I look for other flat chested women. A rant.
Comments
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I made the choice for no reconstruction and have not reqretted it. I made the decision while on a road trip by myself, away from family influence and having the time to decide what I really wanted. This was after meeting with the PS for recon and waiting on my surgery date to be determined. Just decided I was done with surgery and wanted everything done and over. Called my BS on the trip home, said I changed my mind, wanted the other breast gone and be done. Two weeks later it was all over and I was breast-free!
On my first work trip, I wore foobs two days. At the end of day two they came off and I have never worn them since. So I had foobs while working during the day but when I went to dinner that night with the same co-workers I was flat chested. Not a word has ever been said and it really doesn't matter to me.
I am most comfortable without that dang bra and being flat chested it pretty fun. I always had big boobs so this is different for me and feels like freedom. Reminds me of 'back when' when young women were burning their bras
.I will be 59 on Monday and I look forward to enjoying many years being flat and free! Today - I don't see myself ever changing my mind. It's so quick and easy to dress in the morning, and less stuff to pack for work trips, and less to worry about in airport scanners, and the list goes on. I found a good seamtress to help modify clothes so it's all good.
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Ohio, I like your approach.
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Wow - Alexandria's post really sparked an interest! But I think most of us are saying the same things. As Starak said, it would be a shame for anyone to feel oppressed to go in any particular direction, because being accurately presented with all of the choices; and being allowed to feel comfortably accepted in whatever choice you make is so important. I don't remember who said it, but feeling comfortable enough to wear or not to wear forms each day, in the same way you choose a pair of shoes each day sounds perfect, and extremely well adjusted. I love that comparison, because it moves the importance of whether or not to wear forms for the day, way down on the priority scale and away from something it is necessary to obsess over. Most of us obsess at the beginning because we are sure everyone is staring at us. Reaching the point where choosing whether or not to wear forms each day in the same manner as choosing shoes or other accessories sounds like a wonderful place to be in this journey.
Breastfree.org was the first site I found when I was diagnosed last year that addressed the topic of not reconstructing and was extremely helpful in helping me feel it was ok not to reconstruct. Before finding that site I thought I must be a weirdo for choosing not to reconstruct. And in the same way, this site allowed me to see that I was not wacko for going formless - so yes everybody - we need to get the info out there. I would love to see pamphlets at the surgeon's office and breast health centres.
Erika - Somewhere back a page or two I mentioned that I had a second surgery Friday to remove as much of the hematoma as possible, and that I have since been bleeding through the old drain hole site. I woke up this morning without blood for the first time, took the bandages off and took a wonderful long shower (the first in two weeks). I am seeing the surgeon on Monday for followup and to get the pathology report. I still have some blood under the surgical site, but hopefully not so much that he will open me up a third time. I'll let you know what happens Monday.
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Just saw the home care nurse - made a point of telling her about my decision to stay flat and that choosing to stay flat, with or without wearing forms, needs to be presented to clients as an option. I asked her to let clients know that she has met a client who made that choice, and is happy with it, when they ask questions about recon. She says she will keep that in mind, because no one else has ever told her they were choosing not to reconstruct. Get the information out there - one person at a time!
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I wanted to add that breastfree.org is the site that educated me on my choices and prepared me for what I would look like post BMX. In addition, reading the comments in this forum was and is a huge support to me- I would not have the confidence that I do without these resources. Thank you!
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One person at a time, and we can change the world.
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You all put things so well. I agree with all of your statements, but we do seem to be the minority out there. I'm so happy with my decision to NOT reconstruct.
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We're the minority for now. It's hard, because we have to fight a culture that puts much too much emphasis on one part of a woman's anatomy instead of on the entire woman.
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I am really happy with my decision not to reconstruct. I am also very happy with my decision to have a bilateral. I am very comfortable and have not had the unwanted attention I thought I would have when going out flat. It also very comfortable and somewhat freeing. It's needs to an option that is offered. If I had not been part of this board I would not have noon I had the option of a bilateral instead of a unilateral. I think if I had been forced to the unilateral it would have ceated more depression on a daily basis. Strangely, I would have considered myself more mutilated with one left behind to taunt me. Does that make sense?
