I WANT MY MOJO BACK!
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Since I was perimenopausal before this whole cancer thing came up, I was already having problems with orgasm - the intensity was gone, as well as night sweats. So with the phytoestrogen supplements my Gyn doc told me to take, everything improved. I mean they really worked! But then, 2 months later, I found out about the BC, which was hormone +, so bye bye phytoestrogen capsules. Now a year later, after Lumpectomy, Radiation and now 6 months of tamoxifen, the sexual problem has really gotten worse, it's like I'm dead down there and along with weak sensations, it's also become very difficult to get to an orgasm at all, not to mention the hot flashes. It's at the point where I was considering bio identical hormone balancing or just taking a break from the tamoxifen and going back on my phytoestrogen supplements for awhile. I've also been researching herbal remedies. But I went to my Med Onc today and told him about all these problems and he gave me a prescription for Wellbutrin to help the libido as well as the horrible mood swings I've been having. When I got home, I started researching this wellbutrin and found out that many studies show that it actually helps women with sexual dysfunction as a side benefit even though the company that makes it is not promoting it for this benefit. So now I'm eager to try it. Wondering if anyone else has tried this? I will let you know how it does for me in a few weeks.
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I'm on Wellbutrin (among others) for stress and don't notice a difference in my libido, but I've always been highly sexual. Too bad my husband isn't anymore......sigh.
Good luck! It's a drug that you don't feel in your system, but has to build up. Give it a chance...
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rguiff- you might want to check into interference with tamoxifen and wellbutrin- I ran into something on here about wellbutrin being an inhibitor of tamoxifen- it might be newer research and not common knowledge amoung docs? I have been on Wellbutrin for years and will be going on tamoxifen after I finish chemo, so I'm not sure what will happen. I like Wellbutrin a lot tho- it def helped in the sex dept- at least until I went into chemopause. I was pretty solidly still pre-menopausal before this, so i'm hoping that goes away, I get my period back, and tamoxifen doesn't interfere too much.
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loved the postions and the cute names that help you remember them...learned about Crouching Tiger from my last BF (the first significant post BC boyfriend), when you add a vibrator that you control in front, you will both be on the ceiling...but I'm ready to try some of the others...and I found a new man to try them with, well he's not so "new" , we have been friends for the past year or so, but at the time I was involved with someone else (the aforementioned proponent of the Crouching Tiger)..
post the BIg BReak up, dating several guys for the past two months with The Friend in the mix, I have found so many new things to ponder about life after BC, life after a big break up, relationships in our mid 50's..
what's new with The Friend?..he is 6 years younger than I am, he seems to adore me and has for a long time, and he is poor as a churchmouse (there had to be a "bad news"part, didn't there?)..
the 3 other previous significant relationships (2 pre BC, one post BC) have been with guys the same age as me or older than me, commitment phobes ultimately, and successful to wealthy guys
and unlike the last one who was the same age as me, with the new one erections are never a problem..woo hoo for that!
I am tired of the dating thing and going to settle down and give The Friend a try..he's very different from the 3 others
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RoseG -- I've been on Welbutrin for 5 or 6 years now and before I had to increase my zoloft it worked like a charm. I wanted sex every day and night. Wore my poor DH out as his libido has never been over active. If your onc gave you the perscription you shouldn't worry as most of the med oncs are more up-to-date on drug interactions than the internet reports. If you are worried about a conflict call him/her up and ask. Don't rely solely on the web/internet for information.
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Alyad, I had come across something like what you described, and did read a little more about it. What I read didn't sound thoroughly convincing though. My Med Onc is pretty up on research, so I trust him. He even told me about a new remedy for hot flashes, that is being used with good results, although it hasn't been studied here. It's called tincture of rhubarb and I'd probably have to look online to find it. Even if the Wellbutrin does make tamoxifen a little less effective, I think the quality of life I'll gain if it works is worth it. Because this sex problem has really been stressing me out and stress is what I really feel caused my cancer in the first place! And besides, I've been feeling ambivalent about the tamox anyway, even considering whether or not to stay on it or to go the natural route. But for now, I'm encouraged by what you and Shannon56 have said about the Wellbutrin's effects. I'm hoping it has the same effect for me!.
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Hi Ladies,
I'm glad I found this sight. I had my ovaries removed in Oct of 08 & diagnosed with BC in Jan 09. I have not had a sexual drive since October and now that I have started Tamoxifen it seems worse. I am going to mention Wellburtin to my Onc. Thanks for sharing this info. Happy Mothers Day!!
