Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?
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Mandalala...I imagine that if Jesus was here today, he would be quite offensive to the right wing christians of the US. He would threaten all of the rigidity of their outlook...loving everyone, and all. I am no expert on Jesus, so I could be way off base, but I think you nailed it on the head by saying "maybe they wouldn't find him rightwing enough." I am constantly amazed at how inconsistent the rightwing here in this country is with the basic ethics of love thy neighbor and turn the other cheek. They seem to look for the issues on which there is least agreement, rather than focusing on the things we might all agree need help. Focus on abortion, rather than helping homeless families with young children. Focus on gay marriage, rather than supporting young married couples with strong protection for maternity/paternity leave. I just get so angered by it all.
And then I see my Maori tagline...and I head off to the sunshiny back deck...:)
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lindasa - that's the MOST frightening thing I've learned about all this - had never heard of it before - was astonished to hear one of the MEN trying to ge a presidential candidate say something ( paraphrasing here) about President Obama being "too concerned about the Earth" that "we're supposed to have Dominion over it" ------ PLEASE somebody tell me he meant to say STEWARDSHIP - as in leaving the Earth even better than we found it! "Take only pictures, leave only footprints..."
I really think this is all making me feel even sicker than bc - and I never thought that was possible....
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There are those within organized religion who make no secret that they believe that the Earth ...and animals too ... were given to us to use and abuse as we see fit. They believe it's all about humans. Not my idea of 'stewardship' either.
Never understood that view even when I was church going myself. I would think that a god who had created all this beauty and all the wonderful plant and animal life would be most royally p*ssed to watch it being wantonly destroyed.
What SoCalLisa said! Especially in politics and government. And our private lives too please.
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what WR said - also, just being practical, we can't SURVIVE without stewarship of the only Earth we have. Jeez - don't get me started on the loonies who are denying global warning - hope they aren't trying to ski in western ma, or vt this winter....
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well, I am sure if there had been an internet in the ice ages, they would have found a cause for that too...weather on the earth seems to be cyclic...warming, ice, etc...
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I agree that there have always been periods of climate change. Which is what they should have called it instead of global warming. But I do believe that some of our practices are accelerating the changes.
And more importantly we have (or had - it may already be too late) a chance that people did not have in the past ... to use our knowledge of science to mitigate the damage. Instead we are overloaded with denial and that is a pity IMO.
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There was an article in our San Diego Union Tribune about the city planning for
higher water levels...
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I believe that Allstate, or perhaps State Farm, has ceased offering flood insurance in several Virginia counties. They're doing that because of the projected rise in sea level.
You'd think that the right would take notice, since it's an all-powerful, all-knowing corporation that's recognizing climate change.
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As an aside, since Romney believes that corporations are people, is he guilty of murder for dismantling companies? Just curious.
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Hi Ladies,
Just found you all - I can't possibly go back and read everything, but wanted to tag in here. You've probably been through this already, but I was amazed at the number of people saying that they would pray for me when they found out that I had BC. I accepted it as their form of offering some support, but I doubt it did any good. I appreciated the thought behind it though. I'm a high school science teacher and very analytical so approached this (like much in my life) rationally and learned all I could about it to have the best chance of doing well.
I skimmed some posts and agree that I was surprised at the number of women who automatically choose MX, but I understand that everyone is different. I, myself, had 3 lumpectomies with unclear margins and did finally end up with a UMX which found more DCIS but I fought the MX with 3 other surgeries first.
-Judy
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I've decided, like many others on here, to hedge my bets and identify myself as an agnostic! I found that I can no longer believe the strict Catholic doctrine I grew up with. It's kind of sad, since life was much simpler and more reassuring when I was a true believer, However, I found that once I turned that corner, there was no going back. I would like to believe that there is some ratioinale for our being here, and a reason why we were afflicted with BC, but I haven't been able to find it. I find it impossible to believe in a loving, caring God who would allow innocent children suffer with painful diseases and disabilities, not to mention our affliction with BC.
