How to forgive family/friends who disappeared during cancer....
Comments
-
Bravo bobgirl.
0 -
XXXXX.
0 -
"Power position" means just "to be in your own power" -- to not to give up your happiness and ability-to-move-forward-in-your-own-life because of anything that someone else says or does. It is the position of feeling content in your own self-worth -- so much so that you have abundant compassion for others.
When you stop 'needing' other people -- it doesn't mean you no longer want them in your life or don't value them -- it means that you don't lean on them... or base your happiness on their words and actions.
I have been doing this personal work for several years now.
My purpose for posting here was only attempting to share what has actually worked for me, in response to a specific question of how to stop feeling hurt and get on with the relationhip. If you re-read my posts you'll note that I shared an awfully lot of personal information... attempting to show how it was my own thoughts that got in the way of my having rewarding relationships.
These are kind of odd concepts to grasp -- because it is not how our society teaches us to think. Our society is all about 'right' and 'wrong'. And judging. And 'being better than'. And this sort of thinking leaves us with a lot of disappointment and negative emotions.
A happy is life is probably what we all hope for. A life with great relationships and a sense of community and belonging. A life where we can make a difference in the lives of others, and feel true and deep connections.
I am posting in response to those who are hurting -- and are wondering if that sort of life is even possible.
I have found that it is.
It just takes being willing to stop 'being right' and stop 'making them wrong'.
It just takes allowing everyone to be exactly-how-they-are-in-every-new-minute. It means helping when you can, and asking (clearly) for exactly what you want ... and then accepting what people do offer instead of holding out for what you "expect".
If you keep not-getting what you want from one of your relationships -- don't be mad -- just give the relationship a break -- or better yet, if you can -- have a sompassionate conversation with that person telling them your concerns and asking how you can help them... because if they are pulling away there is probably something in their own lives that is pre-occupying them.
But staying in 'anger' or 'disappointment' only hurts you and saps your own energy, which could be used for something more productive... and better for your health!
Truly -- my best to you all.
Linda
0 -
I think that you sincerely want to help. A lot of what you say makes sense. But there's a glitch in there somewhere!
Do you have children?
Truly, I wish it was as simple as you make it sound. To certain extent I believe what you say and for the most part try to live that way. But there are times in our lives that we really need help, love, caring. It makes a big difference if it's there or if it's not.
Once you know that it's not there. What then? You know. You can't unknow.
And when it comes to your child...well, I'll admit, i'm struggling with it. It's not about being right, I don't think.
We all know he was wrong, or at least i think so!
Listen, if your son is Hitler, what do you do? kiss and make up?
0 -
Hitler...good point!
0 -
I'm not reading two things.....accountability and consequences. The lessons society pushed during my formative years (50's) conformity and don't question authority.
I'm glad that the earth shook and we started questioning the relationships in our life. Blood or not.
I will not waste another minute of my life taking breaks or having compassionate conversations with toxic people. Some things are unforgivable.
And no, I'm not sitting around wallowing in anger and regret. I moved on and enjoy the supportive people in my life. Life really is better when you discard the stressors.0 -
Hello Ladies! Oh my word! When I started this conversation I didn't mean to open a can of worms! I'm sorry if anyone has been hurt by it!
I've been following your posts and finally have time to respond ~
I'll try and be constructive... I don't know why I'm even defending my feelings of hurt... but here goes - -
Just for the record, I choose each day to be JOYFUL. I spend time with GOD each morning, and He carries me through each and every day! I was never constantly in a fearful/angry/complaining state of being! Whenever someone DID call or stop over I focused more on how they were doing than myself!? I'm sorry...expectations or not, it does hurt when family/friends vaporize when you need them the most. To expect friends/family to be of some support during cancer (my second time!) is not being weak and expectations or not... it hurts! During my first round of cancer treatments one of my best friends was diagnosed with a recurrence of bc that spread to her brain. I was there for her through thick and thin... no matter what my own circumstances were and how sad and discouraging it was.
As so many of you have said, I am living each day to the fullest and focusing on the positives in my life... I simply don't have the energy to call the missing people in my life to see what's wrong... It's hard to go forward in a relationship and pretend the elephant was never there...
~ Seashell
0 -
That's exactly it! Well said. Pretending the elephant isn't there is the strain. I would love to understand and talk it out and forgive and forget and go on. But I have a gag order! So it becomes a phony relationship. A dishonest one.
I don't understand how to relate in this way but apparently that's what he and his wife know how to do. He used to complain to me, for years, how phony her family was. How they never speak the truth and just go through motions.
Now he's one of them.
0 -
Hi Timbuktu, I am truly sad for you about the situation with your son...and that it affects your time with your Grandchildren. I hope that your son will have a change of heart and reach out to you soon!
Bobogirl, How are you doing? I've been concerned about the lump you had mentioned...
