Diet and Lifestyle
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Moth, you are not odd. You remind us of values to consider, including the impact of diet on other beings and the planet. That is a good thing.
I have been struggling with my switch to almond milk and the fact that almonds use enormous amounts of water.
“California's drought-stricken Central Valley churns out 80 percent of the globe's almonds, and since each nut takes a gallon of water to produce, they account for close to 10 percent of the state's annual agricultural water use—or more than what the entire population of Los Angeles and San Francisco use in a year.“
Dietary decisions include value choices too.
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Thank you for all the info DearLife. I should schedule a checkup with my Dr to check levels. I just wonder if I’m meeting the daily requirements I need so that’s why I think supplements can be helpful at times.
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Moth I’ll get on the vegan soapbox with you anyday!!! It’s hard to hold back sometimes because I think being vegan instills a such a sense of pride.
I’m definitely a foodie. I love looking at cookbooks and making new vegan recipes!
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DearLife - the water / almond thing was a big media campaign by dairy & meat producers in California
The reality is that meat & dairy agriculture are way more water intensive industries.
just a few facts from Truth or Drought https://www.truthordrought.com/almond-milk-myths/- Almonds produced in California
- Water use: 8% of CA ag water is used to grow almonds (10% was an error spread in the media and retracted)
- Yields: CA produces a whopping 99% of US / 80% worldwide almonds
- Dairy produced in California
- Water use: 15% of CA ag water is used to grow alfalfa hay for livestock feed, used mostly for dairy, which is part of the total of 47% of California's water used for meat and dairy (note this doesn't even include the animals' drinking water or that used for sanitation, slaughter once "spent," etc.).
- Yields: CA produces just 21% of US / 1.4% of global dairy
0 - Almonds produced in California
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Warrior, I'm trying to like cooking. I have the How Not to Die cookbook from the library here right now & I've even flipped through it
Mostly I just hope someone else in my house will look at my bookmarks and make it for me LOL 0 -
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Moth - Just do the Raw Food Diet - no cooking involved!
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Thanks Moth for the info about almonds and dairy. I will stick with almond milk.
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DearLife- Don’t feel too bad about the almonds used to make almond milk...most brands only contain 2 almonds per carton.
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nonomimi - I know some raw food vegans & OMG they food prep a lot! All the chopping! Mind you some of them make amazing stuff like cashew & date 'cheesecakes' etc but it's not fast.
If I win the lottery first thing I'm doing is getting a live-in Indian cook LOL
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Moth, thanks for the article. Gorski is very thorough, as usual.
DearLife, I also came to the conclusion (pre-cancer) that the key is to eat a diet that actually provides the nutrients we need. There is no good evidence, as far as I can tell, to support taking supplements, except to correct specific deficiencies. I have also found that when you focus on nutrition (rather than calories) you typically end up eating things that also help maintain a healthy weight and you feel full and satisfied in a different way, because your body is actually getting what it needs.
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Momine - I agree about getting nutrients from food and supplements only if you can't get it from food. BTW, since you are in Greece, is there a special recipe from Ikaria that makes them one of the healthiest, longest living people on earth?
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Nonomimi, not really. Mainly it is just a combination of chill village life, physical activity and a healthy diet. The traditional Greek diet involves a lot of veggies, pulses, fish and fruit.
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just an aside... I think we discussed in the previous thread how some people misinterpret the Mediterranean diet. Some folks I know think it's going to a Greek restaurant and having tons feta on everything, deep fried seafood, full fat red meat - really anything if it's on a shish kebab skewer
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Moth, I have always wondered too about the “Mediterranean diet" after spending many evenings in Greek, Italian and Spanish restaurants (in North America). The food can be very rich, at least what I used to order lol. Likely in Europe the rich meals and bottles of wine are for special occasions, but here we often indulge too much when eating out.
There was an interesting article recently that found flaws in one of the major studies on the Mediterranean diet. It was about cardiovascular benefit, but there is commentary on the challenges of nutrition research. The full article is here.
Conclusion:
“So what should I eat?
The PREDIMED retraction isn't a total dismissal of Mediterranean eating patterns, but it's a reminder of just how difficult it is to come by clear advice on precisely what people should eat for their best health.
