I look for other flat chested women. A rant.
Comments
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tdbear...not for vanity, but when 3 places flagged on the MRI, my nerves were shot, I couldn't deal with 2 lumpectomies on the remaining breast, so off it went.
And I swear by the Handfull bra! I use those inserts in all kinds of clothing...0 -
crystal, what are the inserts made of?0 -
Not for vanity here either. I didn't want the worry of having bc show up in the other breast. I felt like I would be waiting for that other shoe to drop the rest of my life.
I totally love being flat, but that handful bra looks pretty nice. Crystal are the inserts heavy?0 -
Hello everybody ~ it's me again ❤ I've been busy visiting family and unable to post. I had a CT last week and go tomorrow for results. I wanted to make sure nothing is going on before going forward with surgery to take out my left implant and smooth out the right side where implant came out in August.
SunflowersMA ~ you said you had the implants taken out in the office...how did the scars go? Hope this isn't too personal but are you tight flat or do you have lumps where the extra skin is. It could be because my implants were a C size and when the one was taken out in August the flaps he left for future surgery are lumpy.
grammaB ~ I will probably go ahead and get bra/prothesis for both since my deductible is met but am thinking I would only wear if necessary for special dress occasions.
I am also Triple Neg (very agressive) and read somewhere on here where small growths had appeared under the implant and I just want to be able to feel anything if it grows back. I see the MO every 3 months but CT only 6 months unless symptoms appear.
tdbear ~ Is your other side your real boob or an implant? Do you have problems with your back only having one boob? I may be imagining it but my one flat side seems like the back aches because of the uneven weight. No vanity ~ health and sanity. I will look up the handful.com, sounds good.
Ok girls, I just miss my natural "ladies and nipples". Is that too honest? I think I'm just starting to realize they are gone for real and grieving somewhat. Trying to figure out how to be sexy again for myself and hubby. (He says I am and loves me but I just am having a harder time) Maybe there is a feed for that! HaHa!!
xoxo, gwenie0 -
Gwenie, I sure miss my nipples too, the actual boob less so. We have lost body parts, I think it is both normal and healthy to mourn that loss.
Mine was not triple-neg, but it was huge and nasty, and my surgeon asked that I not do recon for 2 years, exactly so that a local recurrence would be easier to detect. Also, so that complications from recon would not interfere with timely completion of treatment. Other than still missing the nipples, I have adjusted pretty well and I doubt I will ever do recon.0 -
SunflowersMA ~ you said you had the implants taken out in the office...how did the scars go?
PS used the original horizontal scar, just about 1 1/2 inch at the side nearest underarm to remove implants. So, no new scars.
Hope this isn't too personal but are you tight flat or do you have lumps where the extra skin is.
LOL - nothing is "too personal" after what we've all been thru
I'm concave, with "angel wings" on each side, used to call them lumpy dog ears, but learned, maybe on this thread, they're angel wings. Much bigger on one side than the other.
It could be because my implants were a C size and when the one was taken out in August the flaps he left for future surgery are lumpy.
Think we all have that "extra" stuff on the sides, used to be part of the "natural" breast, tho not breast tissue. I had very small implants explanted, about 300cm at the most.
Bottom line for me: I AM SO HAPPY NOT HAVING SILICONE LUMPS ON MY CHEST under my pec muscles.
Starting the 5 Tibetan Ritual, also using foam roller on side on yoga mat, will let you know if it helps.0 -
Sunflowers, I hope you enjoy the 5 Tibetan Rites! Just don't overdo it, three reps are all you should do, and stay at that level till you feel you can increase the reps.
If you have any trouble with any of the positions, there is an alternative position explained in the Peter Kelder book...Take care and enjoy! I'd love to hear how you go!0 -
Good Morning Ladies ~
Went to my MO yesterday and I passed my CT with flying colors. (My sweet hubby said I studied hard, he keeps things lighthearted) Yea for me and No Evidence of Disease!!!! NED ~ just found out what that meant and happy to use it! All these terms throw me for a loop.
