I look for other flat chested women. A rant.
Comments
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BarredOwl, I like living in Santa Cruz. A lot. ;-)
kathindc, some woman who are considering reconstruction might find seeing a plastic surgeon useful in making up their minds. Certainly a plastic surgeon can tell them what types of reconstruction they are good condidates for. And a plastic surgeon should give them a realistic idea of the results they could expect. The problem I see is that some plastic surgeons don't give women a realistic idea of the results. And they certainly tend to gloss over side effects (like many doctors). And the decision to have reconstruction or not to have reconstruction can be complicated enough that some women may want to discuss it with a neutral (mental health?) person. But I agree they shouldn't be made to. That is just wrong.0 -
Lisa-e - yes a woman should see a PS but only if she wants or is thinking about recon like I mentioned in my original post. Some of us have no desire from the very beginning to have it. Therein lies the problem with doctors. Some assume it is the natural course for a woman to want it and to give them a hard time or demean them for not wanting it is so wrong. Thankfully, my surgeon respected my wishes.
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My surgeon told me that legally he was required to present the option of reconstruction.
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My doctor put in it words that are hard to forget. His first look at me after surgery was "how can you ever be happy looking like that?". it still haunts me because I am not happy looking like this. But my spirit and soul are happy, and I am still very feminine, and I am so so so glad the cancer is gone. This was never about looks, it was about getting the cancer gone.
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A note on the lighter side:
I started a new game (20 Questions) and I hope this takes you there.
https://community.breastcancer.org/forum/31/topics/836885?page=1#idx_3
and that you will want to play along.
natasha0 -
For me at the time of my first dx in 1990 there weren't a lot of options for recon even if I wanted it. It was before the days /just beginning days of saline implants and I certainly wasn't going to use silicone..the only other option was what they called transflap and at 107 pounds there wasn't much I could "borrow" from someplace on my body to stick someplace else..plus even if they could have done so, I was told by a friend who'd had it done that it was something like a 10 hour surgery...no way I was going for that.
Anyway, when faced with another dx last year no question I had an mx and no recon. I thought about it for a nanosec since all the techniques are totally different from the old days and I figured I could start all over again and get my 30 something breasts back..but then I thought of the possibility of infection, extended downtime, and even more trips to UCSF. Again the answer for me was no way.
My insurance through the writers guild is great, and I have worked out of my home office my whole life, but after spending the last 2 two yrs before diagnoses taking care of my mom who had ovarian cancer/ and my dad who was just plain old and ornery...it was really tough to jam work into a schedule of driving them around to chemo etc...I was really eager as were our agents to get me back to work so that was a factor also. I think I was happier getting back to my normal schedule (even fitting my chemo in) of writing without more medical stuff. For me flat is fine, I know it's not what everyone wants but some of us I'm sure are happier that way.
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ksusan, that sounds like a load of crap to me. My BS NEVER talked about recon,,, if he had, I would have told him no. As it was, I never brought it up cuz I didn't want it, , he assumed I was having it and left the excess skin. Legally required,, hmmmm,,,,
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I feel like the luckiest person in the world when it comes to bmx and recon with the docs. I chose to not reconstruct and when I informed my docs they both told me that it was the best, safest choice.
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crystalphm, I'm so sorry your doctor ever put that thought in your mind. It's your body and your choice. Who is he/she to impose his/her opinions into medical advice?? Should a doctor do that if you want birth control or to have IVF? You seem like a beautiful woman, as do many of the women on this board!
From reading others' comments I think I was one of the very lucky ones too, ending up with the 10 year old look. My scars have widened a little in certain spots. Maybe keloids? But I still like the way I look and the choice I made. My breast surgeon did ask me "are you sure?" a couple more times than I would have liked. And when I cried one time when she asked, I think she thought I was unsure. But then I explained to her, it was not the thought of being flat that bothered me. No, I was very comfortable with that idea! What upset me was being put in the position have to do this at all. At my one month post surgery check up, she admitted she wished more women made the choice not to reconstruct because healing was better and there were less complications.
