I look for other flat chested women. A rant.
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Barbara, I looked up the address to send Breast Pockets and it is not on Manhattan but not as far from the water as I would like either. I am with you that I hope they are all safe and will be back to something approaching normal soon though with something of this magnitude, it will be good again but never the same.
Barbara
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Barbara,
I think I have around 300. I am in an emotional lock down and can't seem to work on that project right now. If I could switch out my brain for a lighter airier one, I would.
We are OK, we are in part of Broklyn that did not get flooded. We have electricity and internet, thankfully.
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Painterly, I got cheap mastectomy bras for the purpose. I cut the straps and back off, sew the bra on the inside of the tank, leaving the openings for the foobs free. If you do it neatly, you can even get away with wearing the tank by itself, but usually I waer something over it. It is a good idea to put the bra and foobs on, then the tank, then pin the bra nad tank together to get the positioning right, remove, cut and sew.
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YAY MT!! So glad to hear you're ok. Hard to visualize beyond what's on the tv. XOXO
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It is good to hear from you MT1, I was wondering if you were ok, and not just because of the storm. Things will get better.
Starak I think I know that sensation. Tomorrow is my one year anniversary of my first mx, and I thought that the strange feeling in my chest would have gone away by now. It doesn't happen everyday, and it becomes more irritating the more tired and stressed I am. I wouldn't describe it as pain exactly, but I have to rub it until it at least calms down (no matter where I am!) . Sometimes rubbing lanacane or an anti-inflammatory cream on it helps.
I hated bras all of my life because my breasts were small and the bras therefore never stayed put. I would spend half the day yanking them down. It took six months for my chest to feel comfortable enough to put a bra on, and I knew it would not stay down. I actually took maternity elastic and sewed one piece on each side of the bra, and then sewed buttons on the sides of my dress pants to button the sides of the bra down to the pants (because maternity elastic has all of those little button holes). It worked pretty good, but my chest is still not comfortable in a bra band, so I gave it up and am staying flat. For me, the camis are more comfortable, and they kind of flatten out the remainng breast a little to make it less noticeable. Imagine - trying to make the other breast less noticeable! Anyway, having the second one off on the 28th of November, and I am looking forward to being the same on both sides. Hope I won't regret it.
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Momine....thanks for the sewing tips.
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Painterly, you are welcome. TLC online usually has lots of pocketed bras on sale. Since you just need the cups, the style and fit really don't matter much. They also have a couple of cheap styles that come in tons of colors, so you can match the tank and bra in color. H&M usually has a good selection of cheap tanks.
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Starak, dang! I can't believe you lost the "crown."
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This morning I woke to the realization that I am taking Zoladex (once a month subdermally) and perhaps all these tough emotions are being magnified by it.
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To all you seamstresses out there, take picture(s) of your tank top + garments and post, please. I had purchased one prosthesis ready bra - HATED IT - am wearing just AMOENE camisoles and t-shirts with the prosthesis sleeves in them (TOO EXPENSIVE). I find these to be a bit tight . . . I would like something LESS tight. I can't "picture" what your hand-made garments look like. THANKS!!!
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Djustme, Just as you say not pain exactly but you have to rub it until it calms down. That is what I find does cause stares. I have seen people in the next lane at rush hour on the interstate who cannot take their eyes off of me when I have to rub my chest or even simply press on it to try and calm it down. It is that which grabs people by the throat and makes them notice and not in a good way. I have had to prepare female co-workers ahead of time so they would understand when it happens.
On the other hand, would you all go back and look at Painterly's observations when downtown for coffee. For her the take away was some question about recon or not. I had a totally different take away, perhaps from being super endowed before and flat now. I noticed the minimally endowed woman is mentioned in passing and immediately becomes part of the background, never to be noticed again. That is my experience with flat, not that I will be negatively noticed but that I will become invisible. Truth is I actually find it to be a bit of a plus. If I feel the need for a little notice I can seriously go for makeup, skinny jeans on super long legs, and a bit of a heel to make them even longer. The rest of the time I can just blend in with the crowd.
Melly, You are one of my heroes here. Your avatar never fails to make me smile. Hang in there. I know without a doubt there is light at the end of that tunnel even if you can't quite see it yet.