Diane
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SSRI antidepressants are the ones that may cause tamoxifen to not work properly. Wellbutrin is not an SSRI so I think it is OK. If you are taking an SSRI and tamoxifen you need to talk to your onc about it. My PCP didn't know this and when I questioned him about it he left the room, came back and said I shouldn't take them both. Since I never wanted to start the antidepressant to begin with I slowly weened myself off. Here is part of the article:
Interactions between certain genetic polymorphisms and antidepressants called selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) may be associated with altered tamoxifen activity, according to a new study in the January 5 issue of the Journal of the National Cancer Institute.
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cut and pasted from another thread- says that despite Wellbutrin not being an SSRI it is an inhibitor of Tamoxifen. maybe this is outdated
Meanwhile, here's some info about drugs that inhibit CYP2D6 that should be avoided while taking tamoxifen:
http://medicine.iupui.edu/clinpharm/COBRA/TamoxifenGuide.pdf
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Hi Ladies,
Can I join this discussion because I sure need your insights and advice! Not only is my libido missing in action, but sex is downright painful.
Very quick background: Hysterectomy on 50th birthday, BC near 51st birthday. Vaginal dryness was my only issue -- and was fine with a little lube -- until chemo in January. With Taxotere, I got so dried out that every time we tried sex I wound up bruised and torn even with a boatload of lube!
So we knocked off sex until I was through chemo, but I've been using Replense the entire time to keep things from drying out even more. Just tried it again -- and the pain is still there. It's like there's no elasticity left at all. I finished chemo a month ago.
My medical oncologist was no help. He referred me to my gyno who just said that my tissues were in good shape, and to use the Replense and I'd be fine.
That's just not happening. I not only want my mojo back, but that does me no good if I can't do anything about it!
My husband has been extremely patient but enough is enough already. It's been 5 months!
Thanks for listening and thanks in advance for any advice you can offer.
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Dear texas357,
Am so sorry to read about this. Are you doing things slowly, with plenty of foreplay? Without estrogen, I think, our bodies take much longer to warm up.
I'm mid-chemo and also in chemical ovarian shut down. I'm using Replens too. I am finding that we need to start really slowly, and for the first little while it feels like it is going to be painful or not work, but gradually my body relaxes and can accommodate him without pain. So he enters me bit by bit, and lets me go at my own pace so that I am in charge of when he moves further into me. I think it requires a fair degree of self control on the part of the man, but after about 5 minutes of careful and gentle my body has opened up and we can go at it more. One he was literally one inch inside me for about 5 minutes while my body decided whether it wanted him there or not. It decided it did, and so he penetrated me more, still very slowly.
We also play lots of games - role play, etc, I suppose you would call it - which helps my body get in the mood. We did this anyway, but I am sure glad of it now. And on the times when my body is not behaving, I recommend fellatio as a means of making sure your man feels well loved!
I hope some of this is helpful - I am sure others with more experience than I will be along shortly.
So those are the things I would suggest.
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Sakura thanks for reccomending the Pjur- good stuff! I think it was on another thread- but its a great silicone based lube- get the stuff for women. I found it at the local adult store- it was about 20 bucks. I am just coming off chemo tx 4 and really not in the mood at all- but we'd bought the stuff and decided to do some "research" on how it felt on both of us- well we're both all lubed up- he's hard, I don't feel "that" bad, let's do it.While I wasn't really aroused, it was still kinda fun and didn't hurt (but do take it very slow at first like Sakura said).
The level of friction is def different than normal- maybe a little tackier? For it me is kinda similar to using a condom vs nothing- the condoms we used were the Trojan her pleasure that have a little texture on them. I went off the pill when I was dx so we used those for several months- he got a vasectomy in Feb (Happy Valentines' Day!) and just recently got checked to ensure he's shooting blanks. DH thought it felt different with the pjur too- in a very good way.
I cannot say enough about Mr Big too-Hitachi Magic wand- If I have the potential to get there at all, it will work. some days I still feel nada even with that- but its nice to know that will work sometimes. I used that with the Crouching Tiger a couple times- holy crap!
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Thanks Sakura. If I read between the lines, things do get easier? Kind of "use it or lose it"? Which goes in line with something I read somewhere that increasing blood flow to the area on a regular basis is helpful?
