Great saying about depression
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Thanks Kate,
Barbe-Dh passed away in Aug 2010.----There is some very sophisticated neuro testing avialble in the last few years. He would have never regained superficial skin sensation. It was very sad. I know he was pissed at himself once it happened b/c as a nurse I studied the drugs I was giving to patients, always, very extensively b/c it's what you don't know that can cause the worst problems.
I always try to take the lowest dose of what ever. Even lower than the beginning recommended start level. For example, Celexa is usually 20 mg , I rook 10 mg and still had major s/e/'s Savella, I take 25 mg twice a day , the usual dose is 50 twice a day.
Xanax-is aprazolam--it is a bensodiazepine-----in the same family class as valiun, Ativan, restoril.
The antidepressants are in the SSRI or SNRI or Maoi groups. I will try to find something I wrote for another thread and bring it back here.
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This might explain a washoit period------- br back with the SNRI?SSRI stuff
Jul 19, 2011 11:58 pm, edited Jul 19, 2011 11:59 PM by sas-schatzi sas-schatzi wrote:
To all-have seen multiple posts re: which new thing is working. Just a phrase to add to all the other info that clogs our brains. A WASHOUT PERIOD. This is a time when you stop one treatment and start another. In studies this washout period can last from weeks to months. It depends on the study. 8- 12 weeks in general. Ren you can ask pharmacist husband.
What the washout does is prevent giving credit or discredit for a treatment response -- bad or good or none, to the new tx. Just as many responders have said, I did 2-3 things different didn't know which one is working. That's how a washout helps. When I quit Arimidex, I did a 2 1/2 month washout before starting Femara. When Femara started with s.e. within 3 weeks, there was no question in my mind they were attributable to Femara. Conversely, when the Arimidex sledgehammar hit. the s.e. were growing for a time, but then I started Celexa. The hammer came down within 2 weeks. I chose to quit both drugs b/c I couldn't tell which one was the offender. Symptoms kept getting worse with a final dx of fibro given in DEC 09. Arimidex started May 09 symptoms started slow, but on pain meds for sx>>>sept got real worse, celexa started sept 29th09>>>...stopped both drugs nov09>>> dec fibro dx. The point I hope is clear ---muddled won't help
We are so desperate for a response, too many things may be changed at once. If something goes bad like an increase in s.e which drug/tx do we blame. Again , conversely, if things go well. Is it b/c of all or only one. Are we then adding something to the regimen that could have been left out. Some may say, if it's all good who cares I'll just keep doing them all. I get that. But all drugs have consequences, we may not be aware at first what they are, but long term could be a problem. For example the D controversy. My Endocrine doc feels excessive amounts of D, We must watch kidney function every 3 months/ and it could adversely impact parathyroid levels and phosphorus. On the D thread I was the only one to mention it and it wasn't mentioned by any of the ONC docs to any of the posters. Well is it b/c the ONCS don't know?. The run to a new tx, must not hurt us in the long term, i.e kidney dysfunction years down the road. So, just a suggestion to try and leave a washout period between new tx's, I know it easier said then done, I have aged visualy 10years b/c of insomnia. I so want to do anything to get it under control. UGH.
So, consideration of a washout or lapse time between new treatments to allow a drug or tx to be able to be given full credit or discredit for the change. Rennasaus' Dh might be able to give us a rough minimum of weeks between adding something new.
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Theses are antidepressants drugs by class.
Jul 23, 2011 01:12 pm, edited Jul 23, 2011 02:21 PM by sas-schatzi sas-schatzi wrote:
Hi AGD, welcome. There are multiple neurotransmitters in the brain. Serotonin, norepnephrine, dopamine, these are the major players. Will do a quick search after I post this and add if there are more that I either didn't know about or have forgotten. I will also try to find a complete list of drugs in each group versus just naming a few and add them.
SSRI-selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor
citalopram (Celexa, Cipramil, Emocal, Sepram, Seropram)
escitalopram oxalate (Lexapro, Cipralex, Esertia)
fluoxetine (Prozac, Fontex, Seromex, Seronil, Sarafem, Fluctin (EUR))
fluvoxamine maleate (Luvox, Faverin)
paroxetine (Paxil, Seroxat, Aropax, Deroxat, Paroxat)
sertraline (Zoloft, Lustral, Serlain)
dapoxetine (no known trade nameSSNRI or SNRI--selective serotonin norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor
Venlafaxine (Effexor XR, Effexor)
Desvenlafaxine (Pristiq)
Duloxetine(Cymbalta)milnacipran(Savella)
TCA-----tricyclic antidepressants---Doxepin, elavil --older class of drugs, not much used anymore b/c of to widespread side effects And the advent of first the SSRI's then the SNRI's
DRI's --dopaminergic reuptake inhibitors-------wikepedia lists a huge amount of drugs in this class. The most well known one for general population use is Wellbutrin.