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Hi, Judy, my fellow October surgery member and fellow high school science teacher, and fellow atheist!
Being one that automatically chose umx, I can say it was because I'd already been through a year and a half of ongoing mammos, mris, biopsies and excisions. I was contemplating getting a mx even if the last biopsy came back benign because I just couldn't keep going to full alert about my left breast (the right never has said "boo"). I was tired of it all. Also, I didn't want to have rads and that would have been the protocol if I'd had a lumpectomy.
I am sorry that your lumpectomies weren't enough to take care of it for you. I wish that that route had worked out for you. I am glad that we can just keep on keepin' on...:) Wishing you all the best...
Basilsmom...I was raised atheist and have never even remotely believed in a god...but I can completely relate to you saying that everything seemed so much simpler. I have often found myself wishing I could believe in some greater power...and I could relax and not work so hard. But, I don't believe in some greater power and so I work hard at making my life experience and the life experiences of those around me as good as possible. There are days, though...
Of course, that is the trick, isn't it...to take those hard days and find meaning and beauty in them...
Here's to all of us...finding meaning and beauty in all we do! (A virtual raise of the glass in toast to us all)...
Claire
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Claire,
Your response was so helpful to me! It is good to know that I am not alone in my feelings. I wish I could have something that gives me complete security and reassurance, but I will have to settle for a lot of possibilities, but no guarantee. It is really helpful to have people like you in the same corner. I will continue to believe that living life as the best person I can be is its own reward. Good luck!
Sandy
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I too was raised catholic. Did it give me purpose? I don't think so. It was a just a way of life handed down from my parents. I must say I loved all the rituals and special celebrations on holy holidays. It did teach me to be good. Imagine me a NUN. What was I thinking.
My adult children have never really been exposed to any organized religon. I had a lot of pressure when they were young to baptize, sunday school ed, blah blah, but I just could not be a hypocrite.They are good people with great charachter, empathy and compassion. And HAPPY. We had a conversation on Saturday about religon. They are both devout athiets and live an honest life. More than I can say about some of my god fearing friends.
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CLC - I hope I didn't come across as critical of those who chose MX. It was not my 1st choice, but again we're all different. Now I think of it as instead of 6 weeks of rads I had 6 weeks of recovery from the MX. What branch of science do you teach? I'm a physics teacher through and through - when hired on 5 years ago at my current school, as I was on my way out the Upper School director said he had a last few questions for me, one he asked was whether or not I could teach chemistry. My answer - I can't but I'd rather not. So far I've not been asked - thank goodness.
chef127 - I was raised Jewish and I too love the traditions. I now refer to myself as a traditional jew, not a religous one. We celebrate Hanukkah with our son, we go to a seder at my in-law's house, but that's about it. We do not keep a kosher house and I don't keep kosher for passover, but I do love to make fried matzo for myself and my son. It was good to hear about your kids because we haven't exposed our 9 year old son to much other than the traditions and I sometimes wonder if we should. We are raising a caring and kind child so I think we're doing OK.
As a teacher, we always have a discussion at the beginning of the school year about that which we can test and that which we cannot and about science and religion, the provable and the impossible to disprove. It's always an interesting discussion and hopefully starts the students thinking about it at least. We have one science teacher who's a vehement atheist and another who doesn't believe in evolution, so things can get interesting sometimes.
-Judy
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We are the only society in the world that denies Climate Change. The biggest danger to our society is the fear and denial of science by fundamentalists. In spite of numerous court cases where Creationism and Intelligent Design were declared religion rather that science, the far right is still campaigning to have Intelligent Design taught along science. Here is a link to a 135 page court ruling from Pennsylvania on Intelligent Design. It is interesting reading for those of you who have the time. http://www.pamd.uscourts.gov/kitzmiller/kitzmiller_342.pdf
Here is a video of Ken Miller's lecture on the Kitzmiller decision.
