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VITAMIN K2 combined with Vitamin D3 IMPROVES bone density

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  • moth
    moth Member Posts: 3,293
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    Wert, there is a wealth of information about the safety of soy in breast cancer. For example

    "in human studies, the estrogen effects of soy seem to either have no effect at all, or to reduce breast cancer risk (especially in Asian countries, where lifelong intake is higher than the US). This may be because the isoflavones can actually block the more potent natural estrogens in the blood." https://www.cancer.org/latest-news/soy-and-cancer-...

    you can also look at https://foodforbreastcancer.com/recommended-foods.... the sections there all link to studies so you can follow up more.

    Also, the amount of soy involved in a K2 supplement would be miniscule.


  • zogo
    zogo Member Posts: 19,396
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    I take Jarrow brand K2 MK-7 . It does not contain soy.

    Also, I do not supplement with calcium but get plenty from diet. I also take D3 gelcaps made with a Olive Oil rather than seed oils.



  • Wert
    Wert Member Posts: 4
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    zogo, this is where I'm confused about vitamin k2. Your Jarrow brand says no soybeans in the ingredients, but it's made from natto which IS soybeans. So confusing.

  • zogo
    zogo Member Posts: 19,396
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    Wert, that is curious. I reached out to Jarrow for clarification. Will let you know what they say.


  • lillyishere
    lillyishere Member Posts: 775
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    Wert, prunes are one of the best foods for bones. Below is taken from the link:

    Hooshmand and others found that two servings (100 g) of dried plums per day slowed the rate of bone turnover and helped to improve bone mineral density (BMD) in a clinical study of 160 randomized postmenopausal women (100 completed the study) not receiving hormone replacement therapy [10]

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5409740/

    Also, gouda cheese is rich in calcium and vitamin K.

  • zogo
    zogo Member Posts: 19,396
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    Lilly, 100 g of dried plums has 64 g of carbs.

    For those of us minimizing sugar/glucose, that would be way too much for me.

  • zogo
    zogo Member Posts: 19,396
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    Hi Wert,

    Here is the reply from Jarrow.

    "Hi Jane,

    Thank you for your product query regarding MK-7.

    The Jarrow Formulas MK7 raw material is produced via a fermentation process that includes soy and the bacteria Bacillus subtilis spp. Natto. The raw material manufacturing process includes fermentation, extraction, drying, and subsequent purification. The soy is consumed by the bacteria during the fermentation process. Moreover, the subsequent purification steps ensure no residual soy is present in the finished MK7 material.

    Kind Regards,

    Sarah

    Consumer Affairs Team

    Jarrow Formulas, Inc.

    info@jarrow.com

    (866) 459-4154"

  • Wert
    Wert Member Posts: 4
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    zogo , thank you so much! That really makes sense & definitely makes me feel better.

  • macb04
    macb04 Member Posts: 756
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    I take Osteo K Minis, not always taking the 45mg ( not 45 microgram, mcg) dose. Most people don’t know there is no upper limit of toxicity for Vitamin K2. Women have been taking Milligram dosages of Vitamin K2 in Japan for years without side effects.

    It is also soy free. For those who still stay nervous of older information that soy can be harmful for bc patients. Like Moth said, there’s tons of research on soy safety in bc. See her post above


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    https://www.nbihealth.com/bone-support/

    MK4 vs MK7 for Bone Health

    There are two forms of vitamin K2 commercially available in dietary supplements: MK4 and MK7. While they're both naturally found in food, your body can create its own MK4. This is not the case for MK7. We can't make MK7, which is instead only created by bacterial fermentation. Natural MK4 used in dietary supplements is produced from a plant starting material.

    MK7 has a longer half-life than MK4 and both can promote healthy bone laboratory markers and bone density. MK7, however, has never been shown in clinical trials to reduce fractures. Only MK4 has demonstrated the ability to reduce bone fractures in clinical trials.

