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Why was I stronger DURING treatment than I am now?

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  • Rabbit43
    Rabbit43 Member Posts: 121
    edited August 2013

    cfdr...great news! I was typing, stepped away from the computer for awhile and didn't realize you posted. I'm so happy for you. I agree that your NP is wrong. This all takes its toll on us and they would do well to recognize that. It's amazing to me that you kept exercising before, during and after treatment. I hope you find some relief from fatigue soon.

  • Janet_M
    Janet_M Member Posts: 500
    edited August 2013

    cfdr - Hooray for a clean mammo!!!

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    How high was your calcium?  Mine was one point higher than normal and the dr said that is trivial and indicates nothing.  I hope he's right!  I had a lot of abnormal chemistries.  Protein in my urine, high glucose, high cholesterol, live enzyme a bit high.  It was almost reassuring to see in black and white why I feel this way!

    As for fatigue, in the Breast Cancer for Idiots book it says that a percentage of bc survivors never feel the same again after chemo.  "Something to think about before deciding."  Well I thought and thought, but what is the choice?  

    Excercize definitely is helping me, and being off of ARrimidex helps.  I started very slowly.  Only doing 20 minutes at 2 mph on the treadmill.  Originally that was enough to elevate my pulse by 30 points!  Yesterday I did 30 minutes and my pulse went up much less.  So I assume something good is happening.  It's a long road!

    But most important Thank God for the good mammo!  Celebrate!

    In the beginning my husband came with me to every app and was so concerned.  At this point I go to everything alone and he doesn't even know.  I take this as progress!  The apps are routine and we're all getting more and more relaxed about them.  It's a good thing!

  • lenn13ka
    lenn13ka Member Posts: 104
    edited August 2013

    CFDR - Good news!

    Rabbit - DWTS was so much fun. Derek Hough and Tristan McManus were pretty hot. I went to dinner first, tailgated and drank nice champagne and had so much fun with my girlfriends! But after a day of work and an RO visit as well..I hit the wall on Friday. Thank God it rained and I didn't have to go to work..exhausted. I am coming up on 4 weeks post rads. I keep thinking I should have had a masectomy and maybe avoided this. I really don't like how my body feels from Rads.  I recovered very quickly from surgery.

     Tim - I was diagnosed almost 2 years after you and we have a similiar staging. I had a very small postive node. Now insurance pays for positive node women to get an oncotype - which was not the case too long ago. Having an Oncotype score of 17 put me right below the line for low risk. I had a 3/3 split for chemo/no chemo. The deciding vote for me was the Clinical Director of Breast Cancer Oncology at Dana Farber - a 1-2% gain with chemo. She wouldn't even recommend it.She said the research is leaning this way. It was very tough decision but I thought I could make up that 1-2% with lifestyle changes. I just couldn't bring myself to accept doing that to that to myself. Plus my MO kept scaring me with all the things I could do wrong to myself if I continued working  during treatment(dirt, cuts, sun) basically telling me I couldn't work during chemo. These are the decisions I made that I am trying to put behind me so I can just move on and get healthy.

     I regret I was never give the choice of a masectomy so I had to have rads, especially since I had a lot of LVI ( which is why you can have a postive node with a very small tumor.) But now I have the "Rad Fog" in a bad way... I am supposed to be  invoicing right now but I can't concentrate - which is why I am on this board. Off to PT at my gym - the one thing going pretty good.. I'll try to work numbers when I get back!

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    Lenn, I had a micromet.  100 cells and lymph invasion.  Every dr I went to said no chemo.  My onco was 14.  The only one who said chemo was Sloan, and they were the only one's who found the micormet and the lymph invasion so I gave their expertise some weight.  She was not dogmatic and said that all of the other drs may be right.  But she'd advise chemo, CMF, as a precaution.  Part of it is personality I guess.  I'm a scaredy cat and didn't want to leave any stone unturned.  But I understand why the other drs said no chemo.

