INSOMNIACS place to talk in the wee hours
Comments
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Well, I know that kookaburras sit in an old gum tree, are merry kings if the bush, and laugh. Oh--and have a gay life. I think they're birds. Welcome back, Chrissy. I know you all had a good time!0 -
2nd, just came off a 36 hour no sleep binge. Finally fell asleep with the last dose of melatonin at 11 last night. Serious pain problems right now b/c of all the activity and still not recovered from the falls. So, fentanyl is on board which screws with my sleep big time. Checked in with my chiropractor and friend of many years. I need some snap, crackle , and popping. He's been officially retired for about 6 years now. He kept some of us as patients. Only the ones he liked. But he's had a second heart attack. They gave him amiroidione(sic). It messed with him terribly. Damaged heart and right arm. His right arm is basically useless. Poor guy, he was passionate still about chiropractic. He even used the words "I'm bitter as hell". Nothing can undo the damage caused by the drug.
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sassy, so sorry to read that! Only thing worse than no sleep is pain and no sleep. Hoping this corrects itself soon. For me, for the last week or so, it's like I can't get enough sleep (many nights without melatonin and I don't drink alcohol). I fall asleep, usually in the recliner, sleep 8-10 hrs or more. Last week, there were also naps besides the sleep. Pretty much sleep straight thru, maybe I wake up and go right back to sleep (depends if a cat is next to me, and which one, one will head-butt me if she sees I'm awake). Last night, I actually started out in bed with DH, he kept waking me telling me I was snoring (which I rarely do), so went off to the guest room. Not sure if it has to do with winter finally arriving and we're finally turning on the heat.... It's just strange0 -
2nd, I didn't know about my snoring with melatonin. DBF routinely moves to another room, if he awakes in the middle of the night. He can't get back to sleep if I'm snoring. The pain is improving daily. The hardest thing to do, is to keep from not doing. But at least I have DI now. The serious deep cleaning and decluttering is over. It's costly to have her so much right now, but soooooo happy that things are closer to what they used to be. She's worth every nickel. After the first of the year we can play with how often I'll have her come. It sounds like this was a disaster area. It wasn't, but we each have our own standard of what we like. I wasn't living with what I like. Also, I can get back to thrifting. It wasn't fun anymore b/c every drawer, cupboard, and closet was full. I've given away things that weren't working. By working, I mean being used. My collectibles have to be doing a job. LOL.
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hi all, busy today, not a lot of time for BCO (especially more than a word or two).
Sassy, I know how difficult it is to sit and mend, dang near impossible! Glad at least there's progress on pain. I applaud all your de cluttering and cleaning efforts - I need motivation! My house has evolved to a disaster - it was too big when we moved here 15 years ago (the couple who owned previously were just the 2 of them, she didn't work and spent her entire life keeping this immaculate - probably a huge reason we wanted it). 5 bedrooms/3 full baths. It was agreed we would ALL help, that never happened, DH's idea of cleaning is put things in a pile, move to a remote location, repeat. No actual cleaning. After we married, he actually handed me ALL his important papers in two grocery sacks - no filing. First water leak/burst pipe fall 2011, he was unemployed, he did a bunch of packing as we had entire flooring - upstairs and downstairs - replaced so everything had to be taken off the floor, he didn't unpack, left boxes for me (I was working full time plus cooking, laundry, the cleaning I could get to). Last fall, my mx/recon so I didn't do much (not true, I still had to fix my own meals and do laundry), this August thru Oct second pipe probs. only has to move dining room and under stairs storage (holiday decorations+).
does anyone know if it's ok to drink wine and take melatonin?0 -
Sassy, have been experiencing problems lately, you seem so educated, maybe you can shed some light. Appear to be having brain/thought processing probs. Had chemo years ago and while I don't remember completely, I do remember it was a constant fog, very distinctly not normal and all the time (worse than the worst flu or head cold - on steroids!) What I've been noticing lately: it's like I have ADD, my thoughts are all over the place and seems like I can't keep very short term memory long on occasions. Plus, also scary, I sometimes don't see things right in front of me. Doesn't happen all the time, but enough to be concerned (I know my mom's Alzheimer's isn't contagious, but it's weird). Brought it up to MO when I went for 1-month Tamoxifen check, he poo-poo'ed it. Can you shed some light on this?
