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The Metabolic Approach in Conjunction with Standard of Care

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Comments

  • santabarbarian
    santabarbarian Member Posts: 2,310
    edited October 2021

    I did a lot of this when I had chemo. I did fasting mimicking diet for 5 days with chemo on day 3. No SEs other than fatigue/anemia by the latter chemos.

    My 3 week chemo cycle:

    -Fasting Mimicking Diet (Dr Valter Longo) - 5 days (chemo the middle day -1200 cal day one, then 800 for four days

    -Rebuild (*carbs essential!) after fasting - 5 or 6 days

    -Low carb /edge of keto - 10 or 11 days (Whole Foods, mostly vegetarian, a little quinoa and sweet potato, plus a bit of dairy, egg, and fish. Avocado & nuts, olive & coconut for fats. You can check you are at edge of keto with strips that read ketones in urine.


    Did High dose C, Hyperbaric Oxygen, Metformin, Melatonin, D3, Fish Oil, curcumin and a ton of supplements (mostly plant based antioxidants- if anyone cares it's in TNBC forum pinned thread "Success stories" page 6). I worked w Dr Keith Block of The Block Center in Skokie Ill but did my consult remotely and was treated at home. He had me doing interval training on the morning of chemo too. Integrative Oncologist.

    Now, 3 years after treatment, I still do intermittent fasting and a FMD every few months on top of that. I have given myself a 6 month break on supplements to see where I am and will get a blood test for D3 etc when I next go in to see how my body is functioning and restart things if needed.

    I feel really good, no pain, no ache and think that it is the close-to-vegan diet and regular hiking and pilates, plus intermittent fasting. Once you have lost the weight or beaten cancer *whole food* carbs, like above, or flax seed, or almond flour are (IMO) fine. Low glycemic index fruits are healthy too. "Nutrient Dense" is a good rule.






  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited November 2021

    wavesofharmony - Thank you for those links. I've looked into the Y near me, and will start a program to help with my affected arm. I've been losing some weight, so that has helped too, but it makes so much sense to be NOT babying that arm and using it like I should.

  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited November 2021

    Do any of you on Keto have an app to help you?


    Editing to add: what about meal plans like HelloFresh? Are there those kind of plans that work?

  • simone60
    simone60 Member Posts: 952
    edited November 2021

    Homemom, I use Cronometer. I like it because it allows me to track the percentages of type of fat I am consuming. It's also free.

  • salamandra
    salamandra Member Posts: 735
    edited November 2021

    Homemom, I also use Cronometer when I'm tracking (which I need to get back to), and the Keto subreddit for support/motivation/community

  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited November 2021

    Thanks Salamandra and Simon. I'll check it out!

  • wavesofharmony
    wavesofharmony Member Posts: 106
    edited November 2021

    HomeMom,

    I will add my voice to those using Cronometer. There can be a little learning curve but once you use it and have information on things you use often, it gets much easier. It also givers you lots of good feedback.

    For setting up macros for constructing your meals we have found the site (not an app) that Ruled.me is good. You can customize it for your own situation

  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited November 2021

    Thank you waves - I'll explore all of this now Smile

  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited November 2021

    Just would like to get feedback on this website I ran across while googling : The Keto Diet


    One downside to the ketogenic diet for weight loss is that it's difficult to maintain. "Studies show that weight loss results from being on a low-carb diet for more than 12 months tend to be the same as being on a normal, healthy diet," says Mattinson. While you may be eating more satiating fats (like peanut butter, regular butter, or avocado), you're also way more limited in what's allowed on the diet, which can make everyday situations, like eating dinner with family or going out with friends, far more difficult. Because people often find it tough to sustain, it's easy to rely on it as a short-term diet rather than a long-term lifestyle.

  • wavesofharmony
    wavesofharmony Member Posts: 106
    edited November 2021

    Home Mom,

    I find it interesting that “research” shows that low carb eating is hard to sustain and that you are so limited in what you eat. Yes, there are things you avoid (and peanut butter you mentioned is one of the things we avoid not because of low carb but because of other issues with peanuts being very prone to contamination with mold) but in the 6-7 years we have been doing this, I have NEVER felt deprived. Over that time I have gradually lost excess weight and body fat and feel so much better. And I continued to lose some weight and excess body fat even after the introduction of hormone suppression medication that for most women cause them to gain weight.It can make going out to restaurants more challenging but we have learned how to navigate that with few issues.