Hugs back!
0 -
Hi Seashell:
Thanks so much for asking after me. I've got the u/s and mammogram today. You know, up to my neck with things to do in addition. My PCP didn't look very happy as she palpated. I know it's probably nothing. But I also know they'll have to take it out either way. MX likely.
Too busy to deal with that today, however! I don't think you opened a "can of worms" -- I think you are the sweetest. XXX
Timbuktu, I am sending you so many hugs. I am so sorry about your son. I wish you were here: I have two six-year-olds and you could come have dinner at our house! XXX and {{{timbuktu and seashell}}}
0 -
Bobogirl -- best of luck with the tests today
Seashell -- I don't think you opened a can of worms, either... you just opened a conversation.
Timbuktu -- I am really sorry that your relationship with your son is so estranged. My hope for you is that your pain lessens as the new things that bring you the most joy in your current life expand. Hopefully your son will work through whatever his deal is and you can someday become reconcilled and understand what caused him to behave in such a non-supportive way. I would be happy to talk with you more about it (through PM) if you would like... but I am unclear whether you are interested in more of my non-standard views.
All I can say is that this new way of thinking has certainly worked for me -- released me from some old and very deep relationship pains... that affected my ability to deal reasonably with new relationships. We all come to these boards for lots of things. Information. Support. Inspiration. Community.
And, we come here to give support, too.
We each give what we have to give. For some people it is {{{{{hugs}}}}}} -- for some people a several-times-a-day conversation with a few special people on a single thread -- providing online-friendship. Some people post photos of their pets or beautiful scenery. Some post poetry or inspirational verses.
I guess what I offer is the sharing of my (perhaps) outside-the-box self-empowerment and my own personal path to happiness ... Because it has worked for me. Through not only my dx and BMX -- but also through the death of my beloved father -- I found that the key to happiness is within my own self -- it grows from the choices I make about how to 'see' every situation. By taking 100% responsibility for my own happiness, I have been totally happy. My relationships -- every single one of them -- is healed and now again working in satisfying ways -- or at least resolved in my own mind -- with the potential opportunity for reconcilliation in the future... and no 'worry-time' about it for me in the present.
That seems a gift worth attempting to share.
So -- sorry if my ideas made anyone uncomfortable -- but, then again, 'uncomfortableness' often leads to change.... and if we are unhappy about something -- then isn't a change in order?
Another great thing about these boards is that MANY people 'lurk' -- unwilling to post and become subject to the (sometimes harsh) judgment of others -- but they read, and think, and gather new ideas that they can use to solve their own issues.
I often get PM's from 'lurkers' who thank me for some bit of epiphany they get from reading my posts. They write to share their break-throughs in their previously more-rigid (more-negative) thinking... or to ask for some 'outside-the-box' idea about something they are worried about.
Sometimes they ask for (free) coaching in this new-way of thinking. That happened again here from what was posted on this thread. So due to our conversation here-- at least one woman is excited about reconcilling (or at least resolving-in-her-own-mind) a couple of old relationships that were worrisome to her... and has made steps to do so.
And that allows her some new peace-of-mind and excitement -- even during this stressful time of dealing with bc.
So -- Thanks for the conversation, and my best to you all.
Linda
0 -
Bobogirl, included you in my prayers this morning, please keep us posted. Hugs and positive thoughts your way. xo
0 -
Entering the thread late but...I for one am glad people are telling their stories and venting. There is a pretty glossy stereotype out there about cancer patients, and breast cancer patients in particular, that we all have people beating down our doors to help and focus on us. It's not always true. There is also the view of the ass-kicking cancer patient fresh out of treatment with a renewed vigor for life and everything's inspirational and everything comes together and people want to take you on vacations and have celebrations and I could go on and on. That's also not always true.
I think it is fabulous that people have those experiences. But there are just as many who are completly burnt out from treatment, depressed or generally can't fight their way out of bed every morning because chemo and/or hormonal treatment has left them feeling like hell. Or because they're also taking care of other people when they're sick themselves.
Anyway, I digress. I've also struggled with forgiving some people who disappeared during treatment, and also the ones who hung around just enough and made loads of excuses while I've made calls and plans that kept getting blown off. I've taken a step back. More casual acquaintances, if they talked about it, or apologized, we're good. I've had people tell me that they couldn't handle seeing me during treatment because it would have made them too sad. This person has their own issues, and I've moved past it.
Family issues are never clear cut. Illness brings out long standing family dysfunctions. Sometimes you're not the only sick person in the family.
0 -
chemical, that last statement resonate with me. Sometimes you're not the oncly sick person in the family! It also resonates with Linda's message of staying in a power position.
When I was on arrimidex I couldn't stop crying to the dr sent me to an onco-shrink. Who knew they had such things? When I told her my story she said that I had to remember that this is about him, not me. That really turned it around for me, at the time. It's about him, and his problems.
