Anxiety
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Does anyone else get anxiety when they have to make a phone call? I need to call to make a routine doctor's appointment today, and I'm dreading it. I know that's weird, but it is what it is. Been like that for a long time. Anyone else?
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gb2115, I think that different parts of the process (of calling and scheduling, going to, or waiting to hear back from) medical appointments, is a pretty normal response for awhile after a bc diagnosis. There may even be "anniversary" anxiety that pops us years later. I am 14 years NED, and had settled into a routine with health care that didn't typically include anxiety. But when I moved back to this area, and had to re-establish care with a new provider (all mine had retired or moved), and had to refill in all my history (on those blasted forms that don't have enough space), go through it with the nurse (who was clearly unnerved as she was learning their new electronic system and entering all my info was daunting) and then my new doc (who was great, btw) I definitely experienced anxiety. And pretty significant scanxiety waiting for my mammo results. My new provider asked why I hadn't been sent for genetics testing (it was 14 years ago and wasn't as typical as now) and when I was supposed to get my foob imaged (for the life of me can't find a specific number of years written in any report). All in all, I had a pretty significant increase in my anxiety and have had to work to get it back down. Give yourself some time, gb, based on your sig line, you aren't a year out from diagnosis. I think you'll find that your anxiety around medical appointments will wane over time. gentle ((hugs))
Anyone else have anxiety when needing to call? and if so, what do you do to support/help yourself?
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Yeah, I finally made the phone call (had to leave a message but she called me back), so I have my appointment scheduled---this is for my first set of films since surgery--but it's not for a couple of months still. But now I'm second guessing whether or not I wrote the right time and date down. Of course I did, when I go over it in my mind. I wrote it down right on the day in my planner as I was talking to the doctor's office, so why would I write the wrong thing down? But in my head it's this "oh no." Ugh. Classic anxiety. Will give me something to talk with my therapist about next week I guess!!! :-) I was doing so well with my anxiety until cancer came into my life. Thanks for listening MT! I really like this thread...I feel very much less alone in the world!
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That's good to hear gb2115, that is exactly the point of the thread. Anxiety can feel like so solitary and isolating, when in reality it is a pretty common experience. When we share what works for us and what triggers us, we get to at least not feel so alone, but at best benefit from others' lessons learned.
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Dear MT,
Thanks a lot. I need to go through a round of medical investigations soon (not cancer) but because of shortness of breath after exercise which in my case might have to do with sleep apnea. It's on 26th of this month, I go for first consult followed no doubt by a round of tests. I'm practicing "I'm not there yet..." "live in the moment" but it's still bugging me...At the worst side of the spectrum, this could be pulmonary hypertension due to untreated sleep apnea. At the best, something to do with the sleep apnea. I know from experience that guessing ahead of time is useless! My therapist said "just live, you need to go on living meanwhile" but monkey mind" is right behind the corner. So I do keep myself busy, do things that I like, but...
I already have Ativan (1mg a day), so I supposed I'm just looking for something else to calm my monkey mind ... any ideas!?!
Best wishes,
Alick
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Alicki, I think that living in the moment is extremely useful. I also wonder if you've considered NOT frequenting forums like this one, which is for women who have/have had breast cancer. Reading through forums like this, will encourage you to focus on 'scary' things that are not happening in the moment. Focusing on things that might happen goes against everything living in the moment is about. Maybe this would be a good conversation with your therapist. It is hard to calm the monkey mind, but feeding it with sites like this one is almost guaranteed to make it more active. Mindfulness is the practice of being totally present. If you haven't tried, this might be helpful for you. It takes practice, but can be very beneficial. Try going to some sites that are mindfulness oriented instead and see if they provide more relief. Good luck!
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hello,
I don't come on this site all the time anymore only when I do my bi-annual checkups (last one in July-done). I lingered this time because I found your input very helpful and instructing. But you re right about checking sites, we need to be careful where we go not to fuel anxiety. Tame that wild monkey! Thanks!
