Survivors who have used only alternative treatments
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George Wong in NYC is a TCM doctor who has dedicated his life to studying herbs and breast cancer. He makes a breast cancer tea that is very powerful - my BS has a lot of respect for him. And I know one woman who did surgery and then all alternatives and included that in her extensive alt program - cancer free 8 years later!
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Thanks Sweetbean, I've found several web links and will research his methods if they are published. NYC is a little too far for a visit unless I come into a lot of money!
As long term survival after surgery for a primary tumour is not unusual, regardless of which other treatments are used, and we don't know the type of tumour the woman had, the testimonial doesn't help. I'm more impressed with long term survival after mets as they are not normally curable.
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Now here are the sort of testimonials that I'm inclined to believe. Names, photo's, some say they are MD's, with metastatic cancer and claiming years of remission. I'd have to find out if they are validated, but as Dr Wong has an impeccable CV and works in a good hospital, I doubt he could publish false claims.
George Y.C. Wong - Department of Integrative Medicine, Beth Israel Medical Center, New York City
Unfortunately his herbs are not named as it depends on the individual TCM diagnosis and some of his herbs aren't even named yet. But it does demonstrate the capacity for these unnamed herbs to prolong life in addition to any other treatments.
ETA Dr Wong has recently published a study of one herb.
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Joy - thankyou for the information but it doesn't address HER2+ve
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True, Susie, but Abigail doesn't know if she's ER+ and WOM is ER+. When they used to treat without hormonal status they gave everyone tamoxifen as it was more often the right treatment.
Do people only want to hear about HER2+ treatments? Or is this thread for anyone who is looking for alternative treatments whether pos or neg?
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JLW, I know this woman personally. She had a 1.8 cm IDC tumor, Grade 1, ER/PR+, Her2-. The cancer did not appear particularly aggressive, although it was not a small tumor. She convinced her doctors to skip chemo, radiation, and Tamox, all of which were recommended. I know there are people who skip out on surgery, do absolutely nothing else, and do OK. But there are also lots of people who skip out on treatment (or who do all treatment) and still progress, so the fact that this woman hasn't had a recurrence is a good testimonial for her strategy which included numerous alt treatments and diet and lifestyle choices, many of which she continues to this day.
I don't know if George Wong will ever get published - it would mean someone who have to give him money for a study and who is going to fund that? All I know is that the TCM world really respects him, as well as some really great conv BS's and MO's. I'm hoping to go see him, eventually, to get his BC tea.
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Oh I'm jealous Sweetbean. You're so fortunate to be able to see him, I'll be cheering you on. Go for it, what harm can it do? For our stage we could do with something like that. I saw a TCM Dr for a while but didn't feel very confident with him. Too many herbal pills and not enough real herbs.
I saw at the bottom of the study PDF for the SABCS presentation, it was funded by a few individuals and families. Let's hope people continue to fund his research.
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Oh, you are right - he has been published. That is very cool!
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Thanks Sweetbean for the heads up on TCM practitioner.
Good to know that some of those herbs mentioned in his research papers were included in the TCM concoctions that I'd taken
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Thank you for the information on George Wong. I think that if a person were givven a Chinese medical exam, then the findings would suggest what herbs / tea they need for their core issues and breast cancer. I am going to check into this.
Thursday I will have my second Chinese medical exam, and I will ask about this and find out more specifically what herbs they would give for breast cancer that is ER+ PR+.
I am determined to be 8 - 38 years out w NED. But I am realistic, I know I have to be prepared that this could be the way aI go and sooner than later. That could happen with tradditional or alternatives. I chose alternatives long before the bc challenge though, so I have no regrets.
Abigail - you speak from a place of great fear. You are always forthright. You promised to tell the truth of what happened to you if you were pressured any more to use allopathic treatments. And you delivered, true Abigail style. I hope that you will find a way to leave these horrific experiences in this lifetime. Throw that energy off somehow, you will find your way. I used flower essences for my traumas that were holding me back. That worked for me, except for one thing that I do not think I will ever recover.
Zuvart - I assure you that forgiving the perpetrator does not relieve one from getting breast cancer, if that small study should be a probably calculation of our situation. To me, studies need to disclose the truth from the lives or health issues of 100,000 minimum, but that will never happen, and so we end up with ideals. Alts included, as there are not enough to study for any particular remedy. But child abuse and sexual abuse, that could be studied on a grand scale.
YorkieMom.... I hear you too. : ) Here's to all the children who might need help and that someone does step in to save them. And to all who are flourishing under the ecaare of a clinic or physician who need to remain in their care. And to the definition of a charlatan medical practitioner - that we can identify them and deal with them so others are not taken in and lose their lives in hopes for a cure that will not come. And to those healers and medical people who do have something up their sleeve that works for cancer.