  • wintersocks
    wintersocks Member Posts: 434
    edited August 2013

    cfdr- great news for you.

    I have been told that there is a MDT about my 'cyst' thing and then I will be pre-opped. So will be waiting again to find out what this thing is......

    But oophrectomy for sure.

    I caught sight of myself today, OMG I don't look like me. Saw an 'old' lady looking back. Honest, was a shock. This happen to anyone else? 

    God who would be a woman???

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    When I was on chemo I would shock myself when I saw myself in the mirror.  i looked kind of gray and sick.  Don't look that way anymore.  

  • cfdr
    cfdr Member Posts: 308
    edited August 2013

    Rabbit, I know exactly what you mean about the mammo waiting room. I explained to my husband that no, I'm not obsessed about recurrence, but yes, I get anxious when I have an oncology follow-up coming up. There is simply no chance that, on a random day tooling away at work, that someone is going to call and tell me that I have a recurrence or mets. So I really don't think about it much. But on the day that I go to the cancer center, that is a very real possibility. Only an 11% possibility, but very real nonetheless.

    Lenn, my MO did the numbers and I think chemo gave me a 3% better chance of survival. But she recommended it, and said that if she were in my shoes she would do it. My oncotype was 25, but no node involvement. She said that the chemo recommended (taxotere & cytoxan) was not as bad as some. Ha! The three months of chemo was a breeze, relatively speaking, but if I had known that I'd be suffering this much in the summer of 2014, I'm not sure what I would have decided.

    Had a long talk with my husband last night, which he initiated. It was good, but it was also very tough. I feel pretty bruised emotionally today. I wish I had the money to just hole up at a beach motel for a week with a good book.

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    cf, good for you sticking up for yourself with your husband,  We have to be strong and advocate for ourselves.  IT's not easy when you're not feeling well.  

    Many times I have wanted to hole up in a motel.  But I think you did the right thing hashing it out with your husband.

    Bravo!

  • Janet_M
    Janet_M Member Posts: 500
    edited August 2013

    Cfdr - I also wish you could hole up in a hotel for a couple of days. My opnion is that once you get a clean mammo, you should be allowed to coast with the relief for a while. I'm sure you could use a mental break. But - I'm glad that the talk you had with your husband was good. Those talks can be brutal, but as long as you get some results it's not a total waste of energy. Hopefully it wasn't in vain? 

    Wintersocks - The old lady you saw in the mirror is just here on a temporary post-cancer- stress visa until you get yourself sorted out. The real lady is inside, waiting to stand up straight and get excited about living again. She is wearing lipstick and awesome shoes. Tomorrow is a step in the right direction.

    (Horace loves them both ladies equally)

    By the way - I saw an excellent movie last night called 'Love is all you Need'. It's funny and charming, and the lead character wears a wig and has finished chemo and has a romantic adventure. Totally uplifting & and not about cancer, though it does come up from time to time. Pierce Brosnan is the love interest - yum

  • lenn13ka
    lenn13ka Member Posts: 104
    edited August 2013

    CFDR - if I feel this out of it with rads and tam I cannot imagine with 4 rounds of T C - what you did! That is what my MO wanted to do. I am an 11% reccurance with just tam and I guess I am ok with that. I backtracked once after I made my decision but my own MO, who wanted me to do chemo said to stick with my choice and not look back. Being self employed it was mostly about being able to continue working but deep down I am not sure I would have done it if it was my off season. Just don't know.



    Another vote for beach motel! I am there.



    I called one of my very long time customers by the wrong name today. I couldn't get the words out.I see my MO on Tuesday. If this is Tam I am switching! If it rad brain I think I am in for a tough few months.