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I so wish I had found Breastfree.org before my original surgery. Would not have changed any of my decisions but would have normalized and confirmed them and would have provided the photos I had such a difficult time finding. A few things really stood out to me at the time. Being reminded that breasts are not necessary for life making it that much easier to sacrifice them in order to better protect vital organs and the body as a whole. Finding and digesting the law requiring insurance companies to provide recon services if they provide for mastectomy. It was in that law and the part about (paraphrased) "including the other side to achieve symmetry" that let me know major reductions on both sides or BMX were among my options and I could demand them. Frapp, I am with you on this one regarding BMX over UMX. For me symmetry was of paramount importance and a UMX was unthinkable. Fortunately for me on some level, I was so big that a UMX was really unreasonable even medically. Others, on the other hand cannot imagine sacrificing what is still left that is presumably normal and healthy, and to do otherwise for them would be unthinkable. Both conclusions reasonable and viable for those who make them.
Edited to say: I can still say this even though the vast majority of complications and after-effects have been on the prophylactic side.
Barbara
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Hi ladies,
I need a little advice, my surgery was Dec 4th all went well, I bought two of the post mastectomy Cami's which were great for the drains, but yesterday I came home drain free! The cami is a little binding and rubbing. I put on a sports bra last night and it feels much better. Any other helpful hints?
Oh and as I said I my BS had no problem with my decision not to reconstruct. He informed my PS but yesterday I went into my General Pract office and he said what on earth made you decide to not have immediate reconstruction? I was a little shocked..
I don't know if I am strange, but I am so happy with my decision and I have already been out with my flat chest I really don't think most people even pay attention. My surgeon did a nice neat job! I had a little butterfly tattoo above me left breast (Cancer Side) I really didn't care if it stayed or not but it is still there.. A little more sore after the drains came out, but all and all I feel good gearing up for Chemo, but at least I don't have the worries about going in for fills.
Thank you ladies for you input when making my decision. It was the right choice for me! My family also thought it was the right choice.
Prayers,
Carla
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Frapp, I do know what you mean and had similar feelings about it. Also, knowing my personality, the left over boob would have been kneaded 10 times a day to search for lumps. Not everyone is this way, of course, which is why it really is such a completely individual and very personal decision.
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Taking off the non-cancerous left breast was also a non-brainer for me. Ironically, it was the left breast that had given all the scares over the years - I'd had four biopsies - all b-9, on the left. But once they found the wide spread DCIS on the right, I decided to get them both off. Symmetry was a consideration, but I really did not want to continue to play this game. I was getting off the merry go round.
But like Momine says: it's a highly personal decision.
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Hi ladies, I am sort of new to this site (do not post very often) but not new to bc. I had posted in another thread about deconstructing my implant reconstruction or choosing an even more invasive surgery. I have read most of this thread and used other wonderful sources to help me with my decision. I had to really dig deep within myself to what I truly want for my body and ultimately my mind. Monday morning, I will go in and have my reconstruction DEconstructed - bilaterally. I plan to take this all one day at a time but for now, hoping to just be comfortable with being flat. I am also hopeful to have some freedom from this. I am turning 39 next month and thought for sure that I would receive a lot of flack for doing this but I just don't care. I am actually surprised that the support from close friends and family has been way more than I expected. I just could not do any more damage to my body with more surgery. It is just not for me. I know too much now than I did back when I agreed to have the reconstruction done. I need my body for work and play and all around happiness. Anyway, I just wanted to thank you for your posted and stories.
Rebecca
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I like Keira Knightley's steadfast refusal to have a boob job and the way she dresses to accentuate her virtually non-existent breasts.