PS - what's the abbreviation "DI"?0 -
2nd_time_around~~ melatonin is a hormone that our bodies produce naturally, but things like getting older, stress, surgery, etc causes it to not produce as well. I don't drink alcohol, but if I did, I wouldn't be afraid to have some wine while taking melatonin.
One mistake people make is taking melatonin only when they have trouble sleeping, but if you're going to take it, do it everyday. I take 10 mgs about an hour before bed.
Blessings
Paula0 -
Soteria-Hi --I know your screen name , but LOL can't remember what thread.
2nd -ditto Soteria --Paula........... Melatonin is the least to worry about with alcohol. BUT if you go to dailymed.org. you can read about it. Dailymed.org is produced by NIH.gov---------National Institute of Health. NIH is the USA resource for all things drugs, research grants---------lordy they are IT for science in the USA.
When you go to dailymed.org(choose the web address that includes nih.gov) plug drug name into search box on the page. Chose the first drug listed. They are usually the first one that the FDA approved for the drug. This is important b/c all the pre-approval information re: clinical trials will be included , as well as post-marketing info(info accumulated after FDA approval). Once a drug goes generic, companies are no longer required to do research or include research info in their product inserts. Heck if you can't figure it out , it's a perfect excuse to talk on the phone. LOL I'm a phone junky. Seriously, sometimes it so easy to talk for a few seconds to solve a question versus writing.
The fog you are feeling is normal yet abnormal. The key is to figure out if the abnormal is expected or not expected.
Chemo, anesthesia, drugs, injuries, stress(duh-cancer, life, job etc) all can affect our thinking. Lack of sleep can cause major problems in less than 24 hours. The best thing----you have recognized is a change. Make no assumptions about cause.
Hopefully you have an excellent primary care physician PCP. See them and discuss your concerns. Review sx history for this year---will identify cumulative anesthesia affect, review chemo hx this year--same as anesthesia-- cumulative affect. Review head injury hx. Review drugs prescribed and over the counter-OTC. Just b/c it's OTC doesn't mean it's safe for you.
Then there are some blood tests that would be indicated in the presence of a mental status change(fog)---TSH(thyroid study), Folic acid, B-12, Vita D. LOL's(only b/c I have memory issues) there are a couple more, but forget------sorry. A Complete Metabolic Profile--CMP sometimes abbreviated as CMET. CMET covers electrolytes, liver function, and kidney function. All or any, if out of whack can affect thinking.
I posted a link , but will bring it here too for completeness. It's from AARP. It identifies classes of drugs that cause a change in thinking/mental status/ cognitive changes. the article lists the most common drugs in the class. Guess what? lots of BC patients are on them.
Now this post will take more than one reading to sink in. May take several. Why? We are here b/c of lack of sleep. Put together lack of sleep and all the drugs we are subjected too.....and our minds are mush!
Summary:
!. Make PCP appointment
2. Blood test to rule out abnormalities--Tsh, Folic acid, B12, Vita D
3. Review drugs-
4. Sleep however and whenever you can---------but go for a pattern that you are awake in day light and asleep in the dark time.
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Previous post re: drug affect onmemory
To all, we all have discussed chemo/ anethesia brain. We now can call it anesthesia/chemo/drug brain. This article is in AARP magazine. It discusses the drug classifications that can cause memory loss. It describes why each drug class can cause memory loss. It gives specific names of drugs. It gives alternative drugs that can be substituted. I would suggest reviewing it with your prescribing doc if you have concerns regarding any of your meds. I also suggest you put it in your favorite places on your computer. Also, printing it off for future referrence if you have a printer. Please, pass this on to other BCO friends, friends etc.
sassy 0 -
Paula, thanks for the info! Didn't realize I should be consistent with melatonin, thought it was "as needed" basis only, good to know! And I love the hat!