  • rockym
    rockym Member Posts: 374
    edited August 2013

    Every time I have to get a mammo or check-up I'm off my game.  I think we all are since we know we may here some bad news.  I'm not scared of recurrence, so much as them poking and probing me.  I can't tell you how many times they have had to do the diag mammo and then call me in to relook at something else.  Back in 2012, they got all jumpy over a damn cyst, wanted to drain it and afterwards, let me with lymphedema of the breast.  Another time they smashed my breast so hard brown liquid came out and they they wanted to do a needle thing of which I said no way.  They have stuck me in that MRI machine numerous times and even my OB/gyn got all wacky when I had a light period for a few days.  It was off for the vag. ultrasound and a biopsy two feet down from the breasts.  Yep, nervous and anxious allowed.

    For the record, I had 2 micromets that were positive within 2 nodes.  I wasn't going for chemo without a fight, so I had the oncotype after that knowledge.  When the magic number came back at 22, I felt chemo was the best decision.

    Rabbit, I had a root canal, build up and post and then 2 days later a crown lengthening procedure.  The worst part is that NOTHING hurt.  Out of the blue, my tooth cracked in half, all the way down to the bone.  Another $2,500 towards my dentist's new car :-).  Antibiotics and Advils for a week, so hubby better be nice.

  • wintersocks
    wintersocks Member Posts: 434
    edited August 2013

    Hiya Girls

    i too wish for a holiday, alone with a good book. I would like to go walking too. I am going to join a walking club, I am lucky to live in a beautiful part of the world (think Bronte's) and ought to get out more.

    I wish I could have a 'brutal/frank' honest talk with my other half, but he is not a talker at all. Sometimes, I find it incredibly frustrating....but that's just how he is.

    Janet, yes I am hoping I can shake off 'old lady/post-chemo look' - but I fear it may be with me for some time yet!

    Oh yes Horace, he is such a darling and is snuggled up next to me now - It seems to me that our animals offer so much comfort. He has the strangest stare and looks me straight in the eye, like he knows something I don't!! - oh dear...

    I haven't worn 'sexy' shoes in years, mainly to be found in flats and boots. Hey I might try a pair, but not round those weirdy men you spoke of Janet (Ugh and Yuck!!)

    I saw the tummy doc the other day Prof Bowel (this is how I am identifying all the docs I see, by their discipline) -from now on. He said my tummy is fine (on MRI) and the pain is probably referred from the cyst, also with IBS thrown in. Have had v bad pain under my left ribs.  Excrutiating. 

    He would not comment on my 'cyst' thing and said that was gynae dept (now known as Dr Ovary). So will just have to wait I guess.

    Counselling tomorrow, 1st one. I'm not supposed to feel anxious about that?? - but I do!

    Hope every one is well as can be. 

    xx

        

  • lenn13ka
    lenn13ka Member Posts: 104
    edited August 2013

    Rock- first - bummer about your tooth.I hate going to the dentist . second - I would have totally done the same regarding chemo if I were your age, onco and pathology at the time of dx. It is nice to see you at peace with your choice as it seemed you were kind of torn in your early posts on this thread. And, I also think taking yourself of Tamoxifin took some "balls" and I applaud you for that. My mo actually said since I didn't have chemo I would have to stick with the hormone treatments, even I wanted to opt out. I have learned so much from all you on this thread and I thank you again for that!.

    Winter Socks - how did you make out today?

  • Lily55
    Lily55 Member Posts: 1,748
    edited August 2013

    WS i was scared about my first counselling session, saw a woman who said she was experienced in cancer counselling! Well she was awful, and i walked outafter five minutes of session three, made me feel worse at first but i finally found someone experienced in PTSD therapy particular from illness or torture, and he has helped me enormously and we can only do phone or skype sessions as he is way too far away for us to meet, so i hope you get type two.......



    I have just had reduction surgery and tissue taken showed lots of cysts so waiting fir biopsy results.........and adhesions on mx side were so tight to bone they had to be cut. And then had fat transfer in to promote healing. I now wear sexy lycra crutchless and arseless pants down to below knees for compression and think i will go online and pose fir money to help with the costs of surgery!! First two days pretty rough but taking homeopathy and no painkillers now on day four.......can see difference on fat transfer side but its whether it stays there.........