Layered on top of the difficulties with studying nutrition is the fact that people have very strong feelings about food — from scientists to study authors to the media — and these feelings bias the research and how it's interpreted. Food is cultural, it's social, it's about our family histories and where we grew up, and it's something we all have experience with, Allison noted. It's no wonder "people become zealots" when they talk about diet.
Despite what the zealots say, there's lots of data suggesting humans can survive — and even thrive — on myriad eating patterns. The optimal diet for any individual probably varies, but in general, you can't go wrong with lots of fruits and vegetables, little junk food, and not too many calories. If you don't smoke too much, don't drink too much, and exercise regularly, you'll probably be okay. Of courses, that's easier said than done for the vast majority of people.“
This thread and apps like Daily Dozen help me stay on course with this common sense advice. 🥦🍓🏃🏻
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Yes, Greek-American dining is not exactly the same as an actual traditional Greek diet. Also, the original study of Cretan villagers, that started the whole Med-diet thing, included the info, typically skipped over, that these people walked, on average, 7 kilometers (about 4 miles) a day (up and down mountain roads). The traditional diet also includes 180 fasting days a year. "Fasting" in the Greek scheme means no meat, fish, dairy or eggs. You can eat seafood, however.
One aspect of the traditional diet that seems to be hanging on is the eating of greens. When you go to the farmer's market there are entire stands selling only different kind of greens for boiling along with a great variety of herbs: mint, chervil, cilantro, dill, parsley, celery tops etc. Thanks to ten years of crisis, the eating of pulses has also hung on as a regular thing.
Another Greek thing is eating a variety of small dishes to make up a meal. When Greeks go out with friends, this is usually how they eat, passing the plates around to the whole table. From a nutrition standpoint, this can be a very good way of eating. A little seafood and/or fish, 4-5 different veggie dishes (including boiled greens and a raw salad), some kind of pulses etc.
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Wow, that is a lot of "fasting." I'd be willing to try a week every month or two or three of that kind of fasting, or go completely vegan for that week, which may be simpler. The Greek diet sounds similar to the Okinawan one (another place full of centenarians) with veggies, tofu, fish and fruit. Rice doesn't seem to hurt them, maybe because they consciously eat 20% less calories than they normally would to feel full.
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Heidihill, most people do not keep all the fasting days, but in the villages, they probably observe many of them. The most important fasting periods are Lent (all 40 days), a month (I think) before Christmas and a couple of weeks before the Dormition of the Virgin in August. The thing is that Greek fasting really isn't onerous. Because of this tradition, the standard kitchen includes numerous veggie dishes, and once you add shrimp, mussels and calamari the choices add up. This is also why vegetarians are usually pleasantly surprised when traveling in Greece. If you eat in traditional restaurants, you can usually find a selection of things to eat on the regular menu, and nobody finds it odd if you eat a meal without meat.
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how much fruit do you eat? It's so healthy but has a lot of carbs and sugar.
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for fruit, I go by Dr Greger's daily dozen: 4 servings of fruit, of which at least 1 serving is berries.
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Thanks for all the information. Do any of you have documentaries that you like? One of the first for me was forks over knives. I also watched "sugar coated" (no longer on nextflix) but I wish it still was. I found it very informative. Those two films changed the way I look at the grocery store forever. I just watched the pbs "In defense of food" and liked that one as well. Some of the others have been so so.
There was a news story this morning about estrogen and dementia. Cancer really puts some of us between a rock and a hard place with the estrogen suppression, but it was applicable to anyone in menopause. There was a book by the doctor involved in the study "Brain Food" by Lisa Mosconi. I'm thinking about getting it. I just had to do a total hysterectomy so it seems like now I'm seeing all kinds of things about lack of estrogen and health.
Warrior glad you liked the article. I liked that even if you had some extra pounds the exercise and fruit/veggies were the important factor, not your current weight.
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Nonomimi, I eat almost no fruit. Mainly because I don’t like most fruits (too sweet and many smell like soap to me). I do love berries, but they are not available where I live, and when I find frozen ones they are incredibly expensive. I do use a lot of lemon for salads and I eat green apples,when I remember to buy them.
