I look for other flat chested women. A rant.
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I had two things that are likely unrelated - Still...
The first was the end of the incision under the arm on the proph side seemed as if it was stitched to the chest wall. In discussion with BS apparently it was on both sides. The CA side gave way much sooner and has never been much of a problem. I had a softball sized hematoma under my arm and swear on a couple of occasions could feel that last stitch ripping on the right. I always felt that it had somehow been tacked to a nerve as this was the area of ongoing pain. It did eventually give way but took a long time. It formed a big hole/indentation that is permanent, much like an inward deep belly button though this is at an angle instead of straight down. I also sometimes get numbness in the hand on that side. I have to do alot of stretching and full range of motion to relieve it. I am two years out and with much improvement over time, I consider it only a minor issue anymore. When I have trouble wearing bras this is the problem area. I often wonder if it is a nerve encased in scar tissue. Again it has improved enough over time to only occasionally be a real problem.
The other thing was in the beginning couple of weeks, I developed large hard unhappy vessels, much worse on right (not sure if blood or lymph) that ran down the torso on each side. Lasted a couple/few weeks and resolved on its own as the BS said they would. Wonder if I dodged a bullet on that one as they were large, hard, contracted and uncomfortable?
Barbara
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Outfield... This totally resonates with me:
In some ways, I feel like living flat is also a decision not to hide that I have lost that mortality virginity. I can't go back to who I was before cancer.
I had an intense feeling of just that yesterday when some very young guys at the gym were trying not to look at my half flat chest. I was way more aware of the bullet I dodged than the shape of my body...and that it was just as hard for them to see mortality in raw form as it was to see a half flat body.
More importantly, I did not feel any sense of cowering. I felt glad for my being alive and proud of my body shape.
Thank you for putting it into words for me...:)
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So, when you guys experience people looking at your flat chest, do you think they understand what they are seeing, i.e. a breast cancer survivor and her choices?
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No.... I think they are just puzzled. It doesn't look "quite right" but often they cannot exactly figure out what's "not right" aobut it.... and as we have seen, the eye fills in the picture so often that people automatically "see" breasts, so it gets a little confusing for them...
That's my guess.
And unless we say something, or they ask impertinent or rude questions, they will never figure it out!
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I think Linda is onto something with what the eye fills in. I truly believe most people do not notice unless they have been touched by BC either themselves or as close family and friends.
Whether people actually think it or it is only in my internal conversation, I often wonder if other people never think of breast cancer at all but perhaps think about it as a statement about gender or gender transition. Whether that thought ever crosses anyone's mind or not I don't know but I do find that I consciously offer alot of gender clues when going flat.
Barbara
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In my case, the folks at the gym keep seeing me again and again. So they are strangers that get to have a repeat look and consider it again. Also, I am wearing relatively tight workout clothes that make the flat half pretty visible. These folks, I think, have figured out the cancer thing, I think.
Out at the grocery store, very few people notice.
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CLC, I think folks who see you repeatedly may eventually "figure it out" as you have said, especially when you are kind of asymmetrical. Not as easy for them when both boobs are gone.... LOL
Starak, I was actually thinking about those gender clues. I realized yesterday as I put on my t-shirt and jeans that I do actually still look feminine, but with short hair, no makeup, no jewelry - first glance could look like a boy, but once they see the wrinkly face, it's a bit of a give-away!
I was watching some of the very thin women in the Olympics and thought many of us may even pretend we look like them in their form-fitting triathalon-type suits. If there is a v-neck it sort of distracts or suggests shape. So, OK, it's really pretending, and probably stretching it quite a bit to think we might look like these girls... but don't burst my bubble yet.... I like my little fantasy world!
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Outfield,
Re. "In some ways, I feel like living flat is also a decision not to hide that I have lost that mortality virginity. I can't go back to who I was before cancer."
Perfectly and beautifully stated. Thanks for the info, everyone, on cording. Good info to have. Why aren't we made more aware of these side effects?
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In answer to your question, Melly, no. I don't think they know what they're seeing or even relate it to breast cancer. If I was attending the race for the cure, I'm sure the attendees would implicitly understand. But I don't think the general population has a clue. And really, who is going to pry? I'm a talkative, curious one. But I probably wouldn't pry for fear of making someone uncomfortable. Would depend on the context of the encounter, though.
Good question, btw.
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Outfield, I too love the way you put it..."mortality virginity". That says it all.
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I was at a meditation group tonight and a woman came in with no breasts (I am flat too) and honestly, in her denim shirt, *I* didn't notice, and I look for flat chests!!!
I do think everyone notices my flatness though. And yes, when I only had one breast, it was obvious.
But I had an experience with being flat, I was walking by 3 construction workers and one of them called out "Hey Lady No-titties" and I shot back "Breast Cancer" You could have heard a pin drop...then the one older guy starting hooting and clapping for me. The other two looked confused (with few teeth I might add)...but I was proud of *me*. Finally, for one day I felt good about me.
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Crystal...YOU ROCK!!! woot woot woot!!! 0
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Crystal,
Love it! Blessings to the fella who started cheering for you!That is awesome.
