I WANT MY MOJO BACK!
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Okay, Soccermom, I say kick this guy to the curb! Unless, of course, you're in it just for the sex? If so, then just use him for that!
If cancer taught me anything it's that: I'm strong, I can survive chemo & rads, I don't deserve to be treated like crap, and I can make my own rules (and I do!).
Please don't 'blame' cancer for this guy's (or any other guy's) issues!
I have yet to find a good guy to commit since my BC dx 3 years ago but I simply move on to the next one as I have no patience for, nor the time to waste on, those who don't love/like/respect me.
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Well, Amen to what our resident sex advisors are saying, soccermom.
I totally agree-you don't NEED that.
However, my two cents are that there are men out there that seem to thrive on having a woman who fought the hell out of cancer. My hubby is one of those. Our sex life is the best it's been (of course, with thanks to this thread).Marin and Jaybird, where the he** have ya been?!?!!? Don't forget our mojo thread-I'm guessing you've been on the singles thread?
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Well, I don't post here often as I hate to interject my 'mojo' stuff since I'm not on Tamox or an AI. Been there, done that, I now have orgasms close to pre-BC in intensity. Still no real sex drive though. Once I got over the (negative) effects of chemo and chemopause and got my sexuality back I've not wanted to throw that in anyone's face.
I had a guy 'disappear' for no apparent reason, but it was not too long after my telling him, and our discussing, my BC. Coincidence? Perhaps. Either way, if he wasn't man enough to tell me WHY he didn't want to see me then he wasn't man enough for me to want to be with him again. Most men, though, like the strength we post-BC women have!
Cancer sucks but it sure does remind you of who your friends (and lovers) are!
I cheer all who have mojo after BC because no matter who you are it isn't easy. Rock-on grrrls!
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Oh, what a looser! Had a local friend who put on weight after FOUR kids. Husband came home and said he was no longer attracted to her--that he was a very visual person (eye doctor) and wanted a divorce.
She took him for everything including making him build a new house for her and the kids.
sounds like you have the same looser! Just glad it didn't go further and make it harder to break it off.
Give me a break--he knew you had a body, had had cancer, crap, what IS his problem!
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soccermom, I am sorry this guy has proven to be such a disappointment. At least you have been able to see him for what he truly is, as painful as that has been. I know how discouraging it can feel - a man who had 'adored me' and pursued me for nearly 30 years somehow faded away within a couple of months of my diagnosis. It did show me that he merited all those refusals of marriage proposals over the years, but it still can be disillusioning when you thought you knew someone better.
There are good ones out there, they just seem to be very few and far between.
Lisa
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Thank you girls, I am sitting here in a huge muddle after making it thru the day (barely). We took the red eye home from our romantic (well, up to the last day)vacation and I went straight to work..and my eyes were red, but not from the flight.
I guess you will think I'm stupid, weak and wimpy...but part of me thinks there's a chance, maybe slim to none, but there is still all the stuff that I wrote in my earlier message. He did/does admire my strength...I have asked him to be honest, and when I did that he warned me I might not "like" what he said..he claimed some of those little lies I caught him in and was so angry about were to protect me.Then it was almost like he punished me for making him tell the truth, by bringing up the cancer stuff and how it affects his sexual view of me.
I want to know if there is anyone out there who has fought through this stuff with a man and made it and would say it was worth it??? Don't flame me for this, but let's not assume it is easy for them...I'm just asking, how do you work through these kinds of issues with someone you love and who loves you?? I still believe we DO have love, despite all this..
and how many times can you cycle thru this and keep going to find a man such as you describe
no I'm not using him just for sex, but yes, he is very sexually/physically attractive, but still he has his own issues in that area...I described in another thread how he used Viagra for the first month or so, but then stopped and now it's basically morning sex (not my favorite with post BC body issues). I love HIM, I don't care that much that sex isn't always perfect...
and mind you I have a pretty decent implant reconstruction (it better be after how many surgeries..lost track!). well, if you leave out the cold boob problem..all I can think of is the expression "colder than a witches tit"!!! sorry, I don't want to offend anyone, but implant girls may know what i mean.
please don't think I'm being negative, I'm most appreciative of any and all input...I know it would be perfectly justifiable to get out of this, and believe me I almost left him stranded at the beach 3ooo miles from home when some of this unexpectedly came to light after I got it out of him that an ex GF now masseuse had called him while we were on vacation about when was he coming in for his massage..