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Crystal, how gross!
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jkbrca2, that's what mine told me, too. But they are very cautions and only say that AFTER you insist on no recon.
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Like I said before, my docs were wonderful, but one doctor, the radiation oncologist, a very stylish woman, said that she knew some day I would choose to have reconstruction, she could tell that I would want that......
Well 5 years and I haven't... still leaning toward removing the other one, but just can't make the appointment to do it. 0 -
The type of cancer I had (inflammatory) is aggressive, and I am large, so I decided to have both breasts removed rather than just the affected breast. The onco was pleased with my decision, as in his experience (he said) most women with IBC experienced mets in the other breast within 2 years. I also decided on no recon, and again after I told him of my decision, he told me he was pleased because it would be easier to see any mets that may arise.
Mind you, this was my second primary cancer (also had pap thyca), and I subsequently had to have a hysterectomy to remove pre-cancerous cells (another primary, not mets). Oddly enough, most people don't notice the "missing" breasts; really depends on what I wear, I think.
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As a newbie to the website, I've just read your post and LOVE it!
I'm going to be having my second mastectomy on 12/04/15 and opted for no implant. At the same time I'm going to have the surgeon pull the saline implant from my first mastectomy of 19 years ago.
I'll admit to being a bit 'scared' at what the results will look like...not even thinking about prosthesis. But, there is an even bigger part of me that is happily anticipating the freedom of not having breasts.
So, if you have found that group, booked that hotel or restaurant, let me know and I'll be there - sans bra and filled with joy.
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Welcome, Frazoo. Good luck with your procedures. I have been flat and fabulous since Nov 15, 2012. 3 years out and celebrating with my own version of the song: "Stayin' Alive". I have never worn any prosthesis and am very comfortable. No one actually notices. Even when I wear my T-shirt with the OncoWarrior painted on the front, people will look at my chest and ask what that means. When I explain they want to know who in my family had cancer. I say, "Me". Then, while still looking at my chest, ask, "What kind?". I am not making this up. No one notices flat. They notice in-your-face cleavage and large and spill-overs.
I hope you will have good support system to pamper you all through December. No need to use up your healing energy in doing for others. This is the time to let them do for you. OK, enough of my "motherly advice."
Please keep us posted on your progress. There is a site on facebook called Flat and Fabulous, which deals with various flat issues. The sisters there are very encouraging. You may want to check it out.
By the way, where are you?
natasha OncoWarrior
P.S. one thing I really appreciate in the summertime is no more of that under-boob sweat discomfort.
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Welcome Frazoo, sorry you have to join this group. A great group of ladies here. Good luck with your procedures. May your recovery go smoothly. And I second OncoWarriors P.S. It is sooo nice not wearing a bra in the summer.
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I think so much of it has to do with how people around you react. I had a Internet friend earlier on in my process whose husband saw her cancer as a chance for her to get bigger boobs. Really insistent about it, when she wanted to go without reconstruction or foobies. Needless to say, that is an extreme situation and they are no longer together.
In my case, my husband was very supportive so I am very comfortable. One of my co-workers asked me how I handled the reconstruction when I returned to work. When I said I didn't have any, she looked down at my chest and said "ok, I guess I really would not be a good witness -- I didn't even notice!" Most people who are talking to you are looking at your face. If they're looking at your chest, they're having a different conversation LOL!
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Dee I love that phrase "Most people who are talking to you are looking at your face. If they're looking at your chest, they're having a different conversation" - so well put.
Frazoo best wishes with your surgery.
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Frazoo, I hope all is well after your surgery. I am new to this too. My surgery was just one month ago - bilateral mx. I am very pleased with the surgery, and NO reconstruction. The 10 year old look is not bad at all. Some lower necked shirts are too low, but other than that most people really don't notice, just as OncoWarrior stated. I feel great and will be going back to work soon.