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Sakura - you are so right on with the slow entry - it's the only thing that let's me loosen up and enjoy the ride. You younger gals are so open!! Thank you...
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Texas357, I have been told it is indeed use it or lose it. I do think it will be a work in progress as long as my body is so starved of estrogen, and it would be logical that it become more difficult over time, but at least if we keep using the area as nature intended we won't totally dry up!
I do find I still have some natural lubrication after lots of foreplay, but the Pjur helps me relax (Alyad - glad the Pjur worked for you guys!) I had a really nice PM from someone after I first posted on this thread warning that she'd given herself long time vaginal infections from trying to keep up her sex life when her body really didn't want to. I don't want to create problems for myself later, but I do want a a sex life, and a lubricant seems to be the answer at the moment.
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She might have gotten problems because she didn't use a lubricant and had small vaginal tears that got infected.... 0
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I've also read that local use of estrogen is beneficial, and there's just a small amount that gets into your system. I've got to admit that sounds appealing too.
I've been able to avoid infection but only because we abstain for quite a bit of time in between attempts, to give the tears and bruising time to heal.
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I know lubricants are always recommended for the dryness, but that's not really my problem. Has anybody found any of those topical gels or lubricants that claim to increase your sensations to really work? I've tried Zestra and the smell is horrible. It seemed like it might have worked a little the first time I used it but after that it felt like any other lubricant. I've tried a product sold by Walmart called Excite. It has L-arginine and menthol among it's ingredients. The menthol caused a burning sensation that was annoying. I've tried the Siilk lubricants. The one called "tingling" also had menthol which was irritating after awhile and the one called "warming" was better but really didn't help increase sensations enough. Now I see KY has come out with a new one called Intense arousal gel which is about $30.00 and claiming to heighten arousal and intensify a woman's climax. In looking at the ingredients, they seem to be similar to other lubricants, but with tocopherol, which I know is Vit E and niacin added. I also bought Arginmax for women, pills that when taken over several weeks should eventually work by increasing the blood flow to the area , similar to what viagra does for men. I tried a bottle of it which lasted 2 wks, then didn't buy anymore, because I felt that I should have noticed a little something changing by that point.
I hate to keep throwing my money away on these products, but am willing to keep searching until I find something that really helps to increase the sensations, because I'm having such a hard time where before I used to get heated up so easily. The Zestra was the one I had had the most hope for because there seemed to be some actual medical research done showing that it really helped the majority of the women who used it, so that was a letdown. I really feel like I've lost something important in my life. I'm getting tempted to just start taking my GNC phytoestrogen pills again, which I took before I found out abuot the BC. And they really worked for the sexual problem as well as hot flashes. But soy, black cohosh, and evening primrose were some of the ingredients in this product, so I haven't taken them since. However, I've also read some
Dr's opinions on the fact that phytoestrogens might be good estrogens for breast cancer patients that take the place of the bad ones. This is why I keep getting tempted to try them again. Don't know how well they would work with tamoxifen though. I've also tried the estrogen cream. This seems to help with the lubrication but not sensation. I've heard that testosterone cream might also help, but my GYN was reluctant to prescribe that.Anybody experienced with this problem or any products that actually work?
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Hi Rose,
I have not tried any of the lubricants you mention - I stick to Pjur which works for me. I am ER+ so can't have any estrogen-related products anyway. I do recall during my 2 weeks on Tamoxifen (while doing fertiity preservation pre-chemo) I did feel somewhat numb down there. Hope you find something which works.
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My MOJO is back but DH is too afraid he'll hurt me right now. I've talked with him and told him if we go slowly things should be alright. We've used a lubricant since I had my hysterechtomy 5 years ago so that isn't a problem. I tried the Pjur but it didn't seem to work as well as H20 - System JO. I have to have a silcone based product as the water based ones simply don't work at all.
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Gee H2O sounds more like a water based one!
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You're right barbe1958 I actually use the System JO, just grabbed the wrong name on the bottle.