Anyway told her all about my plans to go "flat" before the end of the year (deductible is met) and as I talked her face started making all sorts of frowns and furrows. As I ended my speech she put on a smile and gently reminded me I didn't have to make such a big decision in a short amount of time. Then went over all the reasons mentally for reconstruction. She said I was young at 57 to go rest of my life without breasts. (I thanked her because I thought 57 wasn't all that young actually) Then stated nicely that my body type with concave chest could look like a man with a rounded belly...and would I really be happy. I was thinking in my mind I would be flat all the way down after I lost some weight but actually my rib cage is slightly bigger on one side than the other and it's not fat. Pooh on reality! Truth is I weigh more than I ever have and just between us I am not in marathon shape. But I can hope for energy and weight loss and a new body can't I? I see the picture of MT1 and think I can do that...be flat and small and cute in a t-shirt.
So, hubby and I are going to ponder and visit more with those that have had mastectomies and stayed flat as well as visit with DIEP and LAT flaps. I'm going to see my BS and PS, talk with them again after the first of the year. Hubby doesn't want me to feel rushed and make a decision just because of ded and the holidays. So I am fine with that.
So, I am taking a break from doctors and celebrating my good report and going to dance all day today as I go about living!! Thanks for listening and I would love feedback. ❤
xoxo, gwenie0 -
Gwennie, check out the Flat And Fabulous group on Facebook. Lots of awesome info.0 -
Gwenie, congratulations and a box of your favorite cookies for not telling the MO to MYOB (mind your own business) - yikes - insulting she was ( as Yoda might say:)
Women are NOT their breasts. Flat & Fabulous, or in my case, Concave & Cute0 -
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Gwenie, congrats on the NED!! Going flat is certainly a choice you can make, don't let the BS or PS or any other dr say recon is best for you and try to push you into it. Only you know what will be best for you and you are wise to take time to decide. We are so much more than our boobs!! You can always go back and do recon later if you go flat and then decide you don't like it.
I have been flat since Aug 13 and am loving it!! I got all the talks too, but my mind was made up right from the start. I'm 64 and just don't need boobs. I got all the bras and prostheses, but am not comfortable in them. I've worn them around the house but feel more uncomfortable in them than without. I'd be totally self conscious out in public in the foobs. I've gone flat everywhere and truly no one even notices.0 -
Hi Gwenie,
My BS talked with me about the beautiful form of a woman and how it is part of our identity. Blah, blah, blah... She strongly encouraged me to see a PS. But I interviewed 5 women who had reconstruction. Four had issues. (Encapsulation, dead tissue, implants leaking, implants moving. One person had two implants and had them removed and is now happily without any reconstruction. The two people I know with DIEP flap both had issues and multiple surgeries to repair the damage (fluid leaking into the abdominal area for 6 months, necrosis and surgery to remove the dead tissue). Not to speak of many surgeries to tweak the foobs. Too high, wrong size, lopsided.... I did not want to have multiple surgeries. And with DIEP flap, you wake up in ICU and are in the hospital multiple days. DIEP flap sounds like a natural choice but my BS said it is a very hard surgery and the longer a patient is under anesthesia, the more potential SE. The blood supply with DIEP flap where they attempt to attach arteries does not always work.
Anyhow, I've nothing against this choice for others. Just sharing my thought process for me. And I agree with you, my ribs also appear huge! I go flat around the house and when I'm not working. But for work I where my poofs for now. I do wish my chest was flatter, but it does appear to look better as time goes on.
Take your time and do talk to women who have had reconstruction and the issues and how they feel. Interestingly, 3 of the 5 women were satisfied with the results in spite of having issues and SE. You'll figure it out. Honestly, I think the BS gets some kind of kick back for referrals. My BS really pushed me very hard to see a PS. I never did.
Georgie0 -
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georgie wrote " My BS talked with me about the beautiful form of a woman and how it is part of our identity."