bupropion(Wellbutrin, Zyban)----I would have sworn on a bible it was a SSRI
I said I'd do a complete list. So, here it is. I'm so glad my mind does not need to learn this stuff again. I started learning them in the days of MAOI's --the 70's. Poor young ones of today
.MAOIS--monamineoxidase inhibitors-------way old class of drugs, lots of bad side effects essentialy, use stopped with advent of TCA's. TCA's essentialy stopped withadvent of SSRI's (prozac was the first). There has been a new Maoi approved within the last year , but forget it's name. All I remember thinking about the drug was OH MY why would the FDA allow it , they were that much trouble.
SARI serotonin agonist reuptake inhiibitors- Trazadone Wikipedia has a llot more.
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thanks for your kind thoughts, Lindsey.. the health issues seem to just go on and on, for me, but i keep trying to be gtateful for every "good" day i get.. if i could get one wish, it was that i could take some of the neds i know i need..
i've heard the cracks story, but not exactly like yours... i heard there's a crack in heaven where the lights shine thru.. can you post your version, id love to hear it.....3jays
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3Jays - it is by Leonard Cohen
"Ring the bells that still can ring, forget your perfect offering. There is a crack in everything that's how the light gets in."
I just love this, especially the part "forget your perfect offering." maybe because being perfect is such an unhealthy part of me that I've worked hard to shed.
Been back to work for three weeks now. Boy am I tired and I am only working 5-6 hours. I can't imagine trying to do 8 in another week. I may need a little more time to build my stamina. Physical therapy is a killer, but I MADE IT DOWN THE CLIFFS TO THE OCEAN TODAY!!! Yippee! Once the salt air hit me I was so happy. Then a huge number of dolphins were out in the water. I have never seen dolphins around this part of the peninsula, so I had a welcoming party. It kicked my butt to get back up, but I stretched for a half hour so hopefully I won't hurt too bad tomorrow. If I do, it was worth it. One "old" normal thing I was able to do again.0 -
Congrats Lindsey!! Quite a day of trekking. I think the dophins being there was quite a gift for you....
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Yeah Lindsey!! So glad you made it down to the ocean. I dont live close to the ocean but when I go I drive straight to the beach. I love that feeling of the salt air hitting your face the second you hit the sand. Love that feeling!! Glad you got a little part of your old routine back. I hope PT gets easier.
I started back full time this week and its been a killer...I miss siesta time!! Last night I got home at 7pm fed the pets made dinner sat down in my big comfy chair...fell sound asleep. I woke up at 11 just to take Charlie out and head to bed. I never even ate my dinner. I woke up at 8 am this morning and boy did it feel good. Now I am off to shovel snow/ice and head into the office.
GOOOOOOOOOO RAVENS!!! Happy Saturday!
Diane
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thanks, Lindsey, for the quote.. i suffer with "perfectionism " too.. or used to, but still struggle with letting it go...
sorry for you guys and working.. i WISH i could, but not with my health, any longer.. if i HAD to, I couldn't . I hope it gets easier for you guys....
we live NEAR the beach, but i haven't made it for a LONG time. seems dr appt and dinner after, is all we can manage.. i think the dolphins W
ERE a gift, Lindsey!!!3jays0 -
I agree, the dolphins were saying "welcome back!"
I am so tired by 8pm, but when I crawl into bed at 9ish, I just lay there with every muscle twitching. I just started taking a muscle relaxer before i go to bed to help with the pain from PT. I wonder if it is making my muscles and legs jump around. I just can't lay still. So I got up tonight to read. I hope I still have the page of side effects.
Going to try going back to bed. After midnight and now I am really tired!0 -
I have been weaning off the Hydromorphone as I don't need it right now. I am not in an FM flare and as I'm not going out and getting in and out of the car, or working, I'm not hurting my body. I've stopped all intake of the med, but find I get 'restless leg syndrome' at night. I'm hoping it's from the withdrawal and if that's the worst I get, that's okay! I've been using Oxycontin to break the spasms and just tried Lorazepam last night. It worked! I know that a good sleep is the best defense against anything, so I will do anything to get a good night's sleep.
I hope your muscle relaxer helps, what is it? Perhaps it would be better for me rather than another narcotic or Lorazepam!