When you are sick and weak it's hard to stay in the "power position". You feel so powerless! You have so little control over anything that is happening. And you really do need other people. It makes such a difference! I was so lucky with my friends. They were so supportive! I never expected it. It made me think, I was never that supportive in the past with my friends. But from now on I hope to be.
Yes, if I can think of it as his problem it does make me feel better. It's hard to stay in that mode though as he's a very successful dr, as is she and they are so happy! They have two darling little girls, a beautiful home. But you know, before our first get together in January, he had chest pains. Went to the dr, went for tests. He seemed not to realize that perhaps he was in a stressful situation with his family. The pains went away and he chalked them up to stress, finally. Maybe he's going through something too.
0 -
I love the sometimes you are not the only sick one in your family.
That says it all!!!!!
0 -
Seashell, I so appreciate the prayers!!
Unfortunately I don't have much to report. It was like that the last time. Not a cyst... not a fibroblastoma... doesn't look like a classic presentation of BC. MRI next. I'll definitely have a biopsy, because of my history. And then -- no matter what it is -- if it grows, they're going to have it out. And that will finish off the breast -- I had partial mx before.
I've really toughened up about that. I always knew it was coming. What I don't like is that each time the doctors have never seen anything like it, and then they have like one million tumor panels. At this point, I just want to rock and roll. You know you're not going to keep it in there, right? I want to say to them. So let's get it out.
Hope you guys are well! Sending you lots of {{{{{}}}}}}. Making a blueberry cobbler tonight for my daughter -- her school has what they're calling a 'human circus' tomorrow. The elephants get a break for this circus -- it's just humans!
0 -
You know what I say to people who joke about death - that´s ok I will just haunt you.....so remember that....
0 -
WEll this is an interesting thread, for me its not about blame its just about a sad realisation that ever since he met the woman he married my son became increasingly more precious and increasingly selfish and self absorbed, his love for himself is phenomenal (and I blame myself partly for that as I think I tried to over compensate for his lack of a father( ,I did the best I could as a lone parent but I also had difficult issues to work through too, including very long standing undiagnosed PTSD at that time so I am sure I was not as available as I wanted to be sometimes, and of course doing everything alone is a lot harder.
But now I have reached the point where I think it is just not worth it as I only feel hurt every time there is any kind of contact, his wife has never even offered me a drink (in 6 years) when I have visited and it is clear I have been cast as the weird bad guy, the tension must affect my grand daughter when I have been there so that also affected my decision. I can honestly say I cannot and never have been able to find anything to like in my daughter in law (the only one of his girlfriends I have felt this way about) and my partner feels the same way and he normally gets on with most people superficially.......
But I am left with an ache in my heart and guilt that I really do not like my own son and find it hard not to turn on myself as you are supposed to love unconditionally but I don´t know if I even love him anymore he has taken me for granted so much for so long and even a few months ago when I cleared his loan as he had racked up over a thousand five in default charges and the bank kept on coming to me as guarantor threatening all sorts (too much stress for me right now as there are no citizen rights in this country, not real ones only paper ones) and changed it to a loan to pay b ack to me he did not even write and say thank you or anything, not even an e-mail!!!! Nor did he ask how I am or anything.........so I have chosen not to react or get involved and just stay away and in all honesty I feel happier that way as I know that what I would like from a mother son relationship is not possible with him and the crumbs he is willing to offer, which are very sparse is too painful for me so I walked away and each day that passes I feel better. I know that many will never understand it but i am not angry or blaming just sad and accepting that it is the way it is........I have talked to him in the past but I don´t think he gets it, or has any appreciation of how devasting breast cancer is, he once said he did not want to hear me low as his mother was strong........so I guess I disappointed him too as I have been low......but I did not lean on him then.
Timbuktu and Bobo - I really get you....xxx
0 -
And Lily---I so get you.
0 -
Oh and me too! I don't think you can begin to understand unless you have a grown? son.
He was more mature when he was a teen ager.
Well, his birthday is Wed. and I decided to bake him the traditional cake.
I will kill him with kindness!
0 -
It seems there's been a bunch of discussion lately!
You know, it's ok to feel your feelings, whatever they are and contemplate a decision of what to do or not do with them for that matter.
I'm gonna go philosophical here for a minute, so here goes. After the diagnosis, there is grief. There are several stages of grief which I won't go into all of them- but the big ones include denial, reasoning, anger and acceptance. People go thru some or all, but not everyone moves through them by the same route or rate.
I admit I was stuck in anger a while- and that is completely normal and fine. Life is a work in progress. Yes, work in progress. End of philosophical moment.
Bravo to Linda for evolving into acceptance in only a few months time. keep in mind she can still change her feelings along the way.