Sassy, once again you are a true angel! I was thinking a response of a couple sentences, didn't expect the detail, read thru once, but will need to reread, a whole lot of info. I had bloodwork done back in Juky, only things out of normal range were cholestrol-related, but will need to readdress. Love my PCP - she had BC (and recon) just before my 1st MX, I found out about her about 6 mos later. She definitely has a vested interest in all things BC and is completely understanding and compassionate (she been mentioning recon since I first started with her, but I just wasn't ready. She and PS are right across the hall from one another, they have nothing but wonderful things to say about one another - my whole team is really a very cohesive team).
I read the article, am on statins, antihistamines, was on Xanax only night before and day of procedures, was on pain killers after surgeries, wondering how long they remain in the system (early July was last surgery), and the interaction between them all and yes, stress big time!0 -
2nd, yes, the triple read through. What can our poor brains subjected to all the drugs we keep being prescribed put up with. Of course we are in a fog. AI's and Tamox weren't considered. Short term memory has to go through a whole chemical sequence to be stored into long term memory. These drugs interfere with the chemical sequence. Therefore, were sunk. Take an oxy, say good bye to todays memories. But WTF if you need pain relief, what are you to do?
I used to teach adults, EMS paramedic trainees. First class of each year, I taught studying and testing techniques. Ended the class with what would interfere with learning. 1. stress 2. tiredness, 3. alcohol. If those three factors were involved separately or in combination forget retaining any material studied.
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2nd depends on exposure, but give yourself weeks to months to clean the garbage out.
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sassy, thanks for setting my mind a little more at ease. Made by appt today with PCP for next week. Will have to reread all the info.0 -
hi ladies! It's still early here (4:30 PM) so not thinking of sleeping yet. Watching House Hunters International, they're showing the Sunshine Coast of Australia. Sorry to say, I'm not familiar with Australia geography and where Chrissy, Sheila and Aly live to know if they're showing areas familiar to you all.0 -
I live about 2 hrs north of the Sunshine coast 2nd, but used to live a lot closer and would take the kids there for a day out.
It was very family oriented in those days, no high rise resorts etc., but when I went back recently, it was highly commercialised....focused on the tourist dollar.
The beaches are nice still though but I doubt there are many seaside places left that are like they were in the 'good old days.'
I think I'm getting old,
Sheila.
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Sheila, I keep reminding my friend, we're getting older not old! 60 is the new 80 or 80 is the new 60, something like that! I keep thinking that when my mom was my current age, that was old, but I don't usually feel old (ok, only at times, especially during this past year). Sorry to take so long getting back to you, something's goofy with the ipad - it keeps logging out and now requires a passcode for everything (some kind of update, I think) and it's just a PITA to use. So, with it being almost-winter here, it's almost-summer there.... maybe a trip to the beach? I used to live closer to the beach, now it's about a 45 minute to an hour trip so that's a good excuse not to go (the real one is that I don't look the same as I did back in high school and college when I practically lived at the beach and DH was a copper-top, now more strawberry-blond and burns after just a couple of minutes in the sun. Now, I feel like a beached whale!)
Okay you other lovely ladies: are you all getting some good sleep? I was for several days, but it's been difficult the last couple of nights. Maybe the sudden cold rainy weather has something to do with it.0 -
Hi 2nd, and all. We are having a one year anniversary party on STFU tomorrow the 11th. You're all welcome to drop by for some goodies and libations.
Aussie Sheila, I always giggle when we post on the same threads. I know you understand why. Drop by more often , always enjoy seeing you.
sheila0 -
Sassy, you bring a (much needed) smile to my face!
At one point, I was lurking on STFU, got behind, got lost, gave up. I have never seen thread anniversaries, at least not on the ones I view. Good to know someone keeps track of things like that! I could use a really strong drink right about now....
(PS, am at Mom and Dad's tonight so I have to keep one eye open all night as Mom sometimes gets angry when she finds me sleeping in the guest room, or the living room recliner for that matter. May be back here later)
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2nd, STFU moves fast, and it is hard to keep up. LOL I even wrote a list of names to try to keep the players straight b/c not only are there allot of folks everyone gets multiple nicknames. Today there was 5 pages. Whew!.
May I ask why your Mom gets angry when she finds you sleeping there?
I slept a good part of the day b/c I cleaned and decorated with Di yesterday(Tues). DBF very sick today and my body was in a "total body pain"-TBP situation. I call these type of days "bed days". I was waking up and trying to cook chicken soup for DBF at 6pm EST and he handed me CoFfeE. Now I'll be up all night, and lose tomorrow to sleep. My fault, I could have turned down the coffee. OH WELL..........
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hi ladies, not sure I'll be back tonite, so just checking in while I have a few minutes. Got a last minute invite to meet a couple of BCO ladies for lunch - turned into 4-1/2 hour lunch! If a photo gets posted, will let you know.
Sassy, I tried STFU and gave up because I couldn't keep people straight, now I don't feel so dumb! Sorry about the TBP days, they suck. Hoping you're better today.
My mom has Alzheimer's and I'm told common characteristics include anger and meanness. Not sure why, but that doesn't matter. Her mood generally starts in the late afternoon (I think of it like an older adult colic, it just happens) and lasts till she sleeps. She does it with my dad but to a lesser extent. Mom and I have always had a difficult relationship and I know she's reliving old memories (she's angry now because I come home too late, don't call.....). Anyway, it just is. Thinking she was angry that I was sleeping in he guest room because she just didn't remember, maybe she was scared in some way. She has many strange behaviors brought on by the disease.
The last couple of days have been wild, in an unpleasant sort of way. Again, more details later, and don't want to be a Debbie Downer, I'm in such a good mood from my lunch!
Chrissy, your HB friend was one there so your name got brought up - in only the best of ways.0 -
2nd how much fun. One of my joys in life is to do lunch. They are mostly girls. Lots of happy chatter. Then these lunches with BCO gals. Unbelievable. My short time with 3jays and Chrissy great memory. Then Chrissy and I did some crazy goofy things. All spur of the moment. They all turned out well. versus wrong. I can't wait to go see Spookie and MaryLW, SpecialK and galsal. AND whomever wants to come. Held off scheduling exact date b/c of thyroid. It looks like it'll be coming out after first of year. so a 2nd week in Jan plan is iffy.
So, who else by screen name was there?
Sorry about Mom with AZ's. My MIL had AZ. Totally understand. It's tough.
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HI Sas and Thatgirl--I am up late every night--when I can't sleep I take melatonin from 1.5 to 3 mg--just depending on how bad the insomnia is. Most of the time it only takes 1.5 mg to sleep. When I take 3 mg, I am groggy the next day. The pharmacist recommended it to me. Well I do a lot of my reading, catching up on my shows and peeping out of the windows at night. I think I am use to it. In fact, I feel cheated when I sleep through the night. I only suffer if I have appointments or have to go to work the next day. Otherwise, I love being awake in the middle of the night. Go figure!
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Dwill, I've been a night owl since birth, I so understand about being awake at night.
Sassy, for me, it means so much to put names with faces. Love BCO but sometimes it seems impersonal, easy to hide behind a screen. PS I sent you a PM0 -
Dwilli--------Hey girlfriend, happy to see you here. Hope all is well.
2nd--that's it about the gatherings. Another way that I love is yakking on the phone. Anytime almost.
I've started posting here during the day and night. That way I won't miss you if something normal starts happening with sleep LOL what the hell is normal and where do I find it?
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Dwilli who's Thatgirl--where did I miss her?
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dwill melatonin is a natural hormone our bodies make. As we get older we produce less of it. It's not a drug to be taken when you have trouble sleeping. You take it regularly. I take 10 mgs every night about an hour before bed.0 -
Hi Soteria, glad to see you here
What does soteria mean if it's not to personal to ask. Each member has a 'why" of how they've chosen their names. I always find it interesting. Mine-sas-schatzi is myself and my darling schatzi, a german wired haired pointer. I was on OMG They Found A Cure for Stupid. It was in the early days. Before page 100. Someone found our material quoted on FB. I checked and sure enough it was there. Lots of us altered our screen names and avatars. Some took off the bio Bc data. I did. It was one thing to share here, but sharing with the world was not a consideration. I looked around in the moments of changing my screen name, the first thing I saw was the dog................LOL Not to creative. As I said I do love stories about screen names.Thanks for the info on melatonin. It was either discussed here or another thread. But you know once the pages pass it is lost in time. I even put a few links in the above topic thread for that reason. I'll check the link and see if that's in there. If it isn't I'll see if maybe I can find or write something.
If you check the link after Xmas and I haven't done it, please, a reminder would be taken very well.
You know memory issues, and then add in Xmas. Cherrio sassy0 -
sas-schatzi.....SOTERIA is Greek for salvation.
I used to go on the OMG Someone found the cure for stupid. I haven't visited there in quite some time. I'm on a Conservative thread, Arimidex, Coping After Treatment, and a few others. I started a Bible Study on Pentecostal Sisters a couple months ago.
Blessings
Paula0 -
paging Dr Sassy,
Saw my PCP, you're so spot on! Ah, the new normal! Between Tami and all the crap I've been on in the last 6months, add lots of stress, no wonder I'm having thinking and memory issues as well as being a step away from basket case! She gave me a low-dose Rx for Xanax (as needed), just to lower stress and get some sleep. She did all the blood work mentioned back in Sept. You got it right. Your fees are cheaper!0 -
Paula,
Salvation, good name.
Glad you're here. Just curious, do you check in often? Please make your presence known when you do.0 -
Soteria---wonderful translation. Again me & my dog LOL. But I don't know besides my very strong belief in God how life would have been without my girl Schatzi to keep me in touch with the world. She was heaven sent for sure. But forewarn you I have been known to use an explective. (sic). But please, don't let that chase you away
L&H&P's(Love&hugs&prayers) Badger used to use it as a sign off too. I was very happy to see her on that link. In fact going to bring the link here too 2nd so funny, i'll send you my fee if you like:) Not, silly girl. I'm a retired nurse. I paid attention. I stayed up to date over 40 years, taught for many years, worked many specialties. I'm a learning junkie. My poor stunned brained from all that happens to us doesn't retain info like in the pre-BC days. AND my poor body has been damaged by our life saving drugs.
When I share info it's b/c I know the system doesn't always work. The system is overworked--docs and nurses trying to cram so much into each contact that things can be missed. In younger days, I learned from some very good teachers how to research and evaluate info. That works well with an inquisitive mind.
Glad your PCP visit went well. The PCP is the hub of your care. If this relationship isn't strong, your care can go awry. I suggest a minimum of once every 3-4 months just to bring them up to date on what all the other specialists are doing. Obviously, if you need them for a new particular, be seen.
A suggestion on the Xanax-alprazolam. It's not a bad drug. But used over time, I have seen more patients develop a dependency on it. All drugs have consequences. The drug that I think is better overall is Ativan-Lorazepam. Consider talking with your physician about it when you need a prescription refill. In the mean time I hope it does the trick for you
Look for the link I mentioned in the post to Soteria
Be back0