Best
Alick
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Alick, I think I have to agree with MT Woman. The over 600 posts that you have made on this site, when you have not been diagnosed with breast cancer, is alarming. You need to discuss your need to come here with your counselor. Go to pinterest instead or a website for anxiety. If I did not have breast cancer, I would certainly be on pinterest or other fun hobby related website. Have you explored developing a skill or hobby that could ease your mind? Being fixated on breast cancer, when you do not have it, is not a healthy way to occupy your time.
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hello,
I'll respond to this by saying that I had a scare that lasted for 12 months because the specialist couldn't clear me in 2013-2014. 80% of those posts were made then. Aside this post, I only come here twice a year before my check ups, bi annual. Last Check up in July 2017- done.
So wont be back until check ups.
I would like to thank MT who posted this post, its the best post on anxiety that I have ever read
Bye!
Alicki
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Thanks Alicki!
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Hi, MTw, I saw where you suggested about the things at bed time. Particularly, light. I inadvertently found a source of light interfering with my sleep. The street light that I very, much appreciate at the end of my drive. It baths the whole front yard in this yellow light. Also, the bedroom. How I figured how it was affecting my sleep, is when I put the hurricane shutters up. I slept so good in the absolute dark room. Those shutters have never come down.
Thank you, for all your suggestions
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Hi Sassie, many of us are more sensitive to light than we realize. In Germany, the majority of houses have metal shutters built into the windows that totally block out all light (and quite a bit of sound). After living there for 6 years and then moving back where we don't have anything like that, I have to have black out curtains and even cover up the light coming from my alarm clock!
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New research has uncovered brain cells that become activated in response to uncertain outcomes.
We all get anxious from time to time, but what happens in the brain when this dreaded feeling looms? New research helps to answer this question.In a study of monkeys, Ilya Monosov, Ph.D., of the Departments of Neuroscience and Biomedical Engineering at Washington University in St. Louis, MO, discovered specific cells in the brain that are activated in response to anxiety.
The researcher recently published his findings in the journal Nature Communications.
In simple terms, anxiety is defined as feelings of worry, nervousness, or fear about an event or situation that could yield an unpleasant outcome, such as a job interview or an exam.
While these feelings may quickly subside for some people, others may develop anxiety disorders, wherein anxiety persists or worsens over time.
According to the Anxiety and Depression Association of America, anxiety disorders affect around 40 million adults in the United States.
Dr. Monosov believes that his new study may open the door to new treatments for anxiety disorders, after identifying a group of brain cells that play a role in anxious feelings.
Uncertainty triggers specific brain activity
Dr. Monosov came to his findings by studying the brains of rhesus monkeys, which have many brain structures similar to those of humans.
He focused on the anterior cingulate cortex (ACC) of the brain, a region in the prefrontal cortex that previous studies have shown plays a role in behaviors associated with uncertainty - a key driver of anxiety.
For his study, Dr. Monosov trained two monkeys to associate three different geometric patterns with three different outcomes. One pattern was associated with receiving an irritating puff of air in the face (representing a certain outcome), one pattern was associated with a 50-50 likelihood of getting a puff of air in the face (representing an uncertain outcome), while the third pattern was associated with no outcome.
As the monkeys were shown each geometric pattern, Dr. Monosov used MRI to measure neuronal activity in the ACC of their brains.
The researcher identified brain cells in the ACC that were activated in response to the geometric design associated with an uncertain outcome. However, when the monkeys were shown patterns associated with a certain outcome or no outcome, these brain cells showed no activity.
"We found a population of neurons that activated specifically when monkeys thought something bad or annoying - like a puff of air to the face - might be coming, but not when they knew for certain it was," explains Dr. Monosov.
Findings may fuel new treatments
In another experiment, Dr. Monosov trained the monkeys to recognize two geometric patterns associated with the certainty or possibility of receiving a sip of juice, representing a positive outcome.