I just hope someone can help with ideas of how to try to work through it all. Could it make us both better people? Could it work out??? Could we be stronger as a couple if we could actually talk and communicate about this?? He has said he is trying to change, he doesn't like seeing things this way, but he was just being honest because I demanded it, that sometimes (not always, obviously) the post-bc body is an issue for him.
I mean I know I am sometimes envious when I see another woman with natural breasts...can we really expect our men to not look and maybe long for that too?? so given that this is going to happen, how can we take this sad song and make it better?? if it helps our communication, maybe it could turn out well, given the basis of love we have for each other??
please don't beat up on me for being stupid or blind..I see what you have all said, I just really really love this person, we are basically compatible and despite all this, I feel he does love me and want to be with me.
I could never just date him and see others..think too much of him.
maybe there are some men out there that could chime in?? I'm sure men love the mojo thread..don't they?? help me out..
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Soccermon, well, it seems you've made up you mind so I wish you good luck! 0
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Soccermom,
Do what feels right in your heart and for you. You can mull this over and figure out what you want and then do it. You will know. I had a male friend who pursued me for 14 months (and I never said yes) and I am married to a wonderful man. BC and reconstruction is a big drag and all the emotions that go along with it. My male friend hung the phone up on my ear 7 weeks before my bilat mast (yes, he knew about it) and has never made contact since. It was painful, and I still miss his friendship, and I miss him very much. My DH has stood by me through thick and thin. And I am realizing what an amazing man that he is. He would love me if I had 1 breast, 2 breasts or no breasts at all, if they were large or very tiny tiny tiny. That is the type of man that you need. One who will cherish you. It makes me very sad that I had BC and my friend hung up the phone on my ear when I needed to talk to someone other than my DH. After 14 months of friendship I expected more out of him. He hung up the phone on my ear and I had breast cancer. What kind of person does that? You cannot get blood out of a stone. But if you feel that there is any chance then you need to work on that, until in your heart you know that you have given it your all and you are ready to move on. It sucks, it really does.
Best of Luck,
Kerry
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Thank you all for your understanding and support. It just all does suck sooo much!! Love is hard enough to find, then when you find someone you love, cancer takes it away...I know there are men like your husband, but I don't think there are that many of them, not in my experience.
Like I said..the husband I was with when DX dumped me, the next bf I had after 3 years dumped me, and now this one is on the rocks..but it ain't over till its over..
and I had never been dumped before!!!
if this fails then it's 3 for 3 since BC..sorry to be a depressant, but where else can I vent about this crap!!
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Soccermom,
Things will get better and they will look up for you. The feeling right now is just the pits and you feel like you will never get out from under it. I had days when first diagnosed when I did not want to be me, and I did not want to come home. I wanted to go and be someone else, anyone else to escape my reality. Breast cancer sucks big time!!!!! But you are right, it is not over until it is over and you will know when that time is. If it ever comes. Things will turn around for you and when you least expect it.
I hope you fell better soon.
Kerry
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soccermom....this is exactly what you should feel comfortable doing-- coming here and venting-- because it's not just an exercise in futility but, rather, a very good way of figuring things out, checking in with yourself and others who have had similar experiences, and coming to some decisions about where you want to be headed on your journey...and with whom. You make some excellent points in your posts and I can see that this issue is not just black and white/kick the guy to the curb or be a fool and get trampled on. No, it sounds as though he's trying to come to terms with his own feelings about it all, about you, and about your relationship. In that case, I'd say that it is most crucial for you to keep the channels of communication wide open and flowing and, while trying to be honest and true to yourself, avoid a build-up of any stuffed-down hurts and/or resentments because those are what are most destructive in any relationship. It seems like a very smart idea, in fact, for you guys to consider going to a few counseling sessions, maybe with a therapist who deals with illness or cancer issues. It really might help you communicate in a more neutral environment and also arrive at some mutually-agrreable decisions on how to proceed so that you both benefit. What do you think?
