natural girls
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Virve - Great information on the thermograph! I will have to look into that. Also, did you get a blood test or a saliva test to measure your hormones? Dr. John Lee and others state that the saliva test is the only test where you get true readings but most doctors do not offer it.
My nutritionist told me that she did not think I was metabolizing my estrogen too. However, I have never had a hormone test and would like one done so I can customize my approach to this balancing act.
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Lisa, you are SO LUCKY. I wish someone would have suggested MRI for me!!!
Grace61, I am your sister. Smashing my dense boobs with mammograms for 10 years while a huge thing was growing. It makes me crazy to think if somebody had suggested the MRI, well, it could have been a whole different thing...
Grace, it's a good thing....
Spring.
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this really has nothing to do with this thread but I'm making a couple rhubarb pies tonite.. I've a ton of rhubard.. wish i could give you all a slice. (amazing what a little butter and sugar will do to make anything taste great)
-apple who can't be super healthy ALL of the time
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Just to warn...MRIs are great but I had 3 false positives and 1 real positive. It picked up a tumor that was only 4 mm. But I ended up with 4 excisional biopsies--3 not needed. So do not panic if they see alot going on....it is true that until they biopsy, they may not be able to be sure.
All the best.
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Yes, MRI's can give more false positives, but I would rather have biopsies that come back negative than to have a tumor growing that is cancer. The cost is the other reason they don't recommend them. But for anybody with dense breasts and family history...you can bet I would fight for one!
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Lisa, you say that unfortunatelly MRI found your cancer, which was only 7mm. I say it is fortunate it found it then. It was already there, MRI just alerted you. Here is to MRIs.
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Vivre,
Jorge Flechas, MD, is one of the best known iodine doctors in the world. This is his web site:
http://cypress.he.net/~bigmacnc/drflechas/index.htm
He does the iodine tests and patient consultations for for the Iodine Investigation Project.
Anom
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Thanks Anom
I did do the test through bcchoices. I will call Dr. Flechas tomorrow. My doctor did seem to feel that she was not happy with the lab bcchoices uses. She says that after taking high doses of iodine supplements, she has seen follow up tests with the exact same numbers. So I will ask him about this. I will let you knowwhat he says.
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Hi Grace,
I just want to also say that I think getting an MRI is a good idea. For the five years preceding my diagnosis (last fall) I had a number of MRIs. My breasts were very dense. My mammograms were hard to read and I always had to have a sonogram after my mammogram. I always felt better when my doctor requested an MRI, as well. In the fall, when I was diagnosed with DCIS, it was actually seen on my mammogram film, and was not detected by sonogram. I've had numerous biopsies, and that was the first time anything was seen on my mammogram and was not at all detected on the sonogram. Even though I had decided on a bilateral mastectomy, my surgeon thought it would be a good idea for me to have an MRI prior to the surgery. My biopsy report (prior to my mastecomy) indicated that the cancer went to the margin, so we had no idea how large the cancerous area really was. My surgeon wanted to see if we could get a better idea of the size of the cancerous area, and to see if there was anything going on in my other breast--that way there wouldn't be any surprises on the day of my mastectomy. I was all for the MRI (an easy test for me, except I hate having to get an IV!), and I was so glad that I had it done prior to having the mastectomy, as the results helped put my mind at ease. The MRI results were benign, which meant that my surgeon basically removed it all on the day of the biopsy. My final pathology report (after my mastectomy) reflected the same--no cancer. Thankfully, the area of DCIS was only about 4 mm. I think high risk women and women with dense breasts should have regularly scheduled MRIs. I know the issue with MRIs is false positives, but as Lisa said, I'd rather have a false positive and have a biopsy than have a false negative where the cancer is missed. Best of luck.
Audrey
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Grace,
I had an MRI after my 2 mammos and 2 ultrasounds (6 months apart....they were sure it wasn't cancer) and a biopsy that confirmed a 2cm tumor......my surgeon ordered the MRI to look at both breasts and found that I had 3 other small spots on the affected breast which led me to have a mastectomy instead of lumpectomy. The spots ended up being benign but I am still glad I had the MRI...it confirmed my decision to have the mast instead of the lump because I didn't want to revisit this disease again.I think that all women especially women who opt for lumpectomy should have the MRI before but definitely after surgery to make sure there were no other suspicious areas.....