I would have had a hard time not slugging her! I think that is SO OUT OF LINE, inappropriate, many other things - BUT, I also know so many women who have gotten the same spcheil from their docs - to see the PS the doc worked with - and OH, BTW, they BOTH get more money reimbursed from insurance ( usually) having TWO surgeons working on you - AND their respective offices get more money from the insurance company too. Ok, ok, ok - maybe it isn't true for ALL docs doing this kind of surgery - but I've experienced the "push to reconstruct" myself - and know so many other women who have literally had to DEMAND what they wanted - to be flat & fabulous. A friend who "checks into" these kinds of things, did some research on the charges - and they are SO MUCH HIGHER when a PS does the "finishing" after the BS removes the boobs. Would expect to see this in the media some day soon.0 -
I actually got more grief from my bs re doing the bmx, not about recon. She kept questioning me right up to just before the surgery. I finally said to her, "You know, if I had 3 boobs, I'd still say take them all!!" Thinking back, she really didn't push recon.0 -
Sunflowers MA,
It does not surprise me that the PS and BS get more $$$ when when operate together. It might explain the strong push for reconstruction and referral to a PS. I have also heard from other women say they have been pressured. Guess it is standard. Even saw it on several websites where they mentioned making us "whole". Why should we have to be so insistent that we don't want reconstruction?
Since I really was focused on finding a surgeon to do the mastectomy, I let all her talk all she wanted about a woman's form and reconstruction and didn't take it in... I knew it was MY decision. But it was shocking at the same time. We are so much more than our bodies.
I wonder how much the numerous reconstruction surgeries cost with all the fills, revisions, grafting and tattooing when I can't even get a compression bra under my insurance? Seems a little screwy to me. If I wanted to spend $$$ getting Foobs, they would pay. But they won't pay for a $90 bra to protect me from lymphedema which is about my health.0 -
I had a wonderful female BS. She will not do re-con at time of mx on any of her patients. She never referred me or suggested I go to a PS. I did tell her that I was not interested in re-con and she didn't bat an eye. She did a fabulous job. I got compliments on her nice work from my MO and from the MX bra fitter. In that aspect, I felt fortunate. I am 2 years and 3 months out from sx and my scar is barely visible My only regret is that I had UMX. I wish that I would have had BMX.0 -
I was really grateful to my Surgeon. He listened to me when I said I wanted a Mx and no reconstruction. He said it was entirely my choice, but that the "Door isn't closed!" "If you decide later that you want to reconstruct, you can! He went on to say, "Remember though, it would be a "mound" not a breast!"
That is exactly how I felt about it, he was just confirming, what I already believed. My Mother had not reconstructed after her UMX in the 90's, and I had done my homework, and had looked at the photos on Breast free, and The Scar Project before my surgery.
Almost a year down the track, I still prefer the photos of the non reconstructed women and have never had any issue with my own reflection in the mirror!
This was the absolute right choice for me, and for many of you on this thread. I wasn't pushed or coerced in any way, so I have felt empowered by being supported in my choices.
My heart goes out to the others here, who are having to go through the reversal of surgery that they perhaps didn't really want in the first place and the women who are having reconstruction presented to them as the only option.
I completely support those who have had the options explained to them and choose to reconstruct. That is what's right for them, just as my choice is right for me!0 -
Ariom, your comment, "Almost a year down the track, I still prefer the photos of the non reconstructed women and have never had any issue with my own reflection in the mirror!" is how I still feel more than seven years out.0 -
Glad some women were more fortunate & had BS's who didn't push reconstruction. From what a friend doing research on the issue is finding, that is NOT THE NORM. Especially with WOMEN BS who works "with" a PS in her hospital complex. My harrassment continued when I saw the PS my BS insisted I see ( or she wouldn't do the bilateral I wanted - and that PS kept telling me how much "better cosmetics" I'd get with a DIEP ( I was 62 at the time, still didn't care about "cosmetics" then or now - AND she went on, it would "include a tummy tuck at no additional cost" - I had to "fight" for just implants. Finally went to another PC in a completely different hospital, who took out the extra large expanders ( which I didn't need as I was very VERY large breasted, and could have had immediate reconstruction with implant at time of surgery - BUT, they charge less for that at that hospital) and the new wonderful PS put in the VERY small silicone implants ( less than 300cc I asked for) and also removed them in her office 6 years later when I asked her too.