~Marin
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soccermom....this is exactly what you should feel comfortable doing-- coming here and venting-- because it's not just an exercise in futility but, rather, a very good way of figuring things out, checking in with yourself and others who have had similar experiences, and coming to some decisions about where you want to be headed on your journey...and with whom. You make some excellent points in your posts and I can see that this issue is not just black and white/kick the guy to the curb or be a fool and get trampled on. No, it sounds as though he's trying to come to terms with his own feelings about it all, about you, and about your relationship. In that case, I'd say that it is most crucial for you to keep the channels of communication wide open and flowing and, while trying to be honest and true to yourself, avoid a build-up of any stuffed-down hurts and/or resentments because those are what are most destructive in any relationship. It seems like a very smart idea, in fact, for you guys to consider going to a few counseling sessions, maybe with a therapist who deals with illness or cancer issues. It really might help you communicate in a more neutral environment and also arrive at some mutually-agrreable decisions on how to proceed so that you both benefit. What do you think?
~Marin
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And Deb, I've been around and keeping up with this thread and the one on "Singles"! BUT I'M NOT GETTING ANY, so whaddaya want me to say....."ooooooooh, I'm just lovin' Mr. Hitachi, y'all"?
~Marin
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I miss ya, Marin! Even if Mr. Hitachi is it for now, you are still the sex advisor here!
Soccermom, as usual, Marin gives some fantastic insight that we haven't quite mentioned before. I agree that it does sound like he is trying to figure this out, and not just be a loser. I am one of the first to agree, also, that counseling is nothing to be ashamed of. It truly helps to have a mediator, and allows you to really listen to one another.
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Have to `chime in with a "ditto" on Marin's comments. You love the guy, he seems to love you, too.
I asked my dh 20 years ago how he'd feel about me if I had a mast, and he said he didn't know. I was working with bc patients at the time.
Sounds as if you two have enough worth working for--and couples counseling is a terriffic start. Even if he won't go, or wants to go alone, you may well benefit by a one on one about your own feelings and what you want from life.
My prayers and good vibes are comming your way.
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Thank you sooo much, everyone, I just read all the latest posts and I am just about in tears from just feeling so supported and understood..you have given me hope, and enCOURAGEment!
really think I will broach the idea of couples counseling to him...originally I discarded that thought thinking, no, I can't "force" him, he either loves me or he doesn't, but ya know, maybe I will bring it up, he can always say no
any ideas on how to find a therapist with expertise in this stuff? or does anyone know one in the san diego area?? I'll also try googling around and see what I can find..
anyhow, I am going to print out all your wonderful posts and keep them with me when I need another dose of courage and love. I am so grateful for all of you, sweet dreams ladies, keep the faith!
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Soccermom,
I hope it all works out for you.
Take Care,
Kerry
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Your onc. may be able to recommend a psychologist or clinical social worker in the cancer center that will have a lot of experience in couples/cancer therapy.
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Thanks Dotti, Kerri and everyone who has lent an ear. I have the social worker who runs our support group checking on it for me and will hear back from her on Friday. I really think this whole area (sexual/imtimacy/body image/couples stuff is hugely neglected in cancer treatment)
Today has been hard, I haven't heard from him yet and it's almost bedtime for me...even though I texted him this am "please call me"
We returned from the trip very early Mon am and went off to work and since then I've received a few sparse emails (one a gorgeous photo of us at Waikiki in the sunset, but with no comment on it), a few cute and loving texts, but very short, one of them saying he tried to call me but my mailbox was full (it was)..but so far today...NADA. I'm trying not to freak out. We usually don't see each other early in the week due to conflicting schedules, but it's a little unusual to hear so little from him. I am forcing myself NOT to call him and whine about why he isn't in touch...veeerrrry hard. Lord, Give me strength...but sometimes I'm not sure I have any left.