Barbara
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Where I work there is a full wall 1950 photo mural of a Lockheed Constellation aircraft over the Hudson Bay. The photo looks across the southern tip of Manhattan with the Brooklyn Bridge at the top center of the photo, and the waterfront and Red Hook district of Brooklyn to the right. I live every work day with this photo and now it is keeping all of you in that area of the world in the forefront of my thoughts.
Barbara
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Starak,
Red Hook, which is quite close to us, got hit really hard. There aren't any subways down there and many less monetarily wealthy people can afford to live there, so (of course) the lights are out for most of them. Red Hook is out of electricity and suffered some bad flooding. The Gowanus (a man made tributary), that is just a few hundred feet from here, flooded and overflowed too (think sewage and EPA site combined). We are in Brooklyn and all the subway tunnels are out of order, we can take the subway to the closest stop to the tunnel, then hop a bus to get into Manhattan. It is kind of crazy and those who travel the system are told to add an hour onto their commute, normally It would take David 20-30 minutes to get to his work place from our apartment. My husband walked to work from Brooklyn yesterday. He says going through lower Manhattan is incredible. I wish I were able to see it. But I would rather stay away and let the workers do what they are able.
My parents live in Connecticut and have no electricty. I am happy to say, they found their sailboat, which went missing from the town dock. I do hope they get their electricity back soon.
We always had electricity, thankfully.
...and thank you for calling me a hero.
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Linda, I would give you a big hug if I could. I am so sorry you had to revisit surgery for a recurrence and hope the excisional is all that is necessary. I will keep you in my heart for meditations. Also, I am looking forward to seeing pics of your nice outfits! How nice of your husband to do a photo shoot. Maybe I can rope mine into doing the same thing because I haven't had very good luck trying to take my own. And as far as falling back into the tried and true comfortable clothes for much of the time, I am with you on that!
MT, you have been in my thoughts as well. It may very well be the medication is causing you to feel more emotional. Perhaps a chat with your doc might reassure you these intensified feelings are a normal side effect of the drug. Not that it would make them go away, rather allow you to cope better knowing it is a contributing factor. If you think your symptoms are beyond what is considered normal, I definitely would want to ask. As you continue to process how you want to live your life post-BC and get more time under your belt, you may feel more on an even keel even with the drugs. Sheesh, it's tough enough dealing with our experience without the additional effect of these hormone-related drugs.
Pip, you look beautiful in your dress. Your husband's not so shabby either, but you clearly shine in this pic!
Painterly, that kind of boob behavior annoyed me when I had breasts. Now I kind of feel bad for women whose self esteem is tied up with their breasts and need attention to feel beautiful. They have so much farther to fall if BC comes to visit. On the other hand, a subtle décolleté is a wondrous thing. My breasts were somewhat set apart, so I used to have a bit of cleavage envy. In my heyday, my breasts were lovely, but they never got thrust out like a tray of merchandise. LOL!0 -
Pip, you are gorgeous!!!!! Period.
I remember a girl in high school, somehow over the summer went from a normal appearance for a young teenager to the biggest breasts I had ever seen. The boys were drooling all over her. She carried them proudly. Made the cheerleading team without contest (she actually did have some talent in cheerleading as well, always smiling & laughing & friendly & outgoing).
Tina, thanks for the virtual hug. I am doing much better today - my wonderful PT did some serious myofacial releast today, and even though it was uncomfortable when she started really digging into the scar tissues, I actually feel better this evening. I know stretching and strengthening are the keys to healing, and she is really helping me to jump-start the process again. I am now considering the date of my last surgery to be the start of my recovery (rather than 2 years ago when I started treatment), and am being much more patient with myself.
I had also had some relief with the silicone prosthesis providing slight pressure and feedback to my incision pain, but just hadn't tried them again since this last surgery. Will remember to keep it in my "tool box" for comfort care.
MT1, glad to hear you are safe in Sandy's aftermath. The hormonal treatments are rough physically and emotionally. I finally gave up on it, but realize I am taking risks for cancer recurrence, but also know I don't want to go to jail for offing someone in one of my hormonal rages (I really am a very kind, compassionate, and generally CALM person!), so for now, the marriage survives, DH survives, the house is intact.... LOL! DO talk to your doc about it - there may be other options or help available. You are still very early in your journey, and it takes a LONG time to process all this.
