballpark high, isn't it? Good idea to follow up on that!
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someone mentioned meatballs of oatmeal, egg and veggies- is there a recipe for this? can you post or pm me?
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Ok girls, my new obsession is water. Does anyone have a favorite water they buy? We have fluoride in our drinking water. I have not read anything good about fluoride, in fact it can cause estrogen overload. I have been buying ro water but I read where it lacks in minerals that are very important. So, what is a natural girl supposed to drink? I would love your input.
Patty
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Ivory, holy cow. Talk about a fluctuation. Report back on that. I'd heard it could fluctuate, but WOW.
Luna, onctype of 0 and still wanted chemo. Good grief.
Spring.
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Hi all.
I just noticed this other thread, and wanted to share as I remember someone here was talking about removing ovaries. Just FYI... I didn't read it, but I'm just like, SPEACHLESS!!!!
Removing Ovaries may increase Lung Cancer risk - http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/73/topic/737880
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They should just come out and say it . . . everything we touch, eat, use, breathe and see will cause cancer. There, now we know!
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Luna< I'm with Spring, I wouldn't do chemo for an oncotype of 0 either. You must be pretty young for your onc to have suggested it. I'm biased, hard terrible SE's from the chemo and am now struggling to feel better months later, so really went WTH when you said it was suggested for oncotype of 0. Good luck finding a naturopath.
Spring, article a little disturbing wasn't it. From what I read they included medically induced menopause, not just those that had their ovaries out. Nice
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kmmd, yes the article was disturbing - I had a hyst./1 ovary removed in 1991 at age 28, and then remaining ovary out in 1997, all because of endometriosis and all kinds of estrogen-related issues. Now they say, oh, keep the ovaries in, it will help you not get lung cancer. sheesh!!
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Lots to comment on, so here goes:
As far as exercise goes, get a rebounder! It is fun, easy and essential to getting the lymph moving. The lymph filters out all the impurities in our bodies that can cause cancer. If the gunk just sits there it can become cancerous. The lymph system does the job. Get jumping! Check out the motivation thread if you need some encouragment. Great bunch over there with a positive attitude!
Vit D-How much are you taking Ivory? My chiro, who checked my levels when my other docs thought it was a waste, put me on 6000IU when my test showed I was in the 20's. After 6 months it went up to 45, but it still took another 6 months, and it finally went up to over 100. So be patient. I cut back to 4000 now and will check it again soon. It is really essential to get the D3 level up, so keep working on it.
Luna-I agree with the others, chemo seems like overkill in your case. Get a second and third opinion. Why would the onc compromise your immune system for such a low risk. Did you see the study on posted last week about the actual benefits of chemo?
EWB-I don't really have a recipe for the veggie burgers, I am a little of this, a little of that kind of cook. I would just experiment with making the veggie burgers. I am thinking that if you sauteed a bunch of minced veggies, like mushrooms, carrots, onions, seasoned them well with garlic and herbs, cooled them a bit, then mixed them with a egg (which holds it together) and added a filler like oats, cooked barley, etc. and formed into patties, they might be great. This is how I make meatloaf anyway, and I sometimes have made them into meatballs, one more step and it is a burger. Let me know if it works!
Springtime-as far as the cancer/no ovaries, I would not take worry too much if I was you. The problem with taking out the ovaries is that it gets rid of a lot of the good estrogen along with the bad. More and more doctors ARE realizing that this is not a good idea, but hey, some still foist this upon women. You can get the good estrogen and progesterone which are protective. This is the huge controversy of course, but the facts are that, balancing hormones are the key to prevention. If any of you have not read Dr. Lee, and others and their extensive reasearch on hormone therapy, I advise you to do so. It is protective to have these hormones, they are not the cause of our cancer. The dominance of the bad estrogens is the problem.
