Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?
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All the Museum of the Bible's Dead Sea Scrolls are Forgeries
So not only did they fund terrorists, they did it for fake artifacts. Somehow, that's so very appropriate.
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So, scrolls as fake as the stories they tell. How perfect.
That being said, I saw the traveling exhibit of the parchment texts. As someone interested in many historical periods, it was a fascinating exhibit. And seeing some of the translations of phrases I remembered from my childhood did send chills up my back - that would have happened no matter the content, if it was something I was familiar with. I remember the exhibit as being un-preachy, with an emphasis on the scraps as historical artifacts rather than proof of anything beyond the fact that the Bible exists, not that it's true.
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Wrenn - That book you cited sounds like a real interesting read. I too have heard of various "Jesus like" figures from throughout history, across cultures, etc. Many of the same themes are noted around these figures, e.g. they died and will come again, they "walked among the people", etc. I seem to remember an old PBS show here, featuring Joseph Campbell (raised a Catholic). He might have been an anthropologist. He discussed much of this sort of thing on that PBS special. He was a student or follower if you will, of Carl Jung, who also pointed out some of these kinds of things in his writings. I read some of Jung too many, many years ago, and he suggests that there is a basic need in the human psyche that religion fills, and that these various religious systems have commonalities that all "sooth the psychic soul" so to speak. Jung was the son of a Lutheran clergyman.
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threetree" "The Hero With The Thousand Faces" Joseph Campbell -- I think that was the title There was also a book called "The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross"...... drugs, visions and religion. I have always liked the idea of The Collective Consciousness.
I find the intersecting between religious myths and stories of The Quest from Jason and the Argonauts to Lord of The Rings fascinating.
Christianity just grabbed stuff from old religions and hobbled them together to make the "new" religion palatable. The Goddess Ostara, so goes the story, found a bird freezing in the cold of winter. She turned it into a hare so it could make a burrow in the ground and survive the winter. In Spring (March 21) , the hare returned and laid coloured eggs at her feet. Hello? It is a story of death and resurrection. As for the Easter bunny..............................
Then there is the wandering in the wastelands without food or water and having visions. Ask any medical person what happens to your brain deprived of sleep, food or water. There was a radio personality who decided to stay on the air as long as he could without sleeping. They intervened when he started to interview the little being who lived in his watch. Maybe 2,000 years ago it would have been a vision of an angel or God.
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We saw the Dead Sea Scrolls traveling exhibit too! It was fascinating. One of the things that surprised me was how they put the scrolls in historical context. There was a lot of Astarte worship done in the homes, even if Yahweh was getting all the attention in the temples.
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Miriandra, I can't get over how Christians claim there's only one god (theirs, of course) when their own Bible mentions other ones - and quotes their god as being all pissy jealous of the others. It's full of contradictions.
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I dislike any kind of dogma or doctrine. The Dead Sea Scrolls are interesting as an artifact but sure the Hell don't prove anything other than a bunch of people deciding to believe in "something"
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Wrenn, I remember your mentioning how you remained a virgin for months after being married. That is a hell of an oppressive upbringing to grow up in. Was your husband understanding about it or frustrated? Too many fathers are pervertedly concerned about their daughters having sex, yet it is the reason they themselves have daughters in the first place! Makes no sense. Plus the double standard. It’s okay if men have sex and enjoy it but they do not want women to experience the same kind of pleasure. So much about sex and having sexual feelings is shamed and classified as dirty and disgusting. Why? Religion is so controlling yet many do not see that.
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WOW! the last few posts are so powerful!
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Elderberry - I checked on Amazon about Joseph Campbell books, and the PBS series I remember seeing so many years ago was called the "Power of Myth", and it was done with Bill Moyers, in relation to Campbell's book of the same name. Looks like the "Hero With a Thousand Faces" that you mentioned is a whole collected works of Joseph Campbell. I never knew that existed. I just remember finding the PBS show fascinating. I've always found religion to be very "academically" interesting. As I've said many times on this thread though, I wouldn't really call myself an atheist. I can change by the hour from "believer" to "agnostic" to "atheist" and I think there is a lot that happens in our lives that supports all 3. I do think that like Carl Jung said, religion does offer some definite comfort to the human psyche and offers a "schemata" if you will, that allows us to explain and understand the "not understandable" in certain ways. I think all religions throughout history have attempted to do this in one way or another, and that they all really seek the same basic thing, i.e. to explain the unexplainable and to bring comfort to a given population or culture to not give up hope, because good things might yet be in store.