  • cfdr
    cfdr Member Posts: 308
    edited August 2013

    Wintersocks, my husband isn't much for talking either, but I will say he's gotten much better over the years. Of course, he's much more willing to talk about *my* shortcomings than his own...oh, wait, I forgot, he doesn't have any shortcomings...any shortcomings I perceive are simply a result of my own distorted perception and unreasonable expectations... Yell

    Seriously, though, I realize that I am lucky to have someone who is willing to work through the issues and not just turn his back on me. This has been difficult for both of us, albeit in different ways.

    He painted a picture of me in our conversation that I found very disturbing. I have been very proud of myself for being a tireless self-advocate, for questioning and confirming what the doctors tell me, for doing lots of research and trying lots of solutions, all towards the goal of being the most healthy and productive person I can be. But to hear him tell it, I am preoccupied with my ailments, being sick is a core part of my identity, and I burden him constantly with my endless obsession. I've been pretty devastated and confused trying to reconcile my self-image with his criticisms (which he says aren't meant to be critical, they are just "observations" about how I handle things differently than he does...but he certainly didn't express them as flattering observations).

    Lily, I'm glad you found a better counselor. A bad counselor can make things WORSE. As much as I've been whining about my husband the last couple of weeks, I must say that things would be much worse if we hadn't seen a wonderful counselor who specializes in breast cancer patients and their caregivers.

    Wintersocks, good luck with your counseling appointment! I would love to take a walk in your part of the world. My husband and I want to take a trip to England one day; neither of us have been out of the Americas. He is a huge EPL football fan and wants to go to some games...I'd rather take a walk out on the moors. But we'll both gladly find a pub for a pint of ale!

  • Rabbit43
    Rabbit43 Member Posts: 121
    edited August 2013

    Ladies...I'm on the run and will catch up with everyone later (I missed a lot in the last couple of days), but CFDR...I just want you to know that you have a ton of knowledge and I think in our recent posts, many of us have acknowledged that your explanations of things (i.e. the booze discussion) were very helpful. So no, you are not obsessed, you are educated.



    Wintersocks...I've got my fingers crossed that today went well. Let us know. I think the names you have for your doctors are hilarious. They made me laugh out loud.



  • rockym
    rockym Member Posts: 374
    edited August 2013

    Lenn, thanks for the positive words.  There were a lot of decisions back then and now that all is said and done, I suppose it worked out.  As for balls... well sometimes having a pair would probably be easier then losing the estrogen we all know and love :-).  We are kinda flip flopped in that you skipped the chemo so got stuck with the Tamoxifen and I skipped the Tamoxifen, but got stuck with the chemo.

    Wintersocks, hopefully the counselling went well.  Mr. or Ms. Head Doc can get added to your list.  I did counselling a while back, but the lady I went to just wasn't very sharp.  She was a good listener and I suppose I needed that at the time, but she never helped solve anything.  My husband and I went to see her too, but she wasn't very good at couples so I haven't seen her for a bit.  I tried to find a new person and just when I thought I found someone, she wanted self-pay.  Well, she wasn't good enough to fork out that kind of money.  My copay for a non-doc shrink is $50, so they better be good.  This last lady wanted $100 and I almost laughed in her face.  My psych background and education were about as high as hers so I'm back to square one.

    Too bad after the MO, RO, BS, Gyn and all the others, they don't set us up with a good cancer shrink.  I think I've found a new specialization.  So many more cases and not enough good counselors.

  • Scottiee1
    Scottiee1 Member Posts: 1,790
    edited August 2013

    Hi everybody.....has anyone heard from Dunesleeper?....I sent her a PM but she has not responded and that was 2 days ago!!!!!!