I hate to play games, but I need him to come to me, I don't want to go begging to him. He knows how I feel about him. So I'm gonna go take me one huge sleeping pill and forgeddah bout it till am!
and I didn't mean to hijack the mojo thread..its just, well this is my favorite thread, you are all such cool people to hang out with. Missing him is giving my mojo quite a boost..maybe I'll get some"make-up sex"this weekend??!! lol or maybe it'll just be me and Mr. Hitachi...
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hallelujah--he just called, we had a good chat. I brought up our little blow up on sun during our trip. I told him I'm not mad at him, and in a way it was good that the blow up happened as it is a way for us to get closer and communicate better. He said he is trying to change his former ways as far as pursuing women. He siad our trip together was one of the best he has ever had with anyone. I said for me it probably WAS the BEST. So we are working our way through this.
we will see what the weekend brings...
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Soccermom,
That is GREAT!!!!! You must feel so much better. See there is still hope and the lines of communication are open. Love is sooooo tough sometimes. Empty out your mailbox so it is not full. I think that your approach is right on!!!! Not picking up the phone and making those calls is just a KILLER though and can be pure TORTURE!!! Discussing things calmly is sooo much better though.
Best of Luck and Take Care,
Kerry
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It's good to hear that you're communicating well, soccermom. I agree that issues around intimacy and our sexuality are severely neglected in cancer treatment and I, for one, hope to help ameliorate that in my intended future career as a social worker. For now, though, we help one another here. I've been helped immeasurably in so many area by the awesome chicks on this site. Anyway, I wanted to add that it might not be a bad idea for you to seek a little individual counseling if you don't do the couples thing (or even if you do) in order to express and work through your body image and sexuality issues. You sound like a very hot, generous, sexy woman.....but YOU need to believe that!
~Marin
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First, soccermom - why haven't you ever joined our San Diego Lunch Bunch that has been meeting for over a year?!?
If you scroll down to the 'get togethers' topic, you will see us all there. Yes, I know you are busy with Mr. Loverman a lot, but it's just a couple of hours once a month, and we're a fabulous group of wimmins!Secondly - here's a name for you: Namir Damluji,MD 760-944-0200
(it's pronounced damn-loo-gee). Not a couples counselor, per se, just a very highly recommended therapist. At the other end of the county from me, or that's who I would be seeing.
Glad you had a good talk last night.
Lisa
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Well, WOW do I love this convo. I've just finished chemo and radiation, and started tamoxifen a little over a month ago, so I'm new to this area of the site. It's wonderful how you all are so supportive and brutally honest about your sexuality.
I've only been able to read a few pages, but it brought some immediate questions to mind (along with the one that brought me here). Sorry if these things have been discussed on previous pages, there's just no way to catch up!
First off Marin, I think it was you who mentioned fish oil. I've read conflicting things with that regarding er+ tumors. Do you have a take on this? (Sorry, kind of off topic, but I trust your opinion).
Secondly, does getting aroused cause us to produce hormones that might be bad for us? Do we know?
My main question...well...it's not exactly to do with getting mojo back, but with mojo period, and I didn't know where else to ask it for fear of offending. So here goes- My boyfriend and I were having a ...errrrr...well let's just say "nap" this afternoon. Anyway, the minute it ended I stood right up to get a drink and ended up getting a dizzy spell (just a second long) which was so intense it landed me right back down on the bed! I just laughed at the time, and was able to get right back up but hmmm.....
I know that tamox gives me occasional very short bouts of dizziness at night (they last about as long as it takes to turn over), and I realize that I probably didn't have much blood left in my brain (he he) but has any one else experienced this? I'm not super worried, because I feel pretty good, but mostly it just made me feel old and embarrassed.
I know...I AM old, but I don't want anyone else to know. lol0 -
Lori...I hear ya on the dizziness, but I get it pretty often when I get up somewhat suddenly from any activity...and always have, off & on. It's about a drop in blood pressure or something, so I don't think you should worry about. And just tell your bf that he makes you swoon....he'll ask no further
!Fish oil....I've only recently begun to hear vague rumblings about fish oil having a possibly estrogenic effect and, therefore, risky for those of us with ER+ bc and until there is some hard data supporting that claim, I'll choose to continue taking the supplement. In fact, there have been some studies that suggest that fish oil may actually decrease the availability of estrogen in the body. From what I can gather, if indeed fish oil increases the amount of estrogen available, it seems to occur more in the estrogen receptors in the brain and the heart and this is why fish oil is thought to be good for the health of those organs. But, of course, I'm no expert, so I think that each woman must make her own decision based upon her doctor's recommendation and her level of comfort with it. I really love what it does for my skin and for my natural lubrication (all over) and, so, consider it worthwhile.