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Wrenn, I totally agree that physics will probably have the ultimate answers one of these days. I think the "truth" lies in physics. I think it would be quite possible to equate the negative and destructive forces of the universe to "the devil" and the good, creative forces in the universe to God or Jesus or whatever/whoever. Any reality there in physics would be a lot more complex than that, but just as a basic idea, that's what I'm thinking.
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There is a line from a song by "Goose Creek Symphony" -- I live by it.(bad grammar!) "Don't go buying no one's answers, when your question was for free"
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That's an interesting one, Elderberry.
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I was raised by two parents who chose atheism at a young age. they were adamant about not having their children have any religious upbringing. I only know people who have rejected the religion they grew up with- so feel ignorant in a way. when I had kids I wondered if I should have introduced them to some religion so they could then reject it. I assigned it to my DH who tried a little with our first- she rejected it at 6 or 7 and my husband agreed- the other two got nothing.
thoughts on this?
I have dabbled in Buddhism and have a sense of spiritual support from many sources - I like to hear when people get a sense of community from their religion- too often I hear the opposite though. All my college roommates were lapsed catholics.
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Kind off topic but I recently went to a memorial for a friend that passed away. It was in a nondenominal church, the minister did not know our friend. Everything started out ok....his children spoke and people shared memories. After that the minister went into this 45 minute rant about vaccines killing people. I thought (and I'm sure I wasn't alone) HOW inappropriate! (his death had nothing to do with vaccines). Sad how you can't even in a church get away from politics.
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kidi919 - How awful of that guy! Inexcusable, and I totally agree with you that it was totally inappropriate, along with the fact that vaccines had nothing to do with your friend. Politics have a place, but a funeral at a church is not the place. That minister owes your friend's family one big apology, and even that wouldn't undo the crassness and thoughtlessness of it all. The family and friends will have to remember that always, when they think of the poor man who died.
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kidi919: I probably would have made a scene halfway into his rant. Politics and BS have no place at a memorial. It should be a celebration of the life of the deceased not some tirade.
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kidi, I agree with everyone here. The minister was sooo completely out of line. Especially to go on that long about vaccines. Why would that even be on the forefront of anyone's mind these days? Too bad the minister cannot be fired. A funeral is absolutely no place for any kind of rant. I don't like that he took advantage of having a captive audience to spew his political point of view. Some people may have wanted to object, but out of respectful for the grieving family, they kept quiet. The minister abused his position of presiding over the funeral in order to preach his own personal politics. It's disgusting and to me, very unChristian-like.
Your story reminded me of when my husband's uncle passed away a couple of years ago. Both the viewing and service were held at his church just outside of town. A husband and wife couple who dh and I know stopped to pay their respects and as we sat in the pews having small conversation, the wife started going on and on seemingly endorsing the latest news at the time about Mexican children at the U.S. border who were being kept in cages. I couldn't even believe she was talking about it. At the time, I was still very horrible about enforcing personal boundaries, so I didn't speak up to indicate I was offended by her insensitivity and total inappropriate discussion at a funeral, and my husband didn't say anything, either. These days, having been working on boundaries for several years, I would totally call her out or walk away. But the wife was supposedly “Miss Christianity" I guess nothing says Christian like “them Mexican kids deserve to be in cages", right? !!!
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How awful kidi919.
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Too many Christians live by the belief that they should never pass up the opportunity to show how horrible they are. Or, as I saw on a FB comment this morning, "Ain't no hate like Christian love."
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That Facebook comment is hilarious, Alice. (Not to diminish the seriousness of this memorial fiasco.)
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Can I say "amen" . spookiesmom? :-)
Sad to hear about Jimmie Carter. Whatever his politics were, or his performance as a president (I leave that for the other thread) he was a man who lived his Christian belief. He was kind. He as modest. He helped build homes for the poor. Good works. Too bad so many only profess and yet do so little
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Agree elderberry. Jimmy Carter, along with his volunteers built 157 homes for Habitat for Humanity.
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Saw this and had to share.
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You're right Way too good not to share.
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Ha ha. Gotta love that one!
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!!!
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Ooh, brilliant!
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So true!!!
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