  • wintersocks
    wintersocks Member Posts: 434
    edited August 2013

    ladies,

    My OH's phone (the one with the fruit) has broken, he is having to use an old 'press the keys' type one....

    He has just text me that he has to stop texting because 'my thumbs are really hurting'.........

    Hope everyone is ok. 

  • Pam7712
    Pam7712 Member Posts: 16
    edited August 2013

    Hi all. I’ve been following this thread for quite a while and it’s been extremely helpful. It’s so good to know I’m not the only one feeling worse when I should be feeling better. In fact, I feel completely exhausted and on the edge of a nervous breakdown -- but when I tell my normally supportive husband how I’m feeling, he totally does not understand. He and others seem to think Cancer is behind me, and that I should be energetic and moving forward. What I’d actually like to do is crawl in bed and sleep for about a year.

    2012 was an exceptionally bad year for me. I had some serious problems in my marriage early in the year, got assigned to a boss from hell at work in the summer, my husband lost his job in the fall (and ended up being unemployed for about 6 months), and I was diagnosed in December (yes, I believe there’s a connection between stress and cancer). I had lumpectomy surgery in late December, and finished radiation at the end of March (no chemo, since I was stage I and low grade). I’ve now been on Tamoxifen for about 4 months, and although it’s not as bad as I expected, it’s still uncomfortable (stomach upset, night sweats).

    Physically, I feel OK I suppose. It’s the mental/emotional side that’s giving me problems. Someone mentioned Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) in an earlier post. That seems extreme, but yet it fits. I feel like I’ve been to hell and back, and now I just want to collapse. But then I feel guilty because I think I should actually be feeling much better. My marriage is back on track, I recently quit my toxic job, my husband is employed, my body has healed, my “wimpy cancer” (that’s what my friend, a fellow survivor, called it) is gone, and I have a low risk of recurrence (if I stay on my meds). So then why do I feel so tired and depressed? For those of you who feel like you’ve fully recovered – how long did it take? Thanks for letting me vent.

  • cfdr
    cfdr Member Posts: 308
    edited August 2013

    Pam, welcome.

    I want to smack your friend for her "wimpy cancer" comment. Surgery and radiation and tamoxifen are not for wimps.

    A few years ago I had a basal cell carcinoma (skin cancer). No chance of metastasis. Got it burned off and got a band-aid. Now THAT is a wimpy cancer.

    I wish I could tell you about how long it takes to fully recover. I'm guessing that most people on this forum are here because they are NOT fully recovered yet. The ones who are doing great are out doing great, not posting on the BC forums.

    Fatigue is my ongoing issue, and I've read that more than a third of BC survivors continue to be fatigued 5-10 years after treatment. I find that my mood is OK *except* when I'm fatigued. But when I'm having a bad day (like today), having to struggle against fatigue is depressing. Not having my doctors seem to give a hoot that I'm essentially disabled is depressing. Seeing my husband's disappointment because I want to stay home (again) or am too tired to cook dinner (again) is depressing. Worrying how I'm going to make enough money when I can barely work 5 hours a day, at home, is depressing.

    So I guess what I'm saying is that even without the whole trauma in the past and fear of the future, trying to get through the Right Now is pretty challenging, even a couple of years out.

    On a more encouraging note, though, I seem to be the exception among other survivors that I know. I do know a couple who continue to struggle, but most of the women I know seem OK a couple of months or years down the road. That gives me hope.

    I really wanted to be one of those women running a 5k four months after the end of chemo. Didn't happen. Haven't given up hope that it might happen next year or the year after, though.

  • cfdr
    cfdr Member Posts: 308
    edited August 2013

    Speaking of fatigue...

    I have a question for those of you who are dealing with fatigue on a regular or irregular basis.

    How do you cope?