By the way, my mother had a total hysterectomy and died of lung cancer. But since she started smoking at about 12, I attribute her cancer to that. I also, attribute my cancer partly to the fact that I was exposed to all those carcinigens in my house. She and my SF smoked about 2 packs a day. That is a lot of bad air I was breathing. I once was mad about a guy who smoked. It did not last long. I just hated to kiss an ash tray, no matter how much of a hunk he was! LOL
I never give any credence to any of these studies that show one thing causes cancer. I have read too many books, that convince me cancer is not caused by one thing, but a bombardment of things. I also believe, although we cannot control everything in our environment, if we eat nutritionally(food is the best medicine), exercise daily, supplement what our body lacks, and learn to deal with stress, we can prevent cancer. I really do not worry about a recurrance, because my lifestyle now is nothing like it use to be.
Finally, for you newcomers here, who I am glad to see by the way, check out the iodine thread. It took me a long time to get on the iodine bandwagon, but I have done a lot of reading on it, and the evidence is overwhelming how important adding this is to prevention of all kinds of problems, not just cancer. I have been on iodine for a couple of months now, and will test soon so I can tell what a difference it has made, but I can feel the difference. Not only is my energy up, but I am sleeping better, and my breast and a half have softened, and my scar is disappearing. I hope all of you will read the iodine thryroid thread too.
You gals, with your "Holy Cow" comments, are you Cub fans?
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Not me - I'm a NY fan - Mets or Yankees (the good kind of Mets, not the bad!) - I just didn't want to swear!
Vivre, I love your posts - they are always so calming and informative!
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Vivre: thanks, I have one Onc really pushing me for an oophorectomy and I am resisting for exactly the reasons you mention.
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Thanks Vivre- thatys kind of how I cook- I make up a lot --some times it works and some times...well enough said. I will experiment a bit and let you know.
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Chelev-OMG, eek a METS fan! Okay, I will forgive you, even though I have hated the mets since 1969 because you were probably not even alive then. LOL
By the way, that was the year I gave up on the Cubs too! People still love the biggest losers in sports. I think it is just an excuse for them all to get drunk.
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Vivre, well, yeah, Mets or Yankees, as long as it's a NY team, which doesn't make much sense to any baseball fanatics, but i really don't like baseball so I don't have any strong affliations. Now, if we're talking hockey, that's another story . . . diehard Rangers fan. Those Chi-town people really love their teams - Cubbies and da Bears! (worked with people in Chicago at the board of trade for 11 years). Can't like our Florida Marlins, because well, the teams in Florida tend to suck - I think it's the humidity or heat or something.
In 1969, I was in kingergarten, but thanks for the compliment!!
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chelev ~ Rangers fan, huh?!?
Diehard RED WINGS fan here!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Love. My. Hockey!!!!!!
I lived in Chicago when I was 10-12 years old. Dirty city at that time, sooty I mean. Dad was in the Navy & was stationed there.
((hug))
Val
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Oh yeah, those 69 Mets. What a team. I can still remember it like it was yesterday. Nolan Ryan having to stick his pitching hand in pickle juice to stop the blisters. Those were the days. Sorry Vivre.
I was just watching the Cubbies slaughter the Astros today. Yesterday we did them, today they do us. It's almost like they toss a coin, who's turn to win?
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Girls, I think that it is great you are all sport fans, but we need to get down to business, I could talk all day about the 49ers, but this site is to help us deal and learn more about the C word. You guys could always use the private e-mails, and talk about your team, and right now we need you on our team. Sorry, don"t need to complain, but I'm a little nuts today.
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Hard to keep up with the fast-moving questions and input on this thread, but I wanted to go back and address a question Patty asked about water. Here's a link that might be helpful:
http://www.ewg.org/reports/bottledwater
I don't recall if that's the site where I found bottled waters tested & listed by name, but based on a list I saw somewhere, I stopped using Arrowhead and stick to Crystal Geyser, which rated much higher for purity. For clean taste, I love Hawaii and Fuji waters, but they're pricey, and I'm not sure how they rate. Most of the time, I refill bottles from our undersink purifier which is by Aquasana, and has a very high purity rating.