SO, yes, some women, BS & PS, are wonderful. I pray all the women who have to go thru this, get to see that kind of doctor.
So happy to be out of all that.0 -
River Rat, I am so glad you told me that! I am sure I will never change my mind, but it is great to have it confirmed by someone as far out from surgery as you are!0 -
I looked at a lot of those photos online before my sx. Some of the recon photos were really scary!! They just confirmed that for me, flat was the way to go.0 -
Hi Sunflowers, I have followed all your posts with interest, and really felt for you when you had to go through all that, just to end up having those implants removed. I am also really happy for you that you're so happy with the results and can advise others who are facing the same dilemma.
I am in Australia, and the BC group that I belong to, in the small town where I live has 13 members and growing. Only two of them had Mx and recon, a couple had lumpectomies and the rest of us chose not to reconstruct. Several go flat and fabulous, and the rest of us have boobs foobs and prosthesis. The ages of the group vary from late 40's through to our eldest member who is 81 and had a Mx 2 years ago. We have just heard of a 91 year old who recently had a Umx without recon who is doing well.
My surgeon was trained and operated in South Africa where he set up breast clinics, he moved to London and did similar good works. When I discovered him, he had moved to a large regional town and hour from me, because he wanted to have more time for his family. I was very fortunate to be able to get in to see him quickly, but because of his schedule, I had almost a month to wait for him to do my surgery. I was very impressed by his ethics and experience.
All in all, I was just incredibly lucky, with both my imaging, which was with a brand new state of the art machine, which had just been installed at our local Hospital, which found my DCIS. The DCIS was very likely there, in my previous Mammo, but not seen because it was an old digital image. Right through to getting referred to my Surgeon, and the great Hospital where I had the surgery done.
I had only recently moved to this small coastal town from Melbourne, where there were arguably the best Cancer centers and Doctors available, and I had to explain my decision to lots of friends why I just "knew", that I wanted to be treated here, in my new area.
I don't know if I would have had anywhere near the same experience, if I had still been in the "Big City". So I am forever grateful for the serendipitous chain of events that brought me to where I am now!0 -
Ariom, so sorry to hear there are so many bc women in your small town. I think I was SO disturbed by my own experience because I intentionally chose WOMEN to be my doctors, expecting them to be most empathetic to my wanting to have no reconstruction. In hindsight, I know I wasn't firm enough ( which is very, honestly, unusual for me) but I was still weak in the knees from the diagnosis, and I'd just ( 5 months before) moved to a new part of the country, where I didn't know anyone. So I was doubly "off balance." I soon met wonderful friends, who were so, so nurturing, helpful - and as you've probably found out, once you have bc, there seem to be women all around who know what you're experiencing.
Once I found a wonderful PS, who had only been in this area for a few months, wasn't here when I had my surgery, things turned around for me. As long as I was so "expanded" ( and had several seromas the original PS wanted to put in a drain to drain) she immediately did the very small implants I wanted, and had to do a lot of work to "undo" what the surgeon & PS had done putting in these too large expanders.
Things only got BETTER & BETTER when I went to Dana Farber in Boston for my chemotherapy. A long, long 125 mile drive, but SO WORTH it. They are the just the most wonderful doctors I've ever encountered. SO special, if this experiene can ever be called "easy" - well they made it as easy as possible.
All in the past - now I am "concave & cute" instead of "flat & fabulous" - and I have Angel Wings, not dog ears :-) ( horrible emoticons on this website now, so you can see the smile I now use) - and am happy to "flash" anyone I meet who is questioning having reconstruction! I would be flat if I hadn't had the reconstruction...which is interesting to think about.0 -
Sunflowers, I totally understand how you may have weakened because you were in an unfamiliar place. I am certain, if I hadn't found my Doctor, I could easily have had a much more negative experience because I was new to this place too. I had only been here about 6 months when I got my Dx too. It shattered me. I had, had Ca scares before, but this was very different.
I am forever grateful to the wonderful women here, in my little town, and on this website who took me under their wings when I was at my most scared and vulnerable.
