Treating estrogen responsive cancer naturally
Comments
-
THanks Marijen. I'm not a great reader and do get confused about the conflicting reports on what is good then somewhere else says no. That's why I was looking for a list which doesn't include something that somewhere else says no.
0 -
If I find a perfect list someday I'll let you know! Why don't you keep a file. Print out the info on the foods you want to keep in your diet. I should do that
0 -
https://draxe.com/probiotics-benefits-foods-supple...
Probiotics - the main takeaway is that it improves immunity which help fight cancer cells. I also heard on John Tesh that probiotics help lower LDL cholesterol and reduces stress. I have also read that reducing stress helps prevent cancer. Not sure if there is a link between cholesterol and breast cancer.
Here is another link discussing the relationship between intestinal flora and estrogen metabolism. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6326245
So I plan to drink some kefir every day now.
0 -
Thanks for the links Gokale, they are really good. Saved. Here's a chart from one.
0 -
I attended a talk last night given by a researcher onc at UCSF who specializes in breast cancer. All these supps and oils and such, there is no real research on because it's not FDA approved. One thing he did say is essential oils, supps, herbs ARE medicines. You need to treat them all just like to you rx drugs. And they really don't know the interaction of them with what meds you are on, and not just cancer meds- other meds you may be taking for another condition. When someone brought up the $ in rx meds, he counteracted with the $ in these essential oils/herbs/supp "natural" which there is nothing natural about any of this as they are all MEDICINE to your body. Just because something is tooted as "natural" doesn't mean it works better or as good, and isn't actually harmful to your body. The focus on just shutting down estrogren has taken over many people from truly understanding what they may be doing to their body. Not everyone is the same. The research on this stuff is sparse compared to rx meds. Iffy at best he said. So the message on this part of the talk was tread lightly with this alternative stuff. Also pointed out that Adriamycin, taxanes and aspirin are plant based meds.
Dr. David Lee is a researcher at UCSF which is very highly acclaimed institution. Tread carefully. Here's the slide put up on this topic:
Nutritional and herbal supps:
No high quality human trials demonstrate any cancer related benefit.
Supps have se's and can be dangerous, even "natural" ones
Treat herbal medicine as if it was a rx med
Check for known se's, drug-herb interactions. Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center website given as best source:
https://www.mskcc.org/search?keys=herbs
https://www.mskcc.org/search?keys=supplementsBe very very careful if you are receiving chemo.
Also brought up this thing I've been seeing going around on alkaline diet. Very interesting. Cancers live in all situations and adapt to their environment so forget about going this route. Plus the body is 7.4 ph naturally, to function properly. Too much alkaline could be deadly. The other end, too acidic, and get very sick. Body has a tendency to make it's way to where it needs to be, 7.4 ph. So don't intentionally mess with this.
Exercise- Yes! Big time can be a major factor in reducing cancer recurrence. For ER+ can be up to 50% reduction in chances of recur. Active = walking good pace for 3 hours a week. Can split it out. If bad joints, water walking/arobics. 3 studies found the risk of dying from colon cancer was reduced by 43-61% with moderate activity (3 hours a week). Prostate cancer benefits from exercise too. Pointed out exercise isn't for weight loss. You are looking at getting healthy. If you walk 1 mile you burn 100 calories. Need to walk 35 miles to lose 1 lb. Reality is the way to lose weight is watch your intake of food to the amount of activity you have. Eat less.
Diet- Organic foods are safer but it's a myth that it's healthier than reg produce. No pesticides and just makes it safer.
Many interventional trials have been performed in large groups of pts with bc, colon cancer and prostate cancer. Different diets studied:
low fat
high fruit and veggies
low glycemic
No intervention trial has demonstrated improvement in cancer related outcomes with long term follow up. However diet can prevent a cancer from developing in the first place.
Common sense diet for cancer:
balanced diet
eat in moderation
lots of fruit and veggies
min preservatives
shop perimeter of the grocery store (fresh stuff there)
If your grandmother doesn't understand the ingredients then don't buy it.
Aspirin- For some people aspirin can be started to reduce the risk of cardiovascular disease and colorectal cancer. No reduction in breast, lung or advanced prostate cancer.
Vit D- He doesn't know why pcp's are into testing so much for vit D on cancer pts. If your value is over 20, you have sufficient vit D. You don't want to be lower because it can be at least partly responsible for dementia, cancer, etc. Vit D doesn't prevent pre cancer polyps in the colon. Most studies giving vit D supp have not shown benefit in regards to cancer prevention (both primary and recurrence) and survival.
Summary- Lifestyle
The great lifestyle change that can improve a cancer survivor's chances of NED for good is exercise.
Goal 3 hours a week.
Aspirin can prevent recurrences and improve survival in pts treated for colorectal cancer.