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restless leg syndrome is my very worst, and painful side effect from the ms; so i feel for you, Lindsey.. i hope its just from overworking them right now, in pt.. i cna't tolerate requip, or the normal drugs for it, but if it continues, let the dts. know.. id tell the pt right away...........3jays0
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3jaysmom I am so sorry you have so many challenges to deal with every single day! I wonder if you could drive by the ocean and park somewhere to enjoy it. Isn't there something about the constancy of the waves coming in and going out.......
Lindsay yeah that you were able to find enjoyment in the beach again! Sometimes if we can hold on to one thing that brings a smile to our face it will make the entire day different.
For all returning to work it is hard I know. I think I went back too early every time. I am having more surgery mid Feb. Fat injections and moving an areola and I am only taking one day after surgery off. I think I am nuts. I talk with him again to have more questions answered and I am going to ask him if it is realistic. I sit so that will help.
I hope we can each find joy today and peace.
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thanks for the thoughts, hopefulhealing.. we DO have a boardwalk near the beach near us, the weathers' too cold for me right now.. we DO make a break for the ocean, when we can.. i agree.. i feel the most spiritual at a beach, listening to the waves...3jays0
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Hopefulhealing - it sounds like you have done well since the exchange. I saw my breast surgeron today and she was surprised when she was examing my foobs and they hurt. She gave a sigh and said that that sometimes happens. Wearing anything that rubs on the skin is painful. I wish I would have pursued it more with her because I can't imagine how it could hurt if all the nerves have been removed during BMX.
In both my revision and exchange PS rotated my nipples higher on my foobs, but so far we don't see much difference. It could be if foobs drop more, the nipples will be centered. Another surgery in Feb? I hope all goes well for you. We know we are in good hands with PS, right? Are you doing PT? I am going 3x a week for about 8 weeks. Just trying to get everything moving again.
Even going back to work on Jan 2 part time I am still exhausted. It is hard to work "a little." The demands of the job keep me there 6 hours and I have a hard time packing up my bag and leaving.
3Jays, I agree that the beach is the most sacred place for me too. I love walking on the beach!
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Hi All!! Hope everyone is doing well today...I've been so busy and exhausted being back to work. I havent had time to get online. I do read my email alerts though.
This week was a stressfull one. I thought I was getting paid yesterday...nope...next friday. I had to borrow money from my twin sister to pay my mortgage and she is such a tight wad it was painful. When I asked her for the money telling her I didnt have enough to cover my mortgage until I get paid again she said "why dont you just take it from your savings account" I was like that was gone a year ago. People dont realize how expensive going through treatment is. Especially when you are self employed. Its depressing I think I still owe about $10000 in medical bills. I am hoping 2012 is the year of zero sugeries and procedures. Although I was thinking about fat grafting I am not looking forward to the bills. I might need a year off.
Hopefulhealing you should take more than a day after surgery. When I had a little lipo of the fatty roll that developed under my arm..I thought how do people get their whole body lipod. It was the most painful procedure since my mx. You definitely need a couple days and I took Arnica Montanna for the bruising given to me by my PS if you can get it I would take it. Helps the healing. When is your procedure? I hope this is your last.
Happy Weekend everyone!!! I am off to work. Love those taxes!
Diane
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hope- I think you're pretty brave just taking one day off but, if you do, try to move around as much as possible. It really helps after fat grafting. I found it I sat at my desk for awhile it was really painful when I first got up. So maybe take short little stretch breaks as often as you can for just a few minutes. I am really hoping this is your absolute last, final, finito surgery EVER!
Lindsey- Try to look at the pain as a good thing. (I know! I know! That sounds crazy!) But it could mean your nerves are regenerating. The skin on my breasts went from numb to that hurting, can't stand to have anything rub against them thing too. But then it went from that to having a lot of normal sensation back. It's not everywhere but there's quite a bit back. So just think of this as that crummy, hopefully short lived, transitional stage before you get some feeling back.
DiDel- I know what you mean about the costs. My DH's daughter just came to us recently wanting to know how much money we can contribute to her wedding. (Keep in mind she is in her mid 20's and has been living with her boyfriend for 5+ years.) I don't think she understood our savings is wiped out and her Dad is no longer working (nor her stepmom). I just looked at her like, "Seriously?!?" So, you're right, no one understands how expensive those 2 little initials are- BC.