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Oh, notself, there you go getting all truthy and factual again. You know that emotion sells, right?
:-)
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smiles to scoot.....ain't it the truth....this election season seems the worst I can remember for years...suddenly "religious leaders" who didn't seem to "notice" when children were being abused for years, have gone all "huffy" about their "rights" - shudder, shudder, shudder....
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Do the Catholic bishops understand that they're pallin' around with Republican death penalty murderer-type people?
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scoot
I asked that question once, to a "believer" -- and was told, (I'm not kidding) "it's not (the M word) if done in the name of Dog." Well, he didn't say, ah, Dog. Also noticing that several of Sanatorum's speeches from 2008 are being recycled on line, where he "warns" that we are all under attack from Satan ( an I don't think he mean the soft shiny material ;-)
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So spake all leaders of religious wars throughout history.
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Notself, thanks for the links..really interesting, but also so bemusing that people can talk about creationism and intelligent design as though they are valid scientific alternatives to evolution....it's something which I think most Europeans find really difficult to understand about U.S. fundamentalists...even in highly conservative, Catholic Malta, schools discuss Darwin and evolution but never bring up intelligent design or creationism. I think most practising Christians here see the story of genesis as symbolic rather than literal...ie the 7 days were not REALLY 7 days, but represent millions of years, and so on.
What is frightening about fundamentalists of all colours and creeds is that their ideas are built on fear and superstition, and frightened people are capable of doing very frightening things indeed.
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I agree with what Maria says - and what especially frightens me about 'fundmentalism" - is there is a large segment of the States that thinks it's OKAY - as long as it's "christian" fundamentalism...
more shudders....deeeeeeep shudders....
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.....and they fail to see that the fundamentalism they're espousing is equivalent to that "other" religion's fundamentalism that they so adamantly fear and despise. Perhaps it's time to give them a name: American Taliban? (Sorry, that's not original).
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Lindasa
SO agree - but that would sadly include what Conservative used to mean - does anyone remember Goldwater? While I was not a supporter - he believed in Choice -saying if he had to chose between a Government or an Individual deciding what to do with her body, it was definitely an easy Choice.
What was once called Conservative, seems to have morphed into this dangerous fundamentalism - wish there was a stronger word than fundamentalism to describe it - but fear using the wrld 'taliban' wold just fuel the flames...
first time in my life I've felt so hopeless about anything....
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I don't feel hopeless ... I am downright angry to my core.
I think it is a last gasp attempt to take us back to the dark ages by those who yearn for the 'good old days' that never were good for the vast majority of people the first time around.
Fantasy and fear and ignorance of history fueled by the greed of those who would profit and see themselves as robber barons in their Brave New World. It's sick.
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Things are really extreme when a Presidential candidate can get away with saying that main line Protestants are not true Christians.
"We look at the shape of mainline Protestantism in this country and it is in
shambles, it is gone from the world of Christianity as I see it." http://www.drudgereport.com/flash3s.htm http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/02/21/santorum-and-satan-the-devil-is-in-the-details/John Kennedy had to reassure America that he would not be ruled from Rome. I don't think Santorum can say the same.
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And the fundamentalist evangelicals are so hungry for the power to make laws to control others that they are lining up behind 2 Catholics and a Mormon ... none of whom they considered as 'real' Christians just a short while ago. The whole scenario being played out here is like an episode of the Twilight Zone. With all the players competing to see who can take things to the most absurd level.
Religion can be a good thing and make people's lives better and I have many friends who show me that by their actions on a daily basis. But we are seeing now what happens when it is misused as a tool for those who seek earthly power.
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The candidates want to take us back to the good old days of the Founding Fathers. You know about those days. Those were the days of slavery and women being unable to vote.
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Also there was no electricity, no cars, no phones, no computers, no airplanes, no plumbing, litle health care or free education and it wasn't just women who couldn't vote. It was white male landowners only. Is that what the Republican candidates want?!?!
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