I switched surgeons because he argued with me over what procedure I was having, even though this was thoroughly discussed months before. He insisted on doing a skin and/or nipple sparing procedure despite stating that is not what I wanted. (I was terrified to see what I would wake up to.) He also implied that I would be leso feminine and would not feel whole unless I had reconstruction. I informed him that my beasts were trying to kill me and they had to go AND boobs do not define me as a woman. He walked out of the room. Needless to say I found a new surgeon, who is amazing.
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Sheep - wow! That discourtesy from your previous surgeon amazes me. I do understand there could be a culture of fear that a patient who regrets not having skin sparing and decides she wants recon later might sue, tho' actually I believe there are other recon options that would still be still open to such a patient. But beyond the personal fear of being sued what explanation is there? Can't think of any, even the fear of being sued, that could ever excuse such rudeness.
Best wishes with your recovery in better hands.
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Wow, sheep,,, that is really arrogant of your previous surgeon. Holey Moley! Glad you found a good one who listened to you.
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These folks have licensing boards with a complaint process.
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Sheep, please, please, please report this surgeon to the state's medical board. If he had done something to you that was expressly against your wishes, that could be considered a crime. I'm a doctor, and we can't touch people who do not want to be examined, can't put stitches in someone who does not want them, etc. That's as long as someone is in their right mind.
If, going into a surgery, you were not in your right mind, any surgeon in his/her right mind would need a surrogate to consent for you. It sure sounds like you did not need a surrogate.
I have never heard of anyone suing for having a "skin-sparing" procedure against her will, but I think it may need to happen for some of these jerks to get the message.
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If I were to tell someone she'd be "less feminine" under these circumstances, my licensing board would certainly impose a penalty.
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Sheep, welcome to the BCO community and thanks for sharing your story. Very stressful to have something like that happen with your doc! So sorry you had to go through that as well.
Hang in there, and again, so pleased you joined us.
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I've been on these and other BC boards for over 5 years now and never once have I heard a woman say, she was angry at her doctor because he didn't do a skin/nipple sparing MX. Or because he left her nice and evenly flat....but I've hear complaints about the opposite more times than I can count. What is with the doctors, it's a stressful enough time without them making you feel worse emotionally about it. I as very lucky in my breast surgeon!
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OncoWarrior, I chose no reconstruction and do not wear any prosthetics. I have had two people ask me if I've lost weight recently. I'm like, "Yeah, about 8 pounds off the top!" People are definitely not that observant. Of course, I shouldn't laugh, when I was a kid, I didn't realize my Grandma had had a mastectomy - I just thought she was really flat chested.
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My motto has been "It's all in the flatitude." After 3 1/2 years, I believe in "flaunting the flat." It has been very liberating being flat. I never felt that my breasts defined me as a woman. I went from going to have a lumpectomy to having a BMX, my choice after much thought. Luckily, I had a surgeon who didn't have a problem with that. And bless his heart, he did ask me if I wanted a little something or to spare my nipples. Told him I had no interest in that and that was the end of our discussion. He did make note of our discussion in his surgical notes.
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Linda is so right. Many of us (me too) were left with unwanted excess skin, cuz the surgeon thought we would want recon,, or we would change our mind later. **you are so young, how can you not want recon?* At my last appt with him, I asked him when all this excess would go away, cuz I thought it was post op swelling. That is when he told me it was excess skin for recon.
"but I don't want recon. Can you take this off? You must do this a lot, right?"
"no, never have."
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My story is a bit different as it was always clear I would not have recon. However, I was not left with a flat chest - more rolly polly that I would really like to get rid of. I have a lot of weight to lose since the thyroid cancer, but if I can do that I'm hoping they can fix the chest excess when they fix the skin folds (as they will surely have to). It's been five years since my bilateral mastectomy. If you wear the right cut of clothes, non-clingy material, patterns... people don't notice.
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