Lovingkindness to all of you wonderful wacky women tonight. Thanks for being there!0 -
Starak said:
"I noticed the minimally endowed woman is mentioned in passing and immediately becomes part of the background, never to be noticed again."
Interesting observation! Well, out of the two women, I was closer to the minimally endowed woman and was never like the thrusting gal. I never wished to draw attention to myself when I was young, crazy as it may seem, especially when I was told that I had lovely legs. The only time my legs where actually seen was on the beach, otherwise I wore knee length skirts or even longer. I relunctantly wore the mini skirt, was the last one in it and the first one out of it as fashion changed. I saw this woman as comedy sketch and I agree with Tina that her "self esteem is tied up with her breasts and the need for attention to feel beautiful."
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I forgot the most important point of my comments about myself. Since I never wished to draw attention to myself when I was young, there is no way I would want to do so now and if I do the recon, my biggest worry would be that the ps would make them too big!
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I am up late...ugh....I just watched "say yes to the dress" where Lori, the store owner has her mastectomy and reconstruction...and once again I am feeling a bit lost. She said something like she deserves to look good.
but I do too.
Ok, so my reason why I am not getting reconstruction is I have a total fear/dislike for everything medical, I have mild lymphedema and I can't mentally wrap my head around such a long unnecessary surgery. My husband encouraged this choice, as well as my family, in fact, my family are very proud of me when i choose to be flat.
But tonight I really would like to hear some of your own reasons for not getting reconstruction. Thank you.
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I never for one minute considered reconstruction. Major surgery for what, to look a certain way? I see no logic in that. I would never consider any kind of cosmetic surgery. The risks of things like infection, reactions to anesthesia drugs, etc. etc. which can be life threatening are nowhere near worth it for something that is nonessential. I know I don't speak for everyone, but that's how I feel about it.
Now mind you, I had very little there to begin with, and I can understand if someone had big ole C or D cups, it would be awkward to have only one. Might even cause some muscle strain or something. If that were the case for me I probably would have opted for BMX rather than UMX just to be balanced (as long as both could be done at the same time). But again, that's just me.
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Crystal, for me it started with my surgeon wanting me to delay recon for 2 years. Before that, I had just assumed that everyone did the recon and I hadn't really thought about it much, except to think that I was not happy about silicone and wondering about saline.
Then I started researching and realized that I was very unlikely, given my stage and treatment, to have a result that would make me happy. Then I read how they do the expanders, and I almost fainted at the thought. Yes, I am a total sissy. Then I found out that if you get implants, you will need to replace the darn things. High risk of complications. Lots of pain. So that was just out on so many counts.
The other option is a flap of some kind. Maybe, maybe, maybe I might consider that one day, but I doubt it (and if my BMI stays this low, it is impossible anyway). If I ever do any recon it will most likely be a flap. It does not need replacing, it does not involve silicone nor do they pry your pectoral muscle off your chest and stick stuff under it. The results also look nicer to my eye than the implant jobs. Downside is the high failure/complication rate and the hugely long surgery.
So, if there was some kind of recon that would be relatively easy, highly likely to succeed and give me an acceptable outcome, I would probably go for it. But there isn't, so I don't. Shrug! Besides, I think I look very nice, which given my usual hang-ups is quite funny to me, but it remains a fact, so I go with it.
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Painterly, I am with you on the comedy sketch and agree with you and Tina. Perhaps unfair but that behavior makes we wonder if "they" were the handiwork of a PS.
If I have mentioned this before, it has probably been a very long time on a different thread. I was blessed with a Mom who everyone adored, who was beautiful, successful and as nearly flat as it is possible to be naturally. I learned from a very early age that "girls" do not make the woman and are not the source of femininity. It was those of you who were minimally endowed that I admired and wanted to emulate. Ironic isn't it.
In any case, having seen this hiding bit from both sides, let me tell you it is a whole lot easier to redirect or minimize a whole lot of nothing than a whole lot of something.
FWIW, showing the legs has gone both ways in my life. Probably most often hidden in pants except for shorts in the summer.
Barbara
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I never felt that recon was a viable option for me. I have seen the pictures and know people who have gone that route. I wasn't particularily impressed with the results. For me, they would just be constant reminders of what I lost. I know that sounds crazy, but what is left is all me.