Good luck!
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Accidental...yes, I know it was a good thing that the MRI found it. I meant that unfortunately I had cancer. I tell all women who have dense breasts to push for MRI's.
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Rosemary--Thank you for your info. on making my own DIM by juicing. I don't have a juice machine, though I've been thinking of getting one. I do eat cruciferous veggies every day (thankfully I love broccoli, cauliflower, and red cabbage!), but I remember reading an article a few years back (when I was trying to prevent breast cancer) indicating that the amount of cruciferous vegetables that you'd have to eat on a daily basis was something like a pound, in order to reap the benefits (i.e., prevention of breast cancer). More recent studies seem to indicate that a lot less than that can be helpful for breast cancer prevention, but I guess I feel that taking the DIM supplement, in addition to eating the cruciferous vegetables, is like having a little more "insurance"! As far as flax is concerned--I know a lot of people think it's really great, but my oncologist recommended that I stay away from it, so I don't eat it.
Makingway--my screen name comes from the names of two of my cats--Soap and Snuggles. Soap was the mushiest, sweetest cat and was always on my lap. Unfortunately, he died of leukemia when he was only three. Thankfully, Snuggles was not infected, and I still have her--she's a sweetheart, too!
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HI Everyone,I find myself struggling for the words to express my gratitude and admiration for everyone here. Gratitude for taking the time to respond to me, and admiration for being strong and caring enough to reach out and do so. I have already met a women with BC who is afraid to talk about it and feels "it is better to just not think about it." I respect her position but if each of us felt this way, I for one would still be struggling and waiting for my docs to educate me. It would be a long, long wait.
After reading your posts and armed with a bit of much needed knowledge, I contacted my surgeon to inquire about the Breast Therm. She said it is FDA approved and cost effective (MRI is around $2,600 Therm is approx. $200) but it is still "experimental". She said she did not understand why it was not being used more..possibly the MRI folks had more marketing or influence...She was encouraging and said she would be interested to see how the results correlate with the MRI and Mammogram but she would not use it to make a recommendation. I understood that to mean that since my HMO does not provide it nor contract it, she would not be able to justify using it openly.
I found 2 locations near my home that do the Therm but they have not called me back and I don't know how long it will take to get an appointment. My surgery is scheduled on the 18th and may need to be postponed due to the MRI.
My question to all of you is "Would you postpone the surgery for a week or so in order to have the Breast Therm done?" If I can be seen this week and also have the MRI that would be fantastic and I would feel more confident about my choices but I don't have appointments for either at this point. Just a thought...
As always,
Grace
"Life without you is an up hill task, a barefoot walk in hot sand...."
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Vivre, I had done the iodine loading and had a follow-up with Dr. Flechas, Thank God he is there B/c my Onc and GP had no idea how to advise me about my iodine loading results. Dr. Flechas told me what to do, exaclty. I am so glad.
Lisa, I agree about fighting for MRIs. I have told all my friends and one has fought and got insurance to pay for her, and her Dr. will order one now every year. I had a huge thing growing there, over 5CM for who knows how long. Luckily no nodes were involved (apparently it was a big, stupid pig of a tumor that was lazy) but I did have vascular invasion. MRIs are expensive. Medical professionals will go on about how it gives false positives to try to disuade. But those with dense breasts, which is nearly every woman under the age of menopause, should really consider this. Tell your friends!
If that Thermal thing or something, could be as good as an MRI, then we'd really have something. We need another technology that is as sensitive as MRI, or even better, and is not as expensive. I have "met" so many women on this board who got cancer that was overlooked from dense breasts. I also know of one woman whose cancer was caught at DCIS, and she avoided a lot of treatment, and doesn't have to worry about invasive.
Spring.