I'm not quite there yet. i'm allowed to be angry about all the things breast cancer has taken, ruined or changed in my life over the last 10 years with my initial diagnosis and then my second diagnosis. Breast cancer sucks. It has robbed me of time, body parts, and left a cloud of fear that will linger over my family forever. That doesn't leave me happy at all. Shall I dwell on it? No but I've been told i'm an example of living life deliberately. Let me (us) have my (our) time to complain or vent with those who've been there and done that- when the people around me (us) don't exactly understand. My feelings are mine, I own them. It's ok.
So anyway, people drop off for whatever reason, it's NOT your job to fix them OR their issues. Your priority should be you, your treatment. Then if you want to, tell them how you feel about the situation- if they're worth it.0 -
Good post mebmari - I lack energy all round and have decided to prioritise myself
0 -
I've reached out to my friend. and communication has started. I may have let this friendship go, but our daughters are BFFs and I'd like some insight on what is going on with my teenager.
0 -
I agree with mebmari, Lily -- feel those feelings! I get you too. Unconditional love hurts.
When I have a friend, I love her unconditionally -- it seems I love everything about her, even her quirks. I have a new friend like that, Miranda. She is completely wacky and I love all the wacky things about her.
My point is, that's what I'm doing here. I'm here to love you unconditionally, Lily! I'm not here to give any kind of psychological advisement. This is a place for our sisters to vent! It's my understanding that much of this -- this way in which our friends and family react to our BC -- cannot really be 'resolved.' Maybe it can for some, I don't want to discount that. But people don't just miraculously change into different people, as they might do on a soap opera or something.
Let's think of a list of things we could do for ourselves that would make us happy. It seems that sometimes all I do is work and then do house/administrative/child-related things. Let's make a list! XXX OOO
0 -
bobo girl -- are you here to love me unconditionally, too?
Or are you here to 'judge' what I consider to be my 'gift' of sharing my own personal epiphanies -- as some "kind of psychological advisement"?
Just food for thought.
You are at the beginning of your bc journey... and new to these boards. There are many phases of both. Please believe me when I tell you that I wish you all the best -- and hope that your test results come back to be less-than-you-fear.
I have now been through 9 months from dx through lumpectomy, countless tests, treatments, MRIs, PT and double mastectomy. And, all that came on the heels of over a year of care-taking my Dad through his cancer -- and death.
Through all this -- I have learned a lot about myself and my source of strength. And about cancer. And about the human condition... and the power of the mind.
I have begun to notice how our society tends to undermine our ability to create our own lives, and encourages us to stay stuck in complaint. We are raised to re-act rather than actively create. We are raised to think in terms of 'good' and 'bad' -- 'right' and 'wrong' -- 'fair' and 'unfair'.
We spend so much time judging other people (and ourselves) 'wrong' and life as 'unfair' that we often render ourselves stagnant.
One thing that I have learned about community (anywhere -- but especially here, where our health is at stake) is that 'venting' is often not very good 'support'.
Some women come here seeking actual answers, not just a place to 'vent'. And the question that began this thread was a request for help to let go of hurt -- not foster it.
Absolutely it is good to 'feel your feelings' -- they are the barometer that gagues where your attention lies. When you feel negative feelings (hurt, disappointment, despair) my point is that you can (once aware of your unhappiness) choose to change your thinking about the situation that is causing you pain/concern... in order to create a new (more positive) approach to the circumstances. If you can't see a remedy then you can choose 'acceptance' that whatever it is simply IS that way right now... and focus your attention elsewhere.
Of course you can choose to continue to stay in judgment/anger/irritation/hurt -- if somehow that is serving to make you happy ...
Me -- I have little time for that.
My list of things that make me happy: A long walk in the woods, or through wide-open meadows. Petting and playing with my wonderful dog, Charlie (Australian Shepard). Holding hands and spending time in silence -- or engaging in interesting converstation with my wonderful boyfriend. Taking a long drive in the mountains. Watching the sunset. Noticing the sunrise. Having a picnic then taking a nap in the sun. Standing out under the stars at night...
And having conversations here... sometimes with the occasional result of actually helping someone change their life to one that is more satisfying or more happy.
Going out to have a picnic right now!
Linda
0 -
Linda - I don't think anyone is here to "judge" your "gift". They just don't agree with you.
0 -
There is also a problem with tone.
0 -
I simply couldn't love you more T and M. Come to my house this instant! I have made a vegan chocolate cake with cacao. Cacao fights cancer.
0 -
on my way over...can i bring my new puppy? she provides great entertainment!
0 -
I have been through the disappearance when my daughter had cancer. You find out who you can count on and those that you can't are not worth your time of day. You should be civil but never bend over backwards for those people. Its not worth getting sick over. I learned that many years ago......and unfortunately it is a shock at first, you have to focus on your own health. You need your strength and being bothered by these "family members and friends" is not worth it. Try to move on although it is greatly difficult!
0