I am...... Moving, still. On to take breaks. We are staying at new place now - love it - and computer is still staying here at old house until I transition it to satellite or a Hot Spot Wi-fi or something. Only slow internet service on the hill in middle of nowhere.
Will check back in sooner than later though.
Diane
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PatMom,how are the side effects with Tamoxifen? I want to take something. I need to take something. I am so scared of cancer. My fiance is scared for me and keeps telling me to go get something I can tolerate if I cant take Arimidex. I am sure some people can surviv taking alternatives but are there any studies or statistics? On the other hand,the pkg insert on these pills they give us are listing side effects. A friend told me she thinks I had side effects cause I read the pkg insert and talked myself into it! I was so mad! I told her that one of the thyroid meds they tried me on gave me flu symptoms and I had not read the pkg insert and went to the dr for the flu and then after all the tests they told me it was the thyroid med and go off it and we would get a new one when I got well!!! Good grief,yep I talked myself into mouth ulcers,if I were that great I would talk myself into losing 20 pounds LOL. Anyone else have friends like that?
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Cancer is scary. However, there are sooooo many alternatives out there. Just because most other people blindly follow their doctors' advice like sheep walking off a cliff doesn't mean you have to. For one thing, there is a supplement called Chrysin. It prevents androgens from turning into estrogen. There is another protocol I read that blocks estrogen too, but I just don't remember it right now. I know it has chrysin in it. Check out chrysin and read a lot of alternative cancer tx books. I especially recommend "Cancer: Stepping Outside the Box" by Ty Bollinger. It is a 500 page book that gives you information about a lot of alternative treatments. He also discusses the underhanded ways the FDA and Big Pharma and the American Cancer Society have prevented anything natural (and non patentable) from being used. Standard care is all about profits and greed over desire to help. And I don't even blame the doctors (except for their disinterest in learning about alternatives) because they have been brainwashed by their training.
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Cancer feeds on estrogen? What about sugar? We are so ready to get rid of our estrogen and ignore the sugar? Cancer feeds on sugar. I go to the oncology center and at the desk where you check in is a basket full of free candy. In the infusion room or chemo lounge is a table full of cookies and cakes...plus other yummies you can pick up at the little kitchenette. My onconlogist tried to get me to go on anti-hormones, but never asked how much sugar I ate, or the need to cut back sugar. It seems counter productive to cut back on our estrogen while eating foods loaded with cornstarch, sugar drinks, and sweet treats. Doesn't make since to me.
Wouldn't it be better at the chemo lounge to get rid of the candy and cakes and instead give us a healty green drink or at least green tea?
One way to beat the cancer beast is to starve it's food source...SUGAR
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WOM hoped this thread would stay focus on alternative treatments or ways to beat cancer with alternative medicine. It would be nice if we deleted all our personal comments that diverted the attention to other topics that have nothing to do with alternative medicine. It seems like a very respectful thing to do.
Like Joy said go to another treads that welcome debates. This thread is for those who are using alternative treatments or seeking alternative options in fighting cancer. If you want to introduce another topic start your own thread. Again, lets respect the posters wishes.
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Evebarry, I am sure you are aware, but cancer has multiple food sources - sugar is only one of them.
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FYI on Sugar
Cutting out all sugar is not a way to starve cancer. If your blood sugar levels are low, your body will break down proteins and use the amino acids or lactate to make glucose sugar through a process called glucogenesis.
It is vital for the body to maintain sugar levels for the functioning of the brain.
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There's sugar and there's sugar. Processed, refined sugar is what everybody, not just cancer patients, needs to avoid. Natural sugars, such as in fruits, provide excellent nutrition and as motheroffoursons said, are indeed necessary for survival.
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Layla, I sent your response in a PM so we don't go too far off topic on this thread. If anyone reading along wants in depth info on Tamoxifen side effects, check out the Bottle 'o Tamoxifen thread in the Hormonal Therapy forum which has been going since 2007.
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Wornoutmom, I very strongly support Zuvart's earlier post:
Apr 14, 2012 04:42 pm
zuvart wrote:"WOM, follow your instincts and do NOT publically reveal specifics about your treatments or any personal information on BCO. Assist only those you trust via PMs and let the rest figure it out for themselves"
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And there is that loverly respect we wish from each other.
"Just because most other people blindly follow their doctors' advice like sheep walking off a cliff doesn't mean you have to"
Thanks Dunesleeper. I was perusing some of the nutritional thoughts but I think I'll move on.0 -
I am just alt enough, was a midwife in my other life so I have respect for alternative therapies in all aspects of my life. I think it is time for everyone to cool down, THINK BEFORE you post. Not everyone who has a question is antagonistic to alternative therapy. There are those of us who want evidence for any proposed modality.