See here - http://igossip.com/flat-chested-keira-knightley-looks-thinner-than-ever-at-toronto-premiere
If you didn't know otherwise, you'd think from those photos that she was one of our tribe.
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Yay for Keira Knightly! and boo to your doctor Carlads - what a judgemental thing to say. It's his job to provide medical advice not pass judgement. Hopefully having all these ladies here to come home and 'talk' to helped take the sting out of his words.
Welcome rseventeen! I never thought I would find myself communicating with women all over North America on a breast cancer forum, but it has helped so much.
Today I couldn't stand it any longer - I haven't been anywhere except home and the hospital for over 2 weeks, so I drove to Canadian Tire. It was the closest store that I figured would not be packed, and as I discovered that I could only drive with one hand, it was best not to go any further. Wow surgery knocks the energy out of you! It was nice to be out anyway, and I earned my afternoon nap.
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Carla,
I'm sorry your general practitioner was so insensitive in his comment to you. Those of us who prefer not to reconstruct unfortunately find that some people (including doctors) simply can't imagine that life can go on in a positive way without reconstruction. But especially to say this to you AFTER your surgery, after you'd made the choice not to have reconstruction, immediate or otherwise--very shocking (and judgmental, as Djustme says). I suppose you have an opportunity to educate him, if you feel like it, that not all women want reconstructed "breasts." For that matter, lots of men don't care about that either (my DH for one--he was glad that I chose not to have reconstruction).
Best of luck with your continued recovery. It sounds as though you have a great attitude and enough confidence about what's right for you that you won't be put off by this or any other insensitive comments.
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Rebecca, wishing you the best with your surgery. Please let us know how it goes.
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How about a discussion on how those of us who go flat - how we got there. The steps or how it evolved over time. Perhaps how hard we did or still do try to hide the flat. I suspect there are those out there who think we just put outselves out there on Day 1, full of confidence, and never looking back. I dare say it likely did not happen in quite that way for most or at least alot of us.
I had made the decision to go flat prior to surgery figuring I could always change my mind about foobs. But then The Mutants turned it into a no other option but to go flat without further surgery. My question became how hard am I going to work to hide the flat.
I started with gigantic sweatshirts and men's gigantic lined corduroy shirts, but then I was still frantically trying to hide the drain lumps as well. I drove around in the carts at Walmart and Sam's which helped to hide the bulges besides trying not to physically overdo. With the broken wrist limiting my ability to fix my hair I frankly looked like a homeless person. After the drains came out, I lost the drive around carts but was still drowning in oversized and layered clothing. I just knew there was going to be a scene and waited with baited breath - never came. Living in the southern US and headed into the heat of summer with the unremitting hot flashes, something had to give. The first to go was the layers. Couldn't exactly walk into a law office when I went back to work in sweatshirts so I was still wearing oversized but trying to hide with the ruffles, busy prints, breast pockets, statement jewelry, shapeless tunics, etc. Kept waiting for the stares, any indication people noticed. Up and down the elevators with all these business people and nothing. NEVER NEVER NEVER set foot out of the house without a flat sports bra or Ace bandages strapping down The Mutants sitting on my breast bone. Bet you thought I was immune - I'm not. Actually the bigger fear was that someone would see, not the flat, but The Mutants. That a very tall man standing beside me in the elevator might catch a glimpse down my blouse or God forbid if I leaned over. I obsessed over it. Flat was starting to look really good in comparison in my fevered little brain.
Over time, as there was no reaction to the flat, I would step by step get a little bolder. If I saw something I really loved that didn't hide, I would decide to maybe take a chance, usually starting with the other women shoppers in the dressing area. Each time waiting for the other shoe to drop but it never did. I did carefully stand up straight, smile and act as totally normal and confident as I could possibly muster. Does draw eyes to your face if anywhere but really just lets you disappear into the crowd.
When I was finally well past the year waiting period that was suggested before deciding on what I could live with and not, it became apparent The Mutants had to go.