    However, only MK4 has demonstrated the ability to decrease fractures, the most relevant end point in randomized, controlled clinical trials. Additionally, people with an allergy to soy can react to MK7, since it is produced from soy fermentation. People with celiac disease and gluten intolerance frequently have allergies to other foods, such as soy. MK4 is hypoallergenic.

  • lillyishere
    lillyishere Member Posts: 775
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    zogo, not all calories are the same. Prunes may have more calories on the label however, they fight constipation that makes the food go through easy and lose weight :). I truly believe not all calories are the same, like calories from an apple compared to plain, white pasta because the body absorbs them is totally different. I eat fruit and veggies all day long because I like them and I am thinner than my DH who eats half of my calories but his diet has starchy food and beer :)

    https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/6-reasons-why-a-calorie-is-not-a-calorie#TOC_TITLE_HDR_6

    Also, my personal opinion :). I won't use soy-based products since my ancestors come from a part of the World where soy is unknown. Same as most Asians can't have dairy or wine because for generations their bodies are not used to this type of food.

  • zogo
    zogo Member Posts: 19,396
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    Lilly, you are absolutely right! Good reason not to count calories.

    I count macronutrients instead. Personally, I follow the advice at Optimal Ketogenic Living facebook page.

    The testimonies are pretty incredible and people have reversed diabetes, heart disease and even cancer.

    But, this is just my opinion and personal direction based on my research. Each person has to make their own.



  • Jamielynn1
    Jamielynn1 Member Posts: 1
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    I'm new to the forum after getting bone scan results indicating bone loss. I am devastated and my recovery from treatment is not as I have envisioned but this info gives me renewed hope. Thank you!

  • macb04
    macb04 Member Posts: 756
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    Hi Jamielynn1,


    Glad this posting is a cause for hope for you. That’s exactly why I wrote it. Sharing information helps everyone.

  • rah2464
    rah2464 Member Posts: 1,192
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    I have begun also adding a few prunes daily to my diet, courtesy of the recommendation from RuthBru. I noticed on the package nutritional info that they also contain Vitamin K along with the calcium and other nutrients. I have actually gotten to where I like them ok, eat them after dinner as a sort of "sweet" ha

  • pamep
    pamep Member Posts: 66
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    I too now have a daily prune routine, mine in the morning with coffee. RuthBru has started a movement! My Dexascan showed worsening osteopenia so I am now supplementing with Calcium Citrate, K2, D3, Magnesium, and B12, and also yoga and weight lifting with an emphasis on hips. Plus tamoxifen over an AI. I hope to see an improvement in those T scores next time around!

  • ShetlandPony
    ShetlandPony Member Posts: 3,063
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    Here is another prune idea: Chop them to raisin size and stir them into hot steel-cut oatmeal/porridge. Pour on your favorite milk. (I like almond milk.)

  • rah2464
    rah2464 Member Posts: 1,192
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    Shetland Pony that is a wonderful idea! I currently do oats with almond milk, apple, walnuts, cinnamon, protein powder, and ground flaxseed. Its a concoction for sure! Sending you best wishes for a speedy recovery - God bless you Heart

    Macb04 thanks for starting this thread to raise awareness - its so vital

  • Jewelweed
    Jewelweed Member Posts: 46
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    I just had my vitamin D levels checked. A few years ago, I was at 26, and I've managed to raise it to 42. Go me!

    I'm wondering what is an optimal level and how quickly vitamin D levels increase. Would it be a mistake to increase my dose? Can you get too much?

    Im currently taking Jarrow's BoneUp formula, which includes calcium, vitamin d, vitamin K, magnesium, etc. But I have also started popping vitamin d gummies as well. Then there is the calcium I get from food. I hope I'm not getting too carried away.


  • minustwo
    minustwo Member Posts: 13,196
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    Jewel: Below are the standard ranges for Vit D from my major medical center hospital. I started supplements after cancer treatments & get 4000 IU per day. A year after final treatment my score was 43. They test my numbers every 6 mos along with Calcium numbers before I can get my next Prolia shot. In the last two years my numbers vary from 61-68.

    Standard Range30-150
    Optimum - 42-100