    Here are some of the things I try, and the results:

    -Bludgeoning my way through whatever I want/need to do anyway. This sometimes means nearly falling asleep at my desk, or doing an utterly inferior job of cooking/cleaning, or being fearful that I really should NOT be driving. When I do this, some stuff gets done, but I am miserable. I feel like if I were a stronger person, I would bludgeon my way through more often, and when I don't do it, I feel guilty that I'm not trying hard enough.

    -Doing something "productive" that doesn't require much energy. I can do some of my work lying on the sofa with a laptop, and that has been great, because I can indulge my fatigue but also feel like I'm accomplishing something. As long as I have enough energy that I'm not also mentally fuzzy, this feels pretty OK, like I'm taking care of myself, but also getting stuff done.

    -Exercising. Everything I've read and everyone I've talked to says that exercise is the #1 thing to do for persistent cancer-related fatigue. I have rarely found that it is much help, and in fact, I've often had the opposite experience, finding that it makes me MORE tired. Sometimes if I've overdone it, I'm actually exhausted for days afterwards.

    -Distraction/indulgence. My husband said I went through chemo "with strength and grace", and the reason is because I put no pressure on myself to do more than take a slow walk every day. I gave myself the time and space to heal. If I spent the day on the sofa reading a book, I was totally OK with it. If I had the energy to cook a meal, do some work, go out to dinner, take a longer walk, work on a hobby, I considered that a bonus, not a goal. Now, though, I'm more than 1.5 years post-chemo, and I am putting a lot of pressure on myself to get more clients (and more work), clean the house more, do more yardwork, cook good meals at least two nights a week. So if I don't bludgeon my way through, but lie on the sofa reading, it's a relief not to struggle but I feel guilty and ashamed, too.

    -Trying to fix myself. This is the part that drives my husband CRAZY. This post is an example of what I mean. I'm always doing research, or reading a book on survivorship, or coming onto these message boards hoping that I will find the magic word/practice/pill/vitamin/whatever that will return me to being the kind of person who made a full-time living and cooked and cleaned and went out and had fun.

    Thoughts? What has been your experience?

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    Gee, that was a beautiful thing your husband said.  I truly have not gotten one word of appreciation.  Instead he's very impressed with himself for actually "being there" during chemo.  He's the hero and I'm to be forever grateful that he penciled me into his schedule.  I can't imagine having him say something so beautiful to me.

    Fatigue...  I have to accept it and so does everyone else.  Today I wanted to go back to school shopping with my daughter.  She goes back to college Saturday and it's a great pleasure to be there for her.  No stamina.  I felt so bad.

    I found a bench and sat while she shopped.  Then I went in the car to wait for her to try things on.  I put on the air conditioner and listened to the radio.  It took her over 2 hours!  For some reason I am very achy and tired today.  I tried my best.  She wanted to go to several other stores and I had to tell her the truth, I have no stamina.  Two hours is a lot for me.  I just had to lie down.  She understood and was good to me.  I wish things were different.

    But her kindness and understanding meant more to me than anything!  I would have made no sense for me to push, in pain from store to store.  I'd end up irritable and that would have been the worst!  

    So, I guess what I'm saying is that, on a day to day basis, on an hour to hour basis, I try to accept.

  • rockym
    rockym Member Posts: 374
    edited August 2013

    Pam, nothing is really behind us.  Your flight or fight response was working and there are some of us who crash afterwards.  It takes a while to move forward.  It's the whole 2 steps forward, 1 step back deal.  It sucks, but it is what it is.  I don't know many of us who had much energy for sometime after treatment ended.  Also, when ladies take the hormone suppressors it's a double whammy.  Chemo put me into instant menopause and the hormone pills can do the same.  Typical women get a slow and steady approach to menopause... we don't.

    I don't know how old you are, but this also plays a factor.  Some of us were kinda young (less than 50) when the shit hit the fan.  We were not used to not having lots of energy so having our physical situation take us down a few notches is a surprise.  The energy does come back, but may not be a gung ho as before.  You either ease back to your old self or you accept the loss and focus on other strengths.