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Linda- Your fantasy world seems to parallel mine. When it comes to athletics, breasts don't help. If I remember right they get in the way. I'm 18 months out from surgery & I'm having trouble remembering what having breasts was like.
The thought that has been running through my mind the last couple of days is that maybe I'm kidding myself & nobody will tell me the truth. Maybe I look worse than I realize. The emperor has no clothes-ish. But as been said many times here, nobody notices............Hopefully this thought will go away.
I ran into a former neighbor of mine at Costco today. She asked me "how's your health?" I'm only 53, she's probably 50. No one's ever worded it that way(50-somethings just don't talk that way) & I have no idea what she heard or from who. The conversation went OK & as we parted ways, I assured her I was doing well. I looked down at my chest & laughed when I told her "there's just less of me". She also laughed, she seemed to get it, I think. She was an alternate on the olympic team 20+ years ago. She is also a cancer survivor.
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Crystal - I am proud of you, you go girl
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Coraleliz:
You mention the thought about "the Emperor has no clothes." You judge for yourself. You will need to scan down the page because I posted pics at different times. The white blouse was totally flat from this last Christmas (edited to say: (white blouse) Christmas 2010 - my avatar is totally flat from Christmas 2011). Does that photo grab you by the throat and scream "OMG!!!! THE WOMAN HAS NO BREASTS!!!!" There are before and after pages on that page if you scroll down enough. Same red shirt in both photos a month apart. When I went back everyone told me how good I looked and that I looked better than before. I think I looked better too. All I had was a BMX - no chemo, radiation, or recon, so I had it wayyyyyyyy easier than most.
Emperor has no clothes? Some will notice but is it an OMG!!!!!!!!!!! moment or just a minor after thought?
http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/82/topic/737036?page=13
Barbara
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Starak, you look beautiful.
Crystal: you go girl!
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Stark, the first pic of you post-BC with the white shirt and red belt says, "look at my beautiful face!" but the pre-BC pic with red shirt screams, "look at these giant boobs!" You are a beautiful woman, with or without breasts, but you look lighter, younger and more comfortable without. I don't think anyone would think about whether you have breasts or not in white shirt after or red shirt after. Thank you for sharing pics!
Crystal, great response in what could have been a very distressing moment. You've got guts, girl! So glad the one guy applauded - showed his sense of compassion. People clap for soldiers - you got your recognition for surviving without all the pink rah rah sis boom bah, and I'd prefer that any day! You were acknowledged personally, which is really beautiful.0 -
Starak...you look awesome!
My mind is beginning to churn. I have been thinking about either a prophylactic mx or a reduction on my remaining D breast.
I think I have come to terms with being public half flat. I needed to do that first, I think. But, I spent this summer half flat in all environments...and feel fine about it. I am about to return to work, where I need to wear a prosthetic...as a public school teacher of teens, I need to for a plethora of reasons. And, as I face that prospect, I dread it. I don't want to lug around that size 7 prosthetic, and all of the psychological weight it has in it...the willingness to succumb to societal dictates at my own expense.
So...I am now considering the idea of going all flat. That seems way less difficult to me. On a practical level, no bras, no prosthetics, no physical imbalance affecting running. I believe I would go all flat all the time. That seems very appealing to me compared to half flat. But...I do not want to lose my right breast. I mean, I like my breast...for looks and feelings.
So that leaves me considering reduction, which will compromise...keep breast, reduce imbalance, but not get rid of it.
Then, I just get pissed and wish I could go to work half flat. Or that cancer hadn't put me in the position of having to make these choices. I mean...I don't want to be a hero. I just want to be comfortable. Don't get me wrong, I am proud of being strong and going out half flat...but I didn't ask for the role of stereotype-breaker. And, I cannot even be strong and go out half flat to work...so I am just victim to stereotype there.
And I don't know how long I will struggle with this. Maybe forever.
Sigh...
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Crystal, WAY TO GO! I too am grateful to the man who clapped. Way to go for sticking up for yourself!
Starak, you look fantastic with and without breasts. I sure do understand loving being flat! The first time I ran across the street with nothing pulling at my chest, wow!
CLC, Geez. I am sorry you are faced with these thoughts and this decision.
I was talking to my therapist last week and she said something to the effect of my being a 'pioneer'. By not wanting to wear forms, by embracing my new body, by not caring what the world thinks a female body should look like, I am a pioneer.
My response was, 'Well, it sucks to be a pioneer sometimes!'
I am glad that you seek to make this decision from an empowered place. Take your time and make sure you do what is right for you.
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CLC, I totally understand the inner need to NOT draw attention to one's physical appearance when working with students. I used foobs during the spring semester, hated how uncomfortable they were at times (other times they are comforting as a "bumper guard" from all the "huggers" I know and they provide a little sensory feedback, but bras irritate my ALND arm.... trade-offs...), but since May I have been going flat, and when I look at myself can't always tell a huge difference in how I look. I am wondering if the same thing can happen with being half-flat. I mean, maybe you could try experimenting a bit with different scarves, vests, sweaters, jackets - maybe some things with patterns - that can camaflouge the asymmetry. Get someone to give you HONEST feedback (I frequently ask DH "Do I look OK?" when getting ready to go out - he understands the anxiety I have and has been very helpful and supportive). At some point you may find the right wardrobe that makes you feel good, allows you to go half-flat without calling attention to yourself.