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i too, understand about the costs.. my son is helping us replace the cae someone hit, and totalled.. he went looking with my D
H. asked how much do yu have?ahh....3,00 every penny they gave us.. of course he asked about savings, we said WHAT??? the hosp is still calling us for more money.. my ins paid, we apid 20%: NIW, they want 30% more... i don;t even answer their calls anymore.. what so they think? no money, and the credits ruined, anyway...gggrrrrrrrrrrrrrr3jays0 -
Lindsey I hope as Kate said that this is about sensation coming back for you. That is something so many grieve the loss of. I think I am in good hands for the fat grafting. I still have not decided what to do about the areola/nipple recon due to the issues I have with full and partial areola from failed NSM. I did contact Vinnie Meyers the tatoo artist that does 3D that everyone raves about. I sent pictures and am anxiously awaiting his comments. I know how hard it is to go back. It takes a long time for your body to recover and you have been through so much.
Diane, so sorry about the money issues. It is so stressful going through this as it is without all of that. Being self employed would add yet another layer to it all! I love your attitude of 2012 will be the year without surgeries for yourself. That would be great. I am hoping 2012 which starts the third year for me will be a year I can finally complete the recon! Thanks for the work advice. I just am weary of using my vacation for medical issues............ But I will definitely keep my schedule open in case I need to.
The cost of BC is something that is often overlooked, I agree. People think if you have insurance that it is all good. They don't get that this process is spread out over a long time and is ongoing. I am really hoping that they will figure a way to help those without any insurance get good medical care. As expensive as this has been, I can't imagine the added stress of not having insurance and knowing you have a life threatening illness that needs to be addressed. I have a friend who is on Medicaid and the processs of getting it slowed everything down. Her BC is up into her arm/shoulder area. Would have gotten to that point had she not recently been divorced and forced to medicaid? I don't know but I hate to think about the process delaying care. Sorry I rant
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I just wanted to pop in and say I GOT PAID TODAAAAAAAAAYYYY
Feel so much better with a healthier bank account.
Barbe - Isnt your surgery coming up?? How are you feeling??? I hope your long QTs are gone and that your surgery is still a go!!
I am still sulking a bit over the Ravens loss...
they should totally be going to the Super Bowl!! Oh well, I will watch the half time show and thats about it. I dont like football enough to watch a random team play.
I hope everyone has a great Friday!!
Diane
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Yep, surgery is Monday. For some reason I'm a bit anxious about it. The location is my concern; last time they took the right half of my thyroid, I ended up 3 days in ICU because the tumour was so big!! The space the tumour took collapsed once they took it out and I almost bled out before I got seen. So, I guess it's the CARE portion of it that makes me nervous....
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Barbe Good luck with surgery!! I will be sending positive vibes your way for a smooooooooth surgery and speedy recovery!!
Post as soon as you can so we know you are OK...will be thinking of you tomorrow.
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barbe1958, Wishing you all the best with your surgery.
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Good luck Barbe I hope for a speedy recovery without any compications.
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barbe- Thinking of you today and hope your surgery went well. Let us know how you're doing.
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Thinking about you Barb! Hope all went well and you are home quickly!
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I did AMAZING and was home yesterday!!! I was the perfect patient, dranks lots of fluid, got up to pee and kept the O2 on me while in bed. I had 3 tumours removed, the largest about 1 inch. I get pathology on Feb 17th. The smaller size than my last one removed has me a bit concerned for cancer, but I feel SO good now!!! I hadn't realized just how much these buggers were affecting my brain oxygen levels wise... I feel like I could run a marathon right now!!! Even the surgeon had said 2-4 days and I was out in one!!
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That's great news, barbe. So glad it all went so well and you're feeling better already!
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Good news barbe.
I am so sad I just can't seem to ever move forward with this process. I am so tired of hearing "it's complex" when they look at my chest and try to figure out how to do the rest of the recon due to the failed nsm. It shouldn't have been complex. They should have done it right the first time! Now I am faced with less then optimal choices and very limited. I am so tired. Part of me thinks just go to sleep and don't wake up.
Everyone's life goes on and people laught and have a good time and can't figure out why you are not wanting to be around people or sad. I am just so tired of pretending.
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Oh Barb- So thrilled you got good news, did so well and feel so much better! Wow, that is tremendous!
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Hi All, I've been MIA with a huge presentation at work. Ugh, so tired, but I've loved reading everyone's news for the past 10 days. Presentation went well--too well, now I have a lot of stuff to implement, but I will recommend doing it over the next two years!
Yeah Barbe, great news. I think we are figuring out how to do surgery well. We've all had enough practice! I am so happy for you.
Hopeful, sent you a PM. When is your FG?
Okay Kate, I will meditate on this "good" pain I am having because every nerve is regenerating and working overtime to heal!
Here's to a good day tomorrow to all of you. :-)0