Meg ~ That swing in your estrogen level is unbelievable! Remind me what you're on -- tamox? DIM? I know you'll share with us what your doctor gives as an explanation for such a wild variance.
smallworld ~ You'd asked if there's a difference between recipes for breast cancer and healthy recipes. I've always eaten extremely healthy, and I've been amazed at the amount of fat I've been able to cut out of my diet since learning that fat cells can produce estrogen. One example is yogurt. I frequently have a cup of plain yogurt with fresh & dried fruit and nuts for breakfast. Prior to bc, since I don't have a weight problem and don't eat a lot of other fat, I ate whole milk yogurt for its rich taste. But since bc, I've found some non-fat yogurts I like, thus cutting about 10 grams of fat from that one meal. I also found The Anti-Estrogenic Diet by Ori Hofmekler and Beating Cancer With Nutrition by Patrick Quillan, helpful.
I finally switched this week from I3C to DIM. Couldn't find the Myomin (sp?) vivre mentioned anywhere. Is it OTC? I also ordered Iodoral on-line, and can't wait to get started on it! Deanna
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dlb823,
I am new,I am sorry if this question is dumb or has been answered but, I have read most of the thread & can't find it mentioned.
Aren't there large amounts of estrogen in all dairy? Including eggs?
Thanks for the water information, I forgot about the male fish laying eggs.
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Smallwood,
Oh, alright.
Dawnn
Yes there is estrogen in milk. I think eggs to a lesser degree, but probably.
Here's a Ph.D. talking about milk:
http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/2006/12.07/11-dairy.html
I've been drinking organic almond milk, but I got to thinking about it, and now I'm wondering if they're using almonds that are pasteurized. I wonder if they can call almonds organic if they're pasteurized?
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Rosemary,
I have been a vegetarian for over 5 years, I do use some organic dairy while baking & cooking though. What about rice milk?
Do you ever make your own almond milk? I can't imagine finding the time to do that. I make my own butter when I can find raw organic milk.
I do not think pasteurization can effect a product being organic or not. If the almonds were grown organically & pasteurized according to organic standards, it would be organic. Pasteurized is just heated to kill germs.
I still can't get a straight answer on soy, even from the alternative health dept. at my cancer clinic. I have been buying soy free organic eggs though. My DH & kids eat EVERYTHING.
Just my oldest DD & I are veg.
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Dawn ~ I recently read or heard that one problem with milk is not only the added hormones that many dairy farmers use, but the fact that dairy cows are always pregnant, so even if they're not being given extra hormones, they're producing tons of natural hormones, which we certainly don't need. So even when we buy "hormone-free" milk, we're still getting a huge dose of estrogen. I can't recall where I saw that, but I'll try to do a bit of research on it. And I have no idea about eggs, but I'm sure someone will know the answer.
Rosemary ~ I believe that almond growers are by law still allowed to call their almonds organic even if they've been pasturized, as it now required. I seem to recall a big fuss about that when the new pasturization law came into effect. I'll see if I can find an article I read about it. Deanna
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Thanks, dlb823.
I understand the whole pregnant cow issue. I have just been reading the boards about women's hormone levels going up & down after menopause or ooph, I wonder if what you eat can effect the levels that much? I know we produce them in other places besides the ovary, I am just weighing my options as far as treatment is concerned.
I am WAY pre-menopause, my mom & grandmom had periods past 60yo. I really don't want to remove my ovaries, I can't help to think I may need the other hormones they produce too.
Ignore me, I am overwhelmed, overwhelmed, overwhelmed
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Supposedly the almonds that are "raw" in the health food stores are not always truly raw but are pasteurized. I have read that if they float when you soak them, they are not truly raw. If you can find raw almonds, they are more nutrient rich. When you soak them, they germinate, which releases more of the nutrients.
Almond milk is really easy to make. All you need to do is soak the almonds overnight, then add water, a little almond extract and a little sweetner, such as agave nectar and blend them in a blender for a few minutes. Then, strain the milk with either cheese cloth or a nut milk bag and you have almond milk. It will keep for a few days in the fridge. It really tastes good and is much better for you than cow's milk. We use it in coffee in place of dairy. Not sure about the soy, but with all of the controversy, why take the chance?
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Also, the pasteurization process not only kills the germs it also kills the nutrients in foods. That is why they then add back nutrients to "enrich" them. It is all part of the big, ugly business of processed foods!
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Here's the article I'd read about almonds: http://www.naturalnews.com/021776.html
And here's an interesting one on hormones in milk: http://www.naturalnews.com/020212.html
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