I don't like being a pioneer, either!!!
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Thanks MT...it is comforting...or, rather, supporting, to know that you, and everyone here, understands. I won't rush. If I ever do decide to do reduction or mx, it would not be during a school year. So I will ponder these thoughts for a minimum of one school year. It's funny...I like my body just the way it is now. I think the half-flat is interesting, intriguing and I enjoy it. I just wish I could integrate myself as ME into the society around me. Such a weird twist on being a woman in a misogynist and image conscious society...
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CLC, I wrote the article about going flat, I really look forward to its release sometime next week. It will be interesting to see how it is received. I speak to these topics, I am not a great writer, but I am passionate. I will link to the article on this board when it comes out.
You would think that with 12% of the U.S. population diagnosed with breast cancer in their lifetime, and about 55% of those not getting reconstruction, SOMEONE would have a line of clothing for half/flatties, mysogony to say the least.
I think you are really brave to embrace having a single breast with love and compassion for yourself. I hope this is OK to verbalize. I tried to imagine what that might be like for me and I could not see myself being gentle, compassionate and loving toward my remaining breast, reading your words makes me get teary. Thank you for being who you are.
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Linda...I missed your post before...
I might be able to camouflage well enough. I have done it on no student days and the adults don't notice anything. However, the camouflaging is, in itself, weighty emotionally.
Maybe I just want my cake and eat it too. I want to be comfortable being me...I don't know why I expect that to happen, it has never happened before in my life... Perhaps this is just another step along a lifelong journey to find my place in the world...:)
MT...thank you for reflecting on my words so deeply. It is informative for me to hear that my words sound self-compassionate. Thank you.
Thank you both for your supportive and comforting words.
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CLC, my heart also goes out to you. The fact that you like your body the way it is, the way it looks and feels - which as MT points out, is a very loving, caring and accepting attitude - is something we all struggle with after BC. It's probably the most difficult hurdle after this surgery. You have been fortunate enough to still have one healthy breast, which continues to be very much a part of you, capable of bringing sensual pleasure, a sense of pride and feeling of femininity. I find it so sad that what remains now feels like a problem because of how others might perceive the way you look. I understand we are a culture obsessed with symmetry, and it fits our concept of beauty and what is "normal". Being in a teaching position and around children who are quick to observe and point out differences, I do understand your concern. We don't always get to choose the battles we must wage in life, and this sure is a tough one, but I hope you base your decision on what feels right to you vs how others might feel. Not long ago you grieved losing a breast; why does the healthy one now have to be the "bad one"? It's not fair.
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Life isn't fair. I find myself explaining that to my children frequently. The best we can hope for is that we get to meet life on our own terms.
I am ever grateful for having come through my mastectomy feeling whole. Many women, and me, for much of my life, never feel whole, even with two intact breasts. I will grapple with this and ultimately decide my best route. But I will not forget that I am very very very fortunate to have this to grapple with... Many of the women here had no choice in this matter. And, many have far more challenging choices to make.
It is stunning how bc can redefine one's life. A frame shift.
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This woman designs clothes for unilateral and bilateral mastectomies. Beautiful clothing line.
http://www.chikaradesign.com/flash.html#/collection/clothing/1
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AnneMarie...I love her stuff...especially the bathing suits... They aren't my style...but absolutely beautiful!
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I was thinking about that 55% stat and realized it wouldn't mean 55% of women diagnosed with breast cancer, because there are all the women who have lumpectomies and then aren't either flat or reconstructed, just different. I wonder what percentage they are.
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Just came back here. Scary day where gyn says I need D&C/biopsy for uterine wall thickening. Great. I was going nuts yesterday. Went to SEARS to buy a new vacuum cleaner. Talk about mundane. I have had no reconstruction and have had a bilateral. I HATE my "foobs." They are hot, etc.
So, I was dressed with a casual top, not revealing, and this salesman COULD NOT STOP LOOKING AT MY CHEST. I was angry, but yes, then again thought, he doesn't "get it." I wanted to say calmly, "bilateral mastectomy." But unless someone has been through this, indeed they don't understand there isn't a FREE and "easy" boob job. I'm a candidate for expanders only. I passed on that as I don't want surgery/surgery/surgery unless it is to save my life. And I can always have it done. But I'm almost 54.
Right now, I'm at the stage of GO FLAT AND BE PROUD. I would like to start swimming and found that Danskin has some very lovely simple suits and you don't have to stick anything in them. My question is, how do I put a Carefree pad in a swim suit. GAH.
I say YOU'RE ALIVE, and it's your life. And I have been frightened by stories of women who are on a tenth surgery due to reconstruction problems.
Hang in there ladies. I had a really bad day today. But I come here, after a long time and see I'm not alone. Isolation with this is awful.
BP
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