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Grace-it was great to hear that they are finally becoming more accepting of thermography. It has been around for decades and has gotten better. The reason it is not used routinely is because it was put into a study against mammos many years ago. The techs who read the therms were inexperienced and did not catch as many tumors, so they decided that mammos were better. Since hospitals already had a lot of money invested in the mammo machines, and since they could charge a lot more for them, mammo's won. Now if a man had to get his parts smashed into a machine and radiated, what do you think the decision would be???? I have had 2 therms done and I will never have a mammo again. But keep in mind, they are only as good as the person who interprets it. But my lump was missed on a mammo, I felt it, so I have no faith there. What I like about the therms, besides that they are cheap, is that I feel safe using them, and I will not put off having the test done more often. They are painless and do not expose me to any more radiation. There are studies that say mammos actually cause cancer. If the therm shows something suspicious, I will ask for an ultrasound. If that is suspicious, I will do a biopsy, and if the biopsy is pos. I will then do an MRI. That is the order I did it before anyway. I know the waiting is horrible. I remember all too well, how much I was walking in that thick fog, just wanting to get it all over with as quickly as possible. But pat yourself on the back, because you are way ahead of me. At least you are asking questions. I just did whatever my doctors said. You are doing the right thing by questioning everything. Keep doing that and then just go with your gut. Female intuition is very powerful and if we listen to that little voice in our heads, we will do what is the right thing. When I finally started to do that, I finally began to heal emotionally. That part was much harder than the physical part. I still wish I had never done rads, but I have finally stopped obsessing over it. In my, case, the surgeon got everything out with clear margins, and I had no nodes, so I still do not see why I had to do rads. I was an emotional wreck through the whole thing, but it did force me out to walk everyday. My walks helped me to figure it all out. Time really does heal all wounds. We are here for you when you need us. In the meantime, eat only healthy things, take lots of supplements and walk everyday. It will make you stronger. And make sure you have a great surgeon. A good surgeon is the key because they are the only ones who can get rid of the cancer. But you can shrink it before surgery. My tumor went from 1.8 to 1.6 in the three weeks before surgery. I attribute it to totally changing my regime. Again, it was just my intuition telling me to eat better and exercise, but when they took it out and it was smaller than all the diagnostic tests showed, I felt encouraged that I really could do something. It was empowering.
Sorry for the long blah blah. Have a great day everyone!
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I agree with you Vivre, the "walk every day" is so important. I think my walking was key key key. Our bodies are designed to move, and somehow my body seemed to remember how to get better and burn off all the toxic stuff if I exercised. At least that's how it felt to me.
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Hey Spring
I get so tired of hearing of the "cost" of the MRI. When my doctor here suggested I get an MRI, I was told I would have to go out of town because the hospital didn't have an MRI machine. Erie has three hospitals..not one of them had a machine. I asked why...they said it cost too much for the coils and they couldn't justify buying one when they didn't send that many women for MRI's. I contacted the marketing woman at the hospital I normally go to and told her what they told me. (She is one of my Zumba students). She was floored.
Here is my thinking...how many women do they send away? I ended up going to Cleveland Clinic and the total of all my treatments, etc. is close to $300,000 if not more...I lost track. Now times that my how many other women went outside the area to have their MRI's done, and subsequent treatment. I think the darn hospital could have bought the coils by now!
Not too smart if you ask me!
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How about the cost of missing DCIS and then having a woman will full blown invasive breast cancer? The cost of all that treatment, chemo, rads, surgery, etc etc. It is just Stoooopid if you ask me, boardering on a-moral!!!
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Well, that is what we get for putting men in charge! Our company founder always said, Put women in charge and the world will be a better place!
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Hi everyone ~
I have a question on green tea. Does everyone drink several cups a day or take a supplement instead? I hate the fact that it is a diarrhetic & I get so dry in the mouth. I do like the taste, but find myself not having it very often & certainly not several times a day. So, do you buy supplement in pill form or the green tea drops you can add to whatever. Or, do you just buy the EGCG supplement pill, which is the good stuff in the green tea that we could use. And, I'm so shocked at the price of CoQ10!!
Thanks! (((HUG)))
Val Ô¿Ô
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Not sure what I think of the results of this study, which I came across today while prowling the internet for information on desireable estrogen levels, but thought I'd share it:
http://cme.medscape.com/viewarticle/571252
I just got the results of all some extensive blood work I had done, and have been trying to make sense of my estrogen level (reported as <50, but not broken down any further), and also the very surprising and disappointing fact that my cholesterol, which was never high pre-bc, now is -- which makes no sense to me, especially in view of the recent improvements I've made to my already-healthy lifestyle. Darn! Deanna
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Hi Valerie Jean,
I drink it (I put green tea bags in with my other tea) and I also take supplements. I had to go online to find a CoQ10 without soy, FYI...