As for hormones produced during arousal....well, holy crap, Lori- I've never thought of that! I just gotta say that I have no idea if these hormones can be harmful to us but, frankly, I wouldn't stop having orgasms if it was proven that they are harmful. To me, that would be just wrong! Furthermore, I intend to leave this planet happy and if I stopped having sex, my quality of life would go straight to hell. UH-UH, noooooooooooooo-waaaaaaaaaaaay!!!
So anyway, Lori, welcome to the MOJO board! We also have one over under the "Singles" section for additional sharing, support and info!
~Marin
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I wouldn't worry too much about the arousal hormones. The main hormone produced with orgasm is oxytocin, which helps contribute to that connected feeling after lovemaking. This hormone is also produced during breastfeeding and contributes to feeling emotionally attached to the baby.
Interesting re: the fish oil. I hadn't heard this, makes me feel better about having slipped up on taking it regularly.
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Thanks Marin, for all the info and the welcome. I agree whole-heartedly. Hormones, dizziness, whatever it causes, I'm not willfully giving up my sexual satisfaction.
I have had that blood-pressure drop kind of feeling on occasion. This seemed more intense (more vertigo than fuzzy/grey light-headed feeling), but probably just because of the previous activity. I think the bf was (rightfully) flattered, so I'll never let on it may have been the meds. lol
Hi alyson, that makes total sense. I had forgotten that is also the hormone they used to induce both of my labors many moons ago.
So you're totally right there, oxytocin does produce contractions. Didn't even occur to me. And if sex does increase estrogen levels, I guess I wouldn't really do anything differently anyway. Maybe it's better if I don't know. lol
Hope everyone is having a fun weekend!
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I definitely like the sex oxytocin experience better than the labor oxytocin experience- hard to believe the same hormone is involved!
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Lori,
Have you ever had EKG? I had dizzy sensations and then bam a heart PVC, (preventricular contractions) gone bad. My heart beat was hard after excursion and I did not know that was a problem and I ended up with cardio ablation. I am only 43 great shape, I thought, no weight issues, low BP and great cholesterol levels, so monitor your heart rate and pay attention to any strong heart beats you feel! Just to be on the safe side!
A friend of mine, mom just died in February from the same condition I had. No warning, get EKG if you can!
Dani
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OMG Dani..this is too too strange. I came in this convo to look for YOU particularly. I saw that you had the ablation and my sister meets wtih her doc tomorrow re: hers and wants me to go with her. I saw that you had this procedure and wanted to know if you have any advice for her, what the right questions are to ask the doc etc. She's going to the very best docs in the city, but she was impressed with how I researched and talked to my own docs, so I don't want to let her down by missing something! I know they did explain the risk about "burning through" or something like that and how rare it is. It's a chance she's willing to take. I'm more curious about effectiveness, recovery, pros/cons etc.
I will definitely consider arranging for an ekg if this continues to be a problem. I do know that (except for yesterday) it only happened at night, just like my hot flashes, and is a supposed se of tamoxifen. (I take mine in the evening). I have no shortness of breath or unusual heart-beat after exertion, BUT I do have occasional feelings at night when I'm at rest as if my heart is palpatating. I assumed it was stress, I had an crazy-bad winter way beyond my own dx and tx, things are just beginning to turn for the good, where I actually have some time to reflect. I had also heard this is a se of menopause...which I've been thrown into kicking and screaming. ANYWAY, I am super vigilant about my health now, so I will check into it and I surely appreciate your concern and advice. You do look very young and in great shape, so I guess I shouldn't feel "safe" from heart woes. Especially after chemo.
If you have any words of wisdom for me about my sister's ablation would you mind posting or pm'ing? Any tidbits appreciated. Thanks very much!
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