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Dunesleeper, you wrote: Standard care is all about profits and greed over desire to help.
Well, no actually. You see, in every OTHER industrialized country, that has adopted various forms of universal healthcare, "standard of care" is about what appears -- based on science -- clinical trials, retrospective studies, meta analyses -- to work the best. The USA is unusual in that it regards medical care as a profit-making industry. It's unfair, unwise and unjustified to lump the research that other countries do (and the care they provide their patients) in with the USA.
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lindasa, it is true that other countries do provide alternatives. I read of people going to Mexico and to Germany for alternative tx.
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dunesleeper -- I was only taking issue with your profit and greed statement. Other countries DO offer alternative tx, and some (Germany, for example) most often do this integratively. Others (such as some that I've read about in Mexico) run their clinics both outside the medical establishment and for profit. I have some knowledge of this, in that a good friend with an especially aggressive BC sought out alternative clinics around the world after conventional tx failed her. They sold their multi-million dollar business to pay for this. Sadly, nothing worked for her.
Too often, IMHO, folks are eager to lay all the blame on the U.S. medical industrial complex and ignore the research that takes place in other countries where profit and greed are not the driving forces behind medical innovation.
ETA: No idea what has caused the difference in fonts -- not intended!
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Again...let's keep this thread on alternative medicine as requested by the poster. This thread has been hyjacked to discuss other topics such the FDA or the business of cancer...you can find that on other alternative threads. This is not a thread to debate alternative...rather share what alternative worked for you.
I agree that if we don't get get enough sugar our body will break down our protein to make sugars our body needs. Like someone said, it is the kind of sugar we put into our bodies. Good sugars are full of vitamins, Bad sugar is what I'm talking about...sodas, candy and pastery. .
I also agree that cancer feeds on more than sugar, but sugar is a BIGGIE. I' have a sweet tooth. It's tough saying no to sugar. I imagine cancer as Pac man (old viedo game) looking fo gobble the sugar in our system. I've given up soda drinks, and breads. I try not to eat candy except for occasion a chocolate or will subcomb to a special yummy pastery at a party. I admire those who are so discipline that they reject white sugar, and stay away from process sugar foods. If sugar isn't around, I'm not tempted, but if it's all around me, I'm am tempted.
So...one alternative way for me to prevent cancer is to limit how much sugar I eat, and when I eat it make sure it's healthy.
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Eve, I think when an OP disappears a thread can go in many different directions. This happened yesterday on a thread about chemo that the OP bailed out on. Everyone was just giving their viewpoints about a lot of different things as the original intent of the thread became confused. It's up to the OP to guide this thread back to its original focus, if she wants to. That said, I'm pretty tired of this thread especially as it is impossible to communicate with the OP about her views/thoughts.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeA84udy7hY&feature=player_embedded
I have a friend, who said a few days ago that her aunt had terminal cancer, given a few months to live and she went to Canada for this treatment and the cancer is GONE!
Cancer is finally cured in Canada but Big Pharma has no ... - Youtube
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www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeA84udy7hYYou +1'd this publicly. UndoOct 17, 2010 - 3 min - Uploaded by connectingdots1
this is mirrored from DJStratton "Cancer Cured in Canada, But Big Pharma Says NO WAY! " http://www ...0 -
Yorkimom, WOM maybe lurking, and she might just be too stressful to comment...who knows. Maybe she doesn't want to because she is discusted in what's happened to her thread. She recently brought this thread back to life, but while here she is attacked, and the thread again hyjacked. I've been on other threads where I changed the topic and I was exhorted by another member (not the original poster) to post the question elsewhere as it had nothing to do with the topic posted. I apologized and did as requested.
I think if the thread someone post gets weird, or goes way off course the original poster should have the right to request it be removed or have a lot of the inappropiate post on it removed. My opinion
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I was going to stay out of the fray because my participation on alternative treatments is limited to pm, but yorkiemom....really? That thread from yesterday....yes, people were giving their viewpoints but to be told not to come whining on the Stage IV forum if you gets mets....nobody sees anything wrong with that? Do you really blame her for bailing?
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I was on that thread yesterday. The OP was asking about SE's of chemo and dozens of people took their time to tell her that her perception of the SE's was not reality. Dozens! But still it seemed that the OP had decided that she would rather die than handle the SE's of chemo when the outcome was not guaranteed. Some folks who are into alternative therapies agreed with her so some stunned stage IV's decided to comment back. Was it the right response? Maybe not. But I dont question those who are stage IV because they are the only ones who know what a stage IV life is like!
Regarding this thread, i would love to know if there are alternative therapies that could replace or complement traditional therapies. But the OP wont post any details. So I continue to ask, why? Whats the big secret? Plenty of people might benefit from that information and I would think she would want to help. I guess not?
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