Spring.
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Late present for Mother's Day :Chocolate!
http://www.verechocolate.com/chocolates/pure-dark-organic-chocolate-bar-70-cacao
Organic dark choco - NO MILK -
Certified Organic Vegan & Gluten Free NO Preservatives Single Origin Arriba Cacao Bean 70% Cacao Content: Rich in Antioxidants0 -
Sorry Lisa, of course I knew what you meant. I just could not resist celebrating that you found it so early and never stopped dancing.
Valjean, have you tried internet suppliers. They are always cheaper. I use vitacost.com but there are others so it is worth comparing them.
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Audrey,
That's why I juice, I can put a lot of veggies in. I couldn't possibly eat as much as I juice. By juicing I don't worry about losing the nutrients by cooking them. A lot of plusses there. Taking a pill does sound a lot easier.
Val, I drink 4 cups a day of green tea. I enjoy the loose leaves over the bags. It looks a heck of a lot better too. Anyone ever open a tea bag of green tea? What is that stuff?
On the MRI front, it took me a week to find a hospital that offers MRI's for breasts. Finally, the place where I go for mammo's saw the need and they have a machine dedicated to us women. That was 5 years ago, and it doesn't seem to be getting any better out there.
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FYI, I also use vitacost.com, like accidental....
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Great article on thermography:
http://naturalhealthcenter.mercola.com/services/thermography.aspx
Vitamin D from the sun, don't shower!
omega 3 vs omega 6-I like this one. It is okay to eat organic butter.
On the previous page someone? mentioned that their cholesterol levels went up. Mine went up drastically after I changed to healthy diet. This worried me until I read that as estrogen levels go down, cholesterol rises because estrogen helps to lower cholesterol. I lowered my estrogen levels with wt loss and diet so this makes sense. Remember how I said getting rid of estrogen completely throws out the good with the bad. I also read in Dr. Strand's book that he does not even place much credence in cholest. numbers. He feels that this is just a scam by drug companies to get people to buy statins. He feels that it is more important to measure the homocystine levels in the blood and they are a better indicator of heart disease. He said that he has had patients with very high cholesterol levels who are very healthy and have no other evidence of heart disease.
ValJean-I drink several cups of green tea daily. It really helps me to feel balanced. Remember you can steep green tea twice, and you do not need to steep it for more than 2 minutes. When it is used the second time, it is naturally decaffinated, so I do the second steeping later in the day.
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How much tumeric are you supposed to take per day?
I've asked this before,but no response...I'm ordering my horde of vitamins and I want to add it to the list.
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Does anyone get stomach upset from coQ10? I started taking a powdered form in January. I was hopeful for increased energy that others have reported. That didn't pan out, but I want better blood pressure readings, so I'm sticking with it. Then after reading some previous discussions about the Kaneka form of Q10 being so much better, I decided to fork up some extra $ to get some. First complaint: it gives me an upset stomach, but not so much if I take it with food. Second complaint: I notice after I got it home that it has soy. Third complaint: Lack of energy has gotten worse since I started this new brand of coQ10.
I'm trying yet one more non-prescription product that's supposed to boost thyroid function. I've been taking iodoral this entire year, 50 mg/day. I tried a bottle of thyroplex, which appeared to have ingredients similar to prescription Armour, but that was a bust. Now I'm trying Thyrocare from WTSmed.
I'm also dialing back my dairy consumption by giving up milk this week. Springtime, how are you doing on the dairy front? Wasn't it you who was going to give up milk also?
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Althea-where do you get iodoral and how much do you take? My doctor said I should take it. Do you take betaine? My doctor said it helps with estrogen metabolism, as well as magnesium. So I am adding the betaine too. I already take mag. but she said I need to take at least 600 mg a day.
I have found that the vanilla rice drink subs for milk just fine. I only use it on cereal and do not drink it.
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