By the end of the recovery, I was 1½ yr out and flat had become a way of life. So much of a way of life that when I did buy the foobs I was actually extremely self-conscious about wearing them. Everyone around me had become so accustomed to seeing me flat that I now expected to be a spectacle for suddenly having breasts. Funny how things can turn completely around. On some level, I think my internal angst was actually greater making the transition to foobs than it had been to flat. Now I have mostly transitioned back to flat. There is no longer angst either way. As was said, it has now become no more important than choosing which shoes to wear. But clearly as you can see, it was not overnight.
Barbara
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Rebecca, I wish you an easy surgery and a speedy recovery. By the way, running without boobs is glorious.
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Starak, I love your ability to be so frank, and the image of you in your cart at Walmart with drains, a giant shirt and crazy hair made me giggle.
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Carla, I too am appalled at your doctor's comment. I hope you know not to take it to heart.
Greenfrog, You are so right that Keira looks like she might feel right at home in our tribe. She is beautiful.
Rebecca, Like everyone else I wish you all the very best with your surgery. Please do stay in touch with us and let us know how you are doing. And coming from a woman who could not run a step or jump due to the sheer weight of the "girls" in her prior life, Momine is so very right that running without boobs is glorious.
Barbara
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Carlads- early on I wore sports bras, cheap ones I got at Kmart. I wore them inside out. Not sure if that would work for cami's because I don't know what one looks like. Actually I still wear the inside out sports bra at times under clothes & sometimes to work-out. Congrats on being "drainfree"! What a relief. Best of luck as you go on to chemo.
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I wasn't even given the option of recon. I'm sure that is because of my stage. Even if I had been given the choice I would not have taken it.
As far as dressing, it's still new to me but I have not bought any new clothes. Today I went out in an llbean turtleneck with a vest zipped half way up. Not one person looked at me strangely. I don't have the money to go out and buy a new wardrobe so my old stuff is going to have to do. Luckily, some of it was too tight anyway, like the vest I wore today. I could never zip it all the way up and now that I can, it's just not my style. Clothing is all about your attitude and what your comfortable in.
I have some sort of mutant thing going on at my breast bone. It feels like I have a puffy square pillow in the middle and the two corners at the bottom have been knoted so they stick out like ears. Then of looks like someone put a really thick stay under my skin right where they would be in my bra. I'm only 5 weeks out of surgery so I'm hoping all this goes away. If not, I can learn to live with it. It's just not as pretty as others I have seen.0 -
I think what Frapp said is exactly how I feel about it. I had my BMX yesterday, no recon. I just have the two drains and my only discomfort is the drains, especially when they're being milked. This board really helped me stay with my desire for no recon, because my BS was wanting me to do implants. Obviously it is too soon to remove my dressings and see what I look like, but I am very happy with my decision so far. I am feeling pretty good and hoping recovery will be quick. I too wanted symmetry and think it would be difficult to have only a umx. I am so grateful for this board for making me feel like my decision not to reconstruct is ok and not abnormal.
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Rebecca: speedy recovery!!
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After wound healing, I HIGHLY recommend massage to reduce scar tissue build up. Best money I have spent in this whole thing.
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My journey was probably a little easier than most.
About a year before I was diagnosed, a friend who is considerably older had a small tumor diagnosed and had a BMX. At first, I thought it was extreme, but the more I thought about it, the more I realized that if I were in her shoes I'd probably choose the same thing. I really didn't care about any lack of mortality benefit to BMX - like Momine I knew I'd probably be bruised from endless self-exams.
What I got was a big, aggressive tumour in my left breast. I asked the surgeon to do them both, she didn't bat an eye, and then on the preop MRI abnormalities showed up in the right that turned out to be in-situ disease. In total, I had IDC, DCIS and LCIS. Nobody has batted an eye about my decision for the BMX. Nobody has ever tried to pressure me into reconstruction. People may have asked politely at some point, but I've never been offended - I'd remember that. The worst that happened was automatically getting scheduled with a PS after my surgery, and I just cancelled that.