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Nonomimi, I just went to check on how much fruit was ok (because I remembered reading that there's no limit—which is good, because I like fruit!) and according to Dr. Gregor, it's pretty much open. Here's the article where he directly addresses the question.
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Moth - I don't really like cooking, either. I look for short cuts and tend to eat the same things routinely.
I drink almond milk, and we often eat meatless meals for dinner and my lunches. My new thing is time-restricted eating - eating only during the hours of 9am-7pm. The only problem I run into is with vacations when my schedule is not in my control.
I also tried black rice for the first time. It's good! It is loaded with anthocyanins.https://www.prevention.com/food-nutrition/healthy-...
As far as supplements go and vitamin deficiencies, I don't have a doctor who will check my vitamin levels. I consulted one naturopath, but I got the impression that she had a program and she didn't deviate from it. The part that turned me off the most was she couldn't even begin to tell me how much all of it was going to cost. My instinct told me to walk away.
I am still trying to develop a routine for nutrition, exercise (trying to increase intensity and add in yoga/pilates), stress management etc. Hoping that with a routine, all this stuff will become automatic. So there's hope because when I first thought about time-restricted eating, I scoffed and felt there was no way. Then I tried it and found it difficult to exercise on an empty stomach. But I kept trying and it slowly got easier, and now it's routine.
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Chelseasculler - thank you for the article.
I was eating all the fruit I wanted, but I think I am going to limit it to mostly berries and keep the carb count lower until I reach my ideal weight. I see members being recommended by their Drs to do the keto diet. Which is similar to what I am already doing minus fruit. I guess I have to eat more veggies
I am on the road and can't remember if this thread already discussed the keto. Sorry if you did.Restricted ketogenic diet: As mentioned earlier, a ketogenic diet can be an effective weapon against cancer. To do this, you need to be on a restricted ketogenic diet. By restricting your carbohydrate and calorie intake, your body loses glycogen and starts producing ketones that your healthy cells can use as energy. Because cancer cells cannot use these ketones, they starve to death.1
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driving from southern CA to northern CA through drought stricken Central Valley. This is Dry grass, not sand.
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CCNC- I liked What the Health in Netflix. It’s a good one. All the side effects of trying to control our hormones concerns me so much. I go back on forth on hormone therapies.....
GoKale- black rice! I’ve never tried that either. Very interesting.
Nono- I hope you enjoy your trip!!! Keto’s been in and out of the discussion and I think we can all agree about limiting the sugar in our diets.
As for fruit- maybe you guys can relate,I’ve realized that I don’t even come close to eating an over abundance of it. When I first started limiting carbs, I thought I might have to limit fruit but when I calculated my daily intake, I don’t come close to, what’s the daily recommendations- is it 5 servings so 5 cups?? I think I eat maybe 2 cups a day. I eat often but I guess I just don’t eat that much. I’m a snackaholic 😉
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CCNC and Warrior thanks for the great documentary suggestions! I buy DVDs for our local volunteer library and found several on Amazon: Forks over Knives, What the Health and In Defense of Food. We have lots of food conscious patrons and people without netflix so they are now on my order list.
Chelsea, I love fruit too so I am glad there is no real limit.
Nonomimi It looks tinder dry there. Scary. Beautiful blue sky though. Our island is rocky and very dry in summer so we worry about fires. Diet choices are related to environment too, from water use to impact of shipping from distant places. More reasons to shop at your local farmers market and freeze the surplus.
GoKale I like restricted eating too. It means I have breakfast later than my DH, but a small change to make.
My mother used to say you should go to bed a bit hungry to lose weight and early dinner plus no night time snacks works for that.
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Hi, guys. Just wanted to say that I was on Dukane diet for years. It's very similar to Keto diet, but with less fat. Still got cancer. Tried Keto diet as well, couldn't stay on it. My body was fighting all the fat I was supposed to eat. I was constantly nauseous. That said, I still cook some Keto dishes that include veggies, but half the amount of fat in the recipe. Now post diagnosis I am trying Mediterranean diet and so far I am loving it. That is, I will return to loving it once my taste buds come back
This thread is extremely useful. Glad to have found it.
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