The results were similar to those seen in the first experiment: when the monkeys were presented with an uncertain outcome, a specific group of brain cells in the ACC were activated. These cells were not activated when the monkeys were presented with the certain outcome.
According to Dr. Monosov, these findings not only help to explain the brain mechanisms that underlie anxiety, but they may also pave the way for new treatments for anxiety and other behavioral disorders.
"Now that we know which cells are active when an animal is faced with the uncertainty of a bad experience, we can try to disrupt the activity of these cells. It opens up avenues of research, which may one day lead to new ways to treat disorders such as anxiety and depression."
Ilya Monosov, Ph.D.0 -
great, thanks for the post! This may also be related to why mindfulness can be so effective in anxiety. Mindfulness is training the mind to just notice what is happening in the moment, without assigning judgment to it. It is the practice of observing the moment, not reflecting on the past or worrying about the future. So the "pattern" that reflects uncertainty is relegated back to just a pattern. It takes practice, but can be really helpful in decreasing anxiety. Really interesting! Thanks!
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Good explanation what mindfulness means, thx MTwoman. I'll try to remember, only notice the pattern and what's in the moment, don't assign judgment.
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Worth practicing! Can be hard to start, but you can build your mindfulness "muscles" just like others
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Oye, anxiety is the real deal for me. It sidelines me, and since beginning mammography and learning I'm high risk (frequent surveillance), its really affected me. No fun. Thank you MTWoman for the info and wisdom. I'll also add that breast screening and elevated breast cancer risk both typically start in our 40s....which is also when we often start into perimenopause and all the fun hormonal swings. Anxiety is a huge symptom of perimenopause, even for women who have never had anxiety before. So it can really be a double whammy. Awareness does help. For me, I didn't at first recognize that I was dealing with anxiety. I actually just really though that the world was ending and there was certain, impending doom around every corner. (So my first irregular mammogram call-back was a whole lot of fun...I knew it was the worst case scenario.) I still deal with anxiety....but it is at least somewhat helpful to now recognize it for what it is.
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Absolutely, Shawna! You raise a good point. For those women experiencing anxiety, it may seem "normal" or a "normal response" to what's going on. Recognizing that it is impairing your functioning is a good first step towards management. A little anxiety can be helpful; make us more alert, give us energy to 'run away from the lion' (from our evolutionary past). But when there is no lion from which to run away, it is a phone call or wait time to hear about results that floods us with fear, that's when it isn't very useful. It actually can keep us from getting our sleep, which we need for our bodies to repair themselves and our minds to be able to properly take in and process information. It can keep us from being able to distinguish between real and only perceived danger. You also raise a good point about hormonal instigators or exacerbaters of anxiety. Recognizing what is driving the anxiety is also a step in the management process. Then it takes figuring out what management techniques work best for you and practice. Thanks so much for adding your experiences to the thread!
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Hi all! I'm new to this forum, but not new to having anxiety. I was diagnosed with GAD (Generalized Anxiety Disorder) some years back and have had panic attacks off and on since I was 16 (I'm 42 now). My anxiety is definitely up right now as I'm awaiting results from a stereotactic biopsy I had done yesterday. I was glad I did think to take lorazepam (generic Ativan) before my appointment yesterday as that definitely helped. I agree that mindfulness and doing meditation do really help, for me it helps "reset" me by forcing me to take a break from all that I'm worrying about. Reading a book or playing a musical instrument can do that for me, too, as it forces much of your cognitive attention to fixate on something other than the worry/worries. Thanks to all for sharing their experiences and tips when it comes to dealing with anxiety, I know it's often not easy to talk about! Also, thanks to for posting the article. I'm always curious to learn more about what parts of the brain are involved in anxiety, etc.