A lot of this probably has to do with who I am. I work in medicine, and tend to come into appointments with a lot of questions and anxieties, but also a sort of forcefulness. I've also never dressed in the most feminine way. I certainly loved my breasts, but it just wasn't that hard for me adjusting to looking different. I also got so skinny with chemo that it wasn't obvious that the flatness wasn't just natural.
At the time of my surgery, theoretically, the thought of being flat didn't bother me as much as I think it bothers many women. Really, I was too freaked out to think or talk about eventual reconstruction, but my gut was saying all along I'd stay flat.
But I felt surprisingly naked! Going out with my new flat chest felt somewhat like being seen without a bra on back when I had breasts (they weren't huge, but they definitely weren't small). It wasn't so much me thinking thoughts that people might be staring, but having a nonverbal, physical feeling that I was missing some essential clothes.
I did get used it it. I have never left the house with forms (but as I've said before, I do understand why some women want to wear forms and I have no negative judgement of that). I had a fear for a while of people looking down my shirt and seeing my scars, so I wore undershirts or sportsbras. Some of that was purely feeling so vulnerable because I was so sick with chemo. I felt very frail, looked very frail, and didn't want random people seeing the extent to which I'd been cut open. That got better with time.
Casually, I dress however I want to. I think some things look better with a flat sihouette, but it has to do with fit, not hiding the flatness. But I do dress differently than before my surgery at work - nothing form-fitting and solid color - but that's more because I don't want my appearance to be a topic of discussion. I don't care if my coworkers ask me about it, but the people that we work with don't need to be focusing their attention on me or my personal life, we need to be focused on them.
I do remember the first time I ran flat. It was a few steps from a parking lot while I was in treatment. I had a jarring thought, "Oh no! I'm not wearing a bra! I put a forearm across my chest to hold my breasts down, and had a wonderful little sudden sense of relief. I don't miss them playing sports or running, that's for sure!
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For scars, when The Mutants were removed my PS used a white silicone pad approx 1/4" thick which was sort of sticky on one side and then held on with an Ace bandage. In my case it wanted to slip all the time and so I wore a totally flat sports bra on top of the whole thing which kept everything nicely in place. The feel was much like white dense memory foam. I wore it nearly 24/7 for approx 7 weeks. It did an absolutely remarkable job in flattening and also cconsiderably improved the original BMX scars. I thought the stuff was so great that I brought it to the attention of my BS and suggested she get with the PS about exactly what it was and its use. Trouble is there are hundreds of products out there but they are not like this. I think I found it once online but spent hours and hours to do so. I suspect it is a medical supply thing direct to physicians and that it is not over the counter.
Even though this is certainly different due to the backing and I think not silicone, it still would give you a very good idea what I am talking about.
http://www.medicalsupplygroup.com/p-16842-kendall-copa-hydrophilic-foam-dressing.aspx
I think this might actually be the stuff
If the link is too long or complicated, try a Google search on "mepilex silicone self-adhesive foam" which should be white on both sides 1/4" pad that comes in different sizes. I think mine was in the ballpark of 4" x 8"
I used one pad for the whole time and just gently washed it. He felt it had done its job after about 7 wks but had prepared me in the beginning that it might take several months.
It was exactly a year ago this week that the pad came off and I was free at last.
Barbara
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MT1
I am a flat chested woman. Because of another chronic disorder my mastectomy scars did not heal and I was on a wound vac machine for a long time. The docs tried to correct the problem through more surgerys. Needless to say my chest is a mess. I didn't want reconstruction and choose not to wear prosthetics. Initially I didn't wear them because of nerve damage from the surgeries...it simply hurt too much to wear a bra. Now I am flat and free! I swim, work out, give public presentation for work...and usually feel very confident. I too, however, would love to talk with other survivors who chose no reconstruction. I have had many survivors talk about their "trophy boobs" (I'd never heard that term before!) and admittedly have times of insecurity but those are rare now
Take care...
Sue
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