Aspirin can prevent colon cancer from ever developing.
Eat a common sense, balanced diet. Everything is ok in moderation. No need to eliminate anything. Brought up sugar. Yes sugar feeds cance, but cancers adapt to become no need for sugar. Cancers are very adaptable to changes in the body. One reason why so hard to find a cure. They change to go with the new environment. So of course for health, lower the sugar the better, but to cut it all out thinking ah ha isn't the right thought. Moderation for everything, even red meat. Some people cut fruits out thinking sugar. He calls that kind of nuts. Moderation is the take away.
Nutrtional and herbal supps have not been found to be helpful and there can be risk of harm.
Talk to your doc about specific questions. Always question as advances are made in the field.
Final word: LIVE. Don't get so wrapped up in cancer that you forget to live your life.
After the talk I found the lady next to me was dx'd at 46 and was NED for 31 years! Tamoxifen had just come out and she was on the 2 year plan. Now at 77 there she is, again. I was the youngest one in the audience. Probably was 30-40 people there. It was held in the auditorium of the hospital and recorded to be televised on the local hospital channel. I asked a couple questions so my face will be on tv at some point.
I just copied the screen shot handouts that were given to us. Not an audience who would go home to read research studies so he kept it at the bullet points bottom line, which I appreciate. Just tell me the latest. Dr. David Lee's specialty is breast cancer and he attends the big conference in Tx ever Dec which runs a few days.
Hope this info helps. At the very least, it's food for thought.
GL to all.
0 -
wow that was a very educational one. thanks artista
0 -
Yes Artista, great information. Thank you. There is one thing that doesn't seem right, that is his comments on Vit D. I have direct experience with low and above 30, big difference in how I feel whether or not it staves off cancer
0 -
Marijen, I just understood it as over 20 and it is normal. Now it may be low normal for some. But the drive I've seen even with myself is to get you to even higher which translates against better protection against recurrence. I myself have a bottle of Vit D3 here 5000 iu having thought that, reading about here probably here somewhere. My mom told me her doc has her on 3000 iu. So more isn't better or better coverage. Individual diffs. He just wanted to let us know that if you have a 20 reading that you are ok----unless you don't feel ok and then you speak with your doc about it.
I love this hospital. On Sept 28 my women's doc will be giving a talk on the effectiveness of vitamins and supps. My dad should sit in on this. He must pop like 10 pills a day for this and that. The guy last night mentioned briefly that there's no real strong human data that shows these pills do much of anything, but if someone feels like it's helping them feel better and healthier then great.
0 -
Found this from the past. It 's encouraging, at least I think so.
Jun 24, 2013 07:49AM glenshee wrote:
Hi I am the husband of a person diagnosed with breast cancer and bone lets 4 years ago in August . She responded very well to hormone therapy currently on femara and bisphosponates. She has had 3 sessions of radiaton therapy for some hotspots. The lets were in her vertebra, pelvic and rib areas. Currently going strong and is being managed as a "chronic" ailment. We consulted a dietitician (many actually) and she follows a diet of low to no gluten (wheat), milk (butter ok), sugar/artificial sweetners (use organic maple syrup) and soya. Organic meat products preferably chicken or fish as your protein. Also supplementation of Vit C, D and Calcium essential. Once she started on the diet and the Vits there was ongoing and meaningful improvements. She has been in this "stable" state for +- 18 months now. Lots of hope out there be positive
0 -
Artista, thanks so much for this valuable information. I'm someone who goes back and forth with supplements. Until recently I was taking Omega 3 daily, then read on this site I think that it isn't advisable with ER+ BC. It's interesting about the drug/herb info. I will look up the links you provided. Have just started a hair/nails supplement with Biotin in it for hair loss on letrozole and a cranberry supplement for urinary frequency (again a letrozole SE). All these supplements are expensive but I feel that they add a psychological benefit of doing something to help with SEs.
0 -
From what I took away from the talk last night, best to get these supps from fresh foods. Omegas, salmon is top. Eat salmon instead of popping omega pills, which has other stuff in it (non active ingredients). You can't do any better than fresh foods. That's why he said shop the the outer isles of the stores. What's in them? Produce, dairy, meats, grains. All the other inner isles are preservatives, unhealthy sugars, processed, etc. Even the frozen stuff unless it's like veggies or something which is the only ingredient, is not wholesome.Hence the balanced diet, varied to cover all bases.
0 -
Artista...thanks for posting this. What stood out in my mind was that exercise can reduce recurrence rates by 50 percent! Why on earth would docs then prescribe an anti hormone that has potential SEs? Anti hormones have also been shown to lower recurrence rates by 50 percent. Just doesn't make sense to me.