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So I've been following this thread recently and though I have no advice regarding substances that will stimulate our libidos or make us more orgasmic (other than some of the things discussed before like testosterone, L-arginine and others that I can't recall offhand), I will say this....I've been on the MOJO thread now for 4 years and have tried nearly everything and suggested lots of possible aids. Over & over we've discussed the dryness issue, the libido issue, orgasms and the crucial emotional component to it all. If I had to summarize what most have found to work, I'd say that what has worked are approaches that focused on connecting with one's partner and creatively recognizing and enhancing our own sexuality and sensuality. What I mean by this is that if we can't find actual physical remedies for the lower libidos and difficulties with orgasms throughthe traditional, tried-and-true means, we have found that experimenting and being open to innovation has often worked. So, to those who are currently experiencing these issues, I'd say, first and foremost, give it time. This is what it takes for our bodies to take stock and adjust and nearly every one of us finds a new (and highly satisfying!) sexual path. In the meantime, it seems that most of us choose to do anything possible to keep the plumbing in good working order and the emotional connection with our partners healthy. We've done lots of things to these ends, each choosing what is most acceptable, comfortable and helpful. Some of the things we've tried include using erotica (written or film) and even porn (men love when you join them in enjoying this, but for some, this is immoral or against her religious or political beliefs), using toys ranging from dress-up props to handcuffs and blindfolds to benwah balls and butt plugs . For others, a new piece of lingerie and a long, sensual massage or hot tub gets them worked up. As for achieving orgasm, I've yet to hear anyone here recommend anything better than the Hitachi Magic Wand. The bottom line with that amazing instrument is that it can be virtually guaranteed to give you the O...and probably more than one.
I hope that some of you get the chance to read back over the years because I can't begin to summarize all that we've discussed and all of the individual aids many women have discovered to work for them. Whatever you do, DO NOT GIVE UP because it is absolutely not a lost cause. Having lost so much from having been diagnosed with this effing disease, you should not have to lose something so vital and pleasureable as your sexuality. So if you have the energy and the desire, fight for it. It should be yours!
~Marin
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Well said Marin! Almost sounded like an acceptance speech for something, but I can't figure out what! hehehehehe
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Okay, so let me say this - turns out that even during chemopause my body can still get all hot and bothered without lots of lubricant. I could not believe how open and ready I was for DBF when he entered me. The trick? Oral sex. Extensive. Not to orgasm (that happened afterwards) but for quite a while, with no pressure to come or anything.
I recommend it!!!!! And as Marin says, I think as much as anything it was an emotional thing. I was really, really relaxed, and my body remembered what to do.
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'They' do say that a woman's orgasm is 90% from her head....
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I have not posted her in a while....still no MOJO with my DH but always with MrBig...lol (aka Hitachi Magic Wand)
I have read on other threads about the pec muscles acting up whenever we open a heavy door or just cutting up veggies.......Well have any of you noticed when you get the Big O that those pectorals go into spasms......lol.......or is it just me?.......
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Linda...How cool is that? I can't say that I've ever had my pecs spasm for any reason, but it makes sense to me that they're involved in orgasm. In fact, it makes sense that most of our muscles are involved, but especially those connected to our more erogenous areas.
I'm not sure if you've tried relying upon oral sex to achieve orgasm, but I highly recommend it, as long as your partner knows how you want it done. For me, it's as surefire as Mr. Big (Hitachi Wand)...well, almost. It takes somewhat longer, but I find it significantly more pleasureable and the pleasure waves involve nearly my entire body (vs. being more localized from the vibe)
P. had to be away this weekend (only the 2nd weekend apart in the year since we met...the 1st was a camping/fishing trip that I wasn't at all interested in). I can't stop thinking about what we would be doing if he were here
!~Marin
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Can anyone remember - is it ok to use pure coconut oil inside the vajay-jay?
I know it's great for massaging and slipping about together, but not sure if it's suitable for using inside......
Any info gratefully received!
Sam
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FitChik and Sakura73, oral was always great for me before. It was what got me started, even when I wasn't really in the mood. Now, it does absolutely nothing for me and this makes me so sad. It's like I'm numb down there and nothing seems to be connected anymore. I don't know if it's the tamoxifen or just progression of perimenopause. I was having problems, like decreased orgasmic intensity before this whole BC thing started, but now I can't come at all with husband, and by myself, it takes a lot of intense concentration and is usually not worth the trouble. I'm currently on wellbutrin prescribed 2-1/2 weeks ago, mainly for this reason. I think it made the orgasms better initially, but now I'm not so sure that it's still working. I've tried some other things (see my earlier post) and am thinking of doing some of the herbal combos that I've been reading about,. I'm still researching because I know some of these products are somewhat estrogenic.
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