    The whole thing does feel like PTSD, but I believe true PTSD comes with the mental obsessing and reliving the event.  I know there is more to it, but I'm not a shrink.  It sounds like you've made some great changes and now you have to wait for things to settle.  The fact that you are low grade and early stage is all a plus.  I happen to like the term “wimpy cancer.”  I used to say I had "beginner cancer."  Somehow that makes the whole thing a little less scary.  I did have chemo based on many things, but now that I am 2 years out, so much of what happened is farther away.  I have hair again, I feel like my old self with the exception of being 10 pounds heavier and not having a period anymore :-).  I'm going to say it took me about a year and a half before things really fell back into place.

    You'll get there too.

  • cfdr
    cfdr Member Posts: 308
    edited August 2013

    Timbuktu, I had to fish for that compliment. After he had spent an hour or so telling me everything I was doing wrong, and how difficult it is for him (!), I asked him flat out--is there anything at all positive you can say about how I've dealt with this? And that's when he said the "strength and grace" comment. So, a year and a half ago, I did something right, in his eyes. Go, me!

    I had a similar experience to you with the shopping mall recently. I had a bunch of shopping to do for myself, and by the end of a couple of hours I was exhausted. I used to hike for miles every weekend, not a couple circuits of the mall wears me out.

    Acceptance is hard. I admit I'm pretty bad at it. I'm only 55 and not ready to retire. I want to hike, kayak, do yoga. I have hobbies that sit neglected, meals I want to cook. I would gladly give up the housework and yardwork if I could afford to pay someone else to do it!

    If I were just more tired at the end of the day I think I could handle it better. But when I have a few days in a row where it is an effort to even get off the sofa, I get way too frustrated. I've even wondered if I should withdraw a chunk of my retirement funds and just float for a year. But my fear is that I won't be any stronger at the end of that year, either.

    Rockym, good point that "wimpy cancer" can also make it seem less scary. I was looking at it from a different perspective: that calling it "wimpy" makes it sound like something that I should be able to defeat pretty easily. But I have certainly been beaten down by this wimp!

  • Janet_M
    Janet_M Member Posts: 500
    edited August 2013

    Pam - Nice to meet you. Sounds like you're right on track. If 2012 was your lousy year, physically and emotionally, this is about the time when you feel like you 'should' be on top of the world but end up crying in a closet. That was me last year, and I felt like the bottom was falling out of my world. I had every reason to feel happy and positive, my treatment was done and my hair was back, but I was waling around with a deep sorrow buried somewhere below my chest. More than once I broke down on a friends sofa, and I'm not much of a crier. But in retrospect, I think I truly had to fall apart in order to build myself back up again. Everything we go through is unnatural, and invasive, and steal time away from our lives. And it doesn't matter is your cancer is wimpy or aggressive, it's all the same sh*t.  The same waiting for results, living in hospital rooms, shopping for wigs, sleepless scary nights. Ugh. By the way, my sister hated the word cancer so much that she referred to it as 'canceritis'. She thought it sounded less scary, and I loved her for that.

    cfdr - Here's to fishing for compliments! In a perfect world you would be getting praised everyday for all your bravery and effort, but men don't know that. My DH (Jim) is pretty generous about telling me how fabulous I am, but if I need a compliment, I ask for it. It never used to be my style until I saw a movie called ' As Good as it Gets' with Jack Nicholson and Helen Hunt. There was a scene in a restaurant where he's be an asshole, and she stands up and says ' I need a compliment, right now', and she demands that he says something nice or she will leave.

    It was an light bulb for me, because I used to be passive, and I never thought to do that. But I believe very much that the most important thing you can do in life is 'Ask for what you Need'. And I apply that to everything. It's been really put to the test the last couple of years, and I'm still a walking psychological experiment most of the time, but I'm getting a lot better. 

