I know I cant be the only lesbian out here?
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Cancersucks, thanks for the rant! Your ex DOES suck and I find myself wanting to slap her in the snot box.
Mutt, I'm sorry you had that experience. My experience was very different. I remember my oncologist asking me if I was going to wear a wig. I told her I'd feel like i was in drag in a wig and that I was more of a Doo rag kind of gal. She just smiled. One doctor seemed surprised by my decision not to have implants, but the rest completely understood why I would not want useless, unfeeling, fake breasts that could potentially block a recurrence of the large mass that none of their tests were able to detect in the first place. Besides I still feel like I get hard nipples in the grocery store (even tho i have none) and I still have some nerves and feeling there....those fake boobs could have messed with that! But, I never felt like I didn't fit in or was being expected to be something I wasn't.
Elizacan, I agree about health care proxy, will, power of attorney. We were married in Montreal but it wasn't legal in NYS back then. We had all that paperwork in place and did actually have to produce it...so, get that stuff in order.
Happy Monday everyone!
GML0 -
Wow, that is BAD behavior. Makes you wonder how many friends she lost because I know when people have done things like that not to me but around me, it sure makes me want to keep a wide berth. I don't know how I would have made it through without the support I had. I'm just sad that people go through this dealing with other crap too.
I did do a healthcare durable power of attorney, actually while I was pregnant with our daughter. It's still good. But if you're not incapacitated enough to need a legal proxy, you can still be feeling rotten enough that you don't want to deal with anybody pulling HIPPA stuff and saying they can't talk to your partner, GF, whatever you call her. I've seen some sad things in healthcare, but it's also getting better all the time.
Elizacan, I certainly got better at dealing with chemo as I went through it, hope you have that experience.
So different topic, do any of you have utter loss of sex drive since treatment? My cancer was ER+ so I'm basically chemically neutered, and I feel it. I have no sex drive at all. It's such a loss. Then there's also the "down-there" fragility issue. I've had to change oncologists a couple times (retirement, moved away) and when I brought it up my onc at the time gave me some testosterone cream. My acacdemic onc didn't think that was a good idea at all, I guess some tumours have testo receptors, so I stopped it. My relationship has definitely suffered this loss. My academic onc basically told me lots of intercourse. I didn't even bother to correct her about the intercourse thing, I was so dejected. There's a difference between staying stretchy for a man and actually wanting to have sex. I don't really need to be stretchy. But I want to want. Sometimes I'll see someone I think is cute and get kind of a brief little flashback, but that's all.
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Hello Kris-
I hardly ever post, because I never want to offend anyone, anywhere, at anytime. Just to add by "cancer land" I meant "cancer world" I think sooner than later we will all be balancing some kind of chronic illness due to all the toxic things we are exposed too, day in, day out, and it's understandable when people process their recovery and then move forward and never look back.
When I used my "hetro handle" it was only to ask a person who I did not know a question regarding something they were talking about and I did not want my orientation to become a distraction. I knew this could possibly happen if they just went back and took a look at the threads that I was involved with in the past, people do judge, I wish it wasn't true, I wish it didn't happen, but most people do.
I try not too. I didn't "hide my sexuality" I just didn't bring it up and I didn't visit any threads that had the word "lesbian" in it, while under my "hetro handle" because I didn't want to give someone an excuse to treat me differently but I will be the first to admit, this also made it impossible for me to be able to expereince acceptance. I can't hide being gay either but this is the internet, noone can see me, well except for big brother, and he already knows I'm gay.
Yes, karma is a powerful thing.
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GML- My surgeon kept on saying "Are you sure, are you really sure, both of them?" (Pained expression) when I told her if I had cancer in one of them, I want the other one off too. guilt by association and all that time together they must have been both plotting to kill me, they later detected cancer in the right breast too but only after it was cleared by a mammy and off my body.
I think your reasoning is worth repeating on why you did not want recon and I quote "useless, unfeeling, fake breasts that could potentially block a recurrence of the large mass that none of their tests were able to detect in the first place."
Outfield-as for sex and loss of libido and all that stuff I never really had it. I was going to be a nun, a near and dear friend told me I was the most non sexual person she had ever met in her life. What does one say to that? Have a good night all- Keep moving forward, CS
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GML, totally with you on the no-reconstruction thing. I am flat as my pecs.
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GML, flying the flat here also. Can't find ILC for crap with what they have and all I needed was something making it harder. Also didn't want to pretend I was something I'm not. Sex drive in the crappers too, still have pain so don't know how much of that is the problem.
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I had my ovaries removed and my sex drive has decreased quite a bit but its not gone. I'm probably a once a monther. My partner doesn't have a big drive either so we match well in that area. I'm very dry though and at the risk of giving TMI, most times I'd be hard pressed to fit a Q tip up there. So, I miss some of the things my ovaries provided but I sure as hell don't miss the mood swings!
GML0 -
Since I am TN they didn't shut my ovaries down, but I did go into chemo pause. I was 42 at DX so he said it was borderline whether they would come back on line. They have come back twice in 16 months, and those are good times
but other than that my mojo is AWOL...0 -
Hey all, just an old Marga skit to help take our minds off our libidos:)
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Anne, that link was a hoot. I saw the L word a few times (no movie channels) but they were all awfully pretty. Iv'e never seen that comedian. Been out of circulation for awhile and there aren't any womyns bars here, they keep going out of business. So there aren't many places to go hang out and watch tv.
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Oh, the clip was great but it makes me sad. We used to have people over to watch the show (I say "we" loosely because after a while I got pretty fed up with it) but everyone's moved away, and kids take you out of circulation. Seems like we used to get comics here but not in forever. I'd go see her. I'd also wear that shirt, flat and all.
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Kris that sucks that you have no places to hang out. Outfield, my partner and I used to host an L-word party every other week (we'd record them and play back two at a time) and we had a good mix of lesbians, gay boys and our straight friends that could handle our obnoxiousness:) We lived in DC then and it was a really good time. Then we moved here to phoenix and just couldn't get it going again. The show was ridiculous I think, but fun:)
Hope everyone is doing ok, JJ, ellie, and elizacan how is it going with you?
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The L word!!!! The good old days, that show was so bad it was good. The show started to get real bad when they killed off Dana. They had no idea where to go after that, bad plot, after bad plot. It just became painful to watch, it didn't matter who was making out with who, but the house parties weret the best!
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The L word!!!! The good old days, that show was so bad it was good. The show started to get real bad when they killed off Dana. They had no idea where to go after that, bad plot, after bad plot. It just became painful to watch, it didn't matter who was making out with who, but the house parties weret the best!
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Outfield - my libido has been in the dumps, also. Menopause (no chemo) came on 6 months after BMX, even without chemo. I occasionally have a bit of a bump in desire, but most of the time I have "no want". This makes it hard for my partner, who is much more interested than I am. I can fake it until I make it, but she can tell. I try to take every opportunity when I do have an interest, but it is really hard for both of us. I had hope when I heard about testosterone creams , but all my docs agreed that is a bad idea for er+, as it turns into estrogen in our bodies, or prompts estrogen production or something like that. So we're stuck. I keep trying; lots of touching, lots of thinking about it in advance, to get my mind in the right place. Fortunately, I'm not dry, yet, and my docs have been wonderful if clueless about the difference between lesbian sex and hetero sex. Maybe I should give a forum.
Maybe we should all have a chat with our docs. Surely they can't be embarrassed?0 -
I guess there was a seminar on intimacy after cancer at my support center. It was taught by a lic. sex therapist. Didn't go because I don't have any issues yet (still not dating with physical interaction) and I know this woman was straight as where 99% of the people there. From what I heard about it they spent alot of time focused on male erectile dysfunction so glad I don't have to physically get it up. Seems like it would be like asking a priest for relationship counselling and I never saw the logic in that either. I do still get the feeling but I am also out talking to womyn that I've just met or have only known for a short period of time, I know thats alot different than being in a long term relationship. Sorry guys, I haven't heard of a thing that estrogen + of us can do. Applying testosterone will cause your body to increase its estrogen production to overcome the increase in testosterone. Everyone just think really dirty thoughts.
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Hi everyone my name is tara I am new to this site . I am 21 yrs old and just had a question for yu all. See I am a butch lesbian so I have of course been mistaken for a guy before multiple times cause of short hair and baggy clothes I have just gotten use to it now an just laugh it off and be like nope not a guy just a lesbian but now I have had a bilateral masectomy and I got called a sir and it just made me so mad I wanted to tell at them but I'm kinda feeling like I have no right to now . When I was ok with I before but now bein flat is hitting me in a different way when I get called sir . An I in the wrong for gettin mad now when I wasn't before ? I also hate that people are looking at me now like I am trans . I have nothing against it at all but is not what I was wanting so maybe Thas was bothering more sometimes is getting looked at like I did this to be a man . I'm new to all these feelings and thoughts bout it as I just had surgery on 2/4/13 so sorry for rambling on just trying to get it all out and find support in others who have gone thru the same . Thanks all for reading and helping with advice .
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I so understand. ..you only miss the twins when they are gone. I dress conservatively old preppy looking clothes. Now without breast if I wear pants, shirt & blazer I do get called Sir more . People make quick judgements based on a glance. No it is not "wrong" to get mad now. You have gone through alot. You had cancer & major surgery. It is ok to feel the way you do. You lost a part of your body.
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Mutt: "Everyone just think really dirty thoughts." LOL!
Tara, I got called sir when I had boobs and now I get called sir without boobs although as I get older it does seem to happen less often. Sometimes it bothers me, sometimes it doesn't. It's always okay if we get mad; it's what we do with that anger that matters.
Just do you and be you. You have made a decision that has quite possibly saved your life. Remember that the next time someone calls you sir.
GML0 -
Tara, I'm 52 years old this Sunday, and I've been mistaken for a male since I hit puberty, even with long hair and earrings, even on the phone. I would describe myself as more androgynous than butch, but that doesn't really matter. I always laughed it off or felt "whatever" and it never bothered me. However, after a bmx three years ago, I became very self-conscious, felt weird about being called sir, and worried about people assuming I was in transition to a sex change, also (which I've never wanted). I've gotten more used to my flat state, and it doesn't bother me as much. The overall shape of my body bothers me more - I have more vanity than I've admitted to myself before. So it's normal to have these feelings, to get mad, to feel weird, to be upset, to have a different body image and so different reaction to others' attitudes or comments about your body. (some of it might also be anger at the cancer, the life changes, reaction to anesthesia, worry about the future - all coming out sideways) I think for me it was best to just chill about my initial freaked-outedness. I talked about it to my partner, and a tiny bit to others, which helped, but time has helped most of all. Sorry not to have better advice.
And Mutt - love it. I do try...
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Thanks for sharing your stories it is a relief to know tht these feelings will get better and I am not the only one who has gone thru the Same things.. I am startin to go out in public more and am learning to just smile when people stare and tryin not to let it get to me . It is hard but I know it can only get better from here.
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Tara, Same thing happened to me and I had the same reaction. Was detecting that guys were acting like I was guy before I realized what was up, took a little while before I figured it out (gotta love chemo brain). There is a comedian Tig Notaro, who is a breast cancer survivor that spoke about the freakyness of the subject in a Vanity Fair article if you would like to look it up. Seems if you are a lesbian and not real fem its a common emotion. Once my breast were gone I got a real understanding of how much weight some guys put on titts to define a persons gender. Mine were barely noticable before so they must have had to look really hard. It wasn't helped by the fact I went bald within 3 weeks after getting my drains out. No titts and bald, must be a guy.
JJ, Hope your world is working smoother, no headaches and the kid is stepping up and helping mom out.
Elleijdan, Hope chemo2 is done and you are doing ok (as much as you can).
Elizcan, Hope your girlfriend is doing ok and your household is getting the physical support you need to get through this without too much extra stress.
The rest of you great womyn I'm glad you have been posting for the new ones and also for me. Its good to come on here, see we are all still in this together and unfortunatly still having some of the same issues.Keep those dirty thoughts at the front of your minds. Kris
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Tara,
I think I said in the other post that I have a very boyish body. I've also got a lowish voice. So even when I had long, long hair, depending on my clothes, I was mistaken for a guy. When I was about 25, someone came up to me in a busstation and said to me, "Me and my sister were wondering, are you a girl or are you a dude?" So even if someone was concentrating on figuring it out, it wasn't always clear what I was. I was never trying to pass as a guy, it's just how I walked and what clothes felt comfortable (jeans and T-shirts). I actually got flunked in a class in grad school because I "didn't look like a woman" (that guy got so totally in trouble because looking like a woman had nothing to do with what we needed to have learned).
Now that I'm older and have to dress for my job, my clothes often identify me as female even though they're not femmie. Right now I'm wearing cords and a button-down shirt and black boots, but they're all a little girlie, not from the boys' department. My life's been like that for a while. I also had bigger boobs from having kids for a little while before I was diagnosed. I don't think I confused anybody between childbirth and the mastectomies.
But then I had the BMX. I also was bald a few weeks later, and pretty soon skinny as a rail. Skinnier. My body really, really looked like a 13 year old boy in the sprouting up part of puberty who hasn't put on much muscle yet. Then my hair grew back in the faux-hawk which completed the look. I got mistaken all the time. It didn't bother me when people called me sir, what bothered me was thinking that when they realized I wasn't a guy they'd wonder if I had the mastectomies as part of transitioning. Nobody ever directly asked me if I was trying to transition, but I suspected they were wondering it all the time. Then I'd feel bad about myself for not wanting anyone to think that, because what would it matter if a stranger thought I was doing that. I think it pointed out to me my own discomforts and prejudices about the transgendered community that I would not otherwise have admitted to myself.
Over time, I stopped worrying about it. I didn't do anything: the concern just evaporated. A big part of it was probably also getting over this assumption that everybody was seeing me, and if they realized I wasn't a guy they were immediately noticing I didn't have breasts. Now, I actually don't think they do. Sure, sometimes, but people don't stare and they don't ask about it. I also stopped caring that they might notice. It just doesn't matter to me, I am who I am. It took a while to get there, maybe a year? It's hard to remember because I'm 2-1/2 years out from my surgery.
So yes, long answer, what you were posting sounded very familiar to me. It will get better.
Edited to add: I'm so glad you all are here.
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Hey Tara,
To quote Dr. Seuss.
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
CS
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Cancersucks, I don't want to look down and think of this shit everytime I look at my hand. I'm still in pain so think about it enough but don't want to have a dialogue with someone else who just looking at my wrist is thinking about it.
Outfield, I had several people that thought I was a tranny. I carried around my pathology report for awhile and showed that off then when the incisions healed enough (was still bald) I grabbed the next tranny that made that assumption, hauled them into the womyns restroom and showed them the scars from the bilateral. Word got out around the people who were curious about it and I haven't had a problem since. I was born with a deep voice and was asked numerous times when I was in grade school if I was a boy or a girl by the other kids. Early form of homophobia.
Tara, Things have eased over time. Now I get al little amused when the cashier at the grocery store calls me mam. I am alot older than you so I know that things are going to be different but also the world is alot more accepting of differences than they were when I was 21. Sorry you have to go through this shit now and at all.
JJ. If we don't hear from you soon I'm going to assume the kid has you locked in the basement instead of getting a job. Just pop in and say your ok. If not there will be some flat lesbians running through towns in northern ohio looking for the lesbian who is a cancer survivor and who likes to sing.
Hope everyone had a decent weekend. Kris
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LOL! Kris. I will be with u running thru the towns in Ohio.
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Kris, just curious how u feel about trans? I have been a bit worried that physicians might call me a transexual male awaiting bottom surgery. But then again, there is this little snickering voice inside me that says..."Ah! you are confused. It is about time you stopped assuming the world is made up of men and women who need to be defined by their choice of male/female sexual partner."
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Hello to everyone out there-
Understandable Kris, it was just a suggestion. I have not had one person ask me about the band, I had only one remark. I was waiting in line to vote last year and a women whispered to me "I've been through that terrible ordeal too, I'm 10 years out." I am sorry to hear that you are in pain Kris. I have a chronic situation that leaves me in pain for most of the time, noone gets it until they have gone through it, it changes life. (I'm not speaking for anyone here, just me) editted once again because I can't spell.
Stay warm everyone,
CS
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Cleomoon, I'm ok with everybody being who they are and sorry if I offended anyone with my terminology, I was just using what we use here. There are so many people in so many different phases of that its hard to keep track. I don't get it but its not my issue to get. If your a good person then I really don't care what you need to do to be happy, just not my thing. I tried to be as clear as I could with my docs. Sometimes it really hit home that they had no idea what I was talking about in terms of my life, being a lesbian, blue collar employment and what would or wouldn't have a bearing on my sex life. I found that a little scary. Glad to hear from you here. The more we here from the more info we get to give to others.
Cancersucks, You probably made that womans day by wearing your bracelet, she got to tell her story and feel like she was encouraging someone else. I just can't deal with the conversation starting up out of nowhere, which is how I would feel if I wore the band. Winter time people don't even notice because there wasn't much there to begin with. I was still feeling pretty crappy last summer so not sure how most people are going to respond to just a Tshirt and really short hair (because the temp. is freaking hot). Guess that will be more for all of us to share.
I'm pooped in a good way so keeping it short. Everyone have a good week. Kris
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I wasn't able to deal with random conversations for a long time. It got better with time.
Brrr, I'll run around flat (how else!), but my mom says they're shovelling a lot of snow up her way in Ohio. Perhaps we should snowshoe.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZtJ76Apv3A