    There are many detractors of low carb eating and when they begin citing research and people’s experiences of losing then gaining weight, I would put money down that most of those situations included people who did extreme versions of that way of eating and were not concerned about eating good quality food (“dirty keto”).

  • salamandra
    salamandra Member Posts: 735
    edited November 2021

    "Studies show that weight loss results from being on a low-carb diet for more than 12 months tend to be the same as being on a normal, healthy diet," says Mattinson.

    First of all, this is weird to be contrasting a low-carb diet with a "normal, healthy diet".

    Second of all, I suspect that many of us who turn to keto did not have the easiest time staying on a "normal, healthy diet." ***

    Yes, the problem with all diets is that people can't sustain them, and whenever they go off the diet, they gain the weight back. For some of us, it's a lot easier to sustain a healthy low-carb diet than a healthy medium or high carb diet.

    This could be flipped: "a normal, healthy diet" is not resulting in better long term weight results for people than low-carb diets are. If a person feels good and is able to maintain their desired weight on keto, there is no reason to second guess it.

    Then I wonder what she means by "normal, healthy". As far as I know, the only diet besides keto that has some decent research behind it is the Mediterranean diet, which can mean many different things and actually *can* be done low carb. But I don't think many Americans would register a Mediterranean diet as "normal" and it would still result in significant restriction for most people.

    In general, nutritional science isn't the greatest. Evidence for low-carb is promising and positive, but still emerging. In the end I think at some level you have to go with how do you feel. If you feel miserable on a diet, it's not working for you no matter how many other people it might work for. If you feel good on it (and it's working for your health or weight goals), well even according to this website, it seems like there's no reason to stop.


    ** It's me. Sometimes in my life I can maintain my weight without trying too hard and just eating what people are eating around me, but if I'm at all stressed or struggling, that goes right out the window. Even when I eat "healthy" foods, the quantities are out of whack, and how much pasta does a person need, even if it is whole wheat. And the cravings for the non-healthy 'normal' foods get quite strong. The restriction of keto actually helps me use less willpower on food tbh

  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited November 2021

    Thanks for the responses! It's good to get as knowledgeable as possible before I start this. Right now I'll finish this plan diet I'm on (I've lost 17+lbs) and then I'm going to start Keto.

    Question: Why is it difficult when eating out? Right now I just make sure I have a lean protein with veggies Ex : A veggie burger w/o the bun and a side salad.

    Also, did you find easy recipes on Pinterest? Are there any I should look out for as "dirty keto"? LOL


    Looks like I'll be on AI for another 3 years and I have had trouble losing weight for the first time in my life while on it, so this looks like a great option

  • wavesofharmony
    wavesofharmony Member Posts: 106
    edited November 2021
  • homemom
    homemom Member Posts: 830
    edited December 2021

    I go off my Optavia diet in the next couple of days. What are recipe samples that you all love to make for each meal?? I don't want to make the same mistake I made last time

  • wavesofharmony
    wavesofharmony Member Posts: 106
    edited December 2021

    Good morning!

    I have been absent for a bit and wanted to explain about a new development in my journey.

    Back in August I saw my Oncology Team for regular monitoring and all looked great. So, the decision was made to start spacing out how closely they were watching me. That was freeing!

    As we headed into the fall I began to experience very subtle, vague neurological symptoms. Coordination and a little lack of awareness on my left side (hand and foot). As a former speech pathologist I know enough neurology to assess myself for deficits of things like a stroke, etc. I have always had some compression issues with my neck, so I started some adjustments with the chiropractor. I got a little relief but the issues didn’t resolve.
    The next line of investigation came through my oncologist. They ordered scans and an MRI. The scans showed no disease burden in my body but the MRI showed a nice size tumor in my brain. Interestingly, when the neurologist in the ER was assessing me, she said that if she hadn’t seen the tumor in my brain she would have given me a normal neurological assessment.