    But the ladies here are proof that when it comes to feeling like you're falling apart, there is an end in sight. It's like fighting your way out of a paper bag without the tools you're used to, but you can get there. It might be a case of time, or it might be a case of finding new tools to start rebuilding. I'm a huge believer in exercise and therapy. I've always relied on exercise for my sanity and now, two months post DIEP surgery, I've really had to tone it down to the point where I'm practically comatose, but I do as much as I can because it calms my head. And therapy could be writing in a journal, or having long talks with friends. It could also be a professional therapist, but it's got to be a good one obviously. I had a hospital appointed psychiatrist who just made things worse. But if something's not working for you - or if it feels wrong - keep trying to find the thing you need. It's a deep uphill slope, and is hard to do alone, but it's worth the climb.

    Janet

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    cfdr, the comment is a little different in context.  sorry.

    I'm 63 so I suppose I'm a little more ready to "retire".  although there is much I want to do and can't.

    My daughter was born when I was 41 so I want to be "there" for her as much as I can.  

    It's not easy to accept limitations.  Even my daughter pushes too hard, doing without sleep so she can do all she wants to do.

    And if only I could sleep!!!  I was up most of last night and finally fell asleep in the morning.  My husband knocked on our daughter's door and woke me.  WHY???!!!  Sleep is how we heal!

    Luckily, although things are tight, I don't HAVE to work.  Good thing because I'm a teacher and I can't imagine being on my feet all day and handling scores of students.  That's the other part of this...being helpless in some ways.

    But again, I'm still here, and that has to be enoughf for now.

  • Timbuktu
    Timbuktu Member Posts: 1,423
    edited August 2013

    Janet, what a strange coincidence.  Or is it?  I'm in therapy and the therapist said that I'm too passive.  I've been thinking about it a lot.  It just not natural for me to ask or to demand.  I grew up being the good little girl who caused no trouble.  But my life has been tough!  So I'm trying to be more assertive.  Asking for what I need.  Ohhh is it hard!  It amazes me how hard.  Other people do it so easily, all of the time.  Like my husband!  lol  But I've been doing it and it causes tremendous anxiety but my life is so much better.  My therapist listened to me complain and complain about my husband.  It's all true.  But then he said "you allowed it".  I really wasn't sure that was true.  But I'm trying to change.  And it's a rocky road but we are making a lot of progress, I think.

    I like that idea "I need a compliment".  It's funny how movies can cut through so much.

    I just saw "Hannah Arendt".  I thought it was brilliant.  She coined the phrase "banality of evil" to describe the Nazis.  Not sure it I agree with that description or not, I do believe there is evil, but what she was saying was that most evil, most cruelty is not a result of demonic malice.  Just people who don't think an don't really care.  That hit me like a ton of bricks.  I think we can all be very cruel, not out of malice, but out of stupidity, insensitivity or cowardice.  It's made me see things a bit differently.  Not that it excuses cruelty, but it explains it in a new way.

    I also saw "Jobs".  He reminded me a lot of my husband.  Part of why I was up last night was there was a discussion about the movie.  How Jobs got all kinds of acclaim but he was not a good human being.  I want my husband to see it ASAP!  lol

  • Pam7712
    Pam7712 Member Posts: 16
    edited August 2013

    cfdr, Rockym, and Janet -- Thanks so much for your wonderful comments. I don't know what I'd do without this community of wise, supportive women!

    I'm 46 years old, and was in the best shape of my life before I was diagnosed. I was in a state of disbelief for a long time, and was so shocked by how the treatments impacted my body. I think I expected to bounce back a lot quicker -- physically and emotionally -- than I have.

    I realize now that I need to be much more patient, and give myself more time to recover. I need to give myself permission to fall apart, and then begin building myself slowly back up again. I do keep a journal, which seems to help. I also saw a counselor a handful of times when I was going through radiation. She was a good listener, but I couldn't help but feel that she really didn't understand. I think if I try that again, I'll find someone who has experience with BC survivors. Moderate exercise seems to help as well.