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Welcome gwen! So glad you've found ways to help "reset" yourself to better manage anxiety. There is a lovely website here that goes into many of the physiological aspects of anxeity: http://www.calmclinic.com/anxiety/anxiety-brain
As far as the brain:
The National Institute of Mental Health explains:
"Several parts of the brain are key actors in the production of fear and anxiety… scientists have discovered that the amygdala and the hippocampus play significant roles in most anxiety disorders.
The amygdala is an almond-shaped structure deep in the brain that is believed to be a communications hub between the parts of the brain that process incoming sensory signals and the parts that interpret these signals. It can alert the rest of the brain that a threat is present and trigger a fear or anxiety response.
The emotional memories stored in the central part of the amygdala may play a role in anxiety disorders involving very distinct fears, such as fears of dogs, spiders, or flying. The hippocampus is the part of the brain that encodes threatening events into memories."
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MT, such treasure! Thank you for sharing your knowledge
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thanks!
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some recent anxiety journal publications:
on the positive benefits of "forest bathing" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28792445
and this lovely full text lit review on "Mindfulness in Mood and Anxiety Disorders": http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S2237-60892017005003101&lng=en&nrm=iso&tlng=en
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For those of us that think too much....
Nine Thoughts For The Thinking Person
By Richard Zwolinski, LMHC, CASAC & C.R. Zwolinski
~ 1 min readThink about the power of your thoughts and change your life.
- Change your thoughts and you change your world. —Norman Vincent Peale
- As a single footstep will not make a path on the earth, so a single thought will not make a pathway in the mind. To make a deep physical path, we walk again and again. To make a deep mental path, we must think over and over the kind of thoughts we wish to dominate our lives. — Henry David Thoreau
- The soul becomes dyed with the color of its thoughts. —Marcus Aurelius
- By verbalizing your deepest thoughts and feelings, you take them out of the realm of intangible into the realm where material and intangible meet. You begin to actually change the routes your thoughts usually take, and charter new territory. You also make space inside to listen to that still, small voice. You'll have made space to hear the answers God sends you. You and the Creator are the co-therapists, the co problem solvers, co life changers. —C.R. Zwolinski
- As the plant springs from, and could not be without, the seed, so every act of man springs from the hidden seeds of thought, and could not have appeared without them. —James Allen
- The world as we have created it is a process of our thinking. It cannot be changed without changing our thinking. —Albert Einstein
- A sick thought can devour the body's flesh more than fever or consumption. —Guy De Maupassant
- The trouble with most people is that they think with their hopes or fears or wishes rather than with their minds. —Will Durant
- The mind can't hold two thoughts at once so try replacing a negative thought with a positive one. —Rebbe Nachman of Breslov
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Thanks Marijen! The power of the mind is amazing. I really like #2 and it goes nicely with meditation or mindfulness practice. At first, when people begin trying to meditate or practice mindfulness, it can feel difficult or awkward. But continuing to practice, over and over again, and extending the time one can be quiet and just notice, is life changing.
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You're welcome MTwoman, I like this one: The soul becomes dyed with the color of its thoughts. —Marcus Aurelius
I never pictured the soul in colors, to me it's sort of a skip the words thing and imagine the best color I can. I am being stressed by three doctors that haven't gotten back to me, one who said he would call over a week ago and no reply from an email two days ago. His lack of response is keeping me from responding to a second doctor. I feel like I have to hold on to my patience, breathe deep, think different thoughts, you know? It's definitely made me anxious. I need my certainty! No such thing right?
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Yeah, certainty is an illusion. Keep breathing, but also be persistent. Call (or email) and then let it go (easier said than done, huh?). Sorry you're being stressed by the very people you are counting on to help. Big fat bummer!
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Yes that's my point exactly! And then they ask why do you feel anxious!! I'm often think about elders who are really foggy brained and not able to explain themselves clearly or remember this and that when the doctor asks. How much wrong treatment do they get. So far I can fend for myself but know it won't always be that way unless of course the bus hits me.
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