    The upshot is I had the tumor removed on Dec 6th. Fortunately for me, I am being treated at one of the best cancer hospitals where they also develop and research the best techniques. The process they used with me included a targeted dose of radiation to the tumor followed by removal. This process kills the live cancer cells before they even touch the tumor. This makes removal easier and safer.

    I came home on the 8th and am working on building back my strength and coordination. I cannot even begin to fathom how difficult this would be if I had not had a degree of fitness behind me! I have already thanked my trainer for the years of sit-to-stand squats…always one of my least favorite things to do but now I am grateful for the muscle memory!

    I will check in again but Ijust wanted to share my experience.

  • norcals
    norcals Member Posts: 206
    edited December 2021

    Wavesofharmony,

    Thank goodness your MO ordered the MRI and that you had enough knowledge to seek help. I’m glad the surgery went well, and I hope that your recovery goes smoothly.


  • moth
    moth Member Posts: 3,293
    edited December 2021

    Wavesofharmony, sorry to hear you've been dealing with this issue!

    Is it a breast cancer met or a new primary or a benign lesion?

    I wish you strength in your post op recovery

  • wavesofharmony
    wavesofharmony Member Posts: 106
    edited December 2021

    the tumor is consistent with a breast cancer metastasis. In the 2 years since my diagnosis no one ever looked in my brain because there were never any symptoms or suggestion that something was going on there. For all intent and purpose it looked like my cancer started in the breast and spread to my spine/pelvis. This was probably something brewing in my body for many years but because of nutrition and lifestyle there weren’t obvious symptoms. As for the tumor that is no longer in my brain I suspect it was also there for a while. I read something that said these things can take 5 years to develop. It was fairly large but not fast growing, and again I didn’t have any “classic” symptoms there was anything going on in my brain…no headaches, seizures, that kind of thing.

    When I spoke with my MO last night, he said my neurosurgeon is one of the best on the planet, especially for great outcomes. They feel like they got everything so my job now is to retrain my brain to work as well as possible. I have been doing some simple things here at home and begin formal therapy Thursday. Hopefully that answers your questions.

  • moth
    moth Member Posts: 3,293
    edited December 2021

    wavesofharmony, just wanted to let you know there's a fairly active Brain Mets sisters thread here & lots of people who've had surgery/gamma knife/ WBR and have recovery experiences so you may want to share there as well https://community.breastcancer.org/forum/8/topics/...

  • lillyishere
    lillyishere Member Posts: 770
    edited December 2021

    Thank you for sharing your story wavesofharmony. I hope you are feeling better.

  • wavesofharmony
    wavesofharmony Member Posts: 106
    edited December 2021

    moth,

    Thanks for the heads up. I have joined the thread.

  • marciam
    marciam Member Posts: 83
    edited December 2021

    Dearest ;

    I would rather suggest a Whole Foods plant based diet as the research by forks over knives physicians agree that plant based can reverse all known types of disease . ive had a brain tumor due to MBC and have been clear now 10 years .
    the diet seems to prevent a recurrence 🥗 the research in the study backed up their conclusions.

    You can also eat less gluten and avoid carbs that way while remaining plant based . That takes care of cholesterol and heart disease . I’ve written a whole good plant based diet cook book just for MBC survival.
    Please send me an email if you are interested.

    Waves if harmony get in touch if you need Suoport for that brain tumor . I had a brain surgery and rads to remove residual tumor . You’re not the same but you can regain some function . Movement function in right hand Is lost however !

    Blessings to you all

    Marcia

  • karistx
    karistx Member Posts: 1
    edited April 2022

    Has anyones integrative doctor recommended high dose vitamin C in conjunction with there standard protocols? Oh and supplements lots of them, I can find the names.

  • moderators
    moderators Posts: 7,884
    edited April 2022

    Hi karistx and welcome, You may find some of these resources a helpful place to start: Complementary Medicine Resource Guide, Dietary Supplements, Suggestions for using Dietary Supplements.

    We don't have any specific on high dose vitamin C. As you know, taking dietary supplements requires that you do some homework, especially if you're getting breast cancer treatment. Before you take anything, make sure you talk to your doctor about what you would like to take and discuss all the risks and benefits.

    Interested to hear what others have decided.