I too, was surprised to see how many women were in our BC group, but since none of us are from here, it makes a bit more sense, older women with BC who have retired to the same area. Bearing in mind that these are just the women who don't work, and who choose to come to our meetings, there are likely more of us in this little town of about 2000 people. The big regional town just 12 minutes drive away has another very large group with BC and a younger group too. There is a BC Dragon Boat team too, who travel all over the world to compete. We also have 2 McGrath Breast Nurses who are financed by the fund raising started after the Aussie Cricketer McGrath's wife was Dx and passed away and continues to raise huge amounts every year in her name. So this area has a lot of BC connection and they raise funds all the time, not just in October:)
I am smiling at your "Concave and Cute!" with Angel wings. I too, have no problem flashing my flat side to anyone who is conflicted about recon. I have also been known to whip out a foob, or prosthesis in our meetings to show someone new what they are like:)
I am so glad you ended up finding the right people and place for you, so many never do, and that colors their experience forever.
I am very glad to be here, with you, and all the others, who can give different perspectives on what is available to women who are facing these difficult decisions.
This is a very worthwhile place to be.0 -
Like reading about ladies who are happy being flat, or concave. I did not want reconstruction but am in the process of accepting my new body. Still dealing with side effects, but the scar is healing nicely so far.
Georgie0 -
Hi georgie, reading your dx, you've been through a lot. This new surgery is so recent for you, so not surprised it is taking a little time to accept the differences.
Are you having SE's from the meds?
Glad to hear your scar is healing nicely. I still massage mine and do the stretching exercises to keep everything supple and to prevent any adhesions. I'm still using the ScarFx strips at night to keep the incision flat and to take any redness out.
I wish you all the best georgie!0 -
georgie - WOW, your latest surgery is almost like today. Seriously, I think it takes time, months & months, to heal from it. The drains ( which I called my plastic hand grenades) were awful, had to learn to sleep on my back, which was NEVAH ( I'm in MA) my sleep position. What made it possible, was when an angel of a massage therapist, showed me how important it was to have a WEDGE shaped pillow under my knees. Now, 6 years later, that's about the only position I can be in to fall asleep.
But the STRESS of the surgery. Yuck, I don't know what the "standard" is now. But I had the surgery one day, and was sent home from the hospital the next morning. Getting out of bed was, ah, well, lets just call it, awkward.
The good news. This is your last breast surgery. But really, it's too SOON for you to do anything but think about healing. Esp. after the l-o-n-g time you've had dealing with bc. That alone is exhausting. I think the acceptance you're looking to create will come as you heal, and become more active. Meanwhile, be gentle and patient with yourself.
I was "explanted" as I call it in July, still haven't bought the silky camisole I've promised myself, but some day soon.0 -
It has been a couple of months since I last posted anything on this site. I have had my world turned upside down after the surgeries. As some of you already know, my boss gave my job to someone else after my first surgery (constructive dismissal); then told me my services 'were not longer required' on my first day back after my second surgery. I worked really hard to find new work and managed to find two part time jobs. in the last two weeks, I have been told by my current 4 day a week employer, that he is retiring on December 31st. leaving me with 1 day of work per week at my other job. I had to make the very tough decision to give up my beautiful 4 year old shih tzus because I will no longer be able to afford to take care of them. My husband and I split up and I am living in the basement of our house because neither of us can afford to live elsewhere; and my only child (23) is likely going to be shipped thousands of miles away within the next couple months to work. I have also developed pain in my arms and hands which I am controlling through exercise and massage. I am going to see my surgeon next month, as my second surgery left me with a lump and possible seroma. I have been doing some research on breast reconstruction, which in my case would have to be implants. I am sooooo glad you ladies are here because logging on and reading your updates reminded me why I went flat in the first place, and that it is the right decision for me. This is important to have in mind when I see my surgeon as he is likely to bring up the issue of a plastic surgery referral when I see him in December. I go flat everywhere - home and work. I think the only place it bothers me is at the gym, where I am self conscious that people check each other out in judgment. I know it will also bother me when my (separated) husband decides to start dating a breasted woman. Thank you all for sharing.0
