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Physical aging appearance

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  • DiDel
    DiDel Member Posts: 733
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    Agada I like many of us,..felt I looked 10yrs older when I completed treatments. I was anti BOTOX for many years and dare I say even poked fun at some folks for getting it...well after years of expensive lotions and potions my PS talked me into it. I had botox injected in my chest muscles at the time of MX which apparently a lot of drs to now to make recovery easier. (it relaxes and numbs the muscle). Since I realized that and had no adverse reactions to it I went for it. I swear ladies...1. A LOT of my friends have been doing it for years and I never knew. 2. IT's AMAZING!! I swear between my new perky pair and not ONE line fine or otherwise under my eyes..around my eyes...in between my eyes I feel 10 years younger! Mentally it has really given me a boost and I was completely shocked at how well it worked! I said on another thread everyone thinks I look younger cause of my new short dark hair Wink

    I don't know if I will do it regularly but I will definitely be doing that again!

    Diane

  • Nordy
    Nordy Member Posts: 1,106
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    Oh Minxie - Sorry I didn't answer your question. I am triple negative. My cancer was diagnosed the day before my first baby was 3 months. Although I was ER negative, my tumor grew like wildfire when I was pregnant (I had found this same lump 7 years earlier, had an US - negative, then lump disappeared - reappeared at about 8 months pregnant and grew and grew...  they thought it was a clogged milk duct). My doctor recommends avoiding HRT but allows (barely allows, but I was dying from hot flashes and not getting any sleep, crying every day and screaming at my kids - so something had to give) me to use a phytoestrogen cream (called Emirita that is sold at places like Whole Foods) and as I have said, does not approve in use of Soy supplements, but has no issue with eating it in moderate amounts. And for me, my intake of soy is probably only a couple times a week. I worry more about use of hormones and antibiotics in our food sources - particularly dairy and beef, but poultry is probably not much better... and pork farmers are pretty bad...  Wow. Have I left you anything to eat?! Bottom line, talk to your oncologist and find what he/she feels is safe for you and in your best interest. We all have our opinions and what works best for us, but each cancer is a little different and you want to have your attending MD/Onc involved and aware of anything that you may be supplementing your diet with. Sorry I can't be of more help!
  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 7,605
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    Nordy, you are ER- so of course it wouldn't make a difference in your case. I am ER+ so I simply cannot add anymore estrogen to my system. As for soy, it is in almost everything today. In Canada we don't use the antibiotics on our meat animals so at least we know we're safe there. It's unbelievable really, isn't it? Is ANYTHING safe to eat? I think not!

  • IHOP
    IHOP Member Posts: 24
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    I definitely think I have aged prematurely since diagnosis and treatment.  I was told it was because the treatment put me into premature menopause.  It's very depressing to look like my grandmother years ahead of schedule. 

  • lago
    lago Member Posts: 11,653
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    chemo-pause or insta-pause I feel is the real culprit of my sudden face wrinkles. I can't call it premature because I was peri and based on my mom and sister I would be done with menopause naturally in 1-3 years anyway… and because I used to smoke it could take of 2 years so basically 1 year early. I mean I do turn 50 in a few weeks. I think that's why other than some night flashes, disappearing vagina, no period and some wrinkles not much else has changed. I was already noticing being a bit dryer and reduced libido before all this.

  • heartnsoul76
    heartnsoul76 Member Posts: 1,204
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    I don't actually have any wrinkles to worry about (I'm 55). My brother dates women in their 50's and he says most of them look older than our mother (she's 84) so the wrinkle thing is no doubt genetic. She sailed through chemo when she was in her late 70's and her hair and skin still look great. Although she did get her jaw area tightened when she was in her 60's, and since I do think chemo messed with my jawline, I'm going to save up for that thermage/laser jaw thing for sure.

    I also just ordered some of Suzanne Somers organic skin-care line for my face from ShopNBC. It's on sale now, and I want to gradually get all the toxins out of my environment. I wish she sold a body wash, too, but one thing at a time.

    Nordy, I hate all the Monsanto stuff going on. I guess you're aware of the bill that just passed the House and was modified somewhat in the Senate to try to protect small farmers. But if the House had their way, NO small farmers would be allowed to sell their produce and Monsanto would just be providing all of the "food" for the entire country. It is getting harder and harder to find safe food, especially in urban areas. We don't know where it comes from, and even if you grow your own, you have to make sure the seedling itself hasn't been modified in some way.

    Also, more creepy food stuff down the road unless consumer awareness increases (supplements AND food, but the food references are mostly at the bottom of the article):

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codex_Alimentarius 

  • Nordy
    Nordy Member Posts: 1,106
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    heartnsoul - I am going to follow your link. I try to keep up with most of what is going on through the Center for Food Safety. It is a great resource for all the garbage that is in our food. And good grief, genetically engineering salmon! Amazing. I don't know how these people put their heads on their pillows at night.

    www.centerforfoodsafety.org 

    If you click to the second page, there is a video on all the work they have done battling GMO crops this year. 

  • jan508
    jan508 Member Posts: 724
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    great links on this thread

    thanks all

    Jan

  • ruthbru
    ruthbru Member Posts: 47,042
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    How much does Botox cost? and how often would one have to have it done to keep it up?

  • Nordy
    Nordy Member Posts: 1,106
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    Ruth - I just bought some for my husband for Christmas... LOL, WELL, he kept complaining that he always looks grumpy because he furrows his brows together. It is usually anywhere from 10-12 dollars a unit and to do between his brows was estimated to be 25 units (he hasn't gone yet but will next week). Will let you know how it goes. Like I said, I am saving up for laser tightening or thermage... or something! It is not so much wrinkles that I am concerned about because I have very few, but the sagging!!!

  • ruthbru
    ruthbru Member Posts: 47,042
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    I suppose it is kind of crazy to be worried about eating the chemicals in food while considering injecting ourselves with toxins. Crazy world!!

  • wenweb
    wenweb Member Posts: 471
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    Ruth:

    I work for a Dr. that does Botox and the minimum charge is $500 for cosmetic purposes.  It's given every 3 months for medically necessary reasons and technically that's how long it lasts.  The ones who pay big bucks can usually hold out a little longer :>) 

  • donnadio
    donnadio Member Posts: 674
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    What  a GREAT thread as this has been such an issue for me since chemo and surgery and goin on two years!!!My biggest complaint is i lost the quality of sleep since all of this occurred and that affects my face and looking aged!!!!!

    I am on a host of supplements, try to excercise where I can to get that glow goin (HA) and am looking into some microdermabrasion tools to maybe slough off some of the dead skin to see whre the glow is?!!!!

    I am in my 50's. looked like 30 something before my BC. I am supposedly post menopausal and because of history and BRCA gene issue.. i am getting my ovaries out in two weeks.  In my head, I feel this will age me more. As they say little estrogen is being produced, i just feel this will bring on more aging??

    In the past, I had been on bio-identica hormones and that did alot for my face in a good way. Now with all I have gone thru so feel I want them again but there is a place inside that says, You can;t based on what I went thru? Having hormones to me. would do alot for our face and aging look.

    Masks, moisturize day (vit cin cream for day use) and night, drinking water, take fish oil supplements and sleep. Sleep for me is my problem as no matter what i do, I never get a full nights sleep and that i know does so much harm for me!!!

    Donna

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 7,605
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    I'm pretty sure Monsato has altered every single seed in the western hemisphere already. They've been working on it since 1940 or something. It's not news. That's how you get "drought-resistent" crops and things like that. 

  • DiDel
    DiDel Member Posts: 733
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    Ruth the one thing to factor in with costs is a lot of PS charge per injection site..and each eye is one separate site then in between eyes another site 3 in total for around and in between the eyes. It will vary in costs depending where you live. My PS charges $250 per site...but gave me a big FAT discount. I don't know if I can keep it up, he said it would last up to 4 months but the more you do it the longer it last. After a while he says it could last up to 6 months.

    I think I need to revise my budget and allocate from my shoe budget to BOTOX. LOL

    Diane

  • lago
    lago Member Posts: 11,653
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    Donna,not surprised to see you here. I think when I first started this journey and called you I asked about if treatment aged you.

    So why aren't your doctors doing more for your sleeplessness?

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Member Posts: 1,017
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    deleted

  • lago
    lago Member Posts: 11,653
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    Do you guys actually put coconut oil on you face? Wouldn't that clog your pores? I've been putting it on my mastectomy scars only.

  • wenweb
    wenweb Member Posts: 471
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    I've had dark course hairs coming out of my chin for nearly 10 years now.  I told my husband and my sister that if I was ever in a coma that he/she would have to pluck them for me!!

    Does the coconut oil get all over your pillowcases for those of you who use it? 

  • lago
    lago Member Posts: 11,653
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    Coconut oil absorbs pretty quickly. If you give it about 10-15 minutes I doubt you will have issues.

  • minxie
    minxie Member Posts: 239
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    Nordy, thanks for the info! I gave up cow's milk 6 years ago when I was trying to get pregnant and switched to soy. I probably have about 1 cup a day - not sure if that's too much. My oncologist has never really said. Sigh, this what to eat/what not to eat drives me crazy sometimes...

  • Nordy
    Nordy Member Posts: 1,106
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    lago - I do use the coconut oil on my face... and all my scars. And yes, it does absorb quickly. I usually plan on staying awake an additional 15 minutes or so just to make sure it soaks in. It does not clog my pores, but I am not prone to oily skin. This may be different for someone who is.

    Barbe - In regard to your comment about me not having to be concerned about estrogen... I was trying to find a way for this to come out without sounding rude, so I am sorry if it does. If you would re-read my post as well as Minxie's (I think) - we are both ER negative, but we both have concerns regarding estrogen. Hers was synthetic estrogen for fertility stuff and mine was all the hormones in my body during pregnancy - during which time my tumor grew like wildfire. In addition to that, my family history consists of uterine, breast and colon cancer, and although I was triple neg, my sister was triple positive. I just find it somewhat... maybe "presumptuous" on your part that you would just assume from the triple neg dx that I would not care or have to be concerned at all about estrogen. Although it is true, not as much as someone who is ER+, but I still have to be concerned. And if you had read my oncologist's opinion on it... he will not let me go on ANY type of prescription hormone replacement (the phytoestrogen cream is my doing and I have stood my ground on that one because otherwise I turn into a sleep deprived, hot, cranky, crazy woman). So please do not assume that you know what each person is faced with just by glancing at their written dx. Everyone has their own circumstances and it is best not to make assumptions about anyone. 

    As for Monsanto... Yes, they have been around a long time, but it was not until 1982 that they first genetically modified a plant seed. (You can refer to the history page on Monsanto's website). And they were the company in 1994 that thought that it would be so awesome to inject cows with hormones to increase milk production (without having long term studies done) - an action that we now all know has been linked to earlier puberty in girls and increasing risk of breast cancer.  They have modified the soybean, cotton, corn, canola, and most recently got into the sugar business. Their crops infect the crops of farmers who do not use their seeds, but the wind does blow and these farmers' crops are infected by these seeds... then Monsanto comes in and bullies the farmers into either using their seed or suing them for stealing their seed. You are right in that they have aquired just about every seed company out there, and who knows what they are engineering without disclosing it. Ladies, if you haven't seen "Food Inc" I encourage you to do so. 

    Again, sorry for going off topic! Has anyone tried any of the Hyaloranic creams out there??? It says it helps to build and maintain collagen. 

  • lago
    lago Member Posts: 11,653
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    Nordy I think Barbe was just giving her honest opinion, not really assuming. Lets face it even the oncs don't know for sure.That being said I don't agree with Barbe either. I think you might have missed out on my post to minxie on page 4 regarding hormone negative and estrogen:

    "…keep in mind that you can get a new breast cancer that is very different from your first. I would think staying away from HRT, keeping your weight down and anything else that can lower your estrogen might not be such a bad idea even fore triple negatives.

    Not saying you will get a new breast cancer but we are at a slightly higher risk than the general public now that we have 1 diagnosis of bc"

  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 7,605
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    I will make this public rather than PM, Nordy I was most certainly not being "rude" so please don't presume so. If you found it rude then you are just being defensive. Estrogen is not safe for consumption. Period. You feel safe using it, so for the sake of others reading this thread who may think it's safe for them, I pointed out that being ER- does make a difference. I am ER+ and can't touch estrogen. I'd like to think that other ER+ ladies reading this will take note. That was my point. Information. Not rudeness.

  • ruthbru
    ruthbru Member Posts: 47,042
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    We are all more at risk overall of another BC (or recurrence); and as others have pointed out, just because the first one was estrogen negative (or positive) doesn't mean a second one wouldn't have a different pathology; so I think what people are saying is that it seems smart to err on the side of caution.

  • susand
    susand Member Posts: 65
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    Hi.  I am glad I found this thread because I feel like I have aged so much in the past 2 years.  I am in my 40's but would still have to present ID every time I tried to purchase alcohol up until my DX.  I naturally had great skin and even though I was a teen in the 80's and tanned to get as dark as possible, It hadnt done much damage.  Unfortunately I didnt realize that my fountain of youth was actually estrogen.  Now after chemo, an ooph, and Arimidex that fountain has been shut off and I instantly look my age.  Its great to get tips here that help prevent it from getting worse.  Thanks to all.  Oh, and when I really get down on how much I've aged since the DX I think of a quote I once read, "Aging is a privelage that is denied to many"...that makes me hope that I will grow to be a very old and wrinkled woman. 

  • wenweb
    wenweb Member Posts: 471
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    susand:

    I love that quote. 

  • heartnsoul76
    heartnsoul76 Member Posts: 1,204
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    Nordy! OMG, I read your link! They can prosecute farmers for saving their seeds? And their genetic modifying includes making sterile seeds so the farmers have to buy them year after year? They are working so hard to put small farmers out of business - I had no idea it was so insidious. 

    Plus this quote which is relevant for us all:

    "Human health effects can include higher risks of toxicity, allergenicity, antibiotic resistance, immune-suppression and cancer."

    I know this is a topic for a whole 'nother thread, but I just had to respond to you - what a mess!

    P.S. Sorry to go off topic again! 

  • lago
    lago Member Posts: 11,653
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    OK this is for all of us: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q15PlMFQdMg
  • barbe1958
    barbe1958 Member Posts: 7,605
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    I've celebrated each laugh line as it means I've laughed a lot. But what I've found recently with aging is the saggin jowl. At least it pulls out the wrinkles around the eyes! Now I know why so many older women wear turtle necks...I used to think they were cold!