0 -
Marijen, I found this fascinating: "We consulted a dietitician (many actually) and she follows a diet of low to no gluten (wheat), milk (butter ok), sugar/artificial sweetners (use organic maple syrup) and soya." Those four groups are the exact four I've had recurring problems with over the past decade and have finally cut out entirely. They all lead directly to an inflammatory response in my body
0 -
It says not to eat them. Low to No: gluten, no milk, no sugars, no soya. What is fascinating is she was stable for eighteen months, maybe still is, I don't know. I wasn't saying you should follow this diet.
Edited to correct the last sentence
0 -
dtad- It CAN reduce recurrence risk by up to 50%. Some stage 1 exercise gurus a few years later are now posting in the stage IV forum. AIs CAN reduce risk.... Key word, CAN as we are all different. Plus who doesn't want to do everything they can to minimize by these meds, diet, exercise, etc? Most people want to throw all the books at it, which includes AIs/Tamox for ER+ folks.
ETA that not everyone can exercise even the 3 hours a week. It's tough. I have severe bilateral osteoarthritis in my knees and a hip that may be forming. So much for walking much. I'm looking into water exercises but who knows if that's just as good as a decent paced walking down the blocks type of thing.
0 -
Hi Artista928, Thanks for the UCSF BC research info. It's very informative. Someone posted previously about the I-3-C supplement, but I found the following at Oregon Sate University:
"In some animal models, I3C supplementation was found to enhance carcinogen-induced cancer development when given chronically after the carcinogen (96-99). When administered before or at the same time as the carcinogen, oral I3C inhibited tumorigenesis in animal models of cancers of the mammary gland (100, 101), uterus (102), stomach (103), colon (104, 105), lung (106), and liver (107, 108). Although the long-term effects of I3C supplementation on cancer risk in humans are not known, the contradictory results of animal studies have led several experts to caution against the widespread use of I3C and DIM supplements in humans until their potential risks and benefits are better understood (99, 109, 110"
http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/mic/dietary-factors/phytochemicals/indole-3-carbinol#safety
This is exactly what the BC researcher at UCSF has said. Supplements are to be treated with caution because there are no research on human, not FDA approved.
0 -
Exactly kit. There are no quality human trials and can cause harm without you or you natural doc knowing it. All this natural stuff including essential oils can be doing more harm than good. There's on real hard research on it. That's why I'll stick to my Tamoxifen which is giving me 0 and I mean 0 se's (some people have minimal se's on AIs- we are all different), diet and try to figure exercise out. Those are the surest bullets for trying for recurrence prevention.
0 -
Also to do with diet, not everyone is blessed to be able to afford good produce and healthy food. Even non-organic is too expensive for many to keep up on daily. So the meds are there for them too.
0 -
We are not supposed to try and influence others.
0 -
I'm not pushing anything, marijen. dtad asked me a question and I answered. I also provided insight into why some may not be able to afford the great diet or do the exercise in the amount and pace needed. Not trying to change anyone's mind. We all will do what we feel is best for our individual profiles.,
0 -
Ok, maybe there should be a Complimentary and Integrative with Conventional Treatment site?
0 -
Wow. Calm down marijen. I posted about the talks, got some thanks including from you, and answered dtad's inquiry. I won't post in here anymore.
GL to you all.
0 -
Wow. Calm down marijen. I posted about the talk I went to from a cancer researcher, got some thanks, and answered a question, I also provided insight as to why not everyone may be able to do the great diet and exercise plans. I'm done here.
GL to you all.
0 -
I'm sorry, I am calm. I have a short memory these days, I believe due to Letrozole
0 -
Marijen, I know you're not saying to necessarily follow that diet, but cutting out those four groups was something I arrived at on my own through a series of elimination diets in an attempt to figure out the source of lots of chronic inflammation problems I was suffering from. So I just found it interesting that those were the same four foods!
1 -
Angela, Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ! Thanks for reply.
0 -
Thanks, Artista. Very interesting/informative list!
0 -
Angela, how do you know you have chronic inflammation problems? What are the symptoms? Or do tests show them? Pls
0 -
i spent $$$ with a naturopath. She tested me for what was causing inflammation in my body. grains, dairy except for Irish butter, soy, added sugar. Sound familiar. 'Am on 30 billion probiotic and diet of chicken seafood and veggies. IBS gone and have more energy. I think the inflammation was giving mre leaky gut which aggravates brain fog and keeps you from processing foods optimally.
0 -
Artista Thanks for posting that. When I had to stop Als due to extreme side effects my one physician said I could possibly get as much benefit from exercise and diet, as the drug. I have taken that to heart. I look at it this way. I have a 16% recurrence rate with Als and no quality of life. I have a 20% without. (according to the MO) So will I be in the 80% or the 20% With exercise and diet that number changes. I may or may not have a recurrence. But until that happens, I am losing weight and I feel and look a lot better and I am enjoying life. What more can I ask for.
0