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Crystal - I didn't chose not to have recon at the time of my cancer surgery - it was never offered to me. So it was always going to be delayed recon or nothing. I am not keen on reconstruction because of the extent of the surgery. I can't have implants because I had radiotherapy and so the only option I would consider would be flap - but it would have to be bilateral which pushes the surgery up to several hours.
Having said all of that I hate being scarred and in pain and breastless and if I could wake up tomorow with two healthy functioning real breasts I would be thrilled. I would love to hold my son close to me and for him to feel soft warm breasts - instead of me wincing because of scar pain. I would love to be able to run my hands over my body when I am in the shower and feel breasts again instead of ribs and scars.
I am nearly up to 5 years since dx - I thought that as the years went by I would grow more accustomed to being without breasts. I haven't. The problems and pain haven't ebbed away with the passing of time. I never thought about breasts when I had them. Now I don't have them the whole breast thing is dominant in my life. I am bored by it all. I just want to get on and live. And that is why the concept (if not the reality) of reconstruction sometimes appeals to me. Perhaps the PS lobby are right - perhaps reconstruction would help me to move on. Perhaps I overthink it too much.
Mel - I have said many times on this site the hormonal part of this experience has been far more life shattering than the lack of breasts. Being plunged into surgical menopause (or chemically triggered) is agony - all exacerbated by AIs. I have gone from a lactating, fertile new mother to a sexless, oestrogen free lump almost overnight. I can only hope that once the AIs are no longer a part of my treatment my body will complete the process of menopause naturally and I will find some balance once more. At the moment though there are times when it is hellish. Truly hellish. Best wishes to you.
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Pip, that doesn't sound crazy to me, sounds just like I felt...still feel.
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I didn't want reconstruction for several reasons. Why if there is no sensation? It didn't make sense. I didn't like the way reconstructed breasts looked. I didn't want foreign objects in me and more surgery. I definitely didn't want flap surgery. But most important, I felt I was more than just my breasts. They only defined me to the outside world that I was female. No matter our choice we live with the daily reminder that we had breast cancer. There is no getting away from that.
Plus, my loving husband put it quite nicely. "Don't do it if you think that is what I want. If it were me, I wouldn't do it." He had no idea when he said this that I didn't want reconstruction. I felt such a relief. When I'm out in public, I hold my head high. I am confident in my appearance and am comfortable being flat. It's all in the flatitude! (This coming from an introvert who doesn't like to call attention to herself.)
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Crystal - I saw say yes to the dress - and am concerned because they showed NOTHING of the post-surgery recovery - she went in the hospital, then "later" she was out and looking fabulous . . . those MONTHS in between is why I chose NOT to reconstruct .. . . I'd like an honest answer about how hard it was for her physically - and why they didn't show that part.
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Kathy in DC - - I LOVE LOVE LOVE that "FLATITUDE" . . . . . YES!
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I had a bilateral in April 2012 and I got a tank top that said my real ones tryed to kill me, I did not have reconstruction but when I wear my fake ones you can still tell because my chest is sinking in and people stare now they really stare when they read my shirt.
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"Flatitude" would be great for a t-shirt.
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Hi Crystal,
If you want to hear the "other" side of the story, you might consider posting your question on the Breast Reconstruction forum. There are some women who post there, like Sassa, who went flat for a while and was really pretty happy with it, but ultimately decided to have reconstruction with implants. She's glad she did.
We truly are each so individual in our needs and in how we experience ourselves. For some reason, although I am plenty vain, I just didn't define myself by my breasts and haven't really missed them much, especially since my relief at minimizing my chances of recurrence (after cancer in each breast) outweighed my sense of loss.
I did consider reconstruction initially. I wasn't a good candidate for implants because of previous radiation on one side (and I hated the idea of something foreign inside me) and I really didn't want the kind of long time under anesthesia necessitated by flap surgeries. And, as I've since learned, a second or even third surgery may be necessary to achieve the desired result. I worried about the effect on my brain of a lot of anesthesia. There's a known negative effect in elderly people, though no proven connection among younger patients. But despite that concern, if I were really feeling badly about myself as a breast-free person, I would consider reconstruction.
The lymphedema is a valid concern. But if you find a surgeon who's knowledgeable about that, I think the risks of